-
AFLW 2024 - Round 10 - Chat, game threads, injury lists, team lineups and more.
Socceroo's Ranking
- Thread starter Bourky23
- Start date
- Tagged users None
grimlock
Hall of Famer
They're revealing a new system after the WC.
- Jul 17, 2005
- 1,223
- 588
- AFL Club
- Adelaide
- Other Teams
- Sydney Thunder, Freo, GWS, Canes
You'd reckon that after our run in the world cup we'd be looking at a personal best ranking. Correct me if I'm wrong but isn't our previous best in the early thirties?
RussellEbertHandball
Flick pass expert
If you really want to know how they work out the rankings read the following document from FIFA's home page. It might help you overcome your sleeping problems.
fifa ranking procedures
From one small part of the document
5.2 Previous results
So that the ranking accurately reflects current form, the greatest importance is attached to matches played in the last twelve months. But attention is also paid to results from previous years. Basically, the current year's points total is averaged in with points earned in the seven preceding years, with weightings that decline progressively the further back we go. After eight years, results are dropped from the calculation altogether.
Thus the points included in the calculations for the ranking at the end of 2003 would comprise the following:
Last 12 months (e.g. 2003) : 8/8 value
+ previous year (2002) : 7/8 value
+ previous year (2001) : 6/8 value
+ previous year (2000) : 5/8 value
+ previous year (1999) : 4/8 value
+ previous year (1998) : 3/8 value
+ previous year (1997) : 2/8 value
+ previous year (1996) : 1/8 value
So even if we were to win the World cup we probably wouldn't even rank 25th. Any system trying to rank 205 nations/territories will be convoluted.
fifa ranking procedures
From one small part of the document
5.2 Previous results
So that the ranking accurately reflects current form, the greatest importance is attached to matches played in the last twelve months. But attention is also paid to results from previous years. Basically, the current year's points total is averaged in with points earned in the seven preceding years, with weightings that decline progressively the further back we go. After eight years, results are dropped from the calculation altogether.
Thus the points included in the calculations for the ranking at the end of 2003 would comprise the following:
Last 12 months (e.g. 2003) : 8/8 value
+ previous year (2002) : 7/8 value
+ previous year (2001) : 6/8 value
+ previous year (2000) : 5/8 value
+ previous year (1999) : 4/8 value
+ previous year (1998) : 3/8 value
+ previous year (1997) : 2/8 value
+ previous year (1996) : 1/8 value
So even if we were to win the World cup we probably wouldn't even rank 25th. Any system trying to rank 205 nations/territories will be convoluted.
FIFA will use a new system after the World Cup, and the new rankings will be released on July 12, three days after the World Cup.
Under the new ranking system, FIFA will take into account games played over the last four years. Under the old system, it counted results over the last eight.
Whatever happens, we will have a much better ranking which will should be sustainable. We might now forever be in the World top 30 or better and stay there.
Under the new ranking system, FIFA will take into account games played over the last four years. Under the old system, it counted results over the last eight.
Whatever happens, we will have a much better ranking which will should be sustainable. We might now forever be in the World top 30 or better and stay there.
red+black said:
Four years is sensible. There also needs to be controls for the quality of opposition and quantity of matches played. A minimum number of games to qualify for a ranking should be set.
There's no way in the world, going on the World Cup, that the Czech Republic, Mexico and United States are top five teams.
tribey
ʎǝlʞuᴉH ʞɔɐS
Veteran
Port Adelaide - Connor Rozee Player Sponsor 2020
Port Adelaide - Zak Butters 2019 Player Sponsor
Port Adelaide - Jack Watts Player Sponsor 2018
Port Adelaide - Nathan Krakouer Player Sponsor 2015
Port Adelaide - Matthew Broadbent Player Sponsor 2013
Port Adelaide - John Butcher 2012 Player Sponsor
Bourky23 said:
In any event the FIFA rankings are absolute bollocks.
Up there with the Logies in the credibility stakes - I just wish the Aussie media would get this memo, like the rest of humanity did years ago.
CharlieG said:
That is the problem with the current system.
Basically it says that a game in the World Cup is more valuable than a game in the Euro, South American, African championships. Those games are more valuable than qualifiers. Those games are more valuable than friendlies.
Because Australia don't play in a legitimite conference Championship, and because we don't play competitive matches against good teams (just the occasional friendly) - we have never been able to accumulate points.
Teams that go well in a major Championship get double-points in a sense. They get the points for getting there and the points for doing well in it.
Teams like the USA and Japan getting out of the group stages of a WC and doing well in their regional Championship automatically find themselves in the top 20 regardless of who they play.
Who cares about FIFA rankings?
dyertribe said:
The only interest in them is ridiculing them.
