Social Science Unpopular Opinions you have (non-football) Part II

[JackOutback]

He’s entitled to his opinion but people are equally entitled to point out what a horseshit opinion it is. At a time when people are condemning violent protests and urging peaceful protest, he’s doubling down on ‘but not that peaceful protest, it offends me’. It’s also hypocrisy at its finest, he wants the freedom of speech to say people should not express their freedom of speech.

And it certainly comes from a position of privilege. To him, the flag and anthem are symbols of respect and unity. He seems unable to consider that perhaps it doesn’t represent those things to other people. He doesn’t have to agree with people kneeling but if he truly believes in the freedoms he claims to believe in, then he should at least respect it.

 

[peternorth]

He’s entitled to his opinion but people are equally entitled to point out what a horseshit opinion it is. At a time when people are condemning violent protests and urging peaceful protest, he’s doubling down on ‘but not that peaceful protest, it offends me’. It’s also hypocrisy at its finest, he wants the freedom of speech to say people should not express their freedom of speech.

And it certainly comes from a position of privilege. To him, the flag and anthem are symbols of respect and unity. He seems unable to consider that perhaps it doesn’t represent those things to other people. He doesn’t have to agree with people kneeling but if he truly believes in the freedoms he claims to believe in, then he should at least respect it.

I saw that Brees knelt during the anthem before once, or maybe more. So I think he isnt racist, and is sympathetic to the plight of his african american brothers. I certainly give him the benefit of doubt.

I think the people will forgive him quickly.

Although this is interesting, one person is told to stay out of political views, the other....he's entitled to an opinion.

 

[phantom13]

I saw that Brees knelt during the anthem before once, or maybe more. So I think he isnt racist, and is sympathetic to the plight of his african american brothers. I certainly give him the benefit of doubt.

I think the people will forgive him quickly.

Although this is interesting, one person is told to stay out of political views, the other....he's entitled to an opinion.

That’s Fox News to a tee.

My brother in law was adamant Brees criticized Kap but I think a lot of people did and unless Brees was particularly vitriolic I doubt anyone would have cared.

 

[Scotland]

He’s entitled to his opinion but people are equally entitled to point out what a horseshit opinion it is. At a time when people are condemning violent protests and urging peaceful protest, he’s doubling down on ‘but not that peaceful protest, it offends me’. It’s also hypocrisy at its finest, he wants the freedom of speech to say people should not express their freedom of speech.

And it certainly comes from a position of privilege. To him, the flag and anthem are symbols of respect and unity. He seems unable to consider that perhaps it doesn’t represent those things to other people. He doesn’t have to agree with people kneeling but if he truly believes in the freedoms he claims to believe in, then he should at least respect it.

Where did he say he doesn't respect people kneeling? Where did he say he was offended? He said he doesn't agree with it and believes in unity and respecting the flag - whatever that means. If he thinks the flag represents everyone good for him, if others don't good for them. People can have different opinions on what the flag represents. In his mind there are other (better?) ways of driving social change. People are going after him like he's calling for a return to plantation ownership. Are Shaq and Charles Barkley wrong for saying the reaction was over the top?

My point is that Americans are so on edge they will react to anyone saying anything. It's not a good foundation for meaningful discussion on important issues.

Unreserved apology too.

FWIW Brees (and many Americans) mentality about Kaps kneeling protest is just ridiculous patriotism and citing the military is a pathetic attempt to justify a deep seated casual racism in my opinion. America won’t dip their flag to the host nation at the olympics because the flag is so important yet rednecks hang confederate flags and brandish tee shirts with the thing. It’s a bit of cloth ffs. If you think kneeling during an anthem (which has nothing to do with the flag anyway) is so disrespectful then isn’t a cop who represents the state and by extension the flag murdering a citizen or racial profiling being much more disrespectful. The logic and mental gymnastics used to condemn kneeling or marching for equality and to end police brutality is astonishing.

Brees apology was actually pretty good and certainly seemed heartfelt but his comment, especially given the timing, his home address and profession, was at best stupid and at worst shows the systemic racism and privilege he has.

