Strategy Trade and List management Thread Part 2 (opposition supporters - READ posting rules before posting)

[hatescaptcha]

Yes to Martin - He'd be dynamic on the Wing / Forward in our side.

Not interested in much else on the market however.

 

[Dogsman16]

The player under the most pressure this finals series out of any team is Zaine Cordy.

Likely Jeremy Cameron he cops first week. If we get past GWS and Brisbane beat Richmond then he gets Riewoldt second week.

His stats don't make for good reading. And hes possibly up against two of the best athletic forwards of the past decade.

 

[Libba39]

What about when beveridge declared we were going to fix our key forward woes in the mid-season draft.......and all he had up his sleeve was Ryan Gardner.

They threw him straight in as the saviour and he had all of 12 possessions in 2 games (including 3 against the might of Carlton) before getting binned.

That’s seriously one of the most unexplainable periods in Beveridge’s history. Amazing how wrong they got it.

I disagree. Schache needed to go back to the twos so they threw Gardner into the mix. He did ok against WCE and the whole team was off against Carlton (Didn't Sam Petrevski-Seton get 40 pos?).

That is all beside the point however. What it did was allow Schache to have a break and go back and work on things and come back a better player. Proof is in the pudding.

 

[dogwatch]

Also not suggesting we put him up trade him, but GC would be mental if they didnt make a serious play for Mitch Wallis. Absolutely the type they need.

Should go again. Jong too.

Honeychurch too

This is the sort of thinking that will doom GCS to forever be the poor cousin (not sure if Ossie is serious but others have suggested Hrovat as well - similar deal). I know Mitch Wallis is a decent player and would probably get a regular game at quite a few clubs but sending them a clutch of B-graders and cast-offs just because it's those players' last chance of keeping an AFL career going is not the answer. It's just going to clog up their list.

What GCS needs is some serious help from the top down, not some bandaids at the bottom end. Whether a priority pick is part of that package is an open question but the AFL must be seriously worried. They've invested a lot in GCS and GWS and both are essential for their TV rights and national development strategies. One's working OK. The other is sinking fast.

 

[Dogsman16]

This is the sort of thinking that will doom GCS to forever be the poor cousin (not sure if Ossie is serious but others have suggested Hrovat as well - similar deal). I know Mitch Wallis is a decent player and would probably get a regular game at quite a few clubs but sending them a clutch of B-graders and cast-offs just because it's those players' last chance of keeping an AFL career going is not the answer. It's just going to clog up their list.

What GCS needs is some serious help from the top down, not some bandaids at the bottom end. Whether a priority pick is part of that package is an open question but the AFL must be seriously worried. They've invested a lot in GCS and GWS and both are essential for their TV rights and national development strategies. One's working OK. The other is sinking fast.

Think there drafting methods have been horrendous. Too focused on KPP’s and not enough on mids.

That being said also, surely they could have taken Max King one pick higher and made it difficult for the twins to leave each other.

 

[oneoffpost]

I’m keen on bringing Bruce to the Kennel but I swear to The Bont if Naughton gets moved back, I’m ripping up my Interstate membership and will stop going to the one game a year I get to see live (I won’t really)
I feel like I’m in an episode of Stranger Things in the Upside Down world. We’ve been crying out for a generational forward for...... Well forever.
Let the kid learn his craft, he’s got the attributes and potential to be something special.

 

[Northernsoul74]

I’m keen on bringing Bruce to the Kennel but I swear to The Bont if Naughton gets moved back, I’m ripping up my Interstate membership and will stop going to the one game a year I get to see live (I won’t really)
I feel like I’m in an episode of Stranger Things in the Upside Down world. We’ve been crying out for a generational forward for...... Well forever.
Let the kid learn his craft, he’s got the attributes and potential to be something special.

With Bailey Smith.

 

[TMoney22]

Wallis signed with the Bulldogs last year on less money then he could get elsewhere. Gellong can't get Charlie Constable in their side despite excellent VFL form as an inside mid. I can't see this happening.

I reckon he could take Kelly's spot in the team and eventually play Selwoods role. I realise he resigned and this only happens if Mitch wants more opportunity than we can give him. If he is happy to stay knowing he will be borderline 22 that's cool too.

