List Mgmt. Contract, Trade & Draftee Discussion, 2023: Picks 1,20,34,39,53 ,58

[Keys]

Link to contract status of all players

The Contracts Thread

2024 List Changes : Out: Retired- Gaff Delisted - Jones, Trew(R), Baker(R), Witherden, Burgiel, Culley(R), Rotham, L Edwards Traded - Darling (NM) Barrass (Hawthorn) In: Trade/FA acquisitions - Graham (Richmond) Baker (Richmond) Owies (Carlton) Draft - Allan (Pick 16) Shanahan (Pick 30) Gross...

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Link to Lore ’s excellent draft order thread that is updated to reflect current ladder positions

Resource - 2023 AFL Draft Order

Every trade as it happens!

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[FKASC]

Academy pick. Interestingly he is part Turkish although I believe not an NGA.

Wow I didn’t realise. ****ing Sydney those campaigners.

Apologies dinnaz

 

[briztoon]

Academy pick. Interestingly he is part Turkish although I believe not an NGA.

There are no NGA's in the Northern Academies, because every kid is part of the academy. The only requirements are based on residency. Kids have to have resided in their academy zone (or their parents mailing address stayed the same) for 5 years, up to their draft year.

There are kids who participate in the academies, who we don't have priority access to, because of residency status, but if they go undrafted in the National Draft, we can prelist them as QLD zone selections as Cat B rookies.

 

[dinnaz]

He was also considered a risk due to his 172cm 68kg size to the point he wasn’t included in knightmares top 20 November draft rankings (value that as you will).

Anyone could have bid at him at 6-10 and it would’ve made life hard for Sydney having already taken Campbell at 5.

176cm and for example Nick Watson this year who most have in their top 10:
169cm, 1.7 goals, 26.0 disposals.

So Gulden was a full year ahead of an equally good prospect.

 

[bzparkes]

I have a dumb question:

Who else trains and plays at MRP? The non-Eagles beagles, do they train there? And do they play there every fortnight in the WAFL? Are they getting the same injuries? is the issue Optus, MRP, or just s**t S&C?

1. Perth
2. Yes

 

[briztoon]

There was a fair bit to unpack from the Rookie Me podcast.

For those that aren't aware, Rookie Me is the company that do all the preseason and post-season testing and measurements of the Victorian kids. AFL Draft Central merged with them a couple of years, so the draft watchers and writers for Rookie Me are there on testing day, interviewing the kids between sessions, etc. They also talk to a lot of club recruiters and scouts at games each week.

On today's podcast episode, they discussed whether the Eagles should trade or keep pick 1.

They mentioned that recruiters and talent pathway staff no longer have Harley Reid as the undisputed number one prospect, that Walter and McKercher are up there with Reid.

They spoke to Reid on the weekend, and spoke to him about potentially moving West.

They have a top 12 (to 15). Then a blanket 30. Mentioned Koen Sanchez is in that group of 30.

They have Reid 1, Walter 2, McKercher 3, Read (GC) 4. Then a gap.

 

[dinnaz]

There was a fair bit to unpack from the Rookie Me podcast.

For those that aren't aware, Rookie Me is the company that do all the preseason and post-season testing and measurements of the Victorian kids. AFL Draft Central merged with them a couple of years, so the draft watchers and writers for Rookie Me are there on testing day, interviewing the kids between sessions, etc. They also talk to a lot of club recruiters and scouts at games each week.

On today's podcast episode, they discussed whether the Eagles should trade or keep pick 1.

They mentioned that recruiters and talent pathway staff no longer have Harley Reid as the undisputed number one prospect, that Walter and McKercher are up there with Reid.

They spoke to Reid on the weekend, and spoke to him about potentially moving West.

They have a top 12 (to 15). Then a blanket 30. Mentioned Koen Sanchez is in that group of 30.

They have Reid 1, Walter 2, McKercher 3, Read (GC) 4. Then a gap.

They do excellent work but do suffer from a bit of group think which is to be expected.

I'd trade down for a top 3 pick (pushed back to #4) and whatever else we can get.

 

[Godfather32]

1. Perth
2. Yes

Doesn't look that bad to me

Injury Hub | WAFL

wafl.com.au

 

[ROO DOGG]

Why not spice things up and get truly creative?

View attachment 1743166

Is that you Mr Rioli?

 

[Chump Change]

There was a fair bit to unpack from the Rookie Me podcast.

For those that aren't aware, Rookie Me is the company that do all the preseason and post-season testing and measurements of the Victorian kids. AFL Draft Central merged with them a couple of years, so the draft watchers and writers for Rookie Me are there on testing day, interviewing the kids between sessions, etc. They also talk to a lot of club recruiters and scouts at games each week.

On today's podcast episode, they discussed whether the Eagles should trade or keep pick 1.

They mentioned that recruiters and talent pathway staff no longer have Harley Reid as the undisputed number one prospect, that Walter and McKercher are up there with Reid.

They spoke to Reid on the weekend, and spoke to him about potentially moving West.

