Prediction St.Kilda Best 22

[stfan]

Marshall dominates clearances, not tap outs. P.Ryder as e.g. showed, how important tap outs to advantage are. Marshall is a
ruck-rover in essence.

I would not see it as ruck rover as he does ruck, it is just that his goal in the ruck contest is to win the ball, and for him that often means positioning himself against his ruck opponent to make it less likely that the opponent will tap the ball so he can gather, and then clear, the ball the ball, rather than primarily being focussed on winning the hit out which he also does win.

Away from the ruck contest he does win the ball around the ground, and is an excellent mark too.


We have all seen games where Marshall has been slaughtered in the tap outs though. The amended ruck rules have worked to Marshall's advantage.

 

[wannabewinner]

Shanghai, Wellington.....

Only positive from Covid - Any chance of another game at those places is unlikely.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

Only positive from Covid - Any chance of another game at those places is unlikely.

How do we know one of the top executives of Chery wasn't at the Shaghai game thinking....hmmm that team is clearly an underdog but something about them......

 

[crawfords cat]

No 22 from me but a few thoughts:

• The idea that RoMa will dominate as a starting key forward is flawed IMO. Part of the reason that he is so dangerous when he goes forward is because of his athleticism -- he outruns his opponent and causes matchup chaos for the oppo defenders. Put him there more permanently and I'm not convinced he does better than King.
• Caminiti starting R1 seems a big question mark due to shoulder recon interrupting his preseason.
• Watching Travaglia's convo vid with Wilkie, he seems to believe he's most likely to start as a winger, due to the glut of HBFs on the team.
• Speculation: Wilson is working with Lenny on his contest & is putting on size. It's been suggested that coaches think he may move inside in time -- could he be the next player to get time at centre bounce?

 

[stfan]

No 22 from me but a few thoughts:

• The idea that RoMa will dominate as a starting key forward is flawed IMO. Part of the reason that he is so dangerous when he goes forward is because of his athleticism -- he outruns his opponent and causes matchup chaos for the oppo defenders. Put him there more permanently and I'm not convinced he does better than King.

Plus Roma simply has not really be trained in doing all the leading patterns that true key forward needs to be competent at. An aspect of the game that we want King to improve upon.

When we first recruited Roma he was playing initially as key forward in the VFL for us. But that quickly changed.

• Caminiti starting R1 seems a big question mark due to shoulder recon interrupting his preseason.

All eyes too will be on Keeler in the preseason games. Caminiti and Keeler are two players who probably are most battling each other to get into the 22/23.

Max and Sharman I regard as both locks.

• Watching Travaglia's convo vid with Wilkie, he seems to believe he's most likely to start as a winger, due to the glut of HBFs on the team.

I think TT will be the draftee that the club will most likely seek get the most senior games into in 2025. Wing as you say could be a spot they throw him into.

How many will depend on not just his form, but also the form and availability of a fairly group of players all pressing to get into the team as there seems to be a lot more competition for places in the 22/23 2025.

That Henry might not be ready for Round 1 may assist TT in debuting in Round 1.

• Speculation: Wilson is working with Lenny on his contest & is putting on size. It's been suggested that coaches think he may move inside in time -- could he be the next player to get time at centre bounce?

I think this is past the speculation stage as Wilson has indicated that he will be looking to play midfield. Most likely this will just be in bursts to see how he goes and to be part of his development. He may eventually transition to be being mainly a mid. Or he may just stay as mainly an outside player who has mid rotations. We will have to wait and see how he goes when he actually lays there.

 

[crawfords cat]

think this is past the speculation stage as Wilson has indicated that he will be looking to play midfield.

That's cool. When did he talk about this?

 

[stfan]

That's cool. When did he talk about this?

I believe that there has been several interviews/ articles in recent times where he has talked about developing his skills to enable him to play as an inside mid.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

I believe that there has been several interviews/ articles in recent times where he has talked about developing his skills to enable him to play as an inside mid.

View attachment 2199366

Face it , if we take our top couple of players out, we are such marshmallows that Aaron Fiora would be an inside mid if he was playing now.

 

[pebblesofsand]

Plus Roma simply has not really be trained in doing all the leading patterns that true key forward needs to be competent at. An aspect of the game that we want King to improve upon.

When we first recruited Roma he was playing initially as key forward in the VFL for us. But that quickly changed.



All eyes too will be on Keeler in the preseason games. Caminiti and Keeler are two players who probably are most battling each other to get into the 22/23.

Max and Sharman I regard as both locks.



I think TT will be the draftee that the club will most likely seek get the most senior games into in 2025. Wing as you say could be a spot they throw him into.

How many will depend on not just his form, but also the form and availability of a fairly group of players all pressing to get into the team as there seems to be a lot more competition for places in the 22/23 2025.

That Henry might not be ready for Round 1 may assist TT in debuting in Round 1.


