Transgender - Part 2

[Gethelred]

Please be aware that the tolerance of anti-trans language on BF is at an all-time low. Jokes and insults that are trans-related, as well as anti-trans and bigoted rhetoric will be met with infractions, threadbans etc as required. It's a sensitive (and important) topic, so behave like well-mannered adults when discussing it, PARTICULARLY when disagreeing. This equally applies across the whole site.

 

[Engimal v3]

How many men will accept a trans man into their brotherhood? It doesn’t happen.

Why not?

 

[Ghost Patrol]

Sounds like the plot to that rom-com.

 

[CM86]

View attachment 2023278

A cocky, chauvinistic advertising executive magically acquires the ability to hear what women are thinking.​

 

[Gethelred]

That tells me everything necessary. I think you need to diversify your sources.

... dude, you don't know an awful lot about me, let alone enough to make that statement.

Might I suggest that this thread could be more to your liking, if this is the avenue you wish to go down?

Society/Culture - The distrust of education

This is an almost ever present conversational topic on the SRP, so it probably should have a thread to discuss it isolated from everything else. Certain groups and politicians like referring to 'Inner city elites', 'Latte sipping', 'Acacdemic/theoretical understanding'; in short, they evince a...

www.bigfooty.com

 

[Gethelred]

Most men don't understand how women think at all. They probably all think a bit differently about feminism, for instance, as well as many other subjects. That's why trans women can't fit in, in the way they want. They can be very nice people to be friends with but they don't think like women. Many would acknowledge that.

... have you ever tried asking other people - let alone women - what they think before, DRS? Because this reads akin to someone who thinks they know already rather than someone interested in investigating.

Conversation/argument is fun. You've got to be willing to give, though, when someone upends your own ideas as incorrect.

 

[Dogs_R_Us]

... have you ever tried asking other people - let alone women - what they think before, DRS? Because this reads akin to someone who thinks they know already rather than someone interested in investigating.

Conversation/argument is fun. You've got to be willing to give, though, when someone upends your own ideas as incorrect.

What makes you think I haven’t?

You don’t sound as if you find conversation or argument fun. You went to university, therefore you believe you have all the “right” answers and the “right” opinions, which aren’t to be questioned. Different opinions that don’t align with your views are an outrage. That’s a narrow way of thinking.

 

[Gralin]

What makes you think I haven’t?

You don’t sound as if you find conversation or argument fun. You went to university, therefore you believe you have all the “right” answers and the “right” opinions, which aren’t to be questioned. Different opinions that don’t align with your views are an outrage. That’s a narrow way of thinking.

you melted about people wanting to have a beer on Good Friday in WA you should probably not get on a soap box

 

[gouki88]

What makes you think I haven’t?

You don’t sound as if you find conversation or argument fun. You went to university, therefore you believe you have all the “right” answers and the “right” opinions, which aren’t to be questioned. Different opinions that don’t align with your views are an outrage. That’s a narrow way of thinking.

Are sweeping generalisations not narrow ways of thinking?

 

[Gethelred]

What makes you think I haven’t?

Because at every opportunity you've ever had on this forum to argue, you've up and run away. You refuse to engage.

Note how you've entered this particular exchange. Not by way of quoting or tagging me; no, you wanted to address the thread at large, talking at people and referring to them rather than talking to them.

You don’t sound as if you find conversation or argument fun. You went to university, therefore you believe you have all the “right” answers and the “right” opinions, which aren’t to be questioned. Different opinions that don’t align with your views are an outrage. That’s a narrow way of thinking.

... again, this is not what university is or is about. This right here evinces a profound distrust of education.

Education is learning a process by which you arrive at the truth, not what the truth is.

 

[Chief]

View attachment 2023281

A cocky, chauvinistic advertising executive magically acquires the ability to hear what women are thinking.​

The irony is that the Brotherhood doesn't think Helen Hunt is all that attractive.

 

[Dogs_R_Us]

Because at every opportunity you've ever had on this forum to argue, you've up and run away. You refuse to engage.

Note how you've entered this particular exchange. Not by way of quoting or tagging me; no, you wanted to address the thread at large, talking at people and referring to them rather than talking to them.

... again, this is not what university is or is about. This right here evinces a profound distrust of education.

Education is learning a process by which you arrive at the truth, not what the truth is.

What do you want me to argue about? I throw out alternative views. Traditional views based on reality, not fantasy. You might call them “old-fashioned”, not “progressive”. The majority of people in society (not here, obviously) hold these views, like it or not. And they’re a great deal more tolerant of fellow human beings than you apparently think.

Your last sentence doesn’t really make sense - you probably mean you arrive at “your” truth. You arrived at “your” truth via your undergraduate course, but is it everybody’s truth? Not mine.

Let’s agree to differ on “truth”, hey?

