List Mgmt. COLLINGWOOD Trade & FA 2024

[Carlthetruth]

Have you ever monitored a trade week or just like to come on here and impose your views on people? Those two are currently decent VFL footballers and no club trades currency for state league footballers. Draft picks are definitely overrated, but so are those two and it has to be strong whatever it is judging by your barnstorming defense of a rubbish take.

For context Frampton 2022 >>>> both of those two right now. What did we give for him? Lipinski 2021 >>>>>>>> both of those two right now. What did we give for him? You’ve got NFI.

The old I feel threatened because I'm not as sure as I thought I was. When they're regulars and playing good footy all will be revealed. This desire for every player to be a Nick Daicos and play great straight away from people like yourself is why some people get player values and draft picks so wrong. If you think Reef and Finn aren't worth much just because they're plying their trade in the VFL you would be wrong. The same people thought we should dump Murph for nothing after his first 3 years, they just don't get development. Fly has said Finn is an important part of the future and then some bigfooty posters think he's worth giving away, I think I'll stick with Fly on this one, he's got a cup to prove it.

 

[memoryofmchale]

The old I feel threatened because I'm not as sure as I thought I was. When they're regulars and playing good footy all will be revealed. This desire for every player to be a Nick Daicos and play great straight away from people like yourself is why some people get player values and draft picks so wrong. If you think Reef and Finn aren't worth much just because they're plying their trade in the VFL you would be wrong. The same people thought we should dump Murph for nothing after his first 3 years, they just don't get development. Fly has said Finn is an important part of the future and then some bigfooty posters think he's worth giving away, I think I'll stick with Fly on this one, he's got a cup to prove it.

Mate, that's not what we're saying.

We're saying their trade value is lower. Trades come from the what the market is willing to pay. It's not what their value could be or might be but what someone else wants to purchase them for.

Now, they could become stars but the willingness of clubs to pay for "could" is low given they're in their fourth year. These players just do no attract a high pick.

You still haven't actually provided an evaluation for what their trade value is but I would imagine you think it's a second or a first round pick.

It's neither.

Follow the draft, look at historical trades.

Bobby Hill had cancer and before that had demand so his price went up. Macrae and McInnes have neither demand or the amount of games played. So, there's your answer for that.

 

[Carlthetruth]

I’m not going to get to caught up in that because my take is beyond 15 it’s pot luck (It could even be as low as 10) and more about landing spot than ability in most cases. You have to be ******* incredible at football to even get on a list so they’ve mostly got it and just need people to believe or an opportunity to present.

What I’m not copping though is that these guys that are year 4 and still a fair way off being best 23 let alone average at the top level are worth anything from a trade perspective. They might get there, but the reality for anyone that has a remote interest in this stuff would be that regardless of the strength of the draft guys like McInnes and Macrae don’t have currency.

You're just going to have to cop it, they do have currency and that's why they're not getting traded, pretty easy to understand I would have thought.

 

[Scodog10]

The old I feel threatened because I'm not as sure as I thought I was. When they're regulars and playing good footy all will be revealed. This desire for every player to be a Nick Daicos and play great straight away from people like yourself is why some people get player values and draft picks so wrong. If you think Reef and Finn aren't worth much just because they're plying their trade in the VFL you would be wrong. The same people thought we should dump Murph for nothing after his first 3 years, they just don't get development. Fly has said Finn is an important part of the future and then some bigfooty posters think he's worth giving away, I think I'll stick with Fly on this one, he's got a cup to prove it.

I notice you didn’t address my comments on Lipinski and Frampton yet I’m threatened

Paddy Dow 2023 >>>> McInnes/ Macrae right now. Dig up mate!

 

[Carlthetruth]

Mate, that's not what we're saying.

We're saying their trade value is lower. Trades come from the what the market is willing to pay. It's not what their value could be or might be but what someone else wants to purchase them for.

Now, they could become stars but the willingness of clubs to pay for "could" is low given they're in their fourth year. These players just do no attract a high pick.

