Australia - US Relationship (If Trump Wins 2024)

[Blue1980]

Really though?

Ukriane war, same after flex
Palestine, same after flex
China, still big bad. Iran similar

Tariffs* I suppose, after the Biden admin spread the largest sanctions regime in history it's not really unprecedented

*When he changes his mind and they end two weeks later

The Greenland, Panama and Canada stuff. He wants to ramp it up and turn the US back to colonialism. He’s also saying FU to Europe.

Now the Europe stuff is sorta posturing sorta not, the Canada/greenland/panama stuff not posturing, he genuinely wants to do it. Now will it happen? Probably not but we are way beyond just thinking trump is “joking” about such things

 

[barreness]

The Greenland, Panama and Canada stuff. He wants to ramp it up and turn the US back to colonialism. He’s also saying FU to Europe.

Now the Europe stuff is sorta posturing sorta not, the Canada/greenland/panama stuff not posturing, he genuinely wants to do it. Now will it happen? Probably not but we are way beyond just thinking trump is “joking” about such things

It's just a change in rhetoric though, not material reality

Panama was invaded in '89 when the US wasn't happy with the leadership, of course they'll do it again if they feel like it. The US got the concessions they wanted so it's fine for now.

Greenland was occupied in WW2(illegally, but what does that matter) and they've refused to leave ever since. If the US officially annexed it nothing would change except Denmark would stop the welfare payments......this is kinda why they don't officially annex places.

Canada may put up a brave face* but we all know it's a US vassal, same with Australia

*I feel like a lot of these things are controlled opposition, keeps the population happy with their perception of independence. The Canadian govt immediately made concessions after the tariffs were anounced

 

[barreness]

NONE! of this turned out right

View attachment 2258299

I mean..... I went through and explained how their foreign policy hasn't really changed. Did you have an example?

I think many 'liberal democracies' have at least tended to electing (proto)fascists, which counter examples would you raise?

 

[Carringbush2010]

I mean..... I went through and explained how their foreign policy hasn't really changed. Did you have an example?

I think many 'liberal democracies' have at least tended to electing (proto)fascists, which counter examples would you raise?

For starters, you're now trying to back pedal from your original post.

And comparing trump to ANY past president is just ridiculous.

No doubt, trump has DEFINITELY gone rogue on his foreign 'policies' - this is not the 'same ol usa' as you're implying. No where near it.

 

[Aussie in exile]

For starters, you're now trying to back pedal from your original post.

And comparing trump to ANY past president is just ridiculous.

No doubt, trump has DEFINITELY gone rogue on his foreign 'policies' - this is not the 'same ol usa' as you're implying. No where near it.

It's clear that Barreness is pro Russian, Pro putin and therefore pro Russia's illegal invasion of Ukraine,

 

[barreness]

For starters, you're now trying to back pedal from your original post.

And comparing trump to ANY past president is just ridiculous.

No doubt, trump has DEFINITELY gone rogue on his foreign 'policies' - this is not the 'same ol usa' as you're implying. No where near it.

I'm not back pedalling at all, I provided examples. You've just said nah ah, WRONG, very Trumpian if I may

The rhetoric has gone rouge, I'm suggesting that the actually policies haven't changed a great deal.
I guess the tariffs and shitting on allies is surprising to many people if you believed the "rules based order" stuff before

 

[Carringbush2010]

I'm not back pedalling at all, I provided examples. You've just said nah ah, WRONG, very Trumpian if I may

The rhetoric has gone rouge, I'm suggesting that the actually policies haven't changed a great deal.
I guess the tariffs and shitting on allies is surprising to many people if you believed the "rules based order" stuff before

Ok then, apart his ridiculous tariffs and stupid livelihood destroying doge he hasn't acted (yet!) on his irrational foreign policies. He just wants to or is he just 'joking'?

Doesn't change the fact you cannot compare this buffoon to ANY past president. Like you did in your original post.

This is not 'American' policy anymore or America, it's a narcissistic dictator that has hijacked the US.

 

[Not Important]

yep! one of the greatest myths has been the tin tanks would always protect us. if it's not in their interests they couldn't give a stuff about us.

"That even Carlson can see this truth should be a source of great embarrassment. The myth that the Americans will come to our rescue should we ever need them has endured for evermore than 70 years, but it has always been just that – a myth.

The mythology of our security relationship with the United States stems, of course, from the experience of the second world war and our “abandonment” by Great Britain. It was further ingrained by the 1951 Anzus Treaty and the formalisation of the security alliance.


But despite unsubstantiated claims to the contrary, the Anzus Treaty promises us nothing – it gives only the assurance that both parties will “consult” when “political independence or security of any of the parties is threatened in the Pacific”, “act to meet the common danger” and report to the UN security council “all measures taken as a result”. All of this means nothing more nor less than what anyone wants it to mean."

The US-Australia alliance has created a unique kind of subservience. What if we don’t need the US to come to our rescue? | Dr Emma Shortis

The alliance with the US is counterproductive to Australian interests, argues Emma Shortis. We need to rethink the alliance to be based on democratic solidarity – not fear

www.theguardian.com

 

[barreness]

Ok then, apart his ridiculous tariffs and stupid livelihood destroying doge he hasn't acted (yet!) on his irrational foreign policies. He just wants to or is he just 'joking'?

Doesn't change the fact you cannot compare this buffoon to ANY past president. Like you did in your original post.

This is not 'American' policy anymore or America, it's a narcissistic dictator that has hijacked the US.

