Worst Coach your club has ever had?

[t_94]

If we talk the Sainrs..... I would say Almost every Saints coach besides Allan Jeans, Ross Lyon, Grant Thomas, Stan Alves and Ken Sheldon.

Thank Ken Sheldon to guide them to finals for the 1st time in 17 or 18 years.

Who did you go for before Fremantle ?

 

[Freomaniac]

Who did you go for before Fremantle ?

I have said this before. It was Carlton

 

[Freomaniac]

Connolly?

If it was judged on the win and Loss record, not even close.

Forgot about him. Go back and have a look at the team on paper from 03-07. Winning 1 final is shithouse. Not even making finals in 04 and 05 pretty piss poor.

I have Said this many times. That 2003-2007 period I had mixed emotions. In some played some beautiful attacking footy in our history. We beat Collingwood by 100 points in Perth one game.

Should of easily made finals, possibly top 4 in 2004 and 2005. Our backline was substandard, but our best footy was good enough be a finals team. I didn't mind trading picks to get players but we did too much in that. Hece we got a ageing squad in 2008.

To me the craziest thing about that period was how poor discipline was for the talent on the list.

Jeff Farmer was a good example of this. Kicked 55 goals in 2006. Missed 13 games due to suspension mostly due to stupidity. Got done for 6 weeks for eye gouging. 3 days before his return in round 7, he caused havoc in Perth Casino including damaging a car. He got a 7 week club suspension. Josh Carr getting suspended during key games hurt too.

Until Lyon, freo had a pretty unlucky run. I know how visionary Neesham was as a WAFL coach, but his list management and MC decisions were breathtakingly bad.

The question I guess is who was to blame, club management or the head coaches they hired. The Steves definitely turned things around at Freo.

Neesham did ok with limited resourses and not having 550 1st round picks.

Connolly is a goose but Freo's mid 2000s team wasn't that great. Freo 2003 to 2006 won 14, 11, 11, 15 games.

In the same period St Kilda won 11, 16, 14, 14. Those 2004 and 2005 PF sides... Cornflakes WTF were you doing???

Connolly years from 2003-7 was summed up like this.

The good was playing some attractive Footy with Pav, Farmer and Paul Medhurst in their primes.

the bad was losing games at home to ordinary sides in 2004-5 which cost us finals in those years.

The ugly was only getting 1 finals win in a 5 year period where we should o played finals each year from 2003-7.

 

[captain blood 17]

Coaching is overrated! What did Tommy Hafey use to say "kick it long and kick it to Royce" that was the tactic. Hafey coached a team of rejects who simply did just that, but he also made sure he had fine ruckmen (Roberts/Green) one champion centreman, (Stewart) one champion Half Back Flankeer (Bourke) and one champion rover (Bartlett). Bingo! He got Balme over as a young kid to protect his assets! Hafey simply was a brilliant player/people person, he trained them hard, but he was the sole figure, the father figure...the real leader of Richmond on field. Those rejects played their guts out for him. These days you have about six coaches, so those who are obsessviely critical of Chris Scott had better include the entire Geelong coaching panel. You must have on field talent to win a Premiership, otherwise Alan Joyce should be regarded as one of the all time greats?

Dude, you have NFI about the champions who played during the Hafey era. The fact you don’t know of names like Barrot, Clay, Sheedy, Dean, Swift, Barry Richardson, Brian Wood, i could go on, but, you sir, are a fool and a fop.


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[captain blood 17]

Wayne Schimmelbush must be a solid nomination for North supporters?


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[Blues177]

First season I followed Ian Stewart was coach.
Six or seven weeks into season he was gone. All vague as to what happened as was just a kid. Still to this day, do not know exactly what went down but bad blood between coach Ian Stewart and captain Robert Walls. I believe at one point Walls might even have had a go at coach physically. Walls left in the season to Fitzroy as could not stay with him and coach such bad blood. Next thing is Stewart gone as we need a new coach and near bottom of ladder. Famously Jezza too over reluctantly as captain-coach.

