Strategy Trade and List management Thread Part 4 (opposition supporters - READ posting rules before posting)

[Mofra]

Giving the importance of the ruck position it's such a strange approach. Nobody here is thinking we should just go out and get Gawn or Grundy or Darcy (Freo) - that's not happening. But give us a ******* chance at having a functional ruck in every game we play.

The more annoying part isn't that we don't have any capable ruck depth, it's the fact that they can come remarkably cheap. A 3rd rounder(ish) gets you the type of ruck who moves for more opportunity - a Pittonet, Nankervis, Witts type. Go cheaper and you end up with a Hickey or Xerri.

Even in recent years if you want to 'draft and develop' a ruck, most of the good ones are pretty cheap. Yes we took Sweet for a pittance but just in the past few drafts where rucks are starting to emerge you'be got Nyuon for a late 3rd in 2019, Ned Reeves a PSD pick, Kieran Strahan and Fort a rookie, Xerri a 5th rounder and Ballendon a 3rd in 2018, then you hit more riches going a bit further back:

In the 2016 rookie draft alone: Draper, Marshall, Ladhams, The big O and Max Lynch

We've taken one ruck since taking English in 2016: Sweet as a rookie in 2017, and if you want to stretch the position to ruck/utility - NMM for a few months in the 2016 rookie draft

 

[Virgin Dog]

Raak is not a KPD and never will be KPP are drafted around the 200cm mark now not the 193cm he is more of what we already have
Cleary is no different to Dale Crozier Richards Williams Khamis
McComb dont make me laugh
Parker as winger is intriguing
Jones and Darcy both ticks

Steven May is ~193cm. Yes, things are trending towards clubs wanting KPDs in the high 190s, but that doesn't rule out Raak becoming a KPD despite "only" being 193cm. Still, I think he'll more likely end up an interceptor (3rd tall) than a true KPD.

I share your view on Cleary - I see him closest to Williams out of all our defenders, although haven't seen anywhere near enough of him yet.

 

[Boyd oh Boyd]

Raak is not a KPD and never will be KPP are drafted around the 200cm mark now not the 193cm he is more of what we already have
Cleary is no different to Dale Crozier Richards Williams Khamis
McComb dont make me laugh
Parker as winger is intriguing
Jones and Darcy both ticks

Steven May is 193. The body he'll grow into matters just as much as his height.

 

[Dog 36]

Kieran Collins

Kieran Collins

Age

26

Ht

194cm

Wt

100kg

Pos.

Def

Career

Season

Last 5

D

4.0

1star

K

4.0

2star

HB

0.0

1star

M

2.0

2star

T

1.0

3star

MG

116.0

2star

No current season stats available

D

4.0

1star

K

4.0

2star

HB

0.0

1star

M

2.0

3star

T

1.0

3star

MG

116.0

2star

was I think around 193 cm nice build but ……

 

[immortalmike]

Wish we had shipped Dunkley off at the end of last year. Surely could have used him for a high future pick and a best 22 key back.

 

[Mofra]

Wish we had shipped Dunkley off at the end of last year. Surely could have used him for a high future pick and a best 22 key back.

Without Dunkley we probably lose the Swans game

 

[VitalDread]

Without Dunkley we probably lose the Swans game

Rather be 0-4 than 1-3

Picks picks picks

 

[immortalmike]

Without Dunkley we probably lose the Swans game

With a more balanced list we probably win the first three games and/or make top four last year.

 

[immortalmike]

Rather be 0-4 than 1-3

Picks picks picks

A decent key back might have helped a bit in the first few games. Getting monstered by McKay and Curnow was fun.

 

[Charlie Bucket]

The more annoying part isn't that we don't have any capable ruck depth, it's the fact that they can come remarkably cheap. A 3rd rounder(ish) gets you the type of ruck who moves for more opportunity - a Pittonet, Nankervis, Witts type. Go cheaper and you end up with a Hickey or Xerri.

