Analysis The Coach – Simon 'Standard Practice' Goodwin: It's time to go (for real this time)

[Topkent]

The reports were basically that five minutes after we said he was up for trade our phones were ringing off the hook. There were reports early this season that Geelong were heavily into him if things didn't work out between the two of us.

His contract is a weird one. I think it really depends on the team and their cap space. Since you have to pay the money anyway a team like North or Adelaide or even Geelong with a lot of their guys coming to the end might entertain something like that.

Tbh as well if it was the difference in maybe bumping up a pick or 3 as well I'd happily take 200k of that on every year and just not have a Billings or Tomlinson as depth

 

[A11dAtP0w3R]

Yeah, he was far easier to sell last year despite the off field troubles coz he was still considered an elite player on field. Clubs will take risks for players like that. What they wont take risks on is players who are average that they have to baby sit. And thats exactly what Oliver is right now. The 7 year 7m deal is the nail in the coffin. I said it a few weeks ago, only way hes traded is if its for **** all and we paying half (if not more) of what's left. No one is taking that awful contract and giving us a top 10 pick for him.

 

[Bluelegs]

Agreed. I can’t stand Goodwin but it’s silly to say he had no impact on the flag then say all the bad footy we play is his fault.

It’s funny that even despite how good 2021 was it still required an all-time burst out of the midfield to seal the game. Never seen a club do that in a GF before and we may never see it again. We overrated our midfield a ton after that too, and it’s part of the reason Goody just doesn’t want to change structure much in there.

Yeah absolutely happy to say that the Grand Final was turned by sheer brilliance and that's often the case for Grand Finals. But you've still got to get there which is my point. Goodwin is certainly a limited coach but I think the team we were benefited from his rigid style in 2021. I don't think it's fair to take that achievement off him in hindsight.

It just tilts me a bit when I hear shit like 'we wasted a generational team' like no, we wasted two good years where we should have gone deep into finals by capitulating when it mattered. If we recognised our issues earlier and changed things up only to play in close prelims or lose a grand final I think that would have been a pretty reasonable result.

 

[markm106]

Yeah, he was far easier to sell last year despite the off field troubles coz he was still considered an elite player on field. Clubs will take risks for players like that. What they wont take risks on is players who are average that they have to baby sit. And thats exactly what Oliver is right now. The 7 year 7m deal is the nail in the coffin. I said it a few weeks ago, only way hes traded is if its for **** all and we paying half (if not more) of what's left. No one is taking that awful contract and giving us a top 10 pick for him.

He is clearly nowhere near his peak. Barely had a pre season. Anyone in the footy industry looking at him knows this. Give him a full pre season and we might see peak Clarry again. It’s not like he’s just turns into an average mid for the rest of his career. Ball is in his court about how the rest of his career plays out.

 

[PerfectFooty]

Goodwin probably at the bar during trade week when the Oliver trade stuff was going down

 

[A11dAtP0w3R]

He is clearly nowhere near his peak. Barely had a pre season. Anyone in the footy industry looking at him knows this. Give him a full pre season and we might see peak Clarry again. It’s not like he’s just turns into an average mid for the rest of his career. Ball is in his court about how the rest of his career plays out.

Whats a full preseason gonna do? He should be way fitter than he is looking now, hes been playing and training for half the season and looks like hes put on more weight than when we saw him against Sydney in round 0. This is with the club watching his every move right now, how's it going to go when hes able to do his own thing in the offseason?

 

[Topkent]

He is clearly nowhere near his peak. Barely had a pre season. Anyone in the footy industry looking at him knows this. Give him a full pre season and we might see peak Clarry again. It’s not like he’s just turns into an average mid for the rest of his career. Ball is in his court about how the rest of his career plays out.

Just kicking the can down the road with this, I remember when it was guaranteed the best player our in history was gonna be back to his best this year. Now it's next year instead.
2 years without AA already. Melbourne goggles to assume he's gonna reach his heights again when he's just comfortable getting paid a million to do enough

 

[Topkent]

Whats a full preseason gonna do? He should be way fitter than he is looking now, hes been playing and training for half the season and looks like hes put on more weight than when we saw him against Sydney in round 0. This is with the club watching his every move right now, how's it going to go when hes able to do his own thing in the offseason?

They'll probably offer him a 10 year contract on 1.4 instead

 

[Bluelegs]

He is clearly nowhere near his peak. Barely had a pre season. Anyone in the footy industry looking at him knows this. Give him a full pre season and we might see peak Clarry again. It’s not like he’s just turns into an average mid for the rest of his career. Ball is in his court about how the rest of his career plays out.