I think this is past the speculation stage as Wilson has indicated that he will be looking to play midfield. Most likely this will just be in bursts to see how he goes and to be part of his development. He may eventually transition to be being mainly a mid. Or he may just stay as mainly an outside player who has mid rotations. We will have to wait and see how he goes when he actually lays there.

Our forwards have leading patterns? Surprise to me!!

Marshall is good enough to play forward but the problem is that since Ryder left we didn't have an alternate ruckman good enough to operate in tandem with Marshall.

Playing dual ruck/fwd helped King as well.

 

[gringo2011]

No 22 from me but a few thoughts:

• The idea that RoMa will dominate as a starting key forward is flawed IMO. Part of the reason that he is so dangerous when he goes forward is because of his athleticism -- he outruns his opponent and causes matchup chaos for the oppo defenders. Put him there more permanently and I'm not convinced he does better than King.
• Caminiti starting R1 seems a big question mark due to shoulder recon interrupting his preseason.
• Watching Travaglia's convo vid with Wilkie, he seems to believe he's most likely to start as a winger, due to the glut of HBFs on the team.
• Speculation: Wilson is working with Lenny on his contest & is putting on size. It's been suggested that coaches think he may move inside in time -- could he be the next player to get time at centre bounce?

Marshall used to struggle as a forward with Paddy Ryder taking the ruck. He's always better drifting in dragging his lagging opponent around. He'd probably be better as a spare across HB like Lyon played McEvoy if playing with a second ruck.

 

[CaptainRisky]

How do we know one of the top executives of Chery wasn't at the Shaghai game thinking....hmmm that team is clearly an underdog but something about them......

 

[stfan]

Our forwards have leading patterns? Surprise to me!!

Just watch Sharman at work.


King needs to be aerobically fit enough to lead more. I believe last year that King had a number of cumulative injuries that saw him stagnant. Early in the season he work up and down the ground and looked good.

I think our forward will like Macrae being in the team.

 

[SG34]

My take:

• Our forward line was still a dog’s breakfast in ‘24, based on stats last year)
• I agree, RoMa might kick the odd goal coming in from nowhere, but not about him permanently resting there
• Ryder and Marshall was the best. Marshall looked below par but the combination was a win-win
• both Ryder and Marshall could function as occasional forwards. I remember both winning us games by kicking 3 or so down there
• question, if Caminiti gets his shoulder right, does he have running capacity to be a second ruck?

 

[Speck]

My take:

• Our forward line was still a dog’s breakfast in ‘24, based on stats last year)
• I agree, RoMa might kick the odd goal coming in from nowhere, but not about him permanently resting there
• Ryder and Marshall was the best. Marshall looked below par but the combination was a win-win
• both Ryder and Marshall could function as occasional forwards. I remember both winning us games by kicking 3 or so down there
• question, if Caminiti gets his shoulder right, does he have running capacity to be a second ruck?

Caminiti has already been playing second ruck when he's out there, so I can definitely see it continuing. He is on the shorter side as a ruck though at 196cm.

Max King is 202cm... I still think he has to go into the ruck this season (as long as he's fit) and free him up from the forward line from time to time. He has the height and leap, it's just his athleticism which needs to improve. Our second ruck solution is staring us right in the face.

I will also keep saying this - I damn well hope our forward line is practising the structure of a Marshall hack kick from the ruck contest. If we play in front and can start winning or at least neutralising 70% of those, we will start scoring from clearance much more often. I'd like to try turn that into a Marshall weapon rather than a criticism (as he will never be the Ryder tap ruckmen we'd all love).

 

[SaintsSeptember]

Caminiti has already been playing second ruck when he's out there, so I can definitely see it continuing. He is on the shorter side as a ruck though at 196cm.

Max King is 202cm... I still think he has to go into the ruck this season (as long as he's fit) and free him up from the forward line from time to time. He has the height and leap, it's just his athleticism which needs to improve. Our second ruck solution is staring us right in the face.

I will also keep saying this - I damn well hope our forward line is practising the structure of a Marshall hack kick from the ruck contest. If we play in front and can start winning or at least neutralising 70% of those, we will start scoring from clearance much more often. I'd like to try turn that into a Marshall weapon rather than a criticism (as he will never be the Ryder tap ruckmen we'd all love).

If our midfield improves, Marshall might find there are better options available to him.
But also if you have an above average forward line, you should be able to capitalise on some of the hack kicks forward.

 

[SG34]

Caminiti has already been playing second ruck ....

Was the Hammer taking centre-bounces? Or do you mean he was like Hawkins or Stewie Loewe, just pinch-hitters when the ball was in their corner of the field, allowing the full-time ruck to run into an open space?

 

[Speck]

Was the Hammer taking centre-bounces? Or do you mean he was like Hawkins or Stewie Loewe, just pinch-hitters when the ball was in their corner of the field, allowing the full-time ruck to run into an open space?

Yes he was.