Even in recent years if you want to 'draft and develop' a ruck, most of the good ones are pretty cheap. Yes we took Sweet for a pittance but just in the past few drafts where rucks are starting to emerge you'be got Nyuon for a late 3rd in 2019, Ned Reeves a PSD pick, Kieran Strahan and Fort a rookie, Xerri a 5th rounder and Ballendon a 3rd in 2018, then you hit more riches going a bit further back:

In the 2016 rookie draft alone: Draper, Marshall, Ladhams, The big O and Max Lynch

We've taken one ruck since taking English in 2016: Sweet as a rookie in 2017, and if you want to stretch the position to ruck/utility - NMM for a few months in the 2016 rookie draft

One ruck in 6 years is putrid. Even more so when the one we took could end up ring the worst of them all.

 

[Dogs_R_Us]

Because Tim English wants to be number 1 Ruckman

I wish he’d just sign a bloody contract, the uncertainty is going to magnify an already painful season.

 

[Bulldogs85]

I wish he’d just sign a bloody contract, the uncertainty is going to magnify an already painful season.

Get this sick feeling that he is leaving at the end of the year GOD I should give myself a uppercut just thinking about it

 

[doggies ftw]

Bit harsh. Played mostly forward for the first six weeks. Missed about eight weeks with a concussion. Wasn't the same player when he came back, forward or ruck.



Geelong?

I’m one of his biggest fans but let’s be honest he’s been close to the worst number 1 ruckman for any club in the league I don’t think that’s overly a big call, as of right now probably mid tier - I don’t think that’s any position to be demanding number 1 ruck spots.

Okay he might have one side who may or may not be interested in him where he can get what he wants - it’s not exactly as strong a bargaining position as people are making out though

 

[Dogs_R_Us]

I’m one of his biggest fans but let’s be honest he’s been close to the worst number 1 ruckman for any club in the league I don’t think that’s overly a big call, as of right now probably mid tier - I don’t think that’s any position to be demanding number 1 ruck spots.

Okay he might have one side who may or may not be interested in him where he can get what he wants - it’s not exactly as strong a bargaining position as people are making out though

He’ll get better. I want it to be with us

 

[ScragCity]

I’m one of his biggest fans but let’s be honest he’s been close to the worst number 1 ruckman for any club in the league I don’t think that’s overly a big call, as of right now probably mid tier - I don’t think that’s any position to be demanding number 1 ruck spots.

Okay he might have one side who may or may not be interested in him where he can get what he wants - it’s not exactly as strong a bargaining position as people are making out though

I'd say he is the form ruck of the comp right now after 4 rounds. This year's form is more relevant than last year's in any contract negotiations.

 

[lachy]

If we believe JUH is a genuine developing KPF maybe it is about looking at utilising one of our better mids or versatile players with decent currency to get in a quality KPF and not a Defender.

That would give us a genuine opportunity to push Naughton back who with Keith gives us 2 quality KPD's, Gards as a back up and Darcy developing.

Forward we get Bruce back, our KPF recruit and JUH developing. Make another developing and Back up KPF priorities in both drafts next season.

Then we really only need to work on the ruck situation.

We are not that far away from a quality balanced list but are we courage's enough as a club as well as supporters to give up quality in an area we have substantial depth to bring in a quality need

 

[Foxman98]

If we believe JUH is a genuine developing KPF maybe it is about looking at utilising one of our better mids or versatile players with decent currency to get in a quality KPF and not a Defender.

That would give us a genuine opportunity to push Naughton back who with Keith gives us 2 quality KPD's, Gards as a back up and Darcy developing.

Forward we get Bruce back, our KPF recruit and JUH developing. Make another developing and Back up KPF priorities in both drafts next season.

Then we really only need to work on the ruck situation.

We are not that far away from a quality balanced list but are we courage's enough as a club as well as supporters to give up quality in an area we have substantial depth to bring in a quality need

McStay is one for the now and slightly long term and then can trade a Dunkley to get a higher pick to draft a developing one in and free up cap space for McStay

 

[Bulldogs85]

Since everyone talking about Ruckman how about this young lad from GWS Kieren Briggs is behind Flynn and Preuss wouldn’t cost much in a trade

 

[Mofra]

Since everyone talking about Ruckman how about this young lad from GWS Kieren Briggs is behind Flynn and Preuss wouldn’t cost much in a trade

Getting any GWS player to the bulldogs would be tough, let alone a local they'd be desperate to keep.

