Mega Thread 2012 - your best 22's, your forward structures and team set-ups

[cma6]

B: Guerra Gilham Gibson
Hodge

HB: Birchall Schoey Burgoyne

C: Young Lewis Savage

HF: Smith Franklin Whitecross

F: Rioli
Roughead

Foll: Bailey Sewell Mitchell

Int: Breust Shiels Suckling
Sub: Puopolo

Emerg: Hale, Stratton, Osborne

Others: Gunston, Ellis, Hill, McCauley, Bateman, Bruce, Boumann, Murphy, Cheney

 

[nickrebellious]

Savage SUB? What is this. Best 21.
Bailey Emergency! Ya gotta be kidding me.
Whitecross? Bloke was on target for AA squad a few weeks back.
Puopolo? Can't have a side without him.

I can't believe you have the likes of err.....oh.

Da-amn our "top-25" is good.

My thinking was for the bench to have Sheils rotate in the midfield, Stratton rotate down back and Breust rotate up forward. Just to have an even balance all over the ground.

Savage as a sub is not because of form. I just think of the amount of damage he can do coming on midway through the third term.

Whitecross is playing awesome, I'm not denying that, but yeah I had to drop someone and no, I can't justify it.

Having Bailey and Puopolo is such a luxury really. Dependent of the make up of the team we are up against, I would swap Gunston out for Puopolo.
I don't know how Hawthorn are going to play all these big bodies. I can maybe see them playing Bailey as the main ruckman, Hale as second ruckman/forward, Franklin half forward, Gunston 3rd tall up forward and Roughead as a utility with a license to do whatever he wants.

And still there is a so many players that are fighting for a spot. Murphy, McCauley, Ellis, Hill, Boumann(after recover) & Schneider.

We have such a great list at the moment, I'm excited!

 

[Simon_Nesbit]

(did I miss the ?)

no probs with the team nick, it just highlights perfectly how strong our depth is currently.

I'd imagine the group of 28yo's now outside the 22 would do anything to get one more finals shot.

 

[Roby]

Whitecross is playing awesome, I'm not denying that, but yeah I had to drop someone and no, I can't justify it.

You have Whitecross in instead of Gunston. Whitecross has shown twice as much this year as Gunston has in his whole career. Plus we won't play a third tall with our reluctance to play Hale and Bailey in the same side with Roughead already there.

Gunston may came in for injured or suspended players, but Whitecross is a key player for Hawthorn.

 

[go hawks!!!]

You have Whitecross in instead of Gunston. Whitecross has shown twice as much this year as Gunston has in his whole career. Plus we won't play a third tall with our reluctance to play Hale and Bailey in the same side with Roughead already there.

Gunston may came in for injured or suspended players, but Whitecross is a key player for Hawthorn.

I agree with you Bob, Whitex is a key for 2012 and for the next 7-8 years also. Plays a role every week,l developing into a 'Selwood' type player, would like him to play as a inside midfielder, something he done well against Geelong earlier in the year.

 

[Cynic]

Slight bump

So how do people see our teams best 22 going forward into the finals? Where do we play Hodge? Do we play the 3 rucks allowing Roughead to go back when a forward gets on top of us? Who is our ideal sub?

This is my effort...

FB Guerra - Schoenmakers - Gibson
HB Birchall - Stratton - Suckling
CE Burgoyne - Mitchell - Whitecross
RU Bailey - Sewell - Shiels
HF Hodge - Franklin - Lewis
FF Rioli - Roughead - Breust
IN Hale - Young - Smith
SU Gunston

 

[Henry Jr]

With regards to the sub role, has any team during the time the sub has been in, used a Ruckman as their sub?

I just think with Hale and Bailey on the field, we just become super slow.

 

[Brant]

I'm just so happy that we have a Best 22 thread back on top of the list!

Big Moose - you've been quiet on the topic

 

[Brant]

With regards to the sub role, has any team during the time the sub has been in, used a Ruckman as their sub?

I just think with Hale and Bailey on the field, we just become super slow.

That's interesting Hank.

As an example, I know my way of thinking would be to select Hale & Bailey on the field with Gunston as SUB, then sub Bailey off for Gunston half way through the 3rd, giving Gunston 40 minutes to do his stuff.

It may well work better that Bailey was SUB, Gunston got 70 minutes to do his thing & was then subbed for Bailey who sent Roughy to FF.

In isolation & in theory I like it, but we'd be in a spot of bother if we lost a wingman to a hammy strain in the first 5 mins.

 

[Henry Jr]

That's interesting Hank.

As an example, I know my way of thinking would be to select Hale & Bailey on the field with Gunston as SUB, then sub Bailey off for Gunston half way through the 3rd, giving Gunston 40 minutes to do his stuff.

