The Law Whose land are you occupying?

[Chief]

these old rivalries and what have you that exist here that have nothing to do with white fellas

My time as a young bloke in a jury on a trial of a girl involved in a fight between Cherbourg and Murgon families was eye opening.

Then again, I went to Eden High School for a year which should have prepared me.

 

[ferball]

I got a brief rundown on the Gold Coast Comm Games and how much damage it caused in local indigenous families.

Yeah.... Yugumbir people, their border is around here too. There is probably some conflict between them and the Bundjalung over who speaks for what country. Politics is ****ed everywhere. Look at the boards on the US election here.

 

[RICHOLEGEND12]

I fortunately, live on my own land in NSW Australia.
The title has existed (not solely in my family name) since circa 1840.

If there is someone out there that was alive in 1840 or full blooded descendent , who can demonstrate prove they are, firstly full blooded aboriginal (ie not part nasty alien) and prove they owned such land in 1840 and it was "stolen" from them , then I am happy to discuss some sort of negotiated agreement.

In 1788 the closest thing to ' international law' on acquisition of land by one of three means
1. A Treaty
2. A signed surrender from war
3. Terra Nullius

There was no aboriginal who could sign a treaty or a surrender, nor could they indicate which part of the land they "owned" because they did not have anything like land title, nor any fixed domicile.

Horrible regrettable things happened in the colonization of Australia. Not one Australian alive today was responsible for the "invasion"
However every part of every continent (except Antarctica) has suffered conflict wars and takeover of land by similar often more intentional and more vicious means.

Australia has progressed to a complete multi-cultural society welcoming new Australians from all over the globe. Racism is declining

YET the "First nation" folk, and their virtue signaling sooky sympathisers want special treatment and be separate and be considered above all the rest
They are the RACISTS, and most of them are half casts or frauds!

Worse they or the sooks want some sort of vague undescribed unagreed form of compensation from the benefits gained by colonization. No one can restore Australia back to 1788 conditions. Really it is just a whinge and an attention seeking self pity excuse that they cannot get along.

There is not any person alive who has any more claim to being Australian or indigenous than me. I had no say in what my genetics or heritage was when I was born in Australia neither did they.

Jesus Christ, this post. I don't even know where to begin.

 

[Chief]

Yeah.... Yugumbir people, their border is around here too. There is probably some conflict between them and the Bundjalung over who speaks for what country. Politics is f’ed everywhere. Look at the boards on the US election here.

And from what I hear, the way native title is run exacerbates local politics with people trying to move up the hierarchy of officially recognised elders and the like. Limit the number of people in the pool so they get more money. It sounds like a tar baby.

 

[ferball]

Jesus Christ, this post. I don't even know where to begin.

He is scared someone is gonna try and take his home off him.

 

[Corpuscles]

Jesus Christ, this post. I don't even know where to begin.

Sorry to read that.

He is scared someone is gonna try and take his home off him.

No he is absolutely certain that they won't!

 

[Snake_Baker]

Haha, 40,000 years they thrived here.

Thrived?

In ~55,000 years they swelled to a population between 750K-1.25million on a huuuuuge land mass, had no agriculture as we know it, no written language, limited tool making, and varying levels of housing ranging from nothing to rudimentary huts. They also killed each other on sight depending on the tribal issues at the time.

Historical accounts of tribal fights allude to it arising from outside incursions in to areas that had food (i.e. it was a big issue)

That's not thriving, that's surviving.

They knew how to MANAGE the environment they lived in.

Bullshit, unless you call the odd group here & there lighting fires as "managing the environment".

We have been here nearly 250 years and are running the place in to the ground.

More bullshit.

The Australian Government needs to compensate and acknowledge for the damage caused to aboriginal culture.

Give them back their huts & sticks?

it is not about victimhood, it is acknowledging the crimes committed and the harm they caused.

I figure western civilisation has done them a huge favor, after the initial colonisation hiccups.

They should thank their lucky stars that the French or Spanish didn't settle the place.

You will use any argument to justify your racism.

You are a fully fledged fruitcake.

 

[Snake_Baker]

In 1788 the closest thing to ' international law' on acquisition of land by one of three means
1. A Treaty
2. A signed surrender from war
3. Terra Nullius

You left out trade (John Batman)

 

[Snake_Baker]

You’d like to revert to a different system of interest in land?

We can’t say “prove you own the land” and then, when markings and generally agreed borders are established, act like it’s a big gotcha moment.

I'm referring to how aboriginals saw themselves in relation to the land.

Pre Mabo: We belong to the land.
Post Mabo: We are the custodians of the land (i.e. the land belongs to us).

 

[Snake_Baker]

Pretty big claim.

You can’t rock up with your own system and philosophy of land ownership and demand that the current occupants prove title under your system. You can, but it’s never going to be accepted by the original occupants.

John Batman..............or was there some form of consumer affairs back then also?

 

[Snake_Baker]

You cant reverse or rewrite history either.

eg The Geeks, The Romans, The Persians The Ottomans heaps of native tribes in Africa. Every European Nation It has been happening since recorded history.

It is about time the descendants and part descendants of the original nomadic occupants realised they live in the 21 Century.

Which tribe did you think you live on? (Edit " Jagera.") What evidence do you have someone lived on your block and claimed as their own.
What was his name?

Those Roman campaigners built their wall right through my family clan lands.

I want compensation!!!