A few years ago on radio Walls explained to Rex Hunt what happened. The trouble started that season ('78) when Carlton lost the round 1 game to the tiges at the G by about 80 points. At training following that round 1 belting Stewart accused Walls of not trying. Walls reply was "Don’t you tell me that I didn’t try, I have been here for 10 years you have been here for 5 minutes". Walls as captain was on the match committee but Stewart told him not to bother turning up to the committee meetings anymore. Stewart then started playing Walls in the back pocket after spending many years playing CHF. Walls thought he was not wanted so he quit.
The next time Stewart and Walls saw each other was in a queue at a pie shop near Brisbane many years later when Walls was coaching the Brisbane Bears. They sat down together to eat their pies and made peace. Stewart and Walls spoke about what happened back in '78 and Stewart admitted that he was not at his best at the time.

 

[Blues177]

Wayne Schimmelbush must be a solid nomination for North supporters?


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3 seasons, no finals.
Sacked after North was annihilated by Adelaide in a pre-season comp game by almost 150 points.
Immediate transformation by North when replaced by Pagan and began winning regularly.

 

[Captain_Bender]

You sir are an imbecile. You have no idea how many times i saw Richmond play in that era...you have no idea about anything at all....


And you are a complete and utter imbecile? You have no idea how many times i saw Richmond play back in that era. I know more about Richmond in the 70's than you will learn in a lifetime. McGhie, Walsh, Rae, Sproule, Andrews, Thorpe etc. You sir are a fool and a flemwad. View attachment 608100

The Geelong sides of 2007-2011 must have been pretty shit then Harley, Mooney and Ottens what a bunch of useless rejects

 

[kranky al]

Ken Judge, and before someone says it was because he tried to clean up the off field stuff

12 wins
31 losses
1 draw
27% winning rate

Game over man

Game over

 

[MiPiG]

I'm still pissed off with Neesham for trading away Andrew McLeod. So him. It was only 24 years ago. I'll get over it. One day.

 

[Freomaniac]

Wayne Schimmelbush must be a solid nomination for North supporters?


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I already mentioned Norths worst coach. Brian Dixon. 6 wins in 2 seasons in 1971-2. Got Norths last Spoon in 1972 with 1 win, then Barrasi took over

 

[captain blood 17]

You sir are an imbecile. You have no idea how many times i saw Richmond play in that era...you have no idea about anything at all....


And you are a complete and utter imbecile? You have no idea how many times i saw Richmond play back in that era. I know more about Richmond in the 70's than you will learn in a lifetime. McGhie, Walsh, Rae, Sproule, Andrews, Thorpe etc. You sir are a fool and a flemwad. View attachment 608100

If i had a set of gloves on me right now.......... In all my years, i have never heard the talents of the players i mentioned and others i didn’t be dismissed as having no ability.
Fortunately for me more learned and astute judges of football from the coaches, players and journos of that era and beyond support me. You’re just a random no nothing on the internet.
But hey, yeah, Billy Barrott was no good etc. Thanks for the laughs.
(Ahhhhhhh, you’re a Geelong supporter. Still sooking over 67 like Farmer. Makes sense. Geelong/Farmer/sooking like a bitch).


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[RobZombie]

Wayne Schimmelbush must be a solid nomination for North supporters?


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Overall coaching record 31-35. '93 certainly showed he wasn't the right coach for that group considering what Pagan did with them, but the Greg Miller episode of the '93 Greatest Season That Was podcast gave some context to the circumstances. He was the last part-time senior coach at North and while he wasn't great, was at least partly a victim of the club's chronic lack of resources.

By comparison, Brian Dixon also coached a team containing a core that would go on to be a powerhouse (though admittedly without Davis/Wade/Rantall, Blight, Schimma or Cable) and could only manage 6-37-1. 1 win in 1972 with Greig, Dench, Kekovich, Snake Baker, Frank Gumbleton, Ken Montgomery, Paul Feltham, Mark Dawson ... pretty poor. That's all before my time following them though so I'm just going off numbers and 2nd-hand reports.

In my time I think Cable and Blight were more disappointing than Schimma. Cable had a better W-L record but the names he had at his disposal, while ageing, were better than anything Schimma had. Trying to make Blight captain-coach was a terrible mistake.

 

[perplexed]

Wayne Schimmelbush must be a solid nomination for North supporters?


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Schimma was bad, but was an improvement on John Kennedy. Bloke was a useless dinosaur. He would yell at the Krakouer brothers for not kicking it long.

