Society/Culture Why are young males now more right wing then older males?

[Carringbush2010]

But if I'm wanting to make sure that I don't want a kid, and the responsibility that comes with it, then I take steps to mitigate it. We all have choices. If decide to not wear a rubber then I have to realise that the potential for STIs or pregnancy is a greater risk.

If I don't, then I best be ready for the consequences.

It's a bit like the responsibility to ride a motorcycle. I cant control what other road users do but if I ride said motorcycle down the highway at 100kmh and I'm wearing only shorts and a tee I best realise that there are some consequences if an accident happens.

Yeah I'm pretty sure everyone is aware of the responsibility and accountability part.

So what if don't wanna be dad wants to wear a rubber but don't wanna be mum doesn't wanna wear a rubber, and we're past the consent part and things have already escalated?

The way you put it was that the don't wanna be mum doesn't have the choice, it's down to the accountability of the don't wanna be dad. Bit unfair I'd have thought.

 

[Gralin]

Yeah I'm pretty sure everyone is aware of the responsibility and accountability part.

So what if don't wanna be dad wants to wear a rubber but don't wanna be mum doesn't wanna wear a rubber, and we're past the consent part and things have already escalated?

What do you mean past the consent part?

The way you put it was that the don't wanna be mum doesn't have the choice, it's down to the accountability of the don't wanna be dad. Bit unfair I'd have thought.

What are you even arguing here?

 

[Saint Shags]

consent part and things have already escalated?

Consent can be taken away at any time.
If don't want to be daddy wants to wear a condom and the female says no, he has the right to stop there and then. And vice versa.
That's the whole point of being responsible.

 

[Saint Shags]

The way you put it was that the don't wanna be mum doesn't have the choice, it's down to the accountability of the don't wanna be dad. Bit unfair I'd have thought.

The point is protecting the individual. But if I'm a guy and I do not want to have a child I make sure that I don't everything in my individual power to make sure that doesn't happen.

I don't go ****ing every woman I can bareback and then bitch about the consequences.
Yes condoms aren't perfect but I'd take something 98% effective over taking the risk. But that's just me.

 

[RedStarUncle]

Yeah I'm pretty sure everyone is aware of the responsibility and accountability part.

So what if don't wanna be dad wants to wear a rubber but don't wanna be mum doesn't wanna wear a rubber, and we're past the consent part and things have already escalated?

The way you put it was that the don't wanna be mum doesn't have the choice, it's down to the accountability of the don't wanna be dad. Bit unfair I'd have thought.

Don't know why everyone keeps going around in morally ambiguous circles.



There is a very clear example where a couple use protection, but the protection fails resulting in a pregnancy. Stick to that example and debate what you need to debate about parental responsibility.

Keep in mind that abortion rights should not live and die on coming up with solutions to parental rights and responsibilities.

 

[Carringbush2010]

Consent can be taken away at any time.
If don't want to be daddy wants to wear a condom and the female says no, he has the right to stop there and then. And vice versa.
That's the whole point of being responsible.

Yeah it take the two parties to be responsible. it's the first time in your rigid and simplistic take you've mentioned accountability goes both ways.

Up until this point you've alluded the accountability is all on the male and the don't wanna be mum doesn't have a choice. Thanks for clarifying.

 

[Gralin]

Yeah it take the two parties to be responsible. it's the first time in your rigid and simplistic take you've mentioned accountability goes both ways.

Up until this point you've alluded the accountability is all on the male and the don't wanna be mum doesn't have a choice. Thanks for clarifying.

that is not at all what they have been saying

 

[Carringbush2010]

Don't know why everyone keeps going around in morally ambiguous circles.



There is a very clear example where a couple use protection, but the protection fails resulting in a pregnancy. Stick to that example and debate what you need to debate about parental responsibility.

Keep in mind that abortion rights should not live and die on coming up with solutions to parental rights and responsibilities.

All I'm saying is that responsibility and choice is a two way street, the one way street example is what has bee alluded by the poster I've replied to.