They have a top 12 (to 15). Then a blanket 30. Mentioned Koen Sanchez is in that group of 30.

They have Reid 1, Walter 2, McKercher 3, Read (GC) 4. Then a gap.

The interesting stuff starts at 20 mins for anyone wondering.

Ignoring GC Academy kids, I have Harley 1 and McKercher 2 and then a gap to Sanders, Watson, Curtin. Given I think there is a more than reasonable chance Colby will go to Tassie when they come in, I think Harley is a must.

This looks like the top 13 at the moment:

Reid
Walter
McKercher
Read
Sanders
Watson
Curtin
Duursma
Caddy
Edwards
O'Sullivan
Wilson
Rogers

It would be good to get a second one of them (for Barrass)

 

[Eastcoasteagle]

Gulden averaged 27.3 disposals and 1.3 goals a game as a 17 year old the year before covid. If that's not a top end prospect I don't know what is
Where they actually went doesnt matter as other clubs know they don't have access. Just like Daicos.

I was shocked Gulden slide that far, he looked that good in his underage year it wasn't funny.
No surprise he's dominating now.

 

[Jumpoff Joey]

What’s the issue with the PP?

Sounds like English Cricket team and it not being in the spirit of the game.

**** that, if it is available. Then ask for it, crusade for it and ask for it again.

It is a free hit that we are entitled to that is within the rules. And if we have 2 wins next season I’d ask again for good measure.

 

[Eastcoasteagle]

There was a fair bit to unpack from the Rookie Me podcast.

For those that aren't aware, Rookie Me is the company that do all the preseason and post-season testing and measurements of the Victorian kids. AFL Draft Central merged with them a couple of years, so the draft watchers and writers for Rookie Me are there on testing day, interviewing the kids between sessions, etc. They also talk to a lot of club recruiters and scouts at games each week.

On today's podcast episode, they discussed whether the Eagles should trade or keep pick 1.

They mentioned that recruiters and talent pathway staff no longer have Harley Reid as the undisputed number one prospect, that Walter and McKercher are up there with Reid.

They spoke to Reid on the weekend, and spoke to him about potentially moving West.

They have a top 12 (to 15). Then a blanket 30. Mentioned Koen Sanchez is in that group of 30.

They have Reid 1, Walter 2, McKercher 3, Read (GC) 4. Then a gap.

Interesting that they don't have Curtin in there before that gap. I thought he was outstanding when he played on Walter in that first game for WA, showed he can play kpd and provide elite rebound. Then went midfield and tore that up in other games...
I'm not disputing their list, I'd just add Curtin to it.

 

[eaglespremiers]

Looking at the Rookie Me scouting notes from the game on Sunday, they say the following on Levi Ashcroft:
"Like big brother Will, he knows how to rack up possessions and waxes well with teammates by hand, often winning and receiving the ball multiple times in a single passage of play."

I've got to say Michael Alvaro is being generous on this particular assessment and watching Ashcroft on Sunday (even as an underager) is a good example why looking at the possession count in U18 matches can sometimes be very deceiving when considering a draftee's ability to have an impact.

 

[dinnaz]

Looking at the Rookie Me scouting notes from the game on Sunday, they say the following on Levi Ashcroft:
"Like big brother Will, he knows how to rack up possessions and waxes well with teammates by hand, often winning and receiving the ball multiple times in a single passage of play."

I've got to say Michael Alvaro is being generous on this particular assessment and watching Ashcroft on Sunday (even as an underager) is a good example why looking at the possession count in U18 matches can sometimes be very deceiving when considering a draftee's ability to have an impact.

Even a Gary Ablett style 40 poss game is still worth 20. It still shows elite fitness and an ability to read the game.

 

[Wooshaaaa]

I have a dumb question:

Who else trains and plays at MRP? The non-Eagles beagles, do they train there? And do they play there every fortnight in the WAFL? Are they getting the same injuries? is the issue Optus, MRP, or just s**t S&C?

Shit S+C

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[dajesmac]

If you get a chance korcula and mjet were pretty cool.

We were moored in hvar one night and all these hooligans tried to storm our boat. Took one of our deckhands waving a gaff around to get them all to piss off.

See Gaff is good for something

 

[Get_The_Gaff]

What’s the issue with the PP?

Sounds like English Cricket team and it not being in the spirit of the game.

* that, if it is available. Then ask for it, crusade for it and ask for it again.

It is a free hit that we are entitled to that is within the rules. And if we have 2 wins next season I’d ask again for good measure.

The last priority picks we got were because we finished last but got pick 4 because GWS were in their first draft .

We got pick 26 (darling) as a consultation. Gaff at pick 4 ended up probably a better career than the top 3 swallow , bennell and day so we lucked out i suppose

 

[Matt_S]

The last priority picks we got were because we finished last but got pick 4 because GWS were in their first draft .

We got pick 26 (darling) as a consultation. Gaff at pick 4 ended up probably a better career than the top 3 swallow , bennell and day so we lucked out i suppose

Gc not gws

 

[briztoon]

Looking at the Rookie Me scouting notes from the game on Sunday, they say the following on Levi Ashcroft:
"Like big brother Will, he knows how to rack up possessions and waxes well with teammates by hand, often winning and receiving the ball multiple times in a single passage of play."

