The Charles Cameron Apology Thread

[DangerSloane]

Fair assessment, for consistency I have Mackay in front but for ability to break a game open like he did Friday then CC has him easily covered. Points to Mackay for me but as you say it's splitting hairs.


MCrouch 2017 Brownlow Winner

Mackay was as good if not better than CC on Friday night.
Watch the game again taking note of his hands, his run and his ball use.

Was one of his better games too, although it wont necessarily look like it on the stat sheet.

 

[Paladin]

Really? I find you man-love and fanboism for a serial under-performer to be positively hilarious.

One good game does not require an apology. One good game, after CC's career, means he's worthy of admittance to Geelong's Callum Chambers Club. If he can back it up by performing regularly, then he'll earn my admiration. Until then, nothing has changed.

Serial under performer?

He finished 9th in the b&f last year and has been best on in 2 of our last 3 finals you flog!

 

[Vader]

Serial under performer?

He finished 9th in the b&f last year and has been best on in 2 of our last 3 finals you flog!

Yes, he's a serial under-performer, and his performances in those two finals just shows how badly he's under-performing the rest of the time.

** He wasn't our BOG in the Sydney final either. He was one of our better players, but not our BOG.

 

[Paladin]

Yes, he's a serial under-performer, and his performances in those two finals just shows how badly he's under-performing the rest of the time.

** He wasn't our BOG in the Sydney final either. He was one of our better players, but not our BOG.

How is 9th in the b&f underperforming?

 

[Drugs Are Bad Mackay?]

Mackay was as good if not better than CC on Friday night.
Watch the game again taking note of his hands, his run and his ball use.

Was one of his better games too, although it wont necessarily look like it on the stat sheet.

Come on!

Mackay was excellent but Cameron just put out one of the best games of all time by an Adelaide player

 

[Jarman3]

Come on!

Mackay was excellent but Cameron just put out one of the best games of all time by an Adelaide player

You left out "Imma let you finish"

 

[Bovo]

In any regard I still have not apologised to Mac-Okay and he has had a pretty decent year....! Cameron needs to go to the back of the queue and he can be dealt with when the next available operator is ready.

 

[DD#23]

Mackay was as good if not better than CC on Friday night.
Watch the game again taking note of his hands, his run and his ball use.

Was one of his better games too, although it wont necessarily look like it on the stat sheet.

 

[Jeffcrowe]

Interesting coaches votes in Ayres medal

Cameron - 9 ie BOG

Mackay - 0 ( played v well but hey we are comparing him to Charlie's game here )

So CC has dominated a prelim that we've won and people on here are still trying to pot him ( and me for sticking up for him )

They should get a new hobby or get fa.rked seriously

 

[Jeffcrowe]

Yes, he's a serial under-performer, and his performances in those two finals just shows how badly he's under-performing the rest of the time.

** He wasn't our BOG in the Sydney final either. He was one of our better players, but not our BOG.

Who was BOG against Sydney Vader ? And where did Cameron rate ?

 

[Vader]

Who was BOG against Sydney Vader ? And where did Cameron rate ?

The AFL website didn't rate him in the top-5. They rated him behind Mrouch, Laird, Sloane, Atkins & Thompson.
The Advertiser rated him 4th, behind Mrouch, Laird & Sloane.
The Age rated him 3rd best, behind Mrouch & Sloane

I'll agree with the Advertiser's ratings - Mrouch, Laird & Sloane having played better than Charlie.

Cameron's game against Sydney was basically a one-quarter cameo. He was all but invisible for the other three quarters. He was very good in that one quarter, but AFL games are played over 2 hours - not 30 minutes.

 

[Golumless]

Yeah we should trade one of our biggest pressure game performers before his peak for an 18 yo kid that struggled to play consistently in the tac cup this year

Great idea

Lovely strawman

I didn't mention anyone to replace him, just a pick. I trust our recruiting staff to nail whatever we are given however. The person I'd replace him with is already on our list (Gooch); good way to blood him and that kid truly has it.

Cameron has been in the system for 3-4 years and until last week, had stagnated badly. We are praying it was external issues but equally this may be it for his peak - a S.Motlop type level, the definition of a hot/cold player. Sure his role plays apart in this, but that 2-3 month dry spell is one of the most concerning things I've seen from a up and coming player; especially one at an experience level where they should be impacting the game more.

Finally. His value will never be higher then this finals series, and he is replaceable considering he is in our bottom 5-7 selected. I wouldn't trade him unless we got a good offer of course, but would be very open if we did because of the amount of opportunity it represents.

Played an excellent final, sure, but the ruthless/smart decision is to be open with the idea of trading him at the right price.

 

[Drugs Are Bad Mackay?]

Interesting coaches votes in Ayres medal

Cameron - 9 ie BOG

Mackay - 0 ( played v well but hey we are comparing him to Charlie's game here )

So CC has dominated a prelim that we've won and people on here are still trying to pot him ( and me for sticking up for him )

They should get a new hobby or get fa.rked seriously

Some are determined to go down with the ship

 

[BunjiMac]

The AFL website didn't rate him in the top-5. They rated him behind Mrouch, Laird, Sloane, Atkins & Thompson.
The Advertiser rated him 4th, behind Mrouch, Laird & Sloane.
The Age rated him 3rd best, behind Mrouch & Sloane

I'll agree with the Advertiser's ratings - Mrouch, Laird & Sloane having played better than Charlie.

Cameron's game against Sydney was basically a one-quarter cameo. He was all but invisible for the other three quarters. He was very good in that one quarter, but AFL games are played over 2 hours - not 30 minutes.

Your comparing journalists opinions with the coaches. Pretty clear difference in credibility

 

[IntelligentFish]

He's kicked 28 goals for the season and delivered on the biggest stage

You have followed he crows before the last few weeks ? You know that we've been finals and prelim finals failures since 2002?

