List Mgmt. 2020 List Management II

[HARKER]

I don't have any of Newnes, Gibbons nor Newman in our starting 22 next year if Betts stays on, all players are fit and we acquire Saad, Williams +

There should be another player that just pops out of nowhere and demands a starting spot come round 1; Honey? Cottrell? Philp? Kemp?

 

[Ninja Worrier]

Come in peace! I know blues supporters don’t want to part with 7 for Saad straight up which is reasonable so some in the media have been going with 7 for Saad and 41 which I still don’t think is right but I’ll look at this to get a bit closer to the mark.


Carlton
Get: Saad, Pick 26
Give: Pick 7, Pick 69


Port Adelaide
Get: Fantasia, Pick 69
Give: Bonner, Pick 26


Essendon
Get: Pick 7, Bonner
Give: Saad, Fantasia

This essentially values Saad at pick 18 or 19 which seems a lot closer to a pick you would trade down to with 7 anyway.

Then trade 26 and 27 for dogs 12

 

[DangerousD]

Not clear Higgins is an upgrade on G

Not clear Higgins is an upgrade on Gibbons

View attachment 998387View attachment 998387

What’s their scope of improvement? Gibbons is 4 years older, more experienced, does he have much improving left, has Higgins been he’d back by the role he plays at the Tigers, what’s his improvement look like?

Lastly Gibbons has been very solid for us, he’s picked ahead of many others so in this instance why are we comparing Higgins to Gibbons? If they are of similar quality why wouldn’t they both play and both be good players?

 

[Jimmae]

I don't have any of Newnes, Gibbons nor Newman in our starting 22 next year if Betts stays on, all players are fit and we acquire Saad, Williams +

There should be another player that just pops out of nowhere and demands a starting spot come round 1; Honey? Cottrell? Philp? Kemp?

Kemp by a country mile.

 

[Jimmae]

Is anything stopping GWS not matching the J.Cameron contract and getting a pick after their first rounder, but then agreeing a side trade swap of picks for say pick #7 in return for GWS fourth round pick? that way GWS will effectively get two first rounders, sounds like it would solve all problems?

The AFL will veto that, and they have the final say on all trades.

 

[Arr0w]

I don't have any of Newnes, Gibbons nor Newman in our starting 22 next year if Betts stays on, all players are fit and we acquire Saad, Williams +

There should be another player that just pops out of nowhere and demands a starting spot come round 1; Honey? Cottrell? Philp? Kemp?

So Newnes, Gibbons and Newman will all play round 1 then?

 

[HARKER]

So Newnes, Gibbons and Newman will all play round 1 then?

Another unnecessary post adding nothing to the point.
Just say what you want to say; " I know everything and no one else knows anything"

That's as courteous as I can be for your endeavours. Maybe hang back from the bath water a little.

Kemp by a country mile.

Could be but there's often someone that shows up from seemingly nowhere.
Could be Honey....or Philp.

 

[Arr0w]

Another unnecessary post adding nothing to the point.
Just say what you want to say; " I know everything and no one else knows anything"

That's as courteous as I can be for your endeavours. Maybe hang back from the bath water a little.

I remember people telling me the likes of Gibbons wasn't rated best 25 start of the season, or that we had better options than Newnes, Levi, Newman(injured of course)

Now you are suggesting a number of kids will replace them all?

Talk about bath water

 

[HARKER]

I remember people telling me the likes of Gibbons wasn't rated best 25 start of the season, or that we had better options than Newnes, Levi, Newman(injured of course)

Now you are suggesting a number of kids will replace them all?

Talk about bath water

Yeah, yeah.......it's always the other guy arrow
"People telling me"....blah blah blah. Self-congratulator of the year on this board.
I said the same too. Should I get my trumpet out also and join you. Go on saying nothing and have smoke blown up your arse. Feels good, I guess.

Pity....

 

[Arr0w]

Yeah, yeah.......it's always the other guy arrow
People telling me....blah blah blah. Self-congratulator of the year on this board.
I said the same too. Should I get my trumpet out also and join you. Go on saying nothing and have smoke blown up your arse. Feels good, I guess.

Pity....

