List Mgmt. Trade & Free Agency talk Pt 2

[Sir_Loin]

Pies rationale was that Treloar's mental health will suffer being away from his partner and child. With both QLD clubs going cold on Treloar what will their reasoning be now?

geez. What an indictment on their culture. Talking about throwing the bloke under a bus. As much as I like taking the piss this is atrocious. Wouldn’t happen at the tiges (a contract that big included).

 

[prodigy]

you are dreaming lol

Mate, you have to pay overs if you want to break someone's contract.
Some here think pick 15 isn't even enough.

15 should 100% be in the conversation, or their first next year.

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[SumTingWong]

Higgo to saints pretty much done

You told us a week ago that Crouch was going to sign a 5 year deal with the cats. So yeah thanks lol

 

[Yappie dribbles]

You told us a week ago that Crouch was going to sign a 5 year deal with the cats. So yeah thanks lol

He did sign 5 years Just wrong club lol

 

[Dunger]

geez. What an indictment on their culture. Talking about throwing the bloke under a bus. As much as I like taking the piss this is atrocious. Wouldn’t happen at the tiges (a contract that big included).

Totally disgraceful. Pies have shot themselves in the foot because he's now got no trade value if there are concerns about his mental health and 'coach-ability'.

He's a couple of 2nd round picks because of that.

Pick 5 for a bloke that might not cope and or is unable to follow coaches instructions? You're better off taking a gun kid from the draft that you know you can develop.

 

[Tiger_Of_Old]

Mate, you have to pay overs if you want to break someone's contract.
Some here think pick 15 isn't even enough.

15 should 100% be in the conversation, or their first next year.

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I'd go future 1st.
2 things.
Will be able to keep a list spot open for those on the fringe to stay for another year.
And we'd know exactly who's performing in the tac cup.

 

[Hank Heavenly]

I'm almost with you. Again, the clubs do get 8-10 years out of that player, and then they've not been able to retain them. They also then get the win of freeing up the salary to go after someone else, so they don't also need high level picks.

I do like the idea of really low level compensation though. The NFL does similar, giving teams picks in rounds 3-7, and they also delay it a year to make sure they are weighting them correctly. I like the idea of something between that and what the AFL has now. Say a team like GWS- they're on the cusp of contending or going backwards. They could face quite a few players leaving and thrust them right to the bottom. They've then got to fill a lot of list spots- however many they planned to as well as a few extra due to free agents. If there's no compo, all those extra spots would be taken by guys right at the end of the draft, or rookies. By giving compensation (2nd round for Cameron/Williams, perhaps 3rd or 4th rounders for other players) it gives the Giants a chance to get some talent at a reasonable level, rather than filling their list with battlers and delaying a return to the top.

I'd also like the removal of restricted free agency, while we're at it. Other comps around the world face their players entering free agency a lot earlier than 8 years. So the AFL have an 8 year window to retain the player, or trade them if needed. Then after that 8 years is up, they still have them by the balls for another 2. Situations like Tim Kelly

11

Tim Kelly

Age

30

Ht

184cm

Wt

83kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

23.6

5star

K

13.5

5star

HB

10.1

5star

M

3.4

3star

T

4.0

5star

CL

4.9

5star

D

19.9

5star

K

12.3

5star

HB

7.6

4star

M

3.1

3star

T

4.7

5star

CL

3.6

4star

D

21.6

5star

K

10.4

4star

HB

11.2

5star

M

2.8

3star

T

3.8

5star

CL

3.8

5star

(I realise he wasn't an RFA) made me sick. Players deserve that freedom to go to the city they want, or leave a bad environment. Waiting up to 10 years just isn't right. I'd love to see unrestricted at 6 years, but realise that's probably too much for most.

So while I'm revamping the AFL's free agency, let's go for.
RFA at 6 years
Unrestricted at 8 years
Compo bands greatly reduced, from 2nd to 6th rounders
Clubs can trade players at will in their first six years, as long as lower income players are protected from interstate moves.


100%- I believe last year we were due to get more for Ellis but they moved us down a band (I could be wrong with that though).

Heres what Ive proposed before... Strip it right back and bring FA timeframes right down.

With a lot of bullshit talk around Free Agency, aimed at the process, aimed at the rules, aimed at the clubs and aimed at the players, I think it's important to look at what the ideal Free Agency model looks like. For mine, if it was really broken down and potentially invited a lot more player movement, it would actually break down some of these "godfather" type offers. Here's what I think it should look like and what implications that would have moving forward:

RULES
- Every Draftee gets existing 2 year contract HOWEVER the player must sign his second contract with the same club. The reason it is just not a 4 year contract upfront, so there is still room for players to be drafted, and if they don't work out, can be delisted after the initial 2 year contract. If delisted they become a DFA and can be signed by another club as per existing rules.

- Restricted Free Agency kicks in after the first 4 years of service. This gives some flexibility around kids with 'go home factor' and other personal type issues to be able to move but giving the clubs the ability to match and keep players as per today's rules

- Free Agency after 6 years of service. Basically meaning any 24 year old or over still at their original club has the right to move tot he club of their choice PERIOD.