 

[Blues177]

I already mentioned Norths worst coach. Brian Dixon. 6 wins in 2 seasons in 1971-2. Got Norths last Spoon in 1972 with 1 win, then Barrasi took over

On the documentary 'Barassi: Operation Premiers' Allen Aylett who was president, and Keith Greig mentioned that Brian Dixon set the foundation on what you had to do to become a successful footy club ie discipline/ training /style of play.

However Mark Dawson mentioned that Brian Dixon cleared too many good experienced players out of the club and played heaps of kids. Dixon also found it difficult to handle strong personalities like Sam Kekovich and Goodingham.

The players that went on to be part of the powerful teams of the mid 70's were still very young in '72- Baker (20), Briedis (17), Dawson (18), Dench (20), Feltham (23), Greig (20), Gumbleton (20) & Montgomery (21).

Kekovich was dropped due to poor form after round 13 in 1972 and was then suspended by the club for the rest of the season because he refused to play in 2 reserves games.

 

[Magpie03]

A few years ago on radio Walls explained to Rex Hunt what happened. The trouble started that season ('78) when Carlton lost the round 1 game to the tiges at the G by about 80 points. At training following that round 1 belting Stewart accused Walls of not trying. Walls reply was "Don’t you tell me that I didn’t try, I have been here for 10 years you have been here for 5 minutes". Walls as captain was on the match committee but Stewart told him not to bother turning up to the committee meetings anymore. Stewart then started playing Walls in the back pocket after spending many years playing CHF. Walls thought he was not wanted so he quit.
The next time Stewart and Walls saw each other was in a queue at a pie shop near Brisbane many years later when Walls was coaching the Brisbane Bears. They sat down together to eat their pies and made peace. Stewart and Walls spoke about what happened back in '78 and Stewart admitted that he was not at his best at the time.

I read a long time ago that there was also something said by Stewart about the Doormat missing training for a personal reason which tipped Walls over the edge. People outside the Blues judge walls on his media and other coaching gigs but at the end of the day he was an amazing player who played in a very tough era and one who never took a backward step. He was and still is Carlton thru and thru .

 

[Freomaniac]

Dude, you have NFI about the champions who played during the Hafey era. The fact you don’t know of names like Barrot, Clay, Sheedy, Dean, Swift, Barry Richardson, Brian Wood, i could go on, but, you sir, are a fool and a fop.


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Surprised you didn't mention Francis Bourke on that list.

But That Richmond side of 1967-82 was a Power House side. Looking back at the 1970s, only 4 teams won Flags: Richmond, North, Carlton and Hawthorn. 2 of them won 2, the other 2 won 3.

Teams that win multiple flags in a 4-6 year period have a core of good players just like the players you listed.

 

[port_adelaide_1870]

Hinkley.

Most will say Primus but Hinkley has had a much better list, a better football department, better and more experienced coaches and has done nothing. If Primus was given half of what Hinkley has been given he would had been more successful

 

[Freomaniac]

Hinkley.

Most will say Primus but Hinkley has had a much better list, a better football department, better and more experienced coaches and has done nothing. If Primus was given half of what Hinkley has been given he would had been more successful

You are probably right.

He looked liked a half decent coach when he took over choco at the late part of 2010. Then you had that Horrible 2011 season. Yeah the resources, well lack of recourses was dire. Having bugger all money didn't help the recruiting department. Port had picks 8,9 and 16 in 2009 and chose John Butcher, Andrew Moore and Jasper Pittard with those picks. Nathan Fyfe was taken at pick 20.

I still remember one interview or Press conference that he was fighting with one arm tied behind his back. Plus in I both of those 2011 and 2012 seasons, Ports Salary cap was the minimum of 92.5% at the time. In that primus era, Port was the only side without a midfield coach.


Still remember those infamous days at Footy park when Port had those tarps/Bay covers. Port lost like 3 million in 2011 and 6 million In 2012.

 

[TubbsFarquhar]

Shaw is a popular choice for the Crows but I'll go with Sanderson. Bailey pulled the strings in 2012 which got us to a prelim and, when he got suspended, it exposed Sanderson for the fraud he was. Clueless and had us playing an atrocious gameplan. Honourable mention to Neil Craig whose stubborness and inept finals coaching cost us a flag. His refusal to tag Robert Harvey cost us a spot in the GF. Then of course there was Massie on Buddy.

 

[Freomaniac]

Jesus, he was stumped in a couple of questions. Still. This was 2008 and Robert Walls was right. We had the oldest list.