You started this personal attack Harks, so we can continue if you like, or lay out a starting 26 and we can dissect

BTW, if Eddie does stay on, doesn't mean he is an automatic selection either

Anything else you would like to add?

 

[HARKER]

You started this personal attack Harks, so we can continue if you like, or lay out a starting 26 and we can dissect

BTW, if Eddie does stay on, doesn't mean he is an automatic selection either

Anything else you would like to add?

So that's what it's about. "You started it and I'll finish it"

So petty....so poor....but go on. You have an agenda to fulfil

 

[Arr0w]

So that's what it's about. "You started it and I'll finish it"

So petty....so poor....but go on. You have an agenda to fulfil

Hahaha

No agenda, I made a statement any you spat the dummy

 

[HARKER]

Hahaha

No agenda, I made a statement any you spat the dummy

Sure...You made a statement.

What was the purpose of your 'statement' other than to suggest I didn't know what I was talking about. You know that...I know that....Cut the bullshit.

 

[Arr0w]

Sure...You made a statement.

What was the purpose of your 'statement' other than to suggest I didn't know what I was talking about. You know that...I know that....Cut the bullshit.

We all have opinions Harks

You think we will lose best 22 players, because they can't play their preferred position, or how do we fit all these mids in

Now you are suggesting a bunch of kids will dislodge starting 22 players, yet we can't debate it?

You must think your opinion should pass through unvetted

 

[james95]

Wonder if Dogs would entertain 6 + 7 from the Dons for Dunkley and try to ontrade for pick 2 to get McDonald before a bid on JUH.
If Crows somehow get 2 for Crouch, could see them doing it to get 3 top 7 picks in the door.
Dogs could form the next Buddy/Roughy combo and put Naughton back where he belongs

 

[katmanblue]

Then trade 26 and 27 for dogs 12

8+45 for 15+20 (Geelong)

Give em 19.

Keep 15 + 26

Trade 26 and future 2nd for 14 (Dogs)


End up with:

Picks 14+15 (2020) + 3rd
Pick 8-12 (2021) + 3rd

 

[BRADLESTICKS]

I know everyone is excited at getting a brand new toy but 6 years for Zac Williams at 750- 800 thousand plus is a terrible move, no player should ever be given a 6 year deal let alone an overweight half back flanker.

He will be the new whipping boy for our supporters before the end of his first season through no fault of his own because he would be crazy to turn down that money, 750-800 thousand is gun all Australian midfielder money he will never be that player.

The new list management team has panicked just to be seen as getting someone through the door and if pick 8 is involved in any way for the Saad deal they would become the laughing stock of the league.

 

[THE_GUN]

I know everyone is excited at getting a brand new toy but 6 years for Zac Williams at 750- 800 thousand plus is a terrible move, no player should ever be given a 6 year deal let alone an overweight half back flanker.
He will be the new whipping boy for our supporters before the end of his first season through no fault of his own because he would be crazy to turn down that money, 750-800 thousand is gun all Australian midfielder money he will never be that player.
The new list management team has panicked just to be seen as getting someone through the door and if pick 8 is involved in any way for the Saad deal they would become the laughing stock of the league.

Pick #8 is most likely to be pick #9 with the Crouch thing looking like a 1st rounder

Has the williams deal been confirmed to be 6 years ?

 

[Stamos]

Has the williams deal been confirmed to be 6 years ?

Yeah. On the Carlton website.

 

[BigBreakfast]

We all have opinions Harks

You think we will lose best 22 players, because they can't play their preferred position, or how do we fit all these mids in

Now you are suggesting a bunch of kids will dislodge starting 22 players, yet we can't debate it?

You must think your opinion should pass through unvetted

Isn’t this the very definition of Dome worthy? Aph? ODN? J? Anyone?

 

[BigBreakfast]

I know everyone is excited at getting a brand new toy but 6 years for Zac Williams at 750- 800 thousand plus is a terrible move, no player should ever be given a 6 year deal let alone an overweight half back flanker.

He will be the new whipping boy for our supporters before the end of his first season through no fault of his own because he would be crazy to turn down that money, 750-800 thousand is gun all Australian midfielder money he will never be that player.

The new list management team has panicked just to be seen as getting someone through the door and if pick 8 is involved in any way for the Saad deal they would become the laughing stock of the league.