 

[Gralin]

All I'm saying is that responsibility and choice is a two way street, the one way street example is what has bee alluded by the poster I've replied to.

no its not

 

[Grumpyshades]

consent to parenthood is a pretty basic human right
we have progressed in society where we don't force women into this situation but the attitude and laws towards men is still some sort of medieval, backward, lack of respect and equality thinking

Poster after poster have expressed the 'if you take the risk' logic, so why don't we apply the same logic and standards to women ? The hypocrisy is next level.

and there is zero doubt, its not even an opinion that society would be a better place if childbirth is the result of 2 consenting parties..All the problems that are associated with forced parenthood would be eliminated

respect, consent equality, mental health just concepts that only apply to one gender..Men's lives are irrelevant, just the little worker bees of society

 

[RedStarUncle]

consent to parenthood is a pretty basic human right
we have progressed in society where we don't force women into this situation but the attitude and laws towards men is still some sort of medieval, backward, lack of respect and equality thinking

Poster after poster have expressed the 'if you take the risk' logic, so why don't we apply the same logic and standards to women ? The hypocrisy is next level.

and there is zero doubt, its not even an opinion that society would be a better place if childbirth is the result of 2 consenting parties..All the problems that are associated with forced parenthood would be eliminated

respect, consent equality, mental health just concepts that only apply to one gender..Men's lives are irrelevant, just the little worker bees of society

I agree... we're a little bit too right-wing on this issue, enforcing individuals to be accountable for their own actions without enough wider societal consideration.

Unlike the right-wing position that you be accountable and responsible for your actions and if your actions lead to producing a baby you have responsibility for that baby... we should be a bit more progressive. A more progressive position would be for a social benefit to be provided to single parents at taxpayer expense, and then we can absolve the unwilling parent.



If that's your take, great. But if your take is that because women have access to abortion; if they don't take it a would-be-father can wash their hands of any responsibility and expect the mother to carry the full financial burden of a child on top of the full parental workload... then I'd start to have to think that sounds like misogyny.

 

[Grumpyshades]

I agree... we're a little bit too right-wing on this issue, enforcing individuals to be accountable for their own actions without enough wider societal consideration.

Unlike the right-wing position that you be accountable and responsible for your actions and if your actions lead to producing a baby you have responsibility for that baby... we should be a bit more progressive. A more progressive position would be for a social benefit to be provided to single parents at taxpayer expense, and then we can absolve the unwilling parent.



If that's your take, great. But if your take is that because women have access to abortion; if they don't take it a would-be-father can wash their hands of any responsibility and expect the mother to carry the full financial burden of a child on top of the full parental workload... then I'd start to have to think that sounds like misogyny.

sorry but I dont agree with individuals are held accountable..Women are free to choose what benefits them. Its only men who are held accountable
throwing extra money at single parents is not the answer either

If you choose this path why are you then complaining about the financial situation ?
Its pretty simple. If you want kids great..Find a partner who also wants kids..Dont force your will on someone else then try and use buzz words like misogyny to justify it

equality is great hey..Funny how uncomfortable people get when it works both ways

 

[Gralin]

sorry but I dont agree with individuals are held accountable..Women are free to choose what benefits them. Its only men who are held accountable
throwing extra money at single parents is not the answer either

If you choose this path why are you then complaining about the financial situation ?
Its pretty simple. If you want kids great..Find a partner who also wants kids..Dont force your will on someone else then try and use buzz words like misogyny to justify it

equality is great hey..Funny how uncomfortable people get when it works both ways

What about the child that didn't choose anything?

 

[Grumpyshades]

What about the child that didn't choose anything?

its a great point..Women (and men) who have the best interests of the child at heart would have no problem with male consent. There is no study where children are better off in fatherless homes..Like i stated it's far better for society

 

[Gralin]

its a great point..Women (and men) who have the best interests of the child at heart would have no problem with male consent. There is no study where children are better off in fatherless homes..Like i stated it's far better for society

this is your way of saying if a woman gets pregnant and the guy doesn't want it then she should abort the baby or its her fault

I'm not surprised by this at all your pfp is pretty clear on what sort of view you hold in general

 

[Grumpyshades]

this is your way of saying if a woman gets pregnant and the guy doesn't want it then she should abort the baby or its her fault