It may well work better that Bailey was SUB, Gunston got 70 minutes to do his thing & was then subbed for Bailey who sent Roughy to FF.

In isolation & in theory I like it, but we'd be in a spot of bother if we lost a wingman to a hammy strain in the first 5 mins.

Yes, but if you start two rucks on the field, you would be in the same situation would you not?

 

[MrFujiMoto]

I would go with (Presuming Hodgey is at least 85% fit by finals) -

Bailey in for his tap work and second efforts. He is definately no mug at contested marks and I think Hale's goal kicking has been less required of late.
Hodge to half back. Teams can isolate Gibbo on an opponent, as the Cats did. Isolating Gibbo and Hodge from coming in 3rd up and directing traffic across half back is much harder. Also great leadership and support for Shoen, Suckling and co.
Burgoyne to a high half forward / forward of the centre mid (if that makes sense). Very damaging when he is forward of centre. Great setup kick and also a very long kick for goal.
Puopolo has to stay in for mine, that forward pressure has to be there and the combo was working so well. He must stay in.
SMith to sub. Probably the only one I am not sure about. He has had great effect in the past as the sub and might be the pace we need.

FB Guerra - Gibson - Stratton
HB Birchall - Schoenmakers - Hodge
CE Lewis - Mitchell - Whitecross
RU Bailey - Sewell - Shiels
HF Gunston - Franklin - Burgoyne
FF Rioli - Roughead - Breust
IN Puopolo - Young - Suckling
SU Smith
I would be happy to see that line up on the park.

 

[Cynic]

With regards to the sub role, has any team during the time the sub has been in, used a Ruckman as their sub?

I just think with Hale and Bailey on the field, we just become super slow.

Not this year, closest I can see is Jordan Roughead once.

Almost inherently midfielders.

*Disclaimer: May have missed some unknown rookie who is a ruck but definitely no front line rucks have started sub this year*

 

[Henry Jr]

Bailey in for his tap work and second efforts. He is definately no mug at contested marks and I think Hale's goal kicking has been less required of late.

I wouldn't be comparing Bailey vs Hale in contested marking ability...

 

[MrFujiMoto]

I wouldn't be comparing Bailey vs Hale in contested marking ability...

No I agree, Bailey is not your deep in the 50 contested mark like Hale. I don't think that has been a huge part of Hale's game this year either though. Not like it was late last year and in the pre season.

 

[Beandip]

I wish people would stop calling for Gunston in the sub role, I just think he's too valuable to be wasted on the pine, he is routinely kicking 4 a game, and will be giving defenders genuine headaches once Buddy comes back, because they now realise it's at their own peril to leave him open (to go double Buddy). Smith and Savage are the sub choice I feel, both can come on pick up 10 odd touches and maybe a goal in a quarter, while injecting pretty frenetic speed against tired legs.

 

[Brant]

Yes, but if you start two rucks on the field, you would be in the same situation would you not?

Possibly.

I guess we'd have Roughy as an option if we were to go a ruckman down early but you're right - we'd be stuck with 2 of them if a wingman was injured...

 

[Henry Jr]

Savage aint no sub. Hill is the best sub we have. Has this knack of coming on and picking up the intensity of the game straight away. When Sav and Smith have been subs, they have struggled to pick up the pace.

Ellis is a smokey for the sub role IF he can get his body right.

 

[Brant]

Savage aint no sub. Hill is the best sub we have. Has this knack of coming on and picking up the intensity of the game straight away. When Sav and Smith have been subs, they have struggled to pick up the pace.

Ellis is a smokey for the sub role IF he can get his body right.

I agree.

I've noticed with Smith especially that he seems to come on & almost 'outrun' the game a bit & himself in the process. He comes on & appears so excited that he's a bit fumbly & looks like he's trying to do too much with the short time he has.

I've always wanted to see Young as the sub for a game or 2. Especially earlier this year (he's found more consistency now) he would absolutely burn the first 1/4 of a game. That got me to thinking that he is quick to pick up the pace of a game or even set the pace a bit himself; both good qualities.

Breust is obviously a good SUB but offers too much for 4 Quarters (including mid rotation & defensive pressure) to be restricted to only playing 1 of them.

 

[hawker92]

Ellis is a smokey for the sub role IF he can get his body right.