Public apologies from celebrities are horseshit. He was asked his opinion on something, he gave it, it created a shitstorm so he apoligised for creating a shitstorm. If there wasn't a big reaction he wouldn't have apologised. I don't think he's any more or less racist today than he was 3 days ago.

Agree 100% about American fascination with their flag. Their mentality about a lot of things is ridiculous patriotism. Is there another country on Earth where you can be crowned World Champions for winning a domestic competition? I don't think they actually know what the word 'freedom' means, and the endless debates on gun ownership and abortion are insane. Freedom to say what you want and bear arms to rise up against the govt, but it's up to that same govt to determine if abortion is OK. Righto.

 

[JackOutback]

Where did he say he doesn't respect people kneeling? Where did he say he was offended? He said he doesn't agree with it and believes in unity and respecting the flag - whatever that means. If he thinks the flag represents everyone good for him, if others don't good for them. People can have different opinions on what the flag represents. In his mind there are other (better?) ways of driving social change. People are going after him like he's calling for a return to plantation ownership. Are Shaq and Charles Barkley wrong for saying the reaction was over the top?

My point is that Americans are so on edge they will react to anyone saying anything. It's not a good foundation for meaningful discussion on important issues.



Public apologies from celebrities are horseshit. He was asked his opinion on something, he gave it, it created a shitstorm so he apoligised for creating a shitstorm. If there wasn't a big reaction he wouldn't have apologised. I don't think he's any more or less racist today than he was 3 days ago.

Agree 100% about American fascination with their flag. Their mentality about a lot of things is ridiculous patriotism. Is there another country on Earth where you can be crowned World Champions for winning a domestic competition? I don't think they actually know what the word 'freedom' means, and the endless debates on gun ownership and abortion are insane. Freedom to say what you want and bear arms to rise up against the govt, but it's up to that same govt to determine if abortion is OK. Righto.

When asked his opinion on people kneeling in the upcoming season, he said he would never agree with people disrespecting the flag. Sounds very much like he said kneeling, about the most peaceful protest one can imagine, is disrespectful.

As I said, just a shit comment and he was called out on it, in some cases by his teammates who experience racism on a regular basis. You’d really think working in an industry where 70 percent of the employees are black might make you a little less tone deaf.

And I agree the apology was crap, clearly run through the PR machine. Blamed how it was perceived; either stand by your comment or try to learn something but don’t blame the listener for your own comments.

 

[kober3742]

Where did he say he doesn't respect people kneeling? Where did he say he was offended? He said he doesn't agree with it and believes in unity and respecting the flag - whatever that means. If he thinks the flag represents everyone good for him, if others don't good for them. People can have different opinions on what the flag represents. In his mind there are other (better?) ways of driving social change. People are going after him like he's calling for a return to plantation ownership. Are Shaq and Charles Barkley wrong for saying the reaction was over the top?

My point is that Americans are so on edge they will react to anyone saying anything. It's not a good foundation for meaningful discussion on important issues.



Public apologies from celebrities are horseshit. He was asked his opinion on something, he gave it, it created a shitstorm so he apoligised for creating a shitstorm. If there wasn't a big reaction he wouldn't have apologised. I don't think he's any more or less racist today than he was 3 days ago.

Agree 100% about American fascination with their flag. Their mentality about a lot of things is ridiculous patriotism. Is there another country on Earth where you can be crowned World Champions for winning a domestic competition? I don't think they actually know what the word 'freedom' means, and the endless debates on gun ownership and abortion are insane. Freedom to say what you want and bear arms to rise up against the govt, but it's up to that same govt to determine if abortion is OK. Righto.

Hi Scotland,

Are you from the US?

US Citizen here. Yes we have many problems. There is a racism problem that is for sure. Our president is not good. Our political system has issues. How can you speak to American mentality? The American mentality that lots of form people get is from news stories read on the internet, or you own media's view of what is going on in the US. As it is with everywhere in the world, media outlets take the most extreme viewpoints and extrapolate it to explaining a larger demographic.

