Autopsy The surprisingly mature post loss discussion.

[littlenails]

Honeychurch's disposal efficiency in the reserves this year is about 67% compared with a team average of 73%, his goalkicking accuracy is less than 50% compared with the average of 60%. Lucas webb has similar percentages. Whilst it is probably true that midfielders in the thick of the action will naturally have worse than average disposal efficiency, the figures are not complimentary to him.

I have seen enough of Honeychurch over the last 3 years and he is not AFL standard. He is good at VFL. I think that if he was in the VFL side that played Casey last Saturday night we would have won.

Here is my take on the Best and Fairest votes for the VFL players for the season so far. With 10 points for best down to 1 point for 10th best.

54 Nick Jamieson 47 (8 games)
19 Lucas Webb 44 (7)
22 Mitch Honeychurch 42 (6)
24 Shane Biggs 30 (5)
3 Mitch Wallis 29 (3)
15 Tom Campbell 23 (6)
34 Bailey Williams 22 (4)
44 Timothy English 21 (7)
16 Toby Maclean 20 (2)
65 Jordan Russell 19 (9)
31 Bailey Dale 15 (3)
58 Matthew Goodyear 14 (6)
33 Lewis Young 13 (9)
12 Zaine Cordy 12 (3)
30 Fergus Greene 12 (5)
32 Kieran Collins 12 (9)
23 Jordan Roughead 10 (2)
61 Liam Nash 10 (4)
43 Jack Redpath 9 (4)
27 Patrick Lipinski 8 (4)
53 Billy Gowers 8 (8)
56 Will Hayes 8 (8)
5 Matthew Boyd 7 (1)
26 Declan Hamilton 7 (8)
35 Caleb Daniel 7 (2)
40 Nathan Mullenger-McHugh 7 (8)
60 Andrew Tashevski - Beckwith 7 (6)
18 Fletcher Roberts 6 (3)
21 Tony Liberatore 6 (3)
28 Josh Prudden 6 (6)
13 Travis Cloke 4 (1)
14 Clay Smith 4 (1)
51 Lauchlan Dalgleish 3 (5)
29 Tory Dickson 1 (2)
36 Brad Lynch 1 (5)
63 Nicholas Ryan 1 (2)

Certain players like Young and Collins seem to be on the improve.

Players like Roarke Smith, Mitch Honeychurch, Declan Hamilton and Josh Prudden should have been delisted years ago. There are also others who shouldn't be around come Christmas time.

Our list managers just don't know their stuff. Somebody once scoffed that 'what should we do, just keep delisting players until we end up with a team full of Patrick Dangerfields'; yes, well that's about the size of it.

Others say that players get developed over time and some are late bloomers. I say that we shouldn't be wasting time and resources trying to make a silk purse out of a sow's ear. Do not persevere with duds.

Jack Redpath seems to have a problem raising his arms above his head to take a high mark. This seems to be an on-going problem for the last few years. He took two overhead marks last Saturday but didn't even seem to attempt that action in the weeks before. He is probably at his prime now and will not get any better. He does a few funny things from time-to-time like try to take one-handed marks. Pick him or Cloke? Pick Redpath, he kicks straighter.

 

[Easty]

You can no longer rest your laurels of the stay-at-home forward. If you have a forward who's sitting inside 50 when the play is in defence, they are a liability. You're playing with 17 men.

Just on this, whilst I don't think Beveridge was outcoached (we just didn't run hard enough), the one thing I found strange if at no point we tried to set up a loose man behind the ball to counter our lack of defense run. It might have been because we went in a defender short as it was, but I still found it strange we didn't try it.

 

[TempleKelvington]

https://www.sen.com.au/news/2017/06/20/it-s-a-non-issue-murphy-on-dogs-infighting/

Seems to me that Axe has got an Ox to grind......perhaps hes got his crossed wired just like sentence my.

 

[grassman75]

Worst and best moment from yesterday, anyone?

Worst - When Stringer marked on the wing outside 50, did a little dance on the spot for 20 seconds, then kicked the ball out on full to the jeers of the Melbourne supporters. A perfect microcosm of where we're at right now.

Best - when the ball was in dispute on the edge of 50m and Caleb took control, picked it up and sent through the most perfect straight shot over a crowd of players . The smallest player in the AFL is our best player, he's doing work while others play.