 

[gouki88]

What do you want me to argue about? I throw out alternative views. Traditional views based on reality, not fantasy. You might call them “old-fashioned”, not “progressive”. The majority of people in society (not here, obviously) hold these views, like it or not. And they’re a great deal more tolerant of fellow human beings than you apparently think.

Your last sentence doesn’t really make sense - you probably mean you arrive at “your” truth. You arrived at “your” truth via your undergraduate course, but is it everybody’s truth? Not mine.

Let’s agree to differ on “truth”, hey?

Lmfao

 

[ShanDog]

The research into the correct way to deal with gender dysphoria over a substantial period of time, which has led to the current approach for dealing with transgenderism - ie, gender acceptance and transition...

Are you disputing it?

What research? The stuff the Cass review identified is very poor and not to be relied upon?

'Cause if you're not and you're still arguing against gender affirmative care, you are wilfully arguing against equality for those people as they would define it. You're arguing for their exclusion from society - again, it's interesting how it was just sport before and now it's this - because you're unwilling to do what it takes to include them, which costs you precious little.

Sorry, that's all complete bullshit. It's all predicate on the idea that gender affirming care is actually good. And as a schoolteacher you should know that just because someone says they want something, doesn't make it best for them. Be an adult.

I really don't see how. It's an exceedingly simple distinction, created to better describe things.

If you think that, you're very out of touch with the average person.

While some theorists - feminist and gender - might take the idea that to be a woman is to adhere to an aesthetic of womanhood - to conform - poorly, that'd be an outgrowth of John Money's views as the creator of the concept in order to protect and enshrine the two genders as binary, as his research into sexual dimorphism wasn't proving it sufficiently to his tastes. There are conservative branches of feminism just as there are progressive ones; not that John Money - who was a creep - was a feminist, but whenever you seize an idea you tend towards taking the parts which are useful to you and some feminists are a bit... opposed to redefining femininity.

This is fascinating but I don't see any relevance.

You don't even have to step in it; the whole situation and shebang doesn't really affect you to my knowledge.

I completely reject this notion while pointing and laughing at you Nelson-style for having the temerity to say it.

 

[CM86]

Sorry, that's all complete bullshit. It's all predicate on the idea that gender affirming care is actually good. And as a schoolteacher you should know that just because someone says they want something, doesn't make it best for them. Be an adult.

But gender affirming care isn't provided to a person just because they say they want it.
It's based on what's medically and professionally considered best for them.

 

[Gralin]

Any time a doctor uses your pronouns you're getting gender affirming care

 

[ShanDog]

But gender affirming care isn't provided to a person just because they say they want it.
It's based on what's medically and professionally considered best for them.

Bloodletting, lobotomies and using arsenic to treat colds were also once considered what's medically and professionally what's best for the patients. Are you so certain that gender affirming care isn't going to go the way of the old hysterectomy? Why? And which model exactly are we talking about?

Any time a doctor uses your pronouns you're getting gender affirming care

Thank you, Gralin.

 

[MrsBlueSky]

... have you ever tried asking other people - let alone women - what they think before, DRS? Because this reads akin to someone who thinks they know already rather than someone interested in investigating.

Conversation/argument is fun. You've got to be willing to give, though, when someone upends your own ideas as incorrect.

Tolerance and respect are a couple of words that come to mind when grinding my teeth about some of the things being said.

 

[Johnny Bananas]

I love it that MEN are instructing (mansplaining) WOMEN as to what they must believe and accept.

If you're that ignorant as to not notice the many thousands of women who already support and accept trans people in your bid to paint this as being mansplaining, just leave the conversation because you'll never post anything worth engaging with. Stick to genocide apologism, at least you know more about that.

 

[Johnny Bananas]

To be fair it's a common argument that women (aka TERFs) often make.

Is this just poorly worded, or are you saying all women are TERFs?

 

[Gralin]

Bloodletting, lobotomies and using arsenic to treat colds were also once considered what's medically and professionally what's best for the patients. Are you so certain that gender affirming care isn't going to go the way of the old hysterectomy? Why? And which model exactly are we talking about?


Thank you, Gralin.
View attachment 2023503

Reckon you might be about done again

 

[ShanDog]

Reckon you might be about done again

Why? The Cass review specifically talks about the circular referencing nature of the guidelines that were developed for treating gender dysphoric kids. And what they referenced wasn't evidence based at all. But, it's come to just be accepted as "the best way to treat it".

 

[the_interloper]

Is this just poorly worded, or are you saying all women are TERFs?

Poorly worded, I mean some women! #notallwomen

 

[ShanDog]

Or as discussed here:

 

[Ghost Patrol]

I completely reject this notion while pointing and laughing at you Nelson-style for having the temerity to say it.

 

[Gralin]

Why? The Cass review specifically talks about the circular referencing nature of the guidelines that were developed for treating gender dysphoric kids. And what they referenced wasn't evidence based at all. But, it's come to just be accepted as "the best way to treat it".

Because you're just being antagonistic for the sake of it