He's also missed some (for my mind) easy set shots at goal, has had more than his fair share of fumbles and turnovers, and came away with 33 clangers for the year.

I need to see another performance like last week before I apologise. Everyone has a good game eventually.

 

[Mismatched]

Never doubted Charlie's ability, just thought we had an opportunity to spell him late in the season and he might have recaptured his form sooner.

Was a risk taking a horribly out of sorts player into cut throat finals, but it paid off in the end.

I can't believe some were suggesting Charlie was only in the side for his defensive pressure, to lower the bar for Charlie that much is doing him a disservice.

The strength of our forward line is that there's legitimately 5-6 players there who can get off he chain and kick a bag of goals. It forces opposition to play man on man and guys like Rance, McGovern, Taylor etc have to think twice before leaving their opponent to go 3rd man up.

The more Charlie, Jenkins and McGovern can get dangerous, the more likely Betts and Walker will get the one on ones they need to dominate.

We're also less likely to need to worry about having defensive pressure, because the oppositions defensive rebounders are all too focused on defending.

 

[Vader]

Your comparing journalists opinions with the coaches. Pretty clear difference in credibility

I accept that. It's also my opinion - I don't believe Charlie had ever been BOG prior to Friday night, because he rarely contributed for four quarters.

I'm happy to accept that the Coaches votes have a greater weighting. Do you know where they can be found?

EDIT: Found the AFLCA votes here. All votes went to Sydney players, and understandably so. No help for anyone looking for evidence that Charlie was rated Adelaide's BOG for that game. Similarly, there's no help for those saying that he wasn't.

 

[Jeffcrowe]

He's also missed some (for my mind) easy set shots at goal, has had more than his fair share of fumbles and turnovers, and came away with 33 clangers for the year.

I need to see another performance like last week before I apologise. Everyone has a good game eventually.

Oh yeah ' everyone plays match winning prelims eventually ' ..... like when for us ?

He's had a good season !!! 17 other clubs would love him

He's kicked 28 goals and had more tackles than Betts Butler Costagna D Rioli

He's in his 4th season - he's been in our best 2 players in the 2 biggest games we've played in last 3 seasons

You have NFI , Nil . Need a new hobby son

 

[Jeffcrowe]

I accept that. It's also my opinion - I don't believe Charlie had ever been BOG prior to Friday night, because he rarely contributed for four quarters.

I'm happy to accept that the Coaches votes have a greater weighting. Do you know where they can be found?

EDIT: Found the AFLCA votes here. All votes went to Sydney players, and understandably so. No help for anyone looking for evidence that Charlie was rated Adelaide's BOG for that game. Similarly, there's no help for those saying that he wasn't.

Maybe check the B and F votes

 

[Jeffcrowe]

How five small forwards could set the tone for footy in 2018
http://m.afl.com.au/news/2017-09-26/the-stats-files-crow-tiger-smalls-crank-up-the-pressure

Wow - such a dud season by Charlie Cameron . Can see why you are all so off him.

This doesn't even include the closing down space he does

 

[Squiba]

How five small forwards could set the tone for footy in 2018
http://m.afl.com.au/news/2017-09-26/the-stats-files-crow-tiger-smalls-crank-up-the-pressure

Wow - such a dud season by Charlie Cameron . Can see why you are all so off him.

This doesn't even include the closing down space he does

That's not a bad article actually, although I don't rate Richmond's forward entry, the small forwards are a vital part of the modern game.

 

[Vader]

Oh yeah ' everyone plays match winning prelims eventually ' ..... like when for us ?

He's had a good season !!! 17 other clubs would love him

He's kicked 28 goals and had more tackles than Betts Butler Costagna D Rioli

He's in his 4th season - he's been in our best 2 players in the 2 biggest games we've played in last 3 seasons

You have NFI , Nil . Need a new hobby son

Such a pity we can't just bring him in for the "big" finals, given that his form was horrible for the last 3-4 months prior to the Prelim Final.

 

[Heafy83]

Probably the best game of Cameron's career. Was brilliant on Friday night. Top 3 on the ground easy. However his problem is consistency and putting decent games together. Hell even putting a decent full game together. He often pops up for a quarter and shows us what he has but then we don't see him again.

If Cameron does the same this week and has 15-20 disposals (at a decent DE%) and kicks 2-3 then I may put my apology hat on. Until then it just shows how large the gap is in between his best and worst. He needs to find a higher base.

Maybe this is the type of player he will be though. Just an impact player who can destroy a team in a quarter. Not sure how I would feel about that yet

 

[Jeffcrowe]

That's not a bad article actually, although I don't rate Richmond's forward entry, the small forwards are a vital part of the modern game.

Exactly - their pressure forwards are one of main reasons that they are in a GF and yet Cameron is better than all of them

And people on here only see offence , they only watch half of the game and basically have NFI

Cameron is extremely highly internally rated by coaches and players

 

[Jeffcrowe]

Probably the best game of Cameron's career. Was brilliant on Friday night. Top 3 on the ground easy. However his problem is consistency and putting decent games together. Hell even putting a decent full game together. He often pops up for a quarter and shows us what he has but then we don't see him again.

If Cameron does the same this week and has 15-20 disposals (at a decent DE%) and kicks 2-3 then I may put my apology hat on. Until then it just shows how large the gap is in between his best and worst. He needs to find a higher base.

Maybe this is the type of player he will be though. Just an impact player who can destroy a team in a quarter. Not sure how I would feel about that yet

You're not watching close enough and or don't understand the modern game

Having said that it is hard to watch on TV sometimes , especially the pressure aspect

But pressure wins big games and that's main focus point this week

IMO kicking straight and taking chances will be the other one