But...the highlights?

in all honesty, you are sailing a sinking ship all on your own. Bradles might want his name back.

Watch him carve up midfields for years to come.

 

[btdg]

Am I the only one really cynical about our list management?

We were sold a ‘3-yr rebuild’ via the draft. It began really promisingly with an investment in KP players, but fizzled a bit with a series of top 20 picks that range from underwhelming to straight busts.

Then 4 years into the 3-year rebuild we did an about face and starting throwing cash at any 26 year old who would accept it.

End result:
- 700k+ for Mitch McGovern

11

Mitch Mcgovern

Age

30

Ht

190cm

Wt

88kg

Pos.

Def

Career

Season

Last 5

D

10.1

3star

K

7.2

3star

HB

2.9

3star

M

4.6

4star

T

2.2

4star

MG

189.8

3star

D

7.6

2star

K

6.5

3star

HB

1.1

1star

M

3.6

4star

T

1.9

3star

MG

179.6

3star

D

10.8

3star

K

6.8

3star

HB

4.0

3star

M

4.0

4star

T

3.0

5star

MG

218.0

4star

and his whopping 0.8 goals, 7 disposals and 3 marks Per game
-$1m in the first year and $500k+ from here on for a half forward with shaky goalkicking who shows up one out of 3 games (at best)
- apparently 800k+ for a back pocket who isn’t one of the top 10 players for the 10th best team in the comp
- 700k+ and a top 10 pick for a half-back flank renowned for running fast, kicking to no-one, and being temperamental about the defensive side of playing in defence.

That’s nearly 25% of the comp on 4 blokes who don’t have an All-Australian between them (and other than Saad haven’t even sniffed it).

Oh, and the chips are definitely being pushed into the middle of the table here. Cripps is a year off free agency, we still rely far too heavily on blokes in their 30s, and the good young players are all hitting the 23-25 age range where they need to start winning or suddenly free agency/demanding a trade starts looking pretty appealing (and we don’t have the cap space to making staying worthwhile if we aren’t winning).

Clearly I’m scarred from the past 20 years but those of us who dared naysay in 2014 were ridiculed on this board too at the time. This looks eerily like a whole new way for Carlton to stuff it up to me, although I’m hoping desperately that isn’t the case, of course.

 

[BRADLESTICKS]

Pick #8 is most likely to be pick #9 with the Crouch thing looking like a 1st rounder

Has the williams deal been confirmed to be 6 years ?

Yeah confirmed 6 years, I could make an argument that short and baker are a better combination than Saad and Williams would be yet we will be paying Saad and Williams combined anywhere between 1.3-1.5 million and the Richmond pair picked up with late or rookie picks are getting paid peanuts.

 

[BRADLESTICKS]

But...the highlights?

in all honesty, you are sailing a sinking ship all on your own. Bradles might want his name back.

Watch him carve up midfields for years to come.

Can you name me the last hbf who at age 26 suddenly transformed into a gun midfielder? It doesn’t happen he is an above average half back who has one top 5 finish in a best and fairest but will never be a gun midfielder, our list management team has made a horrible mistake.

 

[Cripptonite]

I know everyone is excited at getting a brand new toy but 6 years for Zac Williams at 750- 800 thousand plus is a terrible move, no player should ever be given a 6 year deal let alone an overweight half back flanker.

He will be the new whipping boy for our supporters before the end of his first season through no fault of his own because he would be crazy to turn down that money, 750-800 thousand is gun all Australian midfielder money he will never be that player.

The new list management team has panicked just to be seen as getting someone through the door and if pick 8 is involved in any way for the Saad deal they would become the laughing stock of the league.

We were offering Shiel, Cogs and Kelly 7 year deals on over $1 mill each. This is not a panicked acquisition, this was planned from day one of the rebuild. Even better we don’t give up draft picks.

We need to give Cripps the support he needs and he is 25 so he probably has 6 years of quality football to go. Also we have to meet our cap minimum and from years of underspend we have the chance to actually acquire talent rather than overpaying spuds.

I’m 100% onboard with the strategy and super excited to have Zac onboard. Saad and maybe Oliver to go now. Happy days to be a Carlton fan!