Toump pointed this out yesterday but I don't get this. What's the difference between a two month pre-season and two and a half months of playing senior football? Plus he still came back a month before the season started to try and get in shape. If he was just unfit because he ****ed around all summer then that should have been sorted by now.

If he can't get fit playing footy then wtf are we doing? Just make him train for 6 weeks to get him right.

 

[A11dAtP0w3R]

See plenty of guys do it in sports, they get their big contract and their happy to mail in the rest of their career. It feels like that's exactly what's happened here. We paid him the money and now we are stuck begging him to be a good boy, he has us over a barrel.

 

[Johnny Karate]

Yeah absolutely happy to say that the Grand Final was turned by sheer brilliance and that's often the case for Grand Finals. But you've still got to get there which is my point. Goodwin is certainly a limited coach but I think the team we were benefited from his rigid style in 2021. I don't think it's fair to take that achievement off him in hindsight.

It just tilts me a bit when I hear shit like 'we wasted a generational team' like no, we wasted two good years where we should have gone deep into finals by capitulating when it mattered. If we recognised our issues earlier and changed things up only to play in close prelims or lose a grand final I think that would have been a pretty reasonable result.

I agree, we’re clearly not Brisbane 2001-04 or Geelong 07-11 level talented but we had a real chance to pinch another flag in 22 or 23 if we had been better managed. Geelong won in 22 by excellent player management and a tweak to how they played and Collingwood won last year with a blistering start to the season and then hanging in and being clutch when it mattered.

 

[PerfectFooty]

See plenty of guys do it in sports, they get their big contract and their happy to mail in the rest of their career. It feels like that's exactly what's happened here. We paid him the money and now we are stuck begging him to be a good boy, he has us over a barrel.

I feel like with AFL in particular we've seen a lot of players just ease off after getting long term big contracts. One of the few things i agree with Kornes about. Happens through all sports even through different circumstances, seen plenty of B tier tennis players coast into tournaments not taking them seriously, take their pay out and leave after the first or second round

 

[Bluelegs]

I agree, we’re clearly not Brisbane 2001-04 or Geelong 07-11 level talented but we had a real chance to pinch another flag in 22 or 23 if we had been better managed. Geelong won in 22 by excellent player management and a tweak to how they played and Collingwood won last year with a blistering start to the season and then hanging in and being clutch when it mattered.

Yep. The opportunity was there and we didn't do everything we could to take it. That's the core of the frustration.

 

[Topkent]

Toump pointed this out yesterday but I don't get this. What's the difference between a two month pre-season and two and a half months of playing senior football? Plus he still came back a month before the season started to try and get in shape. If he was just unfit because he ****ed around all summer then that should have been sorted by now.

If he can't get fit playing footy then wtf are we doing? Just make him train for 6 weeks to get him right.

He also won a BNF after a double shoulder reconstruction. The narrative that he just needs a pre season is just rubbish.

 

[Lord Nev]

Toump pointed this out yesterday but I don't get this. What's the difference between a two month pre-season and two and a half months of playing senior football? Plus he still came back a month before the season started to try and get in shape. If he was just unfit because he ****ed around all summer then that should have been sorted by now.

If he can't get fit playing footy then wtf are we doing? Just make him train for 6 weeks to get him right.

Clubs only get a very very small amount of 'contact hours' these days so there would be a big difference between doing all fitness based training and doing rehab, skills, tactics etc I reckon. Plus, during the season so much more of the time would be spent of recovery, so if you don't get that preseason base in then you're going to struggle to catch up.

Plus, aside from his offseason issues, he was also coming off last year's injuries, not just the foot and hammy stuff but I seem to remember he had shoulder surgery again (I think it was shoulder).

Fitness seems to be an issue across the board atm though, and it's not new as it was spoken about before the season started.

Completely agree he, and others, would have been better off doing a mini-preseason rather than playing. We've seen that from Goody and co time and time again, and I can't recall an example where it worked out great tbh.

 

[markm106]

Have you guys seen players turn up day one of pre season? They comeback in good nick. They basically don’t have proper time off. This isn’t 1985 where they’ve spent 3 months sinking beers around Europe. Clarry was in poor condition in January. Then trained with a local footballer. He was never getting to his peak this year. Sometimes either play him or put him in the 2s or a preseason for half the year. For his mental health probably better he plays. Also from a team perspective without Gus and much other depth he’s actually needed. It’s a more complex situation than we probably know to be honest.

 

[Topkent]

For his mental health probably better he plays. Also from a team perspective without Gus and much other depth he’s actually needed. It’s a more complex situation than we probably know to be honest.

This is hands down one of the worst takes I've ever read. Now we're playing Oliver for his mental health regardless of the impact on the team? No one's needed. No one half assing around the team being a ¼ of the player they used to be is needed.

He did 3 months of pre season before the actual season started, if he's still not fit that's on him.