ChewTheFat
Draftee
While I'm not convinced they are a perfect system, ELO is certainly better than FIFA (Mind you, they rank Aust much higher so I might be biased)
http://www.eloratings.net/
http://www.eloratings.net/
Heisenberg_
17🏆19🏆20🏆
the current system is a joke, as long as the US is ranked top 20 in the world you ranking needs to be improved
tribey
ʎǝlʞuᴉH ʞɔɐS
Veteran
Port Adelaide - Connor Rozee Player Sponsor 2020
Port Adelaide - Zak Butters 2019 Player Sponsor
Port Adelaide - Jack Watts Player Sponsor 2018
Port Adelaide - Nathan Krakouer Player Sponsor 2015
Port Adelaide - Matthew Broadbent Player Sponsor 2013
Port Adelaide - John Butcher 2012 Player Sponsor
Weaver said:
The other big issue is that CONCACAF play their continental championship once every two years - and quite often Mexico and/or the US and Costa Rica get invited to the Copa America (which is also once every 2-3 years) as well, so in a given four year cycle the top CONCACAF teams might get as many as three or even four bites at the cherry.
Meanwhile Australia play against the Solomons and Vanuatu before meeting Uruguay a couple of times.
The end result is we have Americans who sincerely think their NATS!!! are awesome, while the JCL set over here think we're crap.
CharlieG said:
They are certainly a top 6-7 team and quite easily. Losing your best 2 strikers is going to cause any team problems and when one of them has something like 40 goals from 60 games it increases those problems 10 fold.
Criticise the FIFA rankings, but one important point is to be seeded at tournaments. Hopefully one day Australia can be top 16 and be one of the two seeded teams in a World Cup Group. With any luck, one day our group could be something like England, Australia, Costa Rica, Paraguay.
Borgsta said:
Fair enough, as I said I was going on the World Cup. Nevertheless, I have serious problems accepting that they are as good as Argentina, Germany, Spain and even the Netherlands.
Perhaps if the ranking system was not so biased against friendlies a) they would better reflect actual performance and b) encourage players to turn up for the games, if they knew that it was a big game against a potential competitor for World Cup seedings.
I can understand some sort of weighting for World Cup and regional games (perhaps 1.33 times the number of points for WC finals and 1.1 or 1.2 for regional championships and qualifiers) but these should still be controlled for the quality of opposition first and foremost.
If the current system allows more points to be earned from thrashing Saudi Arabia in the World Cup than beating Argentina in a friendly, then the current system needs to be dumped entirely (as they are apparently doing).
There's only one seeded team in each group - FIFA seeded 8 teams for this World Cup based on previous results (Germany, England, Argentina, Mexico, Italy, Brazil, France, Spain) and then the rest of the draw is designed to ensure that different confederations are represented in groups rather than having say 4 European teams in the same group.red+black said:
It will be a fair while before Australia could ever be seeded for a World Cup Finals, but it would definitely help progressing as of the 8 seeded teams, 6 topped their groups.
Exactly. I have not had a bigger laugh when hearing of America being No.5.Weaver said:
- Banned
- #22
if we knock off Italy and we ebat either Ukraine/Switzelrand and make the Semi Finals then I can see us maybe low 30's but if we get some things our own way maybe high 20's ?
So in the region of 28-33 if we make it to the Semi Finals of the WC
So in the region of 28-33 if we make it to the Semi Finals of the WC
X_box_X
The Opportunist
Veteran
10k Posts
Western Bulldogs - Ed Richards Player Sponsor 2018
Western Bulldogs - Bailey Dale Player Sponsor 2018
Western Bulldogs - Mitch Honeychurch Player Sponsor 2018
Western Bulldogs - Nathan Mullenger-McHugh Player Sponsor 2018
Western Bulldogs - Nathan Mullenger-McHugh Player Sponsor 2017
Western Bulldogs - Bailey Dale Player Sponsor 2017
Exactly. I'm sure if you asked every professional player if they'd rather win a world cup or have his nation ranked as the best team in the world, they would all choose world cup victories (or something similar).Cooldude said:
A good example is Greece in Euro2004.
- Banned
- #24
X_box_X said:
but also please remember that the more itnernational fixtures you win the closer you aer to being #1 in the world and obviously if you win a few games in a row you are a good shot at winning a tournament. So really it coems hand in hand with each other
X_box_X
The Opportunist
Veteran
10k Posts
Western Bulldogs - Ed Richards Player Sponsor 2018
Western Bulldogs - Bailey Dale Player Sponsor 2018
Western Bulldogs - Mitch Honeychurch Player Sponsor 2018
Western Bulldogs - Nathan Mullenger-McHugh Player Sponsor 2018
Western Bulldogs - Nathan Mullenger-McHugh Player Sponsor 2017
Western Bulldogs - Bailey Dale Player Sponsor 2017
Most of the time, yes, that's just logical. But if a team causes a huge upset (like Greece at Euro), obviously they aren't going to take the mantle as the best team in the world by perhaps getting a little lucky in the World Cup.Aaron said:
I'm not sure on where the Aussies will be ranked if they cause a huge upset and win the World Cup, but I'm guessing we wouldn't feature in the top ten.