An ageing squad that had only 6-7 players aged 23 or under.

 

[Freomaniac]

Shaw is a popular choice for the Crows but I'll go with Sanderson. Bailey pulled the strings in 2012 which got us to a prelim and, when he got suspended, it exposed Sanderson for the fraud he was. Clueless and had us playing an atrocious gameplan. Honourable mention to Neil Craig whose stubborness and inept finals coaching cost us a flag. His refusal to tag Robert Harvey cost us a spot in the GF. Then of course there was Massie on Buddy.

I disliked Sanderson. He looked arrogant after that speech after the 2012 season was done saying the crows were on the verge of something.

to this day I am still bitter about that 2012 semi final loss.

Neil Craig was unlucky. Tyson Stenglein wanted to go back to Perth and play for west coast. Had Stenglein played for the crows in the 2006 prelim, he would of contained either judd or cousins. I assure you, a rookie Nathan Van Berlo wouldn't of played.

Massie on Buddy? Ah the 2007 elim final loss. Was Ken McGregor playing? If he was, He would of played CHB and Done a much better job than Kris Massie. Buddy would of only kicked 2-4 goals rather than 7.

 

[BlueRenaissance]

Malthouse by the Flemington straight.

 

[PorcelainBus]

Stuart Magee

 

[Freomaniac]

Easily.

Robert Shaw is the worst coach? Agreed

Few to choose from

Ayres, Neil Craig, Sanderson, Shaw.

Ayres and Craig were decent. Sanderson was overrated.

Neil Craig edges out Robert Shaw. Honourable mention to Brenton Sanderson

I am surprised with this post.

How does Craig edge out, Shaw? I'm honestly curious. I'd have daylight, Ayres and more daylight before Craig.

Craig had his faults, no doubt about it, but I don't think he's the worst.

I Have a similar view.

Neil Craig for mine. His refusal to trade players in and out stopped us from ever getting a forward line to take advantage of our backline and mids...Macgregor and sarge, FFS

you tried to get Pav at the end of 2004 or 2005. Imagine of Pav was CHF for the crows in that 2006 prelim.

Sanderson. The brand of footy he had a us playing post 2012 was putrid.

People would probably expect us to say Robert Shaw but he built the list that won us those flags. Blighty came in, cut some of the fat and we went back to back.

interesting view

We'd have won a flag in the 00's had we had anyone else coaching us. Then there was the bizarre choice of making VB captain. VB was about as inspiring as watching paint dry.

So if you had Tim Watson or Damien Drum as a coach in 2005-6, you would of done better?

I wasn't around with Shaw but out of Ayres, Craig, Sando, Walsh and Pyke then easily Sando. He lost the players completely.

Craig was different which I liked, but overworked the players and then the game passed him.

Pyke has a business background which very applicable into coaching but I wish he was a bit more ruthless at selection.

All except Walsh took us to a prelim but there were signs in all years that we weren't cut out to be champions.

This is from someone from the outside looking in.

I am very surprised about the opinions towards Neil Craig. No way in anyway shape or form was he a horrible coach.

And he wasn't inexperienced. Coached Norwood from 1991-5. Was a fitness/assistant coach in the crows flag years of 1997-8. Eventually became a caretaker coach in the middle of 2004. Then coached the crows from 2005-2011.

I remember Neil Craigs coaching stint like it was yesterday. The tactics was interesting to say the least. They were not the best attacking side goal wise but made up for it with the Pressing tactics when it came to defence.

They were also one of the fittest sides and relied on gut running. The media for this reason coined the term "Crowbots"

The Crows 2006 season was scarily similar to the dockers 2015 season: Excellent 1st half, faltered in the 2nd half then bundled out in the prelim at home. I remember the Crows being like 14-2 then West coast beat the crows by 80 odd points. The wheels started to falter. Then in 2007-9 was 3 elim finals.

I knew Neil Craig was on Borrowed time at the end of 2010 when McLeod, Edwards, Burton and Goodwin all retired.

Crows were desperate to get that gun forward. Kurt Tippett and Taylor Walker were slowly developing post 2006. Tippett kicked like 55 goals in 2009. Walker was slowly developing at the crows from 2008-2011. Craig was gone at the end of the 2011 season, Walker had his break through year in 2012.