Most people from the US don't have "ridiculous patriotism". I am proud to be a citizen of the US just as most commentors on this forum are proud to be a citizen of Australia and rightly so, Australian seems like a great country. I dont speak to know the Australian mentality as I dont live here and have not had many interactions with Australians.

We have some bad cops. Drew Brees says something tone deaf and dumb does not mean that most Americans think that way. Most Americans did not vote for Trump, I certainly did not.

I would certainly like "meaningful discussion" on this topic as I want other countries to understand that the most famous among us do not represent the views of most of us.

Feel free to ask me my views of anything related to the US. I am not calling you folks ignorant, lots of folks on these forums and rightly so do not have much interaction with the US outside of media outlets.

 

[Scotland]

When asked his opinion on people kneeling in the upcoming season, he said he would never agree with people disrespecting the flag. Sounds very much like he said kneeling, about the most peaceful protest one can imagine, is disrespectful.

As I said, just a shit comment and he was called out on it, in some cases by his teammates who experience racism on a regular basis. You’d really think working in an industry where 70 percent of the employees are black might make you a little less tone deaf.

And I agree the apology was crap, clearly run through the PR machine. Blamed how it was perceived; either stand by your comment or try to learn something but don’t blame the listener for your own comments.

I still think the whole thing has been blown out of proportion. If you should down anyone who has an opinion you are only going to end up with a lot of people who keep their opinions to themselves. It's very 2020 and it isn't healthy.

RE: bolded, you'd think so, but then the coach of Denver thought he would help things along by telling everyone he "doesn't see racism in the NFL". Granted I'm not the world's biggest NFL watcher but given there are NFL players protesting racial issue at NFL games I'd say that's an... interesting view to hold.

 

[edgie]

Most Americans did not vote...

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[kober3742]

Most Americans did not vote...

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This is true.

 

[Scotland]

Hi Scotland,

Are you from the US?

US Citizen here. Yes we have many problems. There is a racism problem that is for sure. Our president is not good. Our political system has issues. How can you speak to American mentality? The American mentality that lots of form people get is from news stories read on the internet, or you own media's view of what is going on in the US. As it is with everywhere in the world, media outlets take the most extreme viewpoints and extrapolate it to explaining a larger demographic.

Most people from the US don't have "ridiculous patriotism". I am proud to be a citizen of the US just as most commentors on this forum are proud to be a citizen of Australia and rightly so, Australian seems like a great country. I dont speak to know the Australian mentality as I dont live here and have not had many interactions with Australians.

We have some bad cops. Drew Brees says something tone deaf and dumb does not mean that most Americans think that way. Most Americans did not vote for Trump, I certainly did not.

I would certainly like "meaningful discussion" on this topic as I want other countries to understand that the most famous among us do not represent the views of most of us.

Feel free to ask me my views of anything related to the US. I am not calling you folks ignorant, lots of folks on these forums and rightly so do not have much interaction with the US outside of media outlets.

Hello,

No. I am from WA. I have been to America (8 or 9 states, I appreciate how much more different the US is from place to place next to Australia which is relatively homogenous by comparison) and met plenty of Americans over the journey.

I don't think it's new info that Australians and Americans are very different in some areas. Histories of European settlement are different. Demographics are different. Politics are different. Education is different. It stands to reason that the cultures vary. I'm not talking about the fringes. The fringes anywhere are full of nuts. The US isn't just doomsday preppers and AOC, there's hundreds of millions of people in the middle. Your middle and our middle are still very different. Weekly church attendance varies by state anywhere from about 20% to over 50%. Here it's more like 5%.

I didn't say anything about how many Americans voted for Trump, but 46% of the 137m people that bothered to vote did as did 30 states. As above, about 100m people eligible to vote didn't. No compulsory voting and people don't engage, different to here where compulsory voting is in place and people vote to get out of paying a fine.

 

[kober3742]

Hello,

No. I am from WA. I have been to America (8 or 9 states, I appreciate how much more different the US is from place to place next to Australia which is relatively homogenous by comparison) and met plenty of Americans over the journey.

