The future of the 2 Beau's?

[Goody1971]

Hey gang - my first thread, so be nice...

Beau Dowler and Beau Muston - will they become Hawthorn champions, and cement a regular spot in the side, and if so will 2010 be the year they do it?

Both obviously have plenty of potential and have shown good signs, but so far have been held back by their questionable traits, in particular, Dowler's lack of 'mongrel' and Muston's tendency towards inefficient disposals.

I reckon they could both be winners and hope to see them at their best. Interested to hear the thoughts of others...

 

[Easy Slips Catch]

Great non controversial first post. Welcome.

 

[cosby]

Muston get's a bit of a bad rap.
I think his one 'set play' of getting the ball midfield and delivering to the top of the square could be brandished as a major weapon should he find some more consistency and apply this 'play' to oother places on the ground. Jury's still out on Beau, but we've given him the time for a reason.

Dowler is similar. While not having the luxury of being able to throw him in a key spot and seeing if he'll swim, we've tried him in many different roles, both at Box Hill and in the big stuff.
What's plain to see for me is that he needs to up his confidence levels and take his opportunities by the scruff of the neck, as he's soon going to find himself swamped by others who will be pushing for the same spots. I did note that he scrapped for the ball a lot better in 2009.

Both will be hoping 2010 is a year where they can consolidate a spot on the list, if not in the best 22.

Here's hoping.

 

[Number 24]

it is a make or break year for both.

I have spoken to Beau Muston about where he sees himself. He has said he knows this is a make or break year for him. He said that he put a huge amount of pressure on himself last year in just trying to come back and get a game. He said the pressure told on him and his form fell away. He said his life away from footy was not in the best shape either. He has made adjutments to his life away from footy and now has that aspect in good order. He has a mental approach this year that he will enjoy his footy, do the very best he can, and not worry too much about the future. He hopes with that approach he can give a good account of himself and make the grade.

I have not spoken to Beau Dowler for some time now and so I can't provide any accurate insight into his mindset. I know he took considerable confidence from some games in 2009 and looks forward to 2010. There are really 4 players who are competing for the 3rd tall forward position. Dowler, Lisle, Morton and possibly the Schoe, with the Schoe more likely to be retained as a backman and used as a forward in a switch hit role occassionally. I know the club wants to give Morton a chance to prove himself this year....they hold him in higher regard than a lot of posters on this board......so it seems probable to me that he will get the first go at it., with Dowler and Lisle to be the backup forwards in the event of injury or loss of form. I don't think 2010 will be the end of the road for Dowler so long as he shows improvement and some consistency, even if it is at BHH. I understand there were at least 5 approaches for Dowler in last years trade period and the club refused to even discuss the approaches with the other clubs. So that seems to indicate the club sees a future for him.

 

[hawkstars]

Just on dowler I would play him before Morton but that is just my opinion. the times he was given a go he did OK. Give him a bit more and he will be VERY good. Just see last year against bombers first half.

 

[gibovski]

I always questioned Hawks becoming Beaurepairs when they drafted these two guys with serious injuries both of which were going to be on the list for a year before they would be able to play a game.
Dowler is a straight line lead up forward. I can't see him becoming a focal point for forward movements while Buddy and Roughy are there. He does provide a solid third option when the other two arn't beating their opponents and is useful to stretch opposition defence for tall defenders. He needs to work on aggession, 2nd efforts and forward pressure as he seems to be mostly a lead mark kick forward.
Muston was recruited and was touted as a game breaker. I still remember his first game in the NAB cup. He looked very lively and got plenty of the ball and I was very excited till he limped out of the pack with another serious knee injury. Since then he has never seemed to have the spark that he had in that first game. Hopefully with another solid preseason under his belt he'll get back that spark that I saw in his first game.

 

[Easy Slips Catch]

........... Beaurepairs .............

Bravo.

Lisle has his speed flaws but I like him more than Dowler. I like Lisle's attack on the footy and the contest.

Musto needs to find a role for himself. Dont like his chances.

Big year for both. Given their bumpy rides I hope they succeed.

 

[Collins-Langford-Ayres]

Yeah, I am a fan of Dowler and have seen nothing to suggest Muston will make it.

