List Mgmt. 2015 LIST Discussion - trades, free agency etc

[Duigs]

My too cents worth regards off season movements at current stage.

I think Bell will get back to QLD; dream trade will be swap for Aish and various picks, Aish would fit our ideal age profile, however, not sure if he wants to come to the club, we can afford to pay overs for him, however, doing this, especially at this stage of our rebuild is dangerous.

Menzel, I think we will listen to offers for him, obviously Geelong and SA clubs been thrown around. Wouldnt be surprised if he stays at the club.

Yarran, I believe is all but gone, Richmond, WA clubs and possible Adelaide will express interest. Is worth late first rounder, again with a few shuffle of later picks.

Henderson- will be one of first trades announced, we will get their first rounder with exchange of picks.

Kreuzer- its a gut wrenching decision, however, we dont have many "liquid assets" on the list, Kreuze is one and if we get Band 1 compo for him I think SOS will allow him to leave.

Players like Jamison, Walker, Watson, Warnock and Armfield hold no trade value and even if they do leave it will be for a bag of twisties or steak knives.

Possible targets- J Kolodjashnij, Sicily, Sheridan, Crozier, Lamb, Tomlinson, Aish, Plowman, M Talia, Shoenmakers.

 

[RattAttack]

Would Grimley from Hawks be of any interest? Kicks goals regularly at VFL level. Out of contract and would come very cheap.

 

[DaVillaBlues]

SOS is a pragmatist and given his track record at GWS, I would say that we shall be saying farewell to Kreuzer at season's end.
I don't subscribe to this club culture/fabric been torn apart when Kreuzer leaves (its clearly now a question of when, not if, based on what I'm reading in the papers), we didn't make tough enough list management decisions in the 90s and got burnt (and i am grateful that Mick had the guts to put the broom through a stale list going nowhere)

Re-Signing Kreuzer would be a backwards move for the club, especially when pick 3 is on offer and i am sure SOS and McKay know this.

Players are no longer to clubs and i don't think clubs should be loyal to players.

Our code is becoming more and more like American Sports and Euro Soccer leagues, sacrifices must be made if we are to rise again.

We're clearly not going to be in Premiership contention in the time left in Kreuzer's career, so the best, most logical decision is to cut him loose, and cash in on pick 3.

 

[PumpyChowdown]

If I was SOS -

RETIRE:

1. C. Judd
2. A. Carrazzo

DELIST:

1. D. Ellard
2. L. Jones
3. F. Russell

TRADE or DELIST/RETIRE:

1. R. Warnock
2. A. Walker
3. M. Jamison
4. D. Armfield

TRADE:

1. B. Gibbs
2. L. Henderson
3. T. Menzel
4. S. White
5. E. Curnow
6. C. Yarran
7. T. Bell

TRADE or RETAIN:

1. S. Rowe
2. J. Tutt
3. M. Dick
4. B. Gowers
5. M. Watson

KEEP (core group moving forward):

1. K. Simpson (the only outlier - should be asked to retire due to age, but he's such a God damn Blue legend that he can retire on his own terms)
2. P. Cripps
3. M. Kruezer (keep - still in the age window and we need a good ruck, leader and clubman)
4. M. Murphy
5. D. Buckley
6. S. Docherty
7. N. Graham
8. L. Casboult
9. Z. Tuohy
10. D. Thomas
11. A. Everitt
12. N. Holman
13. B. Boekhurst
14. C. Wood
15. K. Jaksch
16. C. Smith
17. C. Sheehan
18. C. Byrne
19. C. Giles
20. J. Foster
21. B. Walsh
22. D. Viojo-Rainbow
23. T. Fields

 

[Broadside]

Gibbs is an interesting one, hope he has a blinder next year and sell him into next year's (richer) draft? shame we are selling the farm for this draft not next year's.

 

[MrsEddieBetts]

SOS is a pragmatist and given his track record at GWS, I would say that we shall be saying farewell to Kreuzer at season's end.
I don't subscribe to this club culture/fabric been torn apart when Kreuzer leaves (its clearly now a question of when, not if, based on what I'm reading in the papers), we didn't make tough enough list management decisions in the 90s and got burnt (and i am grateful that Mick had the guts to put the broom through a stale list going nowhere)

Re-Signing Kreuzer would be a backwards move for the club, especially when pick 3 is on offer and i am sure SOS and McKay know this.

Players are no longer to clubs and i don't think clubs should be loyal to players.

Our code is becoming more and more like American Sports and Euro Soccer leagues, sacrifices must be made if we are to rise again.

We're clearly not going to be in Premiership contention in the time left in Kreuzer's career, so the best, most logical decision is to cut him loose, and cash in on pick 3.

They've been wrong many, many times before.