Would love to see Ellis have a crack at the sub role. Savage definitely needs to play a full game

 

[HolyRioli]

Could Burgoyne play the sub role? Would be one of the most impactful players we have, yet we know he can't play fulltime midfield because of his knees (at least I think that's right). He's the kind of guy that could come on later in a game and punish a team with a few possessions, or if someone goes down with injury, is versatile enough to play a number of roles. Something like this:

Guerra - Schoenmakers - Stratton
Birchall - Gibson - Hodge
Smith - Lewis - Young
Rioli - Franklin - Gunston
Bruest - Roughead - Puopolo

Hale / Bailey - Mitchell - Sewell

Suckling - Shiels - Whitecross
Burgoyne

 

[Cynic]

I wish people would stop calling for Gunston in the sub role, I just think he's too valuable to be wasted on the pine, he is routinely kicking 4 a game, and will be giving defenders genuine headaches once Buddy comes back, because they now realise it's at their own peril to leave him open (to go double Buddy). Smith and Savage are the sub choice I feel, both can come on pick up 10 odd touches and maybe a goal in a quarter, while injecting pretty frenetic speed against tired legs.

I agree but when you try to fit Bailey, Roughead & Hale in the team inherently a tall needs to be sub for mine.

 

[Dixie Flatline]

Gunston won't be the sub, I can guarantee that. He's either in the 21 or he isn't in the side. When he played as a sub earlier in the season, he was anonymous because he couldn't adjust to the game flow.

Nor will Burgoyne be a sub. The club values his on-field leadership too much to have him sitting in the red vest for three quarters.

The sub will be drawn from one of Hill, Smith, Savage or possibly Ellis for the remainder of the season, IMO.

If Gunston plays, then Hawthorn can only carry one genuine ruckman. Hale has his nose in front because he is a little more versatile around the ground than Bailey, though Hale will need to lift his efforts in first quarters to maintain his place in the side (that round 22 clash with Mumford, followed by a round 23 clash with Cox (assuming Cox isn't rested if the Eagles' spot on the ladder cannot change) will be a big challenge for Hale with Bailey breathing down his neck).

So I'll go with the following as Hawthorn's best 22 for the rest of the season:

B: Brent Guerra, Josh Gibson, Benjamin Stratton
HB: Grant Birchall, Ryan Schoenmakers, Matt Suckling
C: Clinton Young, Sam Mitchell, Isaac Smith
HF: Shaun Burgoyne, Lance Franklin, Cyril Rioli
F: Luke Breust, Jarryd Roughead, Jack Gunston
Foll: David Hale, Jordan Lewis, Brad Sewell
I/C: Luke Hodge, Liam Shiels, Brendan Whitecross, Xavier Ellis (sub)

 

[Prudster]

I remember when the sub rule was first brought in, Sydney used Seaby as the sub. Flat out cost them the game. I don't like the idea of planning to sub off a ruck either, leaves us too vulnerable to injuries. For mine we need to go with Roughy and Hale or Bailey. We are too slow with all three, Buddy and Gunston.

Here's how i would have the team:
FB: Guerra Gibson Stratton
HB: Birchall Shoey Suckling
C: Young Mitchell Lewis
HF: Breust Franklin Rioli
FF: Puopolo Roughy Hodge
Ruck: Hale/Bailey Sewell Shiels
Int: Whitecross Smith Burgoyne Gunston

I originally had Savage in there, but with Hodge and Buddy back, he loses his spot. Smith barely holding his spot in the team. He hasn't really gotten going yet this year.

 

[mrcurly]

Savage aint no sub. Hill is the best sub we have. Has this knack of coming on and picking up the intensity of the game straight away. When Sav and Smith have been subs, they have struggled to pick up the pace.

Ellis is a smokey for the sub role IF he can get his body right.

How many continuous quarters of VFL would you expect from Ellis to prove that his body is actually right? He seems to have played stuff all football this season, and rarely completed 4 quarters playing at sub AFL level.

I see a lot of X love around here, though i cannot think of a single player in last weeks starting 22 that deserves to lose his position for Ellis, and would argue there are even a few outside the 22 ahead of him to cover for our one necessary change - possibly even Franklin.

I would prefer giving Savage more of a run, or giving Cheney or Hill a little more experience - at least those two are more likely to get through the next 7-8 weeks without breaking down. Even Gilham, Murphy or an extra ruckman should get some more gametime, they are more likely to be needed in the run home.

IMO Ellis just needs to get back into shape, show he has enough resilience, and aim at getting back into the side for round1 2013 - The back to back season.

 

[Cynic]

I wish people would stop calling for Gunston in the sub role, I just think he's too valuable to be wasted on the pine, he is routinely kicking 4 a game, and will be giving defenders genuine headaches once Buddy comes back, because they now realise it's at their own peril to leave him open (to go double Buddy). Smith and Savage are the sub choice I feel, both can come on pick up 10 odd touches and maybe a goal in a quarter, while injecting pretty frenetic speed against tired legs.

But they just don't! We've kicked 5 goals from our subs for the year, it is not working!

Savage has struggled to make an impact on the 5 times he has been sub.

Also Smith is an elite runner and I think we're wasting that by making him sub.