You still haven't actually provided an evaluation for what their trade value is but I would imagine you think it's a second or a first round pick.

It's neither.

Follow the draft, look at historical trades.

Bobby Hill had cancer and before that had demand so his price went up. Macrae and McInnes have neither demand or the amount of games played. So, there's your answer for that.

Mate, what you don't get is the club sees them as part of the future. We have an experienced side, players will be exiting the building over the next few years. We are not trading them so who cares what you think they're worth on the open market. Bundling up all these 3's for early picks this year is not happening, that's what you're getting at and it's pure fantasy.

 

[Carlthetruth]

I notice you didn’t address my comments on Lipinski and Frampton yet I’m threatened

Paddy Dow 2023 >>>> McInnes/ Macrae right now. Dig up mate!

They're not getting traded champ, deal with it and Paddy Dow better than Finn and Reef, fug me! That says it all right there.

 

[SchuPie]

If we trade Reef or Fin I doubt its would be for picks - it will be in addition to / bundled with some picks to bring in players ala Smith etc IMO

 

[Dead Eye Didak]

I think you're paying too much attention to birth dates. I think Mitchell needs to be closer to at his physical best to play his role well.i think he's nearing the end.

So you right off players at 30 years of age?

He didn't look near the end against Port or 6/7 months ago in a grand final

 

[memoryofmchale]

Mate, what you don't get is the club sees them as part of the future. We have an experienced side, players will be exiting the building over the next few years. We are not trading them so who cares what you think they're worth on the open market. Bundling up all these 3's for early picks this year is not happening, that's what you're getting at and it's pure fantasy.

As I said last night, I'm not saying they would be traded nor do I want them to be (reminder, I have a signed Fin Macrae, #18 guernsey). I'm stating what they would (as in hypothetical) worth if they were traded. You have continually overassessed their value.

I am not suggesting third rounders would be bundled together and traded. It would never happen. Under your evaluation, pick 26 would be fair for a first rounder. Using the DVI, those points could be exchanged for a first rounder if bundled up with enough for a club bidding with academies.

 

[memoryofmchale]

If we trade Reef or Fin I doubt its would be for picks - it will be in addition to / bundled with some picks to bring in players ala Smith etc IMO

Fin won't be traded - he's contracted until 2025.

Reef might leave but it would be for opportunity.

 

[sr36]

So you right off players at 30 years of age?

He didn't look near the end against Port or 6/7 months ago in a grand final

No I'm not writing him off - just suggesting that he has to be closer to his physical peak than a lot of our other players need to be and thus I don't think he'll be around for much longer as it'll be harder and harder for him to be at his peak.

 

[memoryofmchale]

You're just going to have to cop it, they do have currency and that's why they're not getting traded, pretty easy to understand I would have thought.

Thought you were all about the truth.

What is this mythical currency? Back up what you're saying and we might stop laughing.

Actually, we won't because the currency they do have is tokenistic third rounder. That's what the market will pay. Test this theory out with the other boards.

 

[Fruit]

do you think the Pies would seriously consider McCluggage. Free agency would seem to be more the area we can play in.

 

[manicpie]

do you think the Pies would seriously consider McCluggage. Free agency would seem to be more the area we can play in.

I would imagine he's the one we are most interested in.

 

[memoryofmchale]

do you think the Pies would seriously consider McCluggage. Free agency would seem to be more the area we can play in.

He is one we have interest in. Can confirm.

 

[Beatle Bailey]

any chance we can poach Harley Reid?! Would compliment Daicos remarkably well. If I’m investing in top end talent, you get greatest return with midfielders.

Ok, you grab, I'll drive

 

[NMBB]

.....Would compliment Daicos remarkably well....

I think he'd say wonderful things to Nick - might also complement his midfield work - who knows?

 

[No SPIN]

Mitchell is only 30 though, it's not like he's 34 and his career is ending in the next 12 months. I wouldn't think he needs managing like Pendles or Sidey would require. Titch could play at least another 2/3 years quite capably. Unless he just had real bad general soreness on Anzac Day.