I'm not surprised by this at all your pfp is pretty clear on what sort of view you hold in general

look I'm not really interested going around in circles. Ive made my point. You can agree or disagree. There is no easy solution and granted if a man is in a relationship and they get pregnant then the best solution might be for him to 'suck it up' and take responsibility..My main point is the attitudes towards men need to be better

sorry I dont know what pfp is ? Sure if you want to label my views under one umbrella that's up to you

 

[Gralin]

look I'm not really interested going around in circles. Ive made my point. You can agree or disagree. There is no easy solution and granted if a man is in a relationship and they get pregnant then the best solution might be for him to 'suck it up' and take responsibility..My main point is the attitudes towards men need to be better

sorry I dont know what pfp is ? Sure if you want to label my views under one umbrella that's up to you

the "meme" you had as your profile pic prior to this current rowing one gave a pretty clear indication of how pilled you are

 

[Grumpyshades]

the "meme" you had as your profile pic prior to this current rowing one gave a pretty clear indication of how pilled you are

ok..take care

 

[Carringbush2010]

look I'm not really interested going around in circles. Ive made my point. You can agree or disagree. There is no easy solution and granted if a man is in a relationship and they get pregnant then the best solution might be for him to 'suck it up' and take responsibility..My main point is the attitudes towards men need to be better

sorry I dont know what pfp is ? Sure if you want to label my views under one umbrella that's up to you

Look I get what you're trying to say here.

From my point of view I don't think attitudes towards men are necessarily bad (from a societal collective perspective).

The 'men are bad' mantra (and in this thread young men) is more exception rather than the rule and yes there are isolated examples of men being treated very badly and society has enabled it. Like getting the raw deal in a child custody / divorce cases for example.

What's really happening is that these rare cases of men being treated badly you don't hear about, what you hear a lot more about is the struggles and adversity women go through (which is valid), on a myriad of topics. Why? Because it sells.

Men being treated badly wouldn't sell as much. Why? Because rightly or wrongly men or males have been advantaged throughout human history just by being male, and not a minority group.

Your beef should not with a society as a whole treating men badly or demonizing men, your beef is with the lack of attention men being treated badly get. Who's to blame? Well that'd be msm, not for agenda purposes but because click bait purposes.

This of course gets exacerbated on social media by fringe minded types, BF is a perfect example of that.

 

[RedStarUncle]

Look I get what you're trying to say here.

From my point of view I don't think attitudes towards men are necessarily bad (from a societal collective perspective).

The 'men are bad' mantra (and in this thread young men) is more exception rather than the rule and yes there are isolated examples of men being treated very badly and society has enabled it. Like getting the raw deal in a child custody / divorce cases for example.

What's really happening is that these rare cases of men being treated badly you don't hear about, what you hear a lot more about is the struggles and adversity women go through (which is valid), on a myriad of topics. Why? Because it sells.

Men being treated badly wouldn't sell as much. Why? Because rightly or wrongly men or males have been advantaged throughout human history just by being male, and not a minority group.

Your beef should not with a society as a whole treating men badly or demonizing men, your beef is with the lack of attention men being treated badly get. Who's to blame? Well that'd be msm, not for agenda purposes but because click bait purposes.

This of course gets exacerbated on social media by fringe minded types, BF is a perfect example of that.

Or in other words... let's find one of the very rare examples where there is a semblance of unfairness negatively impacting on men and scream the world down about it because then it sounds like we're balancing the woke-monster that keeps wanting to tell us about all the unfairness negatively impacting on other people.




How common is this "problem" anyway? Do we have masses of men around the world who requested their partner have an abortion and were told no and now they're being forced to pay child support? Just because Kanye West wrote a song lyric doesn't make this one of the single biggest issues facing modern society... I dare say most children born into the world are wanted except maybe for those where abortion rights are heavily restricted. And in the small percent where pregnancy is wanted by one partner and not the other, I bet it's as likely as not that the father disappears from the scene and isn't pursued for child support despite a legal obligation. But boy do those who don't get their own way on this want you to hear about it.