 

[RICHOLEGEND12]

Sorry to read that.


No he is absolutely certain that they won't!

Out of interest, how long has your family name been on the title?

 

[ferball]

And from what I hear, the way native title is run exacerbates local politics with people trying to move up the hierarchy of officially recognised elders and the like. It sounds like a tar baby.

Yeah its like a bomb thrown into indigenous politics. Its very divisive and confrontational. The reality is everyone in these areas is related on some level, they all have stories connected to places too and its easy to play all this against the system. Especially if mining rights are involved. Native title is the Australian State trying to control the implications of the Mabo decision, not some attempt to bring justice to indigenous people.

In places there can be one person or group resonsible for some increase ceremonies and associated critters, other people responsible for the same process related to another critter and someone else responsible for some other situation. The entire area is subject to one claim by only one Native Title representative and doesn't allow for those people all having specific areas of responsibility. It won't recognise that, is written not to recognise it. The act doesn't have any mechanism to recognise it afaik. So if there is any division or conflict in a community Native Title magnifies it and if two people both have a legit cultural rights to parts of one area under a NT claim and there is any bad blood or controversy then look out.

 

[Corpuscles]

Out of interest, how long has your family name been on the title?

I don't see the relevance?
You really "don't know where to start" ?

But no problemo: only since 1968

 

[ferball]

No he is absolutely certain that they won't!

Of course not. Freehold title cancels native title, but that's definitely the vibe you give off.

 

[Snake_Baker]

Standby for generic dispossessed rant in............3.........2.........

 

[Chief]

The act doesn't have any mechanism to recognise it afaik. So if there is any division or conflict in a community Native Title magnifies it

And the LNP love it that way. They get to pontificate about fractured indigenous politics and set people against each other.

 

[juss]

My landlord's I guess.

 

[Slartibartfast]

[

I attended a workplace induction a few years back where an indigenous spokesman gave a talk. He began the speech by stating that white man seeks to dominate the environment, whereas black man seeked to work with the environment.

Shortly after, he stated "when settlers arrived in Victoria, they could ride a horse from Melbourne to Warburton without seeing a forest. This is because the black man was so adept at forest fire management and controlled burns".

Seemed a bit contradictory to me.

No, they do what is called cool burns. They burn early morning when dew is about or after rain.
CFA now accepts this is the best way to go To remove built up undergrowth .
It prevented the super hot wild fires Which we now see which destroys everything including soil.

 

[Slartibartfast]

And so that's definitive then, there's no dispute between mobs of territories? C'mon man, that's about as "ignorant white guy" as you can get.

You speak of "indigenous culture" as if it were a monoculture. What's gives you the right to speak on behalf of thousands/millions of people of mobs from entirely different regions?

What gives you the right to say it is Ok for a race of people to have the land and culture stolen from them???

 

[Chief]

What gives you the right to say it is Ok for a race of people to have the land and culture stolen from them???

Manifest destiny.

 

[Slartibartfast]

Thrived?

In ~55,000 years they swelled to a population between 750K-1.25million on a huuuuuge land mass, had no agriculture as we know it, no written language, limited tool making, and varying levels of housing ranging from nothing to rudimentary huts. They also killed each other on sight depending on the tribal issues at the time.

Historical accounts of tribal fights allude to it arising from outside incursions in to areas that had food (i.e. it was a big issue)

That's not thriving, that's surviving.



Bullshit, unless you call the odd group here & there lighting fires as "managing the environment".



More bullshit.



Give them back their huts & sticks?



I figure western civilisation has done them a huge favor, after the initial colonisation hiccups.

They should thank their lucky stars that the French or Spanish didn't settle the place.



You are a fully fledged fruitcake.

So you judge a society by population size??? What a moron. Population growth is what is killing this world. Your living in it and you cant see this????
Management is living within your means.
They had all the tools thery needed to flourish, ok they did not have TV , guns .
Your ignoarance is amazing, no written language ?? they mainly relied on a verbal culture but used symbols carved and painted also. They lacked nothing for not having Australia Post.
Their story telling is all they needed to pass on the information required.

Your judging them on what you need to survive, absolutely stupid to impose your needs onto them. They met all their own needs for thousands of years.


War, wow. That is exactly what the white man brought you fool ( along with disease which they had not been effected by previously ) . British imperialism is war.

Yep, you are an outright RACIST. Not surprising really.

 

[Chief]

Standby for generic dispossessed rant in............3.........2.........

Waiting for you to add in “they didn’t even invent the wheel”.

Should be good.

 

[The Cattery 1980]

Change the date if you want, although most people will be unhappy.

The whole "you're living on stolen land" thing is the dumbest idea ever and only serves to drive a massive stake between Indigenous and white Australians. If you want good relations then stop telling white people to be ashamed and that their house and land is not their own but actually will always be owned by someone else. This rhetoric only serves to build hate and divide but idiot SJW's keep spreading it to make themselves feel better despite the damage it does.

Well said.

 

[Chief]

Change the date if you want, although most people will be unhappy.

The whole "you're living on stolen land" thing is the dumbest idea ever and only serves to drive a massive stake between Indigenous and white Australians. If you want good relations then stop telling white people to be ashamed and that their house and land is not their own but actually will always be owned by someone else. This rhetoric only serves to build hate and divide but idiot SJW's keep spreading it to make themselves feel better despite the damage it does.

Oh my goodness! We can’t have white people upset. That would never do.