 

[Blue__Balls]

If I was SOS -

RETIRE:

1. C. Judd
2. A. Carrazzo

DELIST:

1. D. Ellard
2. L. Jones
3. F. Russell

TRADE or DELIST/RETIRE:

1. R. Warnock
2. A. Walker
3. M. Jamison
4. D. Armfield

TRADE:

1. B. Gibbs
2. L. Henderson
3. T. Menzel
4. S. White
5. E. Curnow
6. C. Yarran
7. T. Bell

TRADE or RETAIN:

1. S. Rowe
2. J. Tutt
3. M. Dick
4. B. Gowers
5. M. Watson

KEEP (core group moving forward):

1. K. Simpson (the only outlier - should be asked to retire due to age, but he's such a God damn Blue legend that he can retire on his own terms)
2. P. Cripps
3. M. Kruezer (keep - still in the age window and we need a good ruck, leader and clubman)
4. M. Murphy
5. D. Buckley
6. S. Docherty
7. N. Graham
8. L. Casboult
9. Z. Tuohy
10. D. Thomas
11. A. Everitt
12. N. Holman
13. B. Boekhurst
14. C. Wood
15. K. Jaksch
16. C. Smith
17. C. Sheehan
18. C. Byrne
19. C. Giles
20. J. Foster
21. B. Walsh
22. D. Viojo-Rainbow
23. T. Fields

You want to offload literally half the list at once?

 

[HARKER]

You want to offload literally half the list at once?

That's funny. Bolton would be having nightmares at the thought of 15+ 18 year olds to deal with in the one year.

 

[mike ockerts]

Would Grimley from Hawks be of any interest? Kicks goals regularly at VFL level. Out of contract and would come very cheap.

Mentioned him last year and got crickets around here.

 

[Quazza]

That's funny. Bolton would be having nightmares at the thought of 15+ 18 year olds to deal with in the one year.

well he is a high school teacher.....

 

[rezagun]

My too cents worth regards off season movements at current stage.

I think Bell will get back to QLD; dream trade will be swap for Aish and various picks, Aish would fit our ideal age profile, however, not sure if he wants to come to the club, we can afford to pay overs for him, however, doing this, especially at this stage of our rebuild is dangerous.

Menzel, I think we will listen to offers for him, obviously Geelong and SA clubs been thrown around. Wouldnt be surprised if he stays at the club.

Yarran, I believe is all but gone, Richmond, WA clubs and possible Adelaide will express interest. Is worth late first rounder, again with a few shuffle of later picks.

Henderson- will be one of first trades announced, we will get their first rounder with exchange of picks.

Kreuzer- its a gut wrenching decision, however, we dont have many "liquid assets" on the list, Kreuze is one and if we get Band 1 compo for him I think SOS will allow him to leave.

Players like Jamison, Walker, Watson, Warnock and Armfield hold no trade value and even if they do leave it will be for a bag of twisties or steak knives.

Possible targets- J Kolodjashnij, Sicily, Sheridan, Crozier, Lamb, Tomlinson, Aish, Plowman, M Talia, Shoenmakers.

How old is andrew walker?

 

[PumpyChowdown]

You want to offload literally half the list at once?

I'd like to, but it's not really realistic.

 

[thylacine60]

Johnson kicks goals regularly at VFL level.

 

[Blue__Balls]

Johnson kicks goals regularly at VFL level.

So does Watson...

 

[mrbluey]

SOS is a pragmatist and given his track record at GWS, I would say that we shall be saying farewell to Kreuzer at season's end.
I don't subscribe to this club culture/fabric been torn apart when Kreuzer leaves (its clearly now a question of when, not if, based on what I'm reading in the papers), we didn't make tough enough list management decisions in the 90s and got burnt (and i am grateful that Mick had the guts to put the broom through a stale list going nowhere)

Re-Signing Kreuzer would be a backwards move for the club, especially when pick 3 is on offer and i am sure SOS and McKay know this.

Players are no longer to clubs and i don't think clubs should be loyal to players.

Our code is becoming more and more like American Sports and Euro Soccer leagues, sacrifices must be made if we are to rise again.

We're clearly not going to be in Premiership contention in the time left in Kreuzer's career, so the best, most logical decision is to cut him loose, and cash in on pick 3.

You are off your head trading kruz for a pick 3 yep smart move,lets get some kid that mite or mite not make it.. M

Losing kruza is a HUGE BACKWARDS STEP

 

[Heres Waite]

How old is andrew walker?

He is 29. Still has a few years left in him. Hopefully we play him forward from now on.

 

[teknodeejay]

Walker is a decent depth player and club leader. Doesn't squib it that's for sure. Need these types around the club. If Gen Z is being led by Gen Z, then the recipe is for disaster.

 

[DaVillaBlues]

You are off your head trading kruz for a pick 3 yep smart move,lets get some kid that mite or mite not make it.. M

Losing kruza is a HUGE BACKWARDS STEP

No it isn't, we as a club have been guilty in the past of rewarding players with extravagant contracts. And i love Krooz, but as a club, we cannot afford to match the offers tabled to him from other clubs (given the fact he's missed 100 plus games through injury)

Supporters feelings must not enter the equation when it comes to painful list management decisions, and i am optimistic SOS and McKay agree with that mindset, pick 3 is too juicy to turn down, in ideal world Kreuzer signs with the Doggies and leads the Dogs to their first flag since 54 feeding the ball to the Package, Bont and Macrae, and we nab a future superstar in Francis.