The best moment was when they got us all to hold things up in the air to the lion king sound track

The worst moment was when the cruise boat didn't stop in front of my bay








NB: Neither of these things were good, but the footy was shit too

 

[grassman75]

We won the flag last year because our midfield won the contested ball. Now that we aren't, it's coming into our defence much quicker exposing our defenders, and we can't get anything going up forward as we can't move the ball forward quickly

So Macca was right, contested ball is everything

 

[bresker]

I believe it's important to have the ball before you do anything with it. It's hard to win matches if the opposition have the ball all the time.

Do I qualify for my coaching badges now?

We got our fair share of the footy yesterday, contested ball certainly isn't our only problem.

 

[Substance]

I believe it's important to have the ball before you do anything with it. It's hard to win matches if the opposition have the ball all the time.

Do I qualify for my coaching badges now?

We got our fair share of the footy yesterday, contested ball certainly isn't our only problem.

Yesterday was Tuesday mate.

 

[bresker]

Yesterday was Tuesday mate.

True. For reasons I don't want to go into here it's been a very very long week. One day has melted into another

 

[dogwatch]

Players like Roarke Smith, Mitch Honeychurch, Declan Hamilton and Josh Prudden should have been delisted years ago.

Disagree on Roarke. He has potential as a running half back and hasn't had a fair run at it yet. I'd like to see how he goes in 2018.
The others I could agree with ... even though we sponsor 2 of them.

 

[bresker]

I agree Roarke looks like a player to me. Just hasn't had a run at it.

 

[theAthenian]

My opinion. On reflection.
There äre a lot of things gone wrong at the kennel.
Not melodramatic twitter rubbish, but serious football issues
In short :-
Injuries - The BIGGEST factor
Im surprised its not talked about more - no continuity - across all lines - all season
the idea that made the off season so promising was a crameri stringer cloke dickson smith Etc etc etc.. forward setup with a Tboyd pinch hitting and a plethora of midfielders locking it in - So far cameos from all due to injuries - and an inability to score.
When we lost our number one midfielder - roughie (the first buldog to touch it after the ball up) we were in big trouble and exposed as we were last year but last year we were in ......
Form - The SECOND biggest factor
And those who have escaped the icepack, the moonboot or the surgeon long enough to string games together are either out of form, career lows across the board or struggling to play their role. Watching the games I get a sense of ""exaustion" if that makes sense. We are not on edge ready to move, or on the move around the stoppages or in general play, ready to dart in and sacrifice the body in order to get it rolling towards moving numbers. We are alone, without cover. With ball in hand we seem hesitant, confused or just plain out panicy, at key times for long stretches of time. Our decision making is off, hazy not taking the first option. We are playing as individuals not as a team. Individuals who all seem to be battling off-field issues real or unreal but nevertheless individuals. And off course poor form means poor skills and OMG my eyes! We are in a massive form slump.

The truth is it is still the same list give or take. Surely one hamling cant be the difference!
Right now, as Jack would say to Lou as Bob smiled on "they're playing like a good ordinary team that won a premiership"
The players need to "sober up", work hard and turn the year around, maybe clear the air.
And the same applies to the BFboard

We were 7th last year and 6th the year before at the end of the home and away series
we are the western bulldogs a list full of young kids
Last year's "best young list" is not even a year older
we were never Real Madrid - chill on the delistings, coaching shuffles and draft trading

Time is on our side

#imstillbulldog

 

[Sharkey66]

Looking back at the autopsy for the Freo game, so many posts along the lines of "the loss doesn't mean much to me I dont care im still celebrating last year" .
Its only the last week or two that the anger and angst has returned in these threads it seems.
The players wouldn't be too different I'd imagine, even if only subconsciously.
Its good to see the passion back for all on here, can only hope it's the mental kick up the backside the team needs as well.

 

[lachy]

My opinion. On reflection.
There äre a lot of things gone wrong at the kennel.
Not melodramatic twitter rubbish, but serious football issues
In short :-
Injuries - The BIGGEST factor
Im surprised its not talked about more - no continuity - across all lines - all season
the idea that made the off season so promising was a crameri stringer cloke dickson smith Etc etc etc.. forward setup with a Tboyd pinch hitting and a plethora of midfielders locking it in - So far cameos from all due to injuries - and an inability to score.
When we lost our number one midfielder - roughie (the first buldog to touch it after the ball up) we were in big trouble and exposed as we were last year but last year we were in ......
Form - The SECOND biggest factor
And those who have escaped the icepack, the moonboot or the surgeon long enough to string games together are either out of form, career lows across the board or struggling to play their role. Watching the games I get a sense of ""exaustion" if that makes sense. We are not on edge ready to move, or on the move around the stoppages or in general play, ready to dart in and sacrifice the body in order to get it rolling towards moving numbers. We are alone, without cover. With ball in hand we seem hesitant, confused or just plain out panicy, at key times for long stretches of time. Our decision making is off, hazy not taking the first option. We are playing as individuals not as a team. Individuals who all seem to be battling off-field issues real or unreal but nevertheless individuals. And off course poor form means poor skills and OMG my eyes! We are in a massive form slump.