Dowler for mine has the ingredients to be a solid third tall forward. Good strong lead, seems to have good hands and kicks accurately. Also has a big tank so he can keep presenting and also provide some forwrad defensive pressure. Agree that at times he needs to go harder. That will probably come with more confidence and gametime. Lisle has shown enough this pre-season though to suggest he's probably now only a year away from demanding a stint as a third tall. As long as Beau shows a bit, he'll be there next year at least.

Muston on the other hand can't kick. Knee recos or not, he obviously never could kick. What makes it worse is that he doesn't seem to realise his limitation, so tries these around the corner and bullet passes where the percentages are low for most and near zero for him. Seems to have the physical attributes to be a footballer, but now needs another string to his bow. Because of his disposal issue, the only role I see for him now is as a shut down defender. However, I would have Murphy and Straton ahead of him. Would be surprised if he is on our list next year.

 

[Gunston19]

i thought Beau Dowler played very well up foward as the 3rd tall. seeing williams is gone now. he could be that weapon. roughead down the guts, franklin on the right, dowler on the left, all leading at once, now i would love to see that. Also add hooper and Cizla crumming haha

for Muston, i think hes going to be a player just his kicking effic lets him down, from memory he was ment to be top 10 pick but the knees effected that, and also if im correct they said he was a Judd lyk player?

going to have to wait and see hopefully they do become hawthorn champions

 

[hfc70]

I have spoken to Beau Muston about where he sees himself. He has said he knows this is a make or break year for him. He said that he put a huge amount of pressure on himself last year in just trying to come back and get a game. He said the pressure told on him and his form fell away. He said his life away from footy was not in the best shape either. He has made adjutments to his life away from footy and now has that aspect in good order. He has a mental approach this year that he will enjoy his footy, do the very best he can, and not worry too much about the future. He hopes with that approach he can give a good account of himself and make the grade.

Thanks Number 24 , great insight into Beau.

Makes a change from all those negative posters.

Good kid, has the talent just needs to believe it. Come the end of 2010, hope we are all talking about how good this kid really is ! Time will tell.

 

[thatswhatimtalkinabout]

Thanks Number 24 , great insight into Beau.

Makes a change from all those negative posters.

Good kid, has the talent just needs to believe it. Come the end of 2010, hope we are all talking about how good this kid really is ! Time will tell.

I too, am on the Beauwagon - it goes without saying I want everyone on the list to get the very best out of themselves and to fulfil their potential, but even moreso with BM for some reason, maybe it's his tenacity that I admire.

Kudo's to gibovski for the 'Beaurepairs' tag - I've not seen or heard that before - apt and humourous.

 

[ACTion Hawks]

Thanks Number 24 , great insight into Beau.

Makes a change from all those negative posters.

Good kid, has the talent just needs to believe it. Come the end of 2010, hope we are all talking about how good this kid really is ! Time will tell.

I would also like to say thanks to Number 24. This type of insight is the reason I am part of this board.

As hfc70 says, hopefully Beau can "turn the corner" this year and become a key contributor. I remember that a certain Swan player by the name of Brett Kirk was almost delisted at one stage and in the course of one season managed to turn it around and became a premiership player within a year or two!

Go for it Beau

In terms of B1, I have seen progress every year with him and hope that this is the year we see him cement himself as third forward in the Tim Boyle style. Like others, I would like to see a bit more fire, but if he can slot in on average a couple of goals a game to relieve the burden on Buddy and Roughy and provide that third avenue, it would be fine without the aggro.

 

[Henry Jr]

I have not spoken to Beau Dowler for some time now and so I can't provide any accurate insight into his mindset.

Gezz you jump off your favourites quick don't you!

Don't ever get into the bad books with N24. He will drop you quicker than it takes for Dasher to down a Burbon and Coke.

 

[real hawk]

Muston will make it for sure, he has the one thing the others struggle with, a football brain, once he gets some continuity of games under his belt he will shine and be a good player for us, he is as tough as nails as well.

 

[detox]

With Dowler, why not try him out as a mobile ruckman?

He has height and running power, would need a few extra kilos on his frame, but with the way the modern day ruckman is going, it could see a place for him.