One to watch - Charlie Comben from North. He's a forward/ruck, still a bit skinny and developing but should be ready to go from 2024 in the post-Bruce era. Has shown glimpses.

Between Larkey, Xerri, Edwards and CCJ he might find opportunity hard to come by as he develops so we might hold some appeal. English looks set to be our no 1 ruck so a genuine tall who can chop out for 20-25% of the time and offer a target forward would help us.

 

[Mofra]

Two other names to look at:
Jackson Payne (KPD) is under contract but can't get a game for the Lions. We asked about him previously so he knows we're interested and I doubt he's on big coin.

I'd keep a close eye on Brayden Crossley

Brayden Crossley

Age

25

Ht

198cm

Wt

102kg

Pos.

Fwd

Career

Season

Last 5

D

9.4

2star

K

4.5

2star

HB

4.9

4star

M

2.4

3star

T

2.2

4star

G

0.5

3star

No current season stats available

D

9.2

3star

K

5.0

2star

HB

4.2

4star

M

2.0

3star

T

2.2

4star

G

0.6

3star

at Southport, 198cm ruck/forward and strong body. He showed signs at AFL level before getting cut by Gold Coast serving a coke suspension. Potential base salary DFA signing that provides us with depth in the ruck and as a forward. Still only 22.
Exactly the sort of cheap depth we desperately need given our cap issues.

 

[Bulldogs85]

Getting any GWS player to the bulldogs would be tough, let alone a local they'd be desperate to keep.

One to watch - Charlie Comben from North. He's a forward/ruck, still a bit skinny and developing but should be ready to go from 2024 in the post-Bruce era. Has shown glimpses.

Between Larkey, Xerri, Edwards and CCJ he might find opportunity hard to come by as he develops so we might hold some appeal. English looks set to be our no 1 ruck so a genuine tall who can chop out for 20-25% of the time and offer a target forward would help us.

Wishful thinking on my part

 

[weltschmerz]

Two other names to look at:
Jackson Payne (KPD) is under contract but can't get a game for the Lions. We asked about him previously so he knows we're interested and I doubt he's on big coin.

I'd keep a close eye on Brayden Crossley at Southport, 198cm ruck/forward and strong body. He showed signs at AFL level before getting cut by Gold Coast serving a coke suspension. Potential base salary DFA signing that provides us with depth in the ruck and as a forward. Still only 22.
Exactly the sort of cheap depth we desperately need given our cap issues.

Crossley was potentially the best non-AFL ruck in the VFL last year. Bevo would also approve of his facial hair choices.

 

[Bulldogs85]

Two other names to look at:
Jackson Payne (KPD) is under contract but can't get a game for the Lions. We asked about him previously so he knows we're interested and I doubt he's on big coin.

I'd keep a close eye on Brayden Crossley at Southport, 198cm ruck/forward and strong body. He showed signs at AFL level before getting cut by Gold Coast serving a coke suspension. Potential base salary DFA signing that provides us with depth in the ruck and as a forward. Still only 22.
Exactly the sort of cheap depth we desperately need given our cap issues.

Saints were also interested in Jackson Payne at one point

 

[weltschmerz]

Saints were also interested in Jackson Payne at one point

They need more Jacks clearly

 

[House_of_Dahl]

I havent heard the interview no but doesn’t sound surprising that his manager has done his job in trying to increase his power, and in turn value, through the media.

You think Bev of all people would give into a demand like that? I’d say if anything he’d go the opposite way and play him forward out of principle. If that’s the way Tim thinks he can fu** off he was the worst ruckman in the league last year and there’s not a single club in the league even this year that would play him one out in the ruck, so I’m not sure what foot you believe he has to stand on? Where’s he going where he’s going to be the lone ruck?

One of Bevos pressers this year he made a comment along the lines of - Tim wants to be a number one ruck, and was said in the context of limited tall forward options atm. So sounds like there is truth to it