Need to find ways to improve our best 22.

 

[Snarls Barkley]

This is the sort of thinking that will doom GCS to forever be the poor cousin (not sure if Ossie is serious but others have suggested Hrovat as well - similar deal). I know Mitch Wallis is a decent player and would probably get a regular game at quite a few clubs but sending them a clutch of B-graders and cast-offs just because it's those players' last chance of keeping an AFL career going is not the answer. It's just going to clog up their list.

What GCS needs is some serious help from the top down, not some bandaids at the bottom end. Whether a priority pick is part of that package is an open question but the AFL must be seriously worried. They've invested a lot in GCS and GWS and both are essential for their TV rights and national development strategies. One's working OK. The other is sinking fast.

Think there drafting methods have been horrendous. Too focused on KPP’s and not enough on mids.

That being said also, surely they could have taken Max King one pick higher and made it difficult for the twins to leave each other.

I posted this somewhere else earlier in the season but I think it’s easy to forget how close they were to having it clicking in 2014. They had a team that on average was a year younger than the side we fielded last weekend. They were in 8th spot (9-6, 101.5%) but after Ablett’s injury finished the year 1-6 with a percentage of 78 and ended up two games outside the finals places.

In their side they had Ablett at 30 playing a career season, promising KPPs in May, Thompson, Lynch, Dixon and Day who were between 21 and 23 and had played between 40 and 60 games, had an imposing young midfield with Prestia, Swallow, O’Meara and Bennell who were 21 with 60 games played (20 and 40 for O’Meara) and Martin and Kolodjashnij looked good in their first seasons. Rischitelli, Broughton and Harbrow were more than decent experienced talent and they should’ve been chasing more experience to add to that (added Malceski as free agent at EOS but probably could’ve gone even harder). Their bottom 6 was still pretty weak.

Their midfield never got close to playing together again.

Bennell - 15 games in 2015 then traded to Fremantle
Prestia - 8 games in 2015, 14 games in 2016 then traded to Richmond
O’ Meara - 0 games in 2015 & 2016 then traded to Hawthorn
Ablett - 6 games in 2015, 14 games in 2016, 14 games in 2017 then traded back to Geelong
Swallow - 6 games in 2015, 0 games in 2016, has stayed at GC but isn’t the same player he was pre-injuries

Their biggest draft problems have been drafting those skilled flakey flanker types that Scott Clayton loves. They can be very useful if you’ve got the inside stuff sorted but can be pretty ineffectual when you don’t and they picked up a heap of them early like Martin, Ah Chee, Garlett, Lemmens. If their midfield had have stayed together I think a lot of these players would’ve had better careers than they have had so far.

2016 they had four picks in the top 10 (Ainsworth, Scrimshaw, Brodie, Bowes) and you could argue they picked the worst four although I think Bowes is a good player, Ainsworth has shown signs and Brodie still has time. 2017 they were forced to overpay for Lachie Weller because they couldn’t afford to not bring in a player that wanted to play there after all their departures, 2018 they picked up Lukosius and King who I’ve been impressed with but already rumours they both want out, Rankine missed the season through injury but at least sounds more excited to stay but is he going to be another flakey flanker? Not a lot seems to be going their way and not sure what the answers for them are.

The other problem is that they’re losing almost all their stars and are having to pay overs to the others to try and keep them. Apparently their salary cap is bursting at the seams for a team that hasn’t one won of their past 18 games.

 

[Boyd oh Boyd]

Think there drafting methods have been horrendous. Too focused on KPP’s and not enough on mids.

That being said also, surely they could have taken Max King one pick higher and made it difficult for the twins to leave each other.

Drafting KPPs before mids is actually the better way to rebuild, as they talk longer to develop where mids can have an impact in their first 3 years.

 

[Bemoreboyddog]

My top priorities from those that have been linked to us are Bruce, Keath and either Smith or Martin, with a view to lining up like this:

FB: Crozier - Naughton - Wood
HB: Johannisen - Keath - Daniel
C: I. Smith - Bontempelli - Hunter
HF: Lloyd - Schache - Dale
FF: McLean - Bruce - Lipinski

R: English - Dunkley - Macrae

I: B. Smith - Duryea - Suckling - one of Libba/Young/West/Cordy/Trengove/Richards etc

I think this is an extraordinarily dangerous side and as good a structure as we've had in quite some time.