Think about the advantages, Play one of Renouf/Taylor with Dowler as the second option. Play the first ruckman 60-70% of the time with Dowler pinch hitting, and resting forward or on the wing. If he could just be competitive at the contest, the advantage would be like having an extra midfielder.

 

[Pessimistic]

For some reason Beau M's clangers seem to stand out more than the others.

If he does kick on, I can see him getting the whipping Boy role

 

[On the Boyle]

Just a note - I spoke to BM about a month ago:
After so long out of the game, he's still working on getting his head and his kicking back in. His body is good to go for the first time in a while, it's his head that needs settling.

Oh, and BM reads this forum - he's a pretty awesome person (regardless of your opinion of his football abilities) so maybe we want to be more constructive?

 

[Collins-Langford-Ayres]

Just a note - I spoke to BM about a month ago:
After so long out of the game, he's still working on getting his head and his kicking back in. His body is good to go for the first time in a while, it's his head that needs settling.

Oh, and BM reads this forum - he's a pretty awesome person (regardless of your opinion of his football abilities) so maybe we want to be more constructive?

Completely understand the bit about getting the bit between your ears right, however not sure on kicking.

Blokes can kick or can't. You don't lose that much when you've been out for a year or so. Yes you get rusty at full pace and need practice to put the ball in the exact area you want, but you still drop the ball the same, have a feel for it on your boot, have the same perception of distance, height, etc.

 

[thatswhatimtalkinabout]

Blokes can kick or can't. You don't lose that much when you've been out for a year or so. Yes you get rusty at full pace and need practice to put the ball in the exact area you want, but you still drop the ball the same, have a feel for it on your boot, have the same perception of distance, height, etc.

I disagree CLA - any skill can be taught if you persevere long and hard enough, putting a ceiling on someone's skill set because 'they either have it or they don't' seems quite ignorant to me.

Case in point:

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/new...n-the-right-foot/story-e6frg7mf-1111113427108

Hawthorn guru helps put Sewell on the right foot.

"......Sewell is the first to admit that when he was included on Hawthorn's rookie list before the 2003 season, he was fortunate to get the chance. He was great at finding the ball but not fit enough to run out a game. And he was a dodgy kick......."

".......Sewell is renowned as one of the hardest working players at Hawthorn. According to David Rath, the club's high performance manager, no player has worked harder on his kicking. But Rath must also take some of the credit for spotting a fundamental flaw in Sewell's kicking technique which might have otherwise kept short his AFL career.

He has got a very good eye," Sewell said of Rath, a sports scientist by training. "It is amazing the things he picks up. My whole kicking action was out of whack and out of timing. It has certainly been a long process to get it to where it is now........"

".........I knew there was something wrong with his timing and his sequencing, but for a while I could not work out what it was," Rath recalled. "Then it came to me that he was actually circling the ball totally the wrong way......."

"........The result was that Sewell's entire kicking action had to be stripped back and rebuilt. First, he was instructed to do walk-through drills where he would practise releasing the ball without letting it drop. Then, once his hips and shoulders were in sync, he progressed to kicking the ball off a couple of steps, then eventually on the run.

The tedium involved in this sort of work should not be underestimated; nor the challenge of adopting such fundamental change in a match situation.
Sewell has lost count of the hours he has spent re-teaching his body to kick, mainly in one-on-one, 30-minute sessions with Rath.

Theoretically, it takes 10,000 hours to learn a skill from scratch. Sewell occasionally feels himself falling back into bad habits and knows his kicking will forever remain a work in progress. As Rath puts it: "He is still fighting against what he did for 15 years."


So have a bit of faith brother.

 

[Number 24]

I am only too willing to conceed that BM is not the best kick in the side but he is no worse than many others.

Hodge has some aweful clangers surprisingly regularly, so too Goo in the backline. Lewis too can be dodgy all too often. Bateman, Morton and Tuck can come up with howlers on a regular basis. And as goal kickers Buddy and Roughy can make one cringe all too often. And that is only a few of the top.

So IMO this issue about BM's kicking is the product of sheep mentality and whipping boy syndrome, as with Taylor and Murphy, and is taken out of reasonable proportion

Completely understand the bit about getting the bit between your ears right, however not sure on kicking.