I don't think it's new info that Australians and Americans are very different in some areas. Histories of European settlement are different. Demographics are different. Politics are different. Education is different. It stands to reason that the cultures vary. I'm not talking about the fringes. The fringes anywhere are full of nuts. The US isn't just doomsday preppers and AOC, there's hundreds of millions of people in the middle. Your middle and our middle are still very different. Weekly church attendance varies by state anywhere from about 20% to over 50%. Here it's more like 5%.

I didn't say anything about how many Americans voted for Trump, but 46% of the 137m people that bothered to vote did as did 30 states. As above, about 100m people eligible to vote didn't. No compulsory voting and people don't engage, different to here where compulsory voting is in place and people vote to get out of paying a fine.

Hi Scotland,

Thank you for your reply. For context, I am from a state that most people do not care about - even most people from the US, the state of Iowa. I am guessing that is not one of the states that you visited (for reference we either rank 48th or 49th in tourism every year).

I know that you did not reference the Americans voting for Trump. I just used that as a context for my perspective as the media claims that people that voted for Trump are extreme (a point I agree with to a certain degree). I personally voted for a 3rd party candidate.

I apologize that I underestimated your knowledge of us here in the US. That is my fault. I think I go overboard sometimes in making sure people understand that lots of people here are not in line with Trump, and are not criminalizing minorities.

That fact that voting is compulsory in Australia is something that I did not know. Are people in Australia engaged, know the candidates and the policies involved with each candidate? I would find that interesting to know. How do you interpret our middle?

 

[JackOutback]

Hannah Gadsby makes a joke at the beginning of her new show that after moving to America, she felt like she’d been misled. That the average American wasn’t nearly as stupid as she had been led to believe. I’ve visited a few states and almost to a person they were quite nice. Though I didn’t visit the Deep South and it goes without saying that I didn’t visit the kind of places likely to house the fringes, like churches, gun clubs, Klan meetings or Trump rallies (in increasing order of craziness).

 

[kober3742]

Hannah Gadsby makes a joke at the beginning of her new show that after moving to America, she felt like she’d been misled. That the average American wasn’t nearly as stupid as she had been led to believe. I’ve visited a few states and almost to a person they were quite nice. Though I didn’t visit the Deep South and it goes without saying that I didn’t visit the kind of places likely to house the fringes, like churches, gun clubs, Klan meetings or Trump rallies (in increasing order of craziness).

Who would have led her to believe that US people are stupid? We have some people that are dumb yes, but have smart ones as well. The media likes to focus on the dumb instead of the smart unfortunately as is the case with every country in the world. The deep south (MS, LA, AL, SC) to be specific are the most poorly educated and probably least intelligent, that is mostly down to poor education.

 

[Scotland]

I've been asked questions by Americans that I would never be asked by anyone else in the Anglosphere. Your average uneducated Aussie probably doesn't know that the official language in Angola is Portuguese (or why), but I'd be very surprised if there's anyone in Australia who doesn't know that Americans speak English.

 

[peternorth]

Where did he say he doesn't respect people kneeling? Where did he say he was offended? He said he doesn't agree with it and believes in unity and respecting the flag - whatever that means. If he thinks the flag represents everyone good for him, if others don't good for them. People can have different opinions on what the flag represents. In his mind there are other (better?) ways of driving social change. People are going after him like he's calling for a return to plantation ownership. Are Shaq and Charles Barkley wrong for saying the reaction was over the top?

My point is that Americans are so on edge they will react to anyone saying anything. It's not a good foundation for meaningful discussion on important issues.



Public apologies from celebrities are horseshit. He was asked his opinion on something, he gave it, it created a shitstorm so he apoligised for creating a shitstorm. If there wasn't a big reaction he wouldn't have apologised. I don't think he's any more or less racist today than he was 3 days ago.

Agree 100% about American fascination with their flag. Their mentality about a lot of things is ridiculous patriotism. Is there another country on Earth where you can be crowned World Champions for winning a domestic competition? I don't think they actually know what the word 'freedom' means, and the endless debates on gun ownership and abortion are insane. Freedom to say what you want and bear arms to rise up against the govt, but it's up to that same govt to determine if abortion is OK. Righto.