We can't afford to be conservative here/take the safe way out and re-sign Kreuzer, lets roll the dice, take some calculated risks. Hawthorn survived life without Buddy, Crows will when Danger joins Geelong, we'll manage without Kreuzer, its all about the big picture.

 

[RattAttack]

Why wouldn't we send a potential pick 3 to GWS for Treloar?

Neither Pies or Tigers could match that...

 

[Quazza]

He is 29. Still has a few years left in him. Hopefully we play him forward from now on.

feels like he should be around 36

 

[james Dean]

Out via delisting - Judd, Carrazzo, Watson, Ellard, Russell

Out via trade/FA - Henderson, Yarran, Bell

8 changes to a list is enough for one year

 

[Robbo's my hero]

I'd be happy with about a 20% turnover of the list at the end of this season. I'm happy for Carlton to make slow, logical change rather than the frenzy that has occurred at the end of 2013 and 2014. We need to present a stable environment. Give Bolton twelve months. He might transform some of our 'list cloggers' into decent footballers with his approach to football. The last four years have represented unrealistic expectations and bad decisions. I think the off season is about creating a club with a sensible mix of experience and youth.

 

[Omega Blue]

100 plus games seriously

 

[DangerousD]

Okay before I post this, my first preference is to keep Kruezer (love the guy), but given a LARGE contract offer it could be a smarter decision to let him walk. I would also like to keep Yarran given the right circumstances. But given the reality of our situation a fairly large overhaul could be on the cards.
Plus I'm not really sure about the rules surrounding rookies and amount of players on the list so I'm not even sure if this would be possible. But hypothetically, if Kruezer was to go and net us band 1, what are your thoughts on something like this as an extreme:

If Kruezer is let go for band 1 we could have 2,3,21,39,57,
Hendo and 21- Geelong for 11 and 29
Walker for pick 40ish (not sure as to what we would get for him, but given his late surge of form I could definitely see interest from near contending clubs)
Pick 3 and 29 for McCarthy/Patton and 10 (Saw this mentioned but would GWS accept?) EDIT: (FYI, this values McCarthy/Patton as pick 9 under the points system)
Yarran for pick 15ish (Richmond) if not= keep. (Lennon?)
Tom Bell for pick 22 (Gold Coast)
Pick 22- West Coast for Lycett
Aish PSD


Go into the draft 2,10,11,15,39,40,57
2- Jacob Weitering (Dominant CHB)
10-Charlie Curnow (Freak athlete, big bodied mid/key forward)
11-Rhys Mathieson (Most consistent mid in the champs)
15-Ryan Burton (Looked to be best forward in the draft last year before injury)
39-Bailey Rice (assuming bid at 27, Pick 40 becomes 48)
48-Kerbatiah (X-factor small forward, can rack up high numbers as well)
SOSOS- Rookie or 57.

Outs- Judd, Carrazzo, Bell, MK , Ellard, Warnock, Armfield?, Dick, Watson, Hendo, Yarran, Walker.

Ins- Weitering, Curnow, Mathieson, Burton, Rice, Kerbatiah, Lycett, Mccarthy/Patton, Aish.

Rookies
Upgrade Wood, Walsh, Byrne. ?
Re-rookie Sheehan, rookie Giles. ?

Buckley Jamison Tuohey
White Weitering Simpson
Docherty Cripps Aish
Menzel Mccarthy/Patton Boekhorst
Thomas Casboult Everitt
Lycett Murphy Gibbs
Graham C.Curnow KJ Byrne

Rice Giles Fields
DVR Rowe Sheehan
Holman Mathieson Tutt
Johnson Foster Jones
Smith Burton Kerbatiah
Wood E.Curnow Whiley

2017
Buckley Giles Tuohey
KJ Weitering Byrne
Docherty Cripps Aish
Menzel McCarthy/Patton Gibbs
Kerbatiah Burton Casboult
Lycett Murphy C.Curnow
Graham Boekhorst Rice Mathieson Holman DVR

I quite like your thinking, I love Kruze but a simple question needs to be asked, will (players name) still be playing when we next play finals? If the answer is no, then there is not much point in them playing at the blues. I'm a big Mcarthy fan but i think your trade proposal might be a little short of his evaluation, a lot of clubs will chase him.
I also don't think you went far enough with your list cull haha, Jamison to me is in the same class as Walker, GWS or GCS may be willing to swap him for a player on there fringe, like Thomas Bugg or Curtley Hampton, Id aslo trade Thomas if it was for a player. Through in Ed Curnow and Sam Rowe if any team would offer a pick for them, what number i don't care.

Trade for Aish using Tom Bell and hopefully use our PSD pick on Carlisle but unsure why he would want to join us. I have a feeling SOS has a plan that will cut deep but he is a long term thinker.

 

[Stamos]

I quite like your thinking, I love Kruze but a simple question needs to be asked, will (players name) still be playing when we next play finals? If the answer is no, then there is not much point in them playing at the blues.

This idea worked brilliantly for Melbourne with McDonald.