Blokes can kick or can't. You don't lose that much when you've been out for a year or so. Yes you get rusty at full pace and need practice to put the ball in the exact area you want, but you still drop the ball the same, have a feel for it on your boot, have the same perception of distance, height, etc.

 

[WeneedyoungJarmans]

Muston has no future with Hawthorn unless he can become a goal kicking HFF / wingman. 15-20 goals a yr (15 possies) is what is required from him.

His booming right foot kick is his greatest weapon and it has to be used to score.

He'll never be an accomplished decision maker, he cant handball and hes not a natural ball winner.

Dowler has a big future with Hawthorn. He will become an integral part of Hawthorns key position stocks for the next 5 yrs allowing them flexibility with where they play Franklin and Roughead.

I think you'll find Dowler will kick quite a few goals this yr. He's ahead of Morton IMO for 3rd tall option. Morton isnt a KPP option, he needs the twin towers there at all times to allow him 3rd defender. He's also pretty avg off the ground. Not elusive enough to be a medium forward. Jack of all trades for mine master of none. Still a valuable player to keep though but will be a gap plugger.

 

[Hawkinspired]

With Dowler, why not try him out as a mobile ruckman?

You make an interesting point.

Hawthorn will always want Dowler in the side and they would see him as a valuable prospect for the future. The main problem with Dowler is he was unable to hold down a position as a key defender. Not only could he not beat his man, but he looked as out of place as a bikini in Antarctica. This would have been his perfect fit as we lack key defenders.

In the last few rounds of the season he impressed as a key forward. What tough luck. We have probably two of the best 10 key forwards in the comp. Many say lets play him as a 3rd tall... we did it with Tim Boyle, why can't we do it with Dowler? It does seem mouth watering with those three in the forward line, but with the change in pace of the game it seems inpractical to pursue such a structure.

The make up of the modern day forward line is made up of a couple of solid targets and the rest rotate through the midfield. Dowler has the tank, but is he good enough to take a spot from a half forward players like Luke Hodge, Cyril Rioli and Shaun Burgoyne? The club looks to be focusing on a multi-dimensional attack and i just don't see room for 3 talls.

Beau Dowler looks like he could do the job of Roughead or Franklin if either were to go down injured, but it seems unlikely he would ever be good enough to push one of them out of the side.

Re-invent yourself as a Ruckman Beau because your too good to be sitting on the sidelines.

 

[Slayer]

I am only too willing to conceed that BM is not the best kick in the side but he is no worse than many others.

Hodge has some aweful clangers surprisingly regularly, so too Goo in the backline. Lewis too can be dodgy all too often. Bateman, Morton and Tuck can come up with howlers on a regular basis. And as goal kickers Buddy and Roughy can make one cringe all too often. And that is only a few of the top.

So IMO this issue about BM's kicking is the product of sheep mentality and whipping boy syndrome, as with Taylor and Murphy, and is taken out of reasonable proportion

Top stuff Number 24.




Also it's closer to 4 years Beau has missed all up, from about 17 and a half to 22yrs old he has played SFA, for those who think he has only missed a LITTLE bit of footy.
I don't care how good you are, if you miss that much of any sport it's gonna take time to get back to anywhere near what you were beforehand.
And I would hardly call last year as the amount of time he needs before people judge and dismiss him.

 

[Hawkinspired]

As for Beau Muston...

I believe he can improve on his skills but there is too much competition for him to have a regular spot in the side. He'll certainly get a chance to prove himself at the start of the season but he'll find it tough to cement a place in our top 22.

 

[CharlieMitchell]

So IMO this issue about BM's kicking is the product of sheep mentality and whipping boy syndrome, as with Taylor and Murphy, and is taken out of reasonable proportion

Agree wholeheartedly N24.

As you say, Beau's disposal can be hit and miss at times but then you can apply that to any player on our list. For all of Beau's good disposals, it seems to be the handful of poor one's that stick in some supporters minds.
Compare Beau's disposal against Richmond with that of Suckling and Beau comes out on top - why then is Suckling's performance heralded on this board whilst Beau's goes unnoticed or criticised?