I've got to say Michael Alvaro is being generous on this particular assessment and watching Ashcroft on Sunday (even as an underager) is a good example why looking at the possession count in U18 matches can sometimes be very deceiving when considering a draftee's ability to have an impact.

He also said on today's podcast that had Levi played all 4 games for the Championships, he would have probably won Vic Metro's MVP.

 

[eaglespremiers]

Even a Gary Ablett style 40 poss game is still worth 20. It still shows elite fitness and an ability to read the game.

Without a doubt there are attributes to work with here, much like his brother. I just find it frustrating that he almost forces a situation whereby his teammate is obliged to return him the ball, often without improving the team position whatsoever (sometimes making it worse). He absolutely still has valuable disposals during the game.

He also said on today's podcast that had Levi played all 4 games for the Championships, he would have probably won Vic Metro's MVP.

Both things can be true. Metro, and most of the teams not including Allies, were inconsistent so a player that is averaging 25 touches a game probably is within a look in for their best overall.
I mean Reid won Country's best despite having a quiet game last week and resting at full forward in the first game.
Of course, he was BOG against WA and in the top 2 on the weekend, but there are probably other players who were in the mix (for instance, Wilson or Rudd, had he played on the weekend).
I think it's fair to say Ashcroft has a lot to offer and presented well as an underager (not Harley Reid 2022 but still consistently good), I just wish he'd cut this particular attribute out of his game.

 

[dinnaz]

Without a doubt there are attributes to work with here, much like his brother. I just find it frustrating that he almost forces a situation whereby his teammate is obliged to return him the ball, often without improving the team position whatsoever (sometimes making it worse). He absolutely still has valuable disposals during the game.

I see this as two fold.
1. Modern football in general has gone away from blocking and shepherding one guy as he gathers the footy and makes a decision. Now it's all about flicking the ball around until someone is loose. On balance it's the right way to go about it if you have the skills but isn't always going to end up working perfect. What I don't like seeing is constantly waiting for someone else to dig it out, when it's your turn to go- you gotta go!

2. At stoppages teams set up sweepers plus a defensive winger so you rarely get any "punch" out the front of the stoppage. Also defenders play loose within 50m of the ball so a quick kick is also ineffective. To combat both of these you want to hold possession & go around the mass of numbers from the back end and then look to gain ground. That leads to inflated numbers for the more balanced midfielders.

Both things can be true. Metro, and most of the teams not including Allies, were inconsistent so a player that is averaging 25 touches a game probably is within a look in for their best overall.

The champs often throw up odd and imbalanced situations with a lot of factors at play. Midfielders playing out of position or with niggles or not making the squads etc etc
Personally I make most of my judgment based on a larger body of state 19's footy with the u18 champs splitting the tie so to speak.

I mean Reid won Country's best despite having a quiet game last week and resting at full forward in the first game.
Of course, he was BOG against WA and in the top 2 on the weekend, but there are probably other players who were in the mix (for instance, Wilson or Rudd, had he played on the weekend).
I think it's fair to say Ashcroft has a lot to offer and presented well as an underager (not Harley Reid 2022 but still consistently good), I just wish he'd cut this particular attribute out of his game.

Awards are all subjective I guess a nice personal milestone but doesn't really count for much else. You truly see how good a player is when they are the main event as a top-ager with the scrutiny.

 

[Nuffington Post]

According to the Tradies podcast, Sam Mclure reported that Harley Reid does not want to leave Victoria and has indicated this to West Coast.


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[amazingjoshy]

According to the Tradies podcast, Sam Mclure reported that Harley Reid does not want to leave Victoria and has indicated this to West Coast.


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McClure also reckons we'll still take him

 

[Nuffington Post]

McClure also reckons we'll still take him

Yep - I am torn on this now though. Provides more of a case for a pick split (if a decent option presents). Will it be a Judd or JHF situation? History suggests we are pretty good at retaining talent.


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[Cornelius Roy]

176cm and for example Nick Watson this year who most have in their top 10:
169cm, 1.7 goals, 26.0 disposals.

So Gulden was a full year ahead of an equally good prospect.

Did he shrink a cm since he was drafted? Top 2020 prospect stars in Sydney footy factory's latest flag

You’re cherry picking stats from a sample size of 3 NAB league games and excluding the stats from his matches at the 2019 national champs. In the NAB league Gulden kicked 2 goals in one game, and one goal in each of his other two and was listed as best, second best and unlisted in each of these three games.

0.8 and 15 isn’t as impressive when I do it the other way across 4 national championship games, admittedly he was playing forward and not midfield across this time but again, not the same as Watson who kicked 5 goals in a half of football.

I think swans got lucky in that they probably got Gulden 5-10 spots past where alot of people had him landing but I don't believe anyone had him as a top ten and AFL recruiters deliberately overlooked picking him for 20 picks because they knew he was headed to sydney.