 

[Bluelegs]

Clubs only get a very very small amount of 'contact hours' these days so there would be a big difference between doing all fitness based training and doing rehab, skills, tactics etc I reckon. Plus, during the season so much more of the time would be spent of recovery, so if you don't get that preseason base in then you're going to struggle to catch up.

Plus, aside from his offseason issues, he was also coming off last year's injuries, not just the foot and hammy stuff but I seem to remember he had shoulder surgery again (I think it was shoulder).

Fitness seems to be an issue across the board atm though, and it's not new as it was spoken about before the season started.

Completely agree he, and others, would have been better off doing a mini-preseason rather than playing. We've seen that from Goody and co time and time again, and I can't recall an example where it worked out great tbh.

Yeah but as a professional athlete it's on him to get his body right. You get paid to perform and performing requires elite preparation. For example, Petracca didn't really become elite until he fixed his perparation around 2020. Treating it normal job where you just do your hours and switch off really isn't good enough especially for a player paid as much as him.

Is his diet right? Is he doing everything in his power to get the best out of himself? The results would tell you he's not.

Is that an issue with our fitness program? Dunno, I'd still say guys like Gawn and Trac who live and breath this stuff still look as good as they have over the past few years.

 

[A11dAtP0w3R]

Have you guys seen players turn up day one of pre season? They comeback in good nick. They basically don’t have proper time off. This isn’t 1985 where they’ve spent 3 months sinking beers around Europe. Clarry was in poor condition in January. Then trained with a local footballer. He was never getting to his peak this year. Sometimes either play him or put him in the 2s or a preseason for half the year. For his mental health probably better he plays. Also from a team perspective without Gus and much other depth he’s actually needed. It’s a more complex situation than we probably know to be honest.

Right, so you say players comeback in great nick, yet Oliver didn't even after warnings about his behaviour at the exit interviews and in trade week he was still sent home from Lorne. But yeah, he'll be better next year. Trust the process. Third warning is the charm.

 

[Topkent]

Yeah but as a professional athlete it's on him to get his body right. You get paid to perform and performing requires elite preparation. For example, Petracca didn't really become elite until he fixed his perparation around 2020. Treating it normal job where you just do your hours and switch off really isn't good enough especially for a player paid as much as him.

Is his diet right? Is he doing everything in his power to get the best out of himself? The results would tell you he's not.

Is that an issue with our fitness program? Dunno, I'd still say guys like Gawn and Trac who live and breath this stuff still look as good as they have over the past few years.

I'll bet both my nuts that Oliver isn't as professional as Petracca not even close. Trac has nutritionists, he does stretching, goes over seas and trains with other athletes etc. Never gets injured either miraculously. Oliver sleeps on the captains couch to keep out of trouble. When you're being paid a million dollars it's your responsibility to be the best you can be, blaming the club is piss weak

 

[markm106]

Toump pointed this out yesterday but I don't get this. What's the difference between a two month pre-season and two and a half months of playing senior football? Plus he still came back a month before the season started to try and get in shape. If he was just unfit because he ****ed around all summer then that should have been sorted by now.

If he can't get fit playing footy then wtf are we doing? Just make him train for 6 weeks to get him right.

Well. A pre season would be much more running/conditioning than in season training. He’s just more playing and recovering now. Wouldn’t be doing much in terms of tank building etc.

 

[markm106]

Right, so you say players comeback in great nick, yet Oliver didn't even after warnings about his behaviour at the exit interviews and in trade week he was still sent home from Lorne. But yeah, he'll be better next year. Trust the process. Third warning is the charm.

Yea but according to some on here clubs are lining up for him.

 

[Lord Nev]

Yeah but as a professional athlete it's on him to get his body right. You get paid to perform and performing requires elite preparation. For example, Petracca didn't really become elite until he fixed his perparation around 2020. Treating it normal job where you just do your hours and switch off really isn't good enough especially for a player paid as much as him.

Is his diet right? Is he doing everything in his power to get the best out of himself? The results would tell you he's not.

Is that an issue with our fitness program? Dunno, I'd still say guys like Gawn and Trac who live and breath this stuff still look as good as they have over the past few years.

Definitely not giving him an out, just mentioning that on top of his self-inflicted issues there was also legitimate injury stuff too and IMO the club have handled this stuff poorly since Burgess left and they're doing it again as this season rolls on.

The small amount of contact hours is a big issue among the coaching ranks, it's only like 12-15 hours or something like that per week, it's crazy IMO and shows how the AFLPA have taken things too far.

 

[Topkent]

And goalposts shifted.

 

[PerfectFooty]

Not preparing your body as well paid athlete is like a well paid actor rocking up to a movie set to film without having read the script