Strategy Trade and List Management Thread Part 7 (opposition supporters - READ posting rules before posting)
- Thread starter Mutt
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I agree with the general sentiment that Harmes and Kennedy for Macrae and Daniel feels like a bit of deck chair shuffling.
However, Harmes was absolutely humming before he got injured this year.
I can see both being quite solid 20th and 21st best players on a premiership team
That and the potential of a DFA
dogwatch
Premium Platinum
Not everybody's going to be happy. And maybe nobody will be totally happy.
But I keep reading each year how we hang on to players too long. I may have said as much myself over the years.
I keep reading how we are too slow and need more speed.
I keep reading how the modern game has gone past players like Macrae and Daniel.
I keep reading how we need to offload show ponies like Bmith who aren't all-in for the club and his teammates (contrast that with Lobb's attitude in 2024).
I keep reading (and sometimes saying) that we need a few more hard bastards on the list.
I keep reading how we need to stop being bullied, how we need to tackle more, how we need to find space in the midfield for emerging talent like Sanders, West and Garcia.
And on and on.
Every one of those propositions has at least partial validity. Looks like most of the above are going to eventuate. The trouble is they aren't all compatible with loyalty to past Bullgods and their smooth transition to retirement as a one-club legend, or with the "nice" club that many (including me) hope we can continue to be. We are being hard-nosed and pragmatic, just like all our rival clubs. So there simply can't be many fairy tale endings.
It seems we will be moving on players who no longer fit the current thinking of the coaches (whether that thinking is right or wrong). We are clearing out some of the older players who have only been fringe in 2024 (whether that was right or wrong selection policy). We are in fact looking to do many of the things that people have been crying out for.
We might as well embrace the personnel changes and hope the coaches have got it right. Let's just hope we don't get screwed for picks at the same time.
Step forward Sam Power. Now is your moment...
But I keep reading each year how we hang on to players too long. I may have said as much myself over the years.
I keep reading how we are too slow and need more speed.
I keep reading how the modern game has gone past players like Macrae and Daniel.
I keep reading how we need to offload show ponies like Bmith who aren't all-in for the club and his teammates (contrast that with Lobb's attitude in 2024).
I keep reading (and sometimes saying) that we need a few more hard bastards on the list.
I keep reading how we need to stop being bullied, how we need to tackle more, how we need to find space in the midfield for emerging talent like Sanders, West and Garcia.
And on and on.
Every one of those propositions has at least partial validity. Looks like most of the above are going to eventuate. The trouble is they aren't all compatible with loyalty to past Bullgods and their smooth transition to retirement as a one-club legend, or with the "nice" club that many (including me) hope we can continue to be. We are being hard-nosed and pragmatic, just like all our rival clubs. So there simply can't be many fairy tale endings.
It seems we will be moving on players who no longer fit the current thinking of the coaches (whether that thinking is right or wrong). We are clearing out some of the older players who have only been fringe in 2024 (whether that was right or wrong selection policy). We are in fact looking to do many of the things that people have been crying out for.
We might as well embrace the personnel changes and hope the coaches have got it right. Let's just hope we don't get screwed for picks at the same time.
Step forward Sam Power. Now is your moment...
That's robbery
OUT: O'Driscoll, Bedendo, Rypstra (rookie), Smith (assumed), Macrae (assumed)
TBD: Clarke, Keath, Daniel
Our list balance is currently 33 main list (not including Smith & Macrae) + 5 Cat A rookies + 1 Cat B rookie.
Based on that, we have a total of 4 main/Cat A rookie spots to fill, which can come from 2-4 main list + 0-2 Cat A rookies - assuming no rookie upgrades have occured. We also have an available Cat B rookie position open.
Daniel, Keath or Clarke departing opens up further spots, minus any trade ins (Kennedy, XOH etc).
threenewpadlocks
Brownlow Medallist
Baker's good VFL form consistently throughout the year would also mean that he would have gotten a game in a lot of other bad teams, and provides solid depth, and is another name people are forgetting that could be part of the rotation.
- Apr 23, 2013
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Blues definitely looking for R2 pick.
I like him as a player ,but will be surprised if we can give them a r2 ?
Pocket Terrace
Team Captain
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I don’t get too caught up in trade period. Footy season is over.
Having said that, it feels it will be a very similar outcome to recent years. Target fringe players, plus sign on JJ for his annual contract in the hope he can be the player he was 8 years ago. Rinse and repeat.
Having said that, it feels it will be a very similar outcome to recent years. Target fringe players, plus sign on JJ for his annual contract in the hope he can be the player he was 8 years ago. Rinse and repeat.
Dog 36
Norm Smith Medallist
I haven’t payed much attention when Hannebery talks
When we think or hear of Hannebery we all know what image comes to mind!
Not exactly correct but actually even worse.
Saints offered F2 but Carlton want a top 30 pick this year to get ahead of father son bids on the Camporeale twins. They aren't happy Saints split pick 27 as Carlton believe a bid could come before 32.
Baker is the type of player you need on the list. Can play a role if needed, low salary demands and won’t sook it up playing vfl.
Re Daniel, best he moves on and sad to see him go but I would expect he will not be best 22 in NM in 2 years time. If he slows down a little more his deficiencies will be amplified. Dogs making the right call.
That is definitely the same view I’d have if I also didn’t pay attention.
Why did you have to bring this up??????
I got so excited when this trade came through. We had solved our KPF problems and won trade week. How wrong I was. How very very wrong.
threenewpadlocks
Brownlow Medallist
Lets not get lost in the weeds of rookie listed players because it can create confusion and teams spread among the different categories for salary cap reasons etc that's not pertinent to our discussion.
Essentially you have 42 players
James O'Donnell also has to get upgraded from Cat B (outside the list) to onto the list, because we signed him to a two-year deal. It wasn't explicitly stated that he would cease to be a Cat B rookie next year but we would assume that's the case, though he remains eligible to be a Cat B rookie we would want to ward off other potential teams recruiting him.
We are allowed a maximum of 42 players across main list and Cat A rookie.
We can add another 2 Cat B rookies (either tied to F/S or academy, or a other sport recruit like O'Donnell).
Out: O'Driscoll, Bedendo, Smith, Macrae, Daniel (5 players)
In: O'Donnell, Kennedy, O'Halloran (3 players).
I anticipate whether we delist Clarke or Keath depend on whether or not the XOH deal goes through, to take three draft picks. Maybe we delist both (or one absent recruiting XOH) in order to have a fourth list spot open, either to take a fourth draft pick or to hold over a list spot for the SSP period.
We may be downgrading Keath or Clarke to the rookie list if necessary, if we are retaining them (or maybe will do so with JJ, as we did with Duryea last year).
We have picks 35, 48, 90. If we take 3 picks, it'll be whatever we get for Smith, and whatever 35 and 48 become after the Daniel and Smith trades, are both are likely to be upgraded to earlier picks in the 20's and 30s. So we'll have three picks in a quick 15-20 grouping between pick 21 and 40 or so, but nothing later than that IMO.
We'll probably ontrade the future second we get from Geelong onto GWS to get XOH, maybe get a future third or future fourth back.
If we're not going to win shit might as well be here for nostalgia.
lmao im sorry was just the trade that came to mind when thinking of shock out of nowhere trades
dont worry i was also saying we got a steal there when it happened
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Bailey Sniff to the draft
threenewpadlocks
Brownlow Medallist
Lol, it shouldn't be St Kilda's responsibility for how Carlton's overall draft hand influences their strategic decisions over the next two years, providing they're paying fair value
If Carlton want to get ahead of a pick 32 they can take the F2 to market and trade it themselves to any club.