I was pretty explicit in my original post about their foreign policy not changing much

It's a disaster internally

I mean just as an example Bush renditioned people to black sites in Syria and Egypt, Trump is sending them to El Salvador

 

[Carringbush2010]

I was pretty explicit in my original post about their foreign policy not changing much

Yeah it will change if trump follows through and that's the important point. Not that 'he hasn't yet'

Not to mention the tarrifs and thousands of jobs lost through doge.

I mean just as an example Bush renditioned people to black sites in Syria and Egypt, Trump is sending them to El Salvador

I didn't mention this.

 

[barreness]

Yeah it will change if trump follows through and that's the important point. Not that 'he hasn't yet'

I mean he has to follow through before you call me wrong?

Still 100k armed personnel, nukes and overwhelming airpower in Europe. Calling NATO over is a reach, in fact it's the cornerstone of their global hegemony, maybe he's that dumb? I hope so

So far most of Europe has promised to up their defence funding which ironically was his first term request

Not to mention the tarrifs and thousands of jobs lost through doge.

Yeh I'll pay the tariffs are a change in foreign policy, we'll see how many he implements. His destruction of the govt goes to my initial post of fascism spreading

I didn't mention this.

Fair, I was thinking about another's post

 

[Carringbush2010]

I mean he has to follow through before you call me wrong?

It's not about you being 'wrong', it's about you're willing to give him a mulligan 'coz he hasn't yet'

Or are you just joking like donold?, might not follow through, dunno yet, so don't panic yet?

You phuqin serious? FMD.

The fact that donold is even mentioning his foreign policies should put him in the red flag book for anyone with a modicum of integrity. Not a red flag for you obviously

So far most of Europe has promised to up their defence funding which ironically was his first term request

Not the point! The point is trump is willing to give up Ukraine land, hostages and kids, basically 'you give it all up Ukraine and I'll stop vlad' on top of 'but no security guarantees' on top of 'Zelensky you have to give up your minerals to us as well'.

On behalf of Ukraine, like get off your high horse trump you ****. Not your place to give up everything on behalf of another nation in the name of stopping an invasion, which vlad shouldn't have done in the first place.

Do you wonder why Zelensky won't accept the bend over and take a pineapple in the ass deal?

 

[schneebly111]

So if/when the U.S. invades and occupies Greenland (which is more likely than not) when are we finally going to tell the Yanks to piss off, evict their f**king military from our country and find our place as part of Asia?

Because when they do they’ll be confirmed as no better than Russia and far worse than China so it give a brave Australian leader the ammunition they need to get the Yanks to f**k off from our country.

 

[Anzacpaul]

So if/when the U.S. invades and occupies Greenland (which is more likely than not) when are we finally going to tell the Yanks to piss off, evict their f**king military from our country and find our place as part of Asia?

Because when they do they’ll be confirmed as no better than Russia and far worse than China so it give a brave Australian leader the ammunition they need to get the Yanks to f**k off from our country.

Denmark is a part of NATO. If the US invade, NATO are obligated to defend.

If that happened, the uproar in the US would be insane. No one but mentally ill Maga would support that war.

In fact, it might even be enough for Republicans to invoke the 25th, or impeach.

 

[schneebly111]

Denmark is a part of NATO. If the US invade, NATO are obligated to defend.

If that happened, the uproar in the US would be insane. No one but mentally ill Maga would support that war.

In fact, it might even be enough for Republicans to invoke the 25th, or impeach.

Already on Fox ‘News’ they’re softening up the populace the ‘fact’ Greenland should be part of America. There wouldn’t be a war, it would be just America landing its military in force to occupy the territory (only 50,000 people there) which is undefended. The “war” would be over in a few hours.

The EU can bluster and protest but ultimately they don’t have the forces required to prevent a U.S. takeover. Most Americans will go “meh” as the operation would be over very quickly, in fact US tech stocks would see a share increase as they now have control over those critical minerals.

NATO will be redundant after the U.S. takes over.

If it’s not Greenland it’ll be Panama, or Iran. My point being a Putinesque land grabber is now in the White House and his military are occupying parts of Australia. When can we kick them out of our country (that’s assuming the Yanks don’t begin to interfere in Australia as a result of us trying to distance ourselves from them).

 

[Anzacpaul]

Already on Fox ‘News’ they’re softening up the populace the ‘fact’ Greenland should be part of America. There wouldn’t be a war, it would be just America landing its military in force to occupy the territory (only 50,000 people there) which is undefended. The “war” would be over in a few hours.

The EU can bluster and protest but ultimately they don’t have the forces required to prevent a U.S. takeover. Most Americans will go “meh” as the operation would be over very quickly, in fact US tech stocks would see a share increase as they now have control over those critical minerals.

NATO will be redundant after the U.S. takes over.

If it’s not Greenland it’ll be Panama, or Iran. My point being a Putinesque land grabber is now in the White House and his military are occupying parts of Australia. When can we kick them out of our country (that’s assuming the Yanks don’t begin to interfere in Australia as a result of us trying to distance ourselves from them).

NATO has 2.11 million troops excluding the US, who have 1.3m.

 

[Carringbush2010]

Sounds like the question is 'if trump decides to annexe Greenland, Panama, Gaza, anywhere, will trump demand we support him militarily and would we reject that?'

1. Maybe
2. Emphatically yes, it'd be political suicide to support unjustified (and probably illegal) annexation.

As to the thread title, well it seems Labor are for want of a better term, holding out until an adult regains the WH.

Seems if the coalition of the willing are prepared to support Ukraine (and Denmark / Greenland), Albo has alluded, if not said he'd send support.

There seems to be messaging from Albo to trump 'we're not on board with you on x y or z' - like the rest of the world.