Europe War in Ukraine - Thread 2

[Gethelred]

This is a sensitive area for some. With that in mind, I'm going to remind a few posters a few things:

• personal attacks are against forum rules. From this point, any attacks that are directed at another poster will be treated with a warning, then infractions and threadbans if it continues.
• the spread of misinformation is also against the rules. This is taken very seriously by moderation, and you will be asked to support your opinion from time to time. If you cannot satisfy this, you will be provided an opportunity to retract your post; if you do not, you will receive an infraction and a threadban on that basis.

This is a forum for adults, and I'd appreciate you all treating each other appropriately.

 

[Mobbs]

Every day, Russia plunges further into chaos and irrationality to protect Putin's insanity.

How can nobody there in a position of power put a stop to this?

It is ******* madness, and even if they 'win' in Eastern UA, their country is f’ed for a generation (at best).

Got to agree. It's completely irrational.

In terms of how nobody can put a stop to it, well they had guys in power. Folks like Nemtsov (shot in front of the Kremlin), Navalnyy (poisoned and again recently jailed), Kara_murza (poisoned twice and survived!) & probably Sobchak (likely death from poison)etc. Add to that the 6 (so far) journalists from Novaya Gazeta who have been assassinated, and I think we have some light shed on how little opposition there is to the current incumbent!

 

[footyfan1978]

Nato should have

Deal with the now, not with the should have this or that.
Individual governments should know what is needed anyway if they have any real moral compass.

 

[footyfan1978]

Got to agree. It's completely irrational.

In terms of how nobody can put a stop to it, well they had guys in power. Folks like Nemtsov (shot in front of the Kremlin), Navalnyy (poisoned and again recently jailed), Kara_murza (poisoned twice and survived!) & probably Sobchak (likely death from poison)etc. Add to that the 6 (so far) journalists from Novaya Gazeta who have been assassinated, and I think we have some light shed on how little opposition there is to the current incumbent!

The country has well over 100 million people.
They just have to act like human beings and not apathetic zombies with no heart.

 

[Mobbs]

The country has well over 100 million people.
They just have to act like human beings and not apathetic zombies with no heart.

In russia they have word specifically for zombies who stare at the TV and believe the state news, it's something about zombies but I can't remember the exact term.

 

[footyfan1978]

In russia they have word specifically for zombies who stare at the TV and believe the state news, it's something about zombies but I can't remember the exact term.

I am glad there are some within their own nation that even recognize this. Just need so many more to wake up and actually know people power can be a real way forward.
It is that saying that is not Russian, about good people doing nothing, that always concerns me most about Russian consciousness.
The time for being a zombie or putting head in sand is well and truly over.

 

[Stax on the mill]

Borrowed directly from the US book on Arab invasions.
It's war and this propaganda from both sides has been happening since Moses was around.

False equivalence, grub.

 

[hebog]

The country has well over 100 million people.
They just have to act like human beings and not apathetic zombies with no heart.

How did Australians and Britons stop the invasion of Iraq?

 

[Lethality]

So what happens now with the Kyiv and other forces, do they push up on the Donbass or do they just hold their defensive positions in case of attack?

 

[Sqotty from office works]

False equivalence, grub

General Pretreaus from Abu ghraib says hold my beer.

 

[footyfan1978]

How did Australians and Britons stop the invasion of Iraq?

This thread is about Ukraine being invaded by Russia forces as the title thread suggests which is what I am discussing.
I know bugger all about Iraq and not been anywhere near there or have much understanding of that region so I leave to people that know more about that in threads about that.

 

[footyfan1978]

So what happens now with the Kyiv and other forces, do they push up on the Donbass or do they just hold their defensive positions in case of attack?

It is a good question. Hence why they need more fighter planes so they do not need as many of current forces near Kyiv deployed to very different region.

 

[King Elvis]

Nato should have said well before the war started that if there is an invasion of Ukraine, Nato would commit to supporting Ukraine both on the ground and in the air but only within Ukraine's borders.

If they are in a position of superiority like they say they are, they should have been the one's dictating to Russia rather than being dictated to. It would have at least given Russia a much more difficult decision to make as to whether to invade or not.

Spot on.

This blanket refusal to get involved, no matter what was happening, effectively gave Putin a blank cheque to act without consequence.

It was stupid, and weak, there should've been lines drawn in the sand to force him to consider and react to.

 

[mighty tiges]

 

[Visions]

It is a good question. Hence why they need more fighter planes so they do not need as many of current forces near Kyiv deployed to very different region.

Not quite fighter planes, but a pretty decent alternative.

 

[mighty tiges]

 

[mighty tiges]

 

[mighty tiges]

 

[Crow54]

On the local TV news tonight, it was stated that Putin's popularity is rising! So much for the Russian people trying to stop the war, they're egging him on.

 

[footyfan1978]

Not quite fighter planes, but a pretty decent alternative.

Every bit helps.
European nations need to do a lot more too.
and FFS, India, stop funding the Russian forces indirectly by your buying habits there. Please!

 

[Lethality]

Apparently this battle in the Donbass area is going to involve a lot of 'mobile warfare' which involves artillery, tanks, etc. I think that's if the Russians can encircle or pincer the Ukrainians there. This is due to the nature of the terrain, which I'm guessing is open farmland.This must be why they've been talking about getting new tanks.

6:00 onwards.

 

[footyfan1978]

On the local TV news tonight, it was stated that Putin's popularity is rising! So much for the Russian people trying to stop the war, they're egging him on.

I heard one scenario that if he was to say, somehow pull out and think he done enough damage that he might be scared of pro-war rallies because they may not have considered he done enough. They expect all the so called "nazis" with their own ****ed up propaganda to be totally eliminated and not find a deal with..... Hence his own propaganda he bound by.

 

[madmug]

On the local TV news tonight, it was stated that Putin's popularity is rising! So much for the Russian people trying to stop the war, they're egging him on.

Given the 20 years of a steady Putin diet & conspiracy stuff on TV, (similar in a way to Fox/Sky viewers in US & Aus), its no wonder much of the population appear so brain dead to reality.

Heavily invested in 'the big lie' (which differs in Russia, US & Aus), its hard to get the viewers to see what is reality, or at least what is the other point of view. They don't get any sort of analysis.

 

[Better Loosen Up]

Deal with the now, not with the should have this or that.
Individual governments should know what is needed anyway if they have any real moral compass.

Yes, of course we have to deal with the now...

 

[Visions]

Apparently this battle in the Donbass area is going to involve a lot of 'mobile warfare' which involves artillery, tanks, etc. I think that's if the Russians can encircle or pincer the Ukrainians there. This is due to the nature of the terrain, which I'm guessing is open farmland.This must be why they've been talking about getting new tanks.

6:00 onwards.

The key is that Izyum area. If the Ukrainians can move further east from Kharkiv another 40km towards Kupyansk then those supply lines are shut and the Russians aint taking over crap.

 

[Visions]

I heard one scenario that if he was to say, somehow pull out and think he done enough damage that he might be scared of pro-war rallies because they may not have considered he done enough. They expect all the so called "nazis" with their own f’ed up propaganda to be totally eliminated and not find a deal with..... Hence his own propaganda he bound by.

Thats the problem the idiot Putin faces. He made his bed promising the world to the the Russian people with his hate speeches, now he has to lie in it.

No matter what the backtracking Russian shills are now saying, he was going to take over Ukraine for himself and that was the expectation of his audience. Clearly that is now a fairy tale, and acceptance of anything less will be viewed as treacherous.

Would be delicious to see what happens if they totally lost. Pandemonium throughout the Kremlin and country! Would be awesome popcorn viewing.