The truth is it is still the same list give or take. Surely one hamling cant be the difference!
Right now, as Jack would say to Lou as Bob smiled on "they're playing like a good ordinary team that won a premiership"
The players need to "sober up", work hard and turn the year around, maybe clear the air.
And the same applies to the BFboard

We were 7th last year and 6th the year before at the end of the home and away series
we are the western bulldogs a list full of young kids
Last year's "best young list" is not even a year older
we were never Real Madrid - chill on the delistings, coaching shuffles and draft trading

Time is on our side

#imstillbulldog

Fantastic post!!!!

These are not excuses just mere reality. Could some of the other issues had an impact? Absolutely. But these 2 particularly the regularity of the injuries and who they are to and the impact of when they have had them is the biggest impact. There is no one cause, there are a magnitude of causes but injuries are definitely impacting more this season than last

 

[The Buck]

My opinion. On reflection.
There äre a lot of things gone wrong at the kennel.
Not melodramatic twitter rubbish, but serious football issues
In short :-
Injuries - The BIGGEST factor
Im surprised its not talked about more - no continuity - across all lines - all season
the idea that made the off season so promising was a crameri stringer cloke dickson smith Etc etc etc.. forward setup with a Tboyd pinch hitting and a plethora of midfielders locking it in - So far cameos from all due to injuries - and an inability to score.
When we lost our number one midfielder - roughie (the first buldog to touch it after the ball up) we were in big trouble and exposed as we were last year but last year we were in ......
Form - The SECOND biggest factor
And those who have escaped the icepack, the moonboot or the surgeon long enough to string games together are either out of form, career lows across the board or struggling to play their role. Watching the games I get a sense of ""exaustion" if that makes sense. We are not on edge ready to move, or on the move around the stoppages or in general play, ready to dart in and sacrifice the body in order to get it rolling towards moving numbers. We are alone, without cover. With ball in hand we seem hesitant, confused or just plain out panicy, at key times for long stretches of time. Our decision making is off, hazy not taking the first option. We are playing as individuals not as a team. Individuals who all seem to be battling off-field issues real or unreal but nevertheless individuals. And off course poor form means poor skills and OMG my eyes! We are in a massive form slump.

The truth is it is still the same list give or take. Surely one hamling cant be the difference!
Right now, as Jack would say to Lou as Bob smiled on "they're playing like a good ordinary team that won a premiership"
The players need to "sober up", work hard and turn the year around, maybe clear the air.
And the same applies to the BFboard

We were 7th last year and 6th the year before at the end of the home and away series
we are the western bulldogs a list full of young kids
Last year's "best young list" is not even a year older
we were never Real Madrid - chill on the delistings, coaching shuffles and draft trading

Time is on our side

#imstillbulldog

πολύ καλά

 

[Dogs_R_Us]

πολύ καλά

That's easy for you to say

 

[The Inbetweener]

My opinion. On reflection.
There äre a lot of things gone wrong at the kennel.
Not melodramatic twitter rubbish, but serious football issues
In short :-
Injuries - The BIGGEST factor
Im surprised its not talked about more - no continuity - across all lines - all season
the idea that made the off season so promising was a crameri stringer cloke dickson smith Etc etc etc.. forward setup with a Tboyd pinch hitting and a plethora of midfielders locking it in - So far cameos from all due to injuries - and an inability to score.
When we lost our number one midfielder - roughie (the first buldog to touch it after the ball up) we were in big trouble and exposed as we were last year but last year we were in ......
Form - The SECOND biggest factor
And those who have escaped the icepack, the moonboot or the surgeon long enough to string games together are either out of form, career lows across the board or struggling to play their role. Watching the games I get a sense of ""exaustion" if that makes sense. We are not on edge ready to move, or on the move around the stoppages or in general play, ready to dart in and sacrifice the body in order to get it rolling towards moving numbers. We are alone, without cover. With ball in hand we seem hesitant, confused or just plain out panicy, at key times for long stretches of time. Our decision making is off, hazy not taking the first option. We are playing as individuals not as a team. Individuals who all seem to be battling off-field issues real or unreal but nevertheless individuals. And off course poor form means poor skills and OMG my eyes! We are in a massive form slump.