I believe the nba hasn’t referred to champs as world champions for a long time. But I note your point.

 

[Deliverance]

I feel sorry for Thomas Lane. Just four days on the job.

 

[phantom13]

Public apologies from celebrities are horseshit. He was asked his opinion on something, he gave it, it created a shitstorm so he apoligised for creating a shitstorm. If there wasn't a big reaction he wouldn't have apologised. I don't think he's any more or less racist today than he was 3 days ago.

Agree 100% about American fascination with their flag. Their mentality about a lot of things is ridiculous patriotism. Is there another country on Earth where you can be crowned World Champions for winning a domestic competition? I don't think they actually know what the word 'freedom' means, and the endless debates on gun ownership and abortion are insane. Freedom to say what you want and bear arms to rise up against the govt, but it's up to that same govt to determine if abortion is OK. Righto.

In general I would agree with you on the apology but but I’d also say that a number of black nfl players (including some of his teammates) have accepted his apology so frankly what you or I think doesn’t really matter cause his apology wasn’t to or for us.

I’ve been to about 30 states in the US (granted some were basically drive throughs) including a few in the south (Tennessee, Alabama, Arkansas, Mississippi and Louisiana) I’ve never seen anything more jarring on race than going from Memphis into Arkansas. You could literally walk (they were building a pedestrian bridge across the river) from where MLK got shot into a town where confederate flags on the back of pick up trucks were.

I loved America and I loved being there, I had been fascinated with it because of the sport and popular culture since I was a kid but it’s a mess for the people.

 

[Hawk Dork]

I've been asked questions by Americans that I would never be asked by anyone else in the Anglosphere. Your average uneducated Aussie probably doesn't know that the official language in Angola is Portuguese (or why), but I'd be very surprised if there's anyone in Australia who doesn't know that Americans speak English.

I think Ive told the story of the American lady in Anne Franks house asking why there was only a copy of the book in English and not American

 

[Gough]

I feel sorry for Thomas Lane. Just four days on the job.

You don't need any particular training to know that kneeling on somebody's neck until they die isn't covered by your oath to serve and protect.

 

[Deliverance]

You don't need any particular training to know that kneeling on somebody's neck until they die isn't covered by your oath to serve and protect.

Oh yeah, no doubt he knew it was wrong. But I'd reckon less than 1% of the population would be telling guys with years of experience how to do their job, on just their 3rd shift. Shitty position for him to be in.

 

[Gough]

If Madeliene McCann's parent's had not left their toddler children unsupervised while they went and stuffed their gobs she's probably still be alive today. The whole f***ing stupid circus has been about them trying to discourage people from looking at this.

 

[phantom13]

If Madeliene McCann's parent's had not left their toddler children unsupervised while they went and stuffed their gobs she's probably still be alive today. The whole f***ing stupid circus has been about them trying to discourage people from looking at this.

My wife and I watched the doco. I still think they probably accidentally killed her themselves BUT everyone I know who watched it was absolutely staggered by the unlocked doors and distance the parents left between them and their child. I don’t have kids so specifically asked a lot of people I know who do if they’d ever do what the mccanns did and not one said it seemed okay.

 

[revo333]

Most Americans did not vote...

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I was in America for 6 weeks and came back a month before the 2016 election.

The only time I knew there was an election happening was the two times I watched television.

I never saw anything about it when i was walking around the cities.

 

[Gough]

I was in America for 6 weeks and came back a month before the 2016 election.

The only time I knew there was an election happening was the two times I watched television.

I never saw anything about it when i was walking around the cities.

I was in South Africa before the 94 election and you couldn't see any trouble then if you avoided townships. I dare say if you are a middle class American in the 'burbs you can probably avoid seeing most of the trouble there too.

 

[Run n Spread]

The lack of cash is a pain. If you're ordering in, one person is going to have to put it on their credit card or Uber Eats account. I'm not a fan of transferring cash to bank accounts, I'd rather square up next time. But the bigger the group, the harder that is. If it was two or three friends round mine, I'd just pay for it myself.

Always someone who never pays you back tho.