- No Free Agency compensation. It's called FREE Agency for a reason... Not having compensation would drive different behaviours with clubs and the environment they create around list management. This can work in clubs favour, with clubs circling a player knowing they don't have the bargaining chip of the exiting club taking compo picks instead of trading.

REASONS
- If every club drafts on average 4 kids per draft, then anywhere between 12-16 kids on their list every year would be untouchable under new Free Agency Rules. Clubs have a better chance of keeping kids knowing they have them for the first 4 years of their contract. Create a culture an environment that makes them happy, then they shouldn't want to leave in the first place (I can't stress this enough, the question is never asked now as to why players want to leave their original club, rather we all whinge a player wants to leave).

- What it also means is, that instead of the average 40 players per year that qualify for FA or RFA (granted most of them aren't exactly trade targets for other clubs), that number could be as large as 500+ (granted that would only be if every player was out of contract). If half of that number was out of contract that is still 250+ players who qualify.

- With 250+ players qualifying it would do 2 things... 1) create greater competition and desire for mid range players who have been in the system for 4-8 years that under today's rules don't qualify for FA or RFA. Granted it may drive their price up a little, but that then leads to point 2) with more players 'on the market' and higher value for them, it wouldn't leave such a big gap at the top of clubs salary caps, and given there are more than a handful of targets, it would eliminate the 'godfather' offers, as clubs would have to stretch their cap across a greater number of players

- It would also allow teams to rebuild a lot quicker by having so many more players available to recruit. Carlton or Gold Coast for example, they could target say 10 new players around the 22-26 year age bracket to come to the club at once, on top to compliment the 16 draftees that are untouchable by the new rules. With no compensation, there would be no worry about number of players coming in and going out, it would purely come down to salary cap and list spots.

Obviously there would be more detail behind these principals, but it theory, more player movement actually creates an even playing field and eliminates players being over-valued. It gives clubs a chance to rebuild a lot faster and gives players the choice they have been asking for for years.

 

[Hank Heavenly]

I'd go future 1st.
2 things.
Will be able to keep a list spot open for those on the fringe to stay for another year.
And we'd know exactly who's performing in the tac cup.

And Saints may SH!T the bed and fall back below 5th/6th where they finished this year

 

[Muddiemoose]

I'd go future 1st.
2 things.
Will be able to keep a list spot open for those on the fringe to stay for another year.
And we'd know exactly who's performing in the tac cup.

Don’t think we will get anything in the 1st round for him without something going the other way

Where he was drafted is irrelevant at this point and his value is dictated on what he has produced at afl Level and it’s not a lot right now

 

[fargothegreat]

I think the club knows that Higgo has hit his ceiling, so they're cashing in now while he's worth something.

I don't think he's worth as much as a lot of you guys think though. I'm not expecting any more than a mid to late second rounder for him.

 

[Roksman]

 

[Tiges1229]

I wouldn't trade Higgo has more upside than Aarts I can't believe we are even contemplating it.

yep seriously a mistake doing it.

 

[Tiges1229]

Wasn’t Higgins our first round pick when we got him ?

 

[prodigy]

Jack Higgins set to depart Tigerland

The small forward will depart Richmond.

www.sen.com.au

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[Roksman]

 

[Makeshft_Mauler]

Pies rationale was that Treloar's mental health will suffer being away from his partner and child. With both QLD clubs going cold on Treloar what will their reasoning be now?

its weird to me that the club is flat out telling a bloke that they reckon he wont cope with his wife beign away

even when hes clearly telling them hed be fine.

Id take him simply for the memes, weve already established we can beat the second best team with one less player.

imagine it now

top picture is collingwood trelol crying with bucks

bottom picture is richmond treloar with the cup

reckon wed break collingwood for the next 50 years.

 

[CapCotch21]

So sad about Higgins leaving. Don’t want him to go

 

[dusty1234!]

Who would the ‘other’ Melbourne club be?

 

[Tiges1229]

Why don’t we just give saints Dimma for a few years so they can win a flag , in return we will get double fisted no lube

 

[tigers12]

yep seriously a mistake doing it.

Don’t forget we have Maurice jnr coming in we have lots of small forward depth

 

[Roksman]

Obviously I would want a good return but I'm comfortable with the move considering we have RCD, Dow and Will Martyn pushing for a spot next year.

 

[dusty1234!]

I’m very interested to see who the other club is. Maybe thy have better options for a trade. I simply am not willing to do a Butler trade with Higgins. Contracted first round pick- no sir

 

[Tiges1229]

Don’t forget we have Maurice jnr coming in we have lots of small forward depth

Crazy that we waste a first rounder on him , Only to get rid of him 2 years later . Mind boggling

 

[prodigy]

Who would the ‘other’ Melbourne club be?

Its 99% St Kilda

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[Jozzy]

Devastating, I strongly believe this will come back to bite us on the bum.

I know it can be argued that the club has been smart and done well with the players who have been traded out over the last few season.

I still think Butler moving on was the right call despite his 2020 season. However I don’t think moving on Higgins is the right decision.