The truth is it is still the same list give or take. Surely one hamling cant be the difference!
Right now, as Jack would say to Lou as Bob smiled on "they're playing like a good ordinary team that won a premiership"
The players need to "sober up", work hard and turn the year around, maybe clear the air.
And the same applies to the BFboard

We were 7th last year and 6th the year before at the end of the home and away series
we are the western bulldogs a list full of young kids
Last year's "best young list" is not even a year older
we were never Real Madrid - chill on the delistings, coaching shuffles and draft trading

Time is on our side

#imstillbulldog

Nice post. Think because of all the injuries last year we and the General footy public have become a bit immune to it this year.

Unfortunately the injury list still looks pretty full

 

[The Buck]

That's easy for you to say

ευχαριστώ

 

[perro_loco]

I was amazed people were calling for his inclusion

In 4 years he has shown zero at AFL level other than an apparent ability at forward pressure which I have also hardly seen.

The same people continue to ask for Campbell to be included when all he has shown is how far off he is.

I said time and time again last year our depth is poor and got screamed down continually. This year has proven our depth is probably worse than I suspected.

If we had no depth, then how were we able to win the premiership last year with all the injuries. in many instances we won games with no rotations, fit platers, etc. Most players came in and performed their role to a 't'. To me that is depth. Also, when you talk about depth, relative to which club are you saying we have no depth. in the afl there is a finite number of quality players, the rest are depth palyer or developing players. are you saying adelaide has no depth because they lost 'unexpectedly' to the hawks, or geelong? this is such a close and unpredicatble season taht i doubt given your definition of depth that any club has 'depth'. hawthorn and sydney could still potentially win the flag given that they are 2 games out of the eight and we just passed the half way mark. this is such an even comp that we could end up 5th if we win this week and results go our way. long way to go to make any predictions about depth, i believe. Go Dogs and greeting from Argentina. Hope we beat NORF!!!

 

[Mattdougie]

If we had no depth, then how were we able to win the premiership last year with all the injuries. in many instances we won games with no rotations, fit platers, etc. Most players came in and performed their role to a 't'. To me that is depth. Also, when you talk about depth, relative to which club are you saying we have no depth. in the afl there is a finite number of quality players, the rest are depth palyer or developing players. are you saying adelaide has no depth because they lost 'unexpectedly' to the hawks, or geelong? this is such a close and unpredicatble season taht i doubt given your definition of depth that any club has 'depth'. hawthorn and sydney could still potentially win the flag given that they are 2 games out of the eight and we just passed the half way mark. this is such an even comp that we could end up 5th if we win this week and results go our way. long way to go to make any predictions about depth, i believe. Go Dogs and greeting from Argentina. Hope we beat NORF!!!

Because nearly every player played year defining seasons or finals series and were able to carry the less talented players

The depth players have been exposed this year and requires to do more which they have been unable to do be use they are simply not good enough.

Each player had a clearly defined role last year that fir the ability they had so they were not expected or asked to do more than they were possible of.

I have no idea what the coaches thought off season but it seems the whole recipe for thrown out the window and something new was bought in that has not worked from day one.

We lost two very ordinary depth players in Hrvat and Stevens and that is why we have fallen? If those blokes were still on the list would we be any better?

And a lot of the players that carried the VFL team were not AFL bulldog players.

From round 1 this year the team has been weaker than at any stage last year and selection has proven that week in week out IMO. I've said it all year of certain blokes are playing we are not good enough and that has proven to be 100% correct

 

[Mr. Walker]

The best moment was when they got us all to hold things up in the air to the lion king sound track

The worst moment was when the cruise boat didn't stop in front of my bay

NB: Neither of these things were good, but the footy was shit too

Anyone else find it strange, in an "only the Bulldogs could do it" kind of way, that when they do that cruise promotion they use "six months in a leaky boat" as the sound track?

 

[flamethrower]

Anyone else find it strange, in an "only the Bulldogs could do it" kind of way, that when they do that cruise promotion they use "six months in a leaky boat" as the sound track?

Maybe they should start using the Titanic theme?

 

[Deadly Darcy]

Think Norm will need to change the thread title if we happen to roll over tonight

 

[X_box_X]