His biological age is 30 - but with the punishment his body gets every week I can’t share your confidence in his longevity.
But hopefully Wade is the architect of extending his career.

 

[Carlthetruth]

Thought you were all about the truth.

What is this mythical currency? Back up what you're saying and we might stop laughing.

Actually, we won't because the currency they do have is tokenistic third rounder. That's what the market will pay. Test this theory out with the other boards.

I'm quite sure club pro scouts wouldn't agree with you but let's cut to the chase, what you're really angling towards is swapping players for picks to bundle up and get into the pointy end of the draft for Brisbane's pick, it's not happening, that's just the truth and reality. And just to give you a heads up, next years draft will be bad, really bad so factor that in next time.

 

[BuildEmUp]

do you think the Pies would seriously consider McCluggage. Free agency would seem to be more the area we can play in.

only if he indicates he wants to move, and considering how brions are travelling at present that could be a possibility

 

[BuildEmUp]

His biological age is 30 - but with the punishment his body gets every week I can’t share your confidence in his longevity.
But hopefully Wade is the architect of extending his career.

you could say that of every 30 year old, including Buddy who went on for what, 6 more years , and far more banged up than Mitch, Fletcher as full back would be same .. could go on with many more examples ( Fyfe is a good one Yeo another) but writing off a 30 year old because of some perceived view he is banged up is not sound thinking.

 

[memoryofmchale]

I'm quite sure club pro scouts wouldn't agree with you but let's cut to the chase, what you're really angling towards is swapping players for picks to bundle up and get into the pointy end of the draft for Brisbane's pick, it's not happening, that's just the truth and reality. And just to give you a heads up, next years draft will be bad, really bad so factor that in next time.

I think you’re the only one who thinks this. Pro scouts do not value Macrae or McInnes at a second rounder or higher. Read my posts again, Carl. Back up why you think they’re worth more than a third. A weak draft does not price them at that value.

I have never advocated trading players for picks and bundling up third rounders for Brisbane’s first round selection. Again, I have a Macrae guernsey and like McInnes.

To get a first rounder that way, you would need to bundle up many picks for something similar in value to the DVI. And that just doesn’t happen with our hand.

Next year’s draft is over eighteen months away. Probably a bit early to be saying it’s rubbish. I don’t mind some of the talent coming through.

 

[Drought Break]

I’m not going to get to caught up in that because my take is beyond 15 it’s pot luck (It could even be as low as 10) and more about landing spot than ability in most cases. You have to be ******* incredible at football to even get on a list so they’ve mostly got it and just need people to believe or an opportunity to present.

What I’m not copping though is that these guys that are year 4 and still a fair way off being best 23 let alone average at the top level are worth anything from a trade perspective. They might get there, but the reality for anyone that has a remote interest in this stuff would be that regardless of the strength of the draft guys like McInnes and Macrae don’t have currency.

Makes you wonder what our recruiting team saw in them given they were taken in 1st round. Now 4 years of development and only worth 3rd round

 

[Carlthetruth]

I think you’re the only one who thinks this. Pro scouts do not value Macrae or McInnes at a second rounder or higher. Read my posts again, Carl. Back up why you think they’re worth more than a third. A weak draft does not price them at that value.

I have never advocated trading players for picks and bundling up third rounders for Brisbane’s first round selection. Again, I have a Macrae guernsey and like McInnes.

To get a first rounder that way, you would need to bundle up many picks for something similar in value to the DVI. And that just doesn’t happen with our hand.

Next year’s draft is over eighteen months away. Probably a bit early to be saying it’s rubbish. I don’t mind some of the talent coming through.

Don't have to back anything up, if Lachy Weller can go to GC for pick 2 then there are all sorts or probabilities. You attaching iron clad values to players I'm finding amusing, you can guess but you wouldn't know, that's what I'm saying, it's just the truth.

 

[Carlthetruth]

Makes you wonder what our recruiting team saw in them given they were taken in 1st round. Now 4 years of development and only worth 3rd round

Yep, my point exactly, gotta play like Nicky D right out of the gate!