 

[Grumpyshades]

Or in other words... let's find one of the very rare examples where there is a semblance of unfairness negatively impacting on men and scream the world down about it because then it sounds like we're balancing the woke-monster that keeps wanting to tell us about all the unfairness negatively impacting on other people.




How common is this "problem" anyway? Do we have masses of men around the world who requested their partner have an abortion and were told no and now they're being forced to pay child support? Just because Kanye West wrote a song lyric doesn't make this one of the single biggest issues facing modern society... I dare say most children born into the world are wanted except maybe for those where abortion rights are heavily restricted. And in the small percent where pregnancy is wanted by one partner and not the other, I bet it's as likely as not that the father disappears from the scene and isn't pursued for child support despite a legal obligation. But boy do those who don't get their own way on this want you to hear about it.

very rare examples...did genuinely lol
If you tell lies often enough people just automatically believe them

it doesn't hurt society hearing different opinions based on facts as opposed to the one sided narrative we are continually bombarded with

Got to give the people responsible credit though. The mass beliefs with very little evidence, facts or logic to support some views is truly one of the great magic acts of the 21st century..something something back in the 1800's or just look at this small part of the equation logic...impressive

But then again millions and millions of people believe there is a magic man in the sky , so maybe this level of mind control is not that impressive..Maybe people are just inherently dim witted and the society they actually live in is too hard to understand

 

[RedStarUncle]

very rare examples...did genuinely lol
If you tell lies often enough people just automatically believe them

it doesn't hurt society hearing different opinions based on facts as opposed to the one sided narrative we are continually bombarded with

Got to give the people responsible credit though. The mass beliefs with very little evidence, facts or logic to support some views is truly one of the great magic acts of the 21st century..something something back in the 1800's or just look at this small part of the equation logic...impressive

But then again millions and millions of people believe there is a magic man in the sky , so maybe this level of mind control is not that impressive..Maybe people are just inherently dim witted and the society they actually live in is too hard to understand

You keep enjoying being told by the media how hard your life is as, I've assumed, a white male. And I'll just keep enjoying my life as a white male while appreciating the perspectives of those who aren't the same as me.
Sounds like we'll both be doing what makes us happy.

 

[smish]

You keep enjoying being told by the media how hard your life is as, I've assumed, a white male. And I'll just keep enjoying my life as a white male while appreciating the perspectives of those who aren't the same as me.
Sounds like we'll both be doing what makes us happy.

Why are you trying to move the subject matter of this thread from young males to white males?

 

[Carringbush2010]

Or in other words... let's find one of the very rare examples where there is a semblance of unfairness negatively impacting on men and scream the world down about it because then it sounds like we're balancing the woke-monster that keeps wanting to tell us about all the unfairness negatively impacting on other people.

If you wanna do that, don't think many wanna do that, do you have evidence that many wanna do this? Wasn't the point I was making anyway.

But good on you in your attempt to sensationalize something I said to something I didn't, classic fringe social media justice warrior mind set there. Wouldn't have expected such a response from a poster as balanced as yourself (usually)

How common is this "problem" anyway? Do we have masses of men around the world who requested their partner have an abortion and were told no and now they're being forced to pay child support?

We dunno, willing to bet a lot more than what we hear about

Just because Kanye West wrote a song lyric doesn't make this one of the single biggest issues facing modern society

Dunno this lyric, I haven't claimed this, haven't seen anyone else claim this either.

I dare say most children born into the world are wanted except maybe for those where abortion rights are heavily restricted.

Agreed, wasn't arguing this

I bet it's as likely as not that the father disappears from the scene and isn't pursued for child support despite a legal obligation.

Agreed, wasn't arguing this

But boy do those who don't get their own way on this want you to hear about it.

You find this surprising? Wasn't arguing this either.

 

[awaremind]

I see this as a pretty simple thing, the left is riding a misandrist wave, and this makes you feel attacked as a male by the lefts angry feminist prevailing culture. This doesn’t make the left side of politics appealling whatsoever to the average male when the right won’t treat you that way. Older males might have have some earlier connection to the now defunct workers left, which was anti establishment. Then been brainwashed over many years into the grotesque mindstate of the establishment left which has taken over the left side of politics.