Like everyone else, I would prefer to see Naughton developed as a forward. With that said, however, Naughton will be a star no matter where we play him, and I contend that having Naughton in the backline is the quickest route to possessing a damaging spine, particularly if the Bruce rumours are to be believed.

As an aside, I don't think we should hesitate to float or make moves on guys we might prefer to stick with us but have no obvious pathway into the team if it helps us acquire our targets. I'm talking about the likes of Williams and Wallis here. I think you could argue whether Libba fits here as well but I wouldn't dare open that can of worms (along with a couple of others).

The other interesting one is McLean. I think he's at risk, particularly if one or more of West/Cavarra/Greene become realistic options in the forward line - but that's a problem for another day.

At any rate, my point is that I think we're faced with an opportunity to put ourselves in a terrific position if you buy that we're in with a chance for these players. If that means moving first round picks or making hard calls on good players that don't quite fit in, I don't think we should be against that.

Personally, if we landed Bruce I wouldn’t chase Keath as well, I’d actually prefer we chase Keath. I’d still like Trengove to be FB taking on the big guys like Hawkins, Dixon etc.

 

[Bemoreboyddog]

It’s gross list management to pay anything upwards of $600,000 on potential alone and looking at martin that’s really all he’s got going for him. Looking at the stats he seems on the same level as McLean this year which is BOG average when you consider McLean has had his worst year since his draft year.

MTW is a proven match winner and beats Martin on just about every metric bar marking and I think we have strong enough marking options in our forward line already and need a zippy point of difference. (Remember Martin isn’t even fast) Big no from me unless we’re paying him far less then what’s been spoken about so far.

Gross mismanagement won us a flag.

 

[Snarls Barkley]

Drafting KPPs before mids is actually the better way to rebuild, as they talk longer to develop where mids can have an impact in their first 3 years.

Certainly the method Brisbane and Carlton have gone with.

Brisbane got Andrews, Gardiner, Schache and Hipwood before the midfield (mid sized) talent of McCluggage, Berry, Witherden, Rayner and Bailey.

Carlton got Weitering, Curnow and McKay in one draft and have gone with Petrevski-Seton, Fisher, Dow, O’Brien and Walsh in the drafts since.

We’ve gone the other way. Built the midfield first and have only recently brought in the young talls of English, Naughton and Schache. And Boyd and Collins too.

 

[Royale]

We also brought in Adams.

On VOG-L09 using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[LittleG]

McLuggage is who I would love on a wing. Worth chasing with big dollars.

 

[Smiley Boy]

 

[Northernsoul74]

View attachment 735348

Around the same mark as Martin.

 

[House_of_Dahl]

Another reason why Naughton is best suited forward, even though yes he is probably way more consistent as a defender. But tell me how many tall forwards are quick and as mobile as Naughton is? His chasing and defensive efforts are second to none. Find me another key tall his height that is the same. Given the modern game plan is to create pressure and lock it in. You're practically one less player with a lumbering tall that some teams have, some even have a couple of Lumbering forwards. Naughton suits the modern style well and takes pressure off other players to cover for someone else.

100% You get the bonus of having an elite defender in our forward 50. No way he moves back unless forced by circumstance.

 

[mattwa]

Cogs staying at gws.

For all the utter rubbish that hawks fans have been dribbling for months this is amazing Haha

 

[Smiley Boy]

Carlton will end up with Martin now will blow stupid cash to get him after they missed out on Cogs

 

[Munnez]

Cogs staying at gws.

For all the utter rubbish that hawks fans have been dribbling for months this is amazing Haha

Nearly as good as a win

 

[Munnez]

Carlton will end up with Martin now will blow stupid cash to get him after they missed out on Cogs

Let's face it they need to 'win' something to sell hope to their fans

 

[glenashley]

As less and less free agents / uncontracted players become available, watch the bidding war get stupider and stupider with what's left (but even then, no one wants to go to norf).

 

[Dogs_R_Us]

Coniglio signs with the Giants for SEVEN years

 

[Charlie Bucket]

Coniglio signs with the Giants for SEVEN years

Would’ve preferred him signing after we played them