Training 2021 Pre Season training watch

[cryptor]

There are some promising signs that we could see rapid improvement this season despite all the negativity (ie. Patton, Scully, Wright, Sicily ACL, Gunston back)

1. Champion Data rating 5 of our players as 'elite' for their position - equal most of any club. (Sicily and Gunston are in this list but the latter should play most of the year)

2. Full pre-seasons for a number of players who have previously struggled with injury this time of year.

3. Many younger players who've been on the list for a few years who've shown great glimpses previously and are now seeming to have it click for them more regularly (albeit it is just training)

4. We were top 4 after four rounds last year, and then the hubs hit. Not great that mentally we didn't handle it well but that can be dealt with. What's important was that there is clearly talent and ability on this list and we shouldn't let the circumstances of last year undervalue what we have.

5. There seems to be a lot more energy within the group at the moment and it sounds like it's mostly being driven by the younger half of the list.

 

[Bugs1977]

For this season I would be stoked if we didn’t end up bottom 4 ...... but if we did we were competitive in a lot of games. If competitive, a younger list and Clarko still in charge we could become a destination club again. If we get smashed week in week out of course it would put potential recruits off.

Clarko the other day talked about how it was hard to gauge where our list was at and brought up some history and the baby bombers. Not sure if we have a young Hird, Fletcher, Missiti etc on our list but at the start of 93 I bet the Bombers didn’t think they had them either!

I wouldn't be disappointed if we finished bottom 4 as long as we don't get blown out of many games and ideally lead for the majority of most of them and end up getting overrun mainly because we need to pump more game time into our kids. You obviously don't want to see us tank but if end up showing the improvement that Brisbane showed a 4-5 years ago when they were still bottom 4 but were so young only to end up where they are now then I'll take our lumps for a couple of years and enjoy the ride. There's obviously no guarantee that will happen but just thought I'd point out bottom 4 isn't the end of the world and its also important to remember that the upcoming draft is gonna be bloody deep.

 

[TheFourPillars]

The best part about all the news currently is we sound like a TEAM. Everyone working together and pushing each other, everyone will be better for it. The Might be back...

We have always been a TEAM mate but there have been plenty of changes within the list. This along with injuries has meant there was a lot of instability in training. It takes time to build synergy and its still a work in progress especially in the forward line and midfield. Arguably our best forward and best midfielder are still missing

 

[Milkshaker]

Buddy kicks 88 points in a season but can hit Roughie lace out on the chest with a bullet

Bloody frustrating that used to be. Buddy's field kicking was sublime.

 

[HODGEYROAD]

There are some promising signs that we could see rapid improvement this season despite all the negativity (ie. Patton, Scully, Wright, Sicily ACL, Gunston back)

1. Champion Data rating 5 of our players as 'elite' for their position - equal most of any club. (Sicily and Gunston are in this list but the latter should play most of the year)

2. Full pre-seasons for a number of players who have previously struggled with injury this time of year.

3. Many younger players who've been on the list for a few years who've shown great glimpses previously and are now seeming to have it click for them more regularly (albeit it is just training)

4. We were top 4 after four rounds last year, and then the hubs hit. Not great that mentally we didn't handle it well but that can be dealt with. What's important was that there is clearly talent and ability on this list and we shouldn't let the circumstances of last year undervalue what we have.

5. There seems to be a lot more energy within the group at the moment and it sounds like it's mostly being driven by the younger half of the list.

Champion data is a load of shit for the most part.

 

[CHUBBSS]

We have always been a TEAM mate but there have been plenty of changes within the list. This along with injuries has meant there was a lot of instability in training. It takes time to build synergy and its still a work in progress especially in the forward line and midfield. Arguably our best forward and best midfielder are still missing

Last year didn’t work for a multitude of reasons and the team looked mentally fatigued but also we did not gel in the middle, transitioning the ball and up forward, that is the number one thing a team needs to do otherwise your just doing all the hard work with minimal reward. The old adage of a champion team beats a team of champions.

New leadership, new players emerging more development and culture/team synergy is much improved

 

[cryptor]

Champion data is a load of sh*t for the most part.

It's not perfect but far from "a load of shit".

Their ratings have value due to the fact that they look at the data that points to how games are actually won and then to the data that points to the players that most influence that.

You don't have to agree with it but at least it's based on something largely objective. As opposed to almost every other mainstream player ratings list which is really just pure subjective opinion.

 

[Milkshaker]

Can’t wait for all this positivity to be set alight when the Bulldogs run over us in our first hitout, and everyone forgets the progress and development being reported on at training in favor of writing off the entire year.

should be good.

Could you give me a week ban if that happens so I can't read the post mortem thread? That would be great!




You know you want too.

 

[OnTheRocks]

This is why your avatar is perfect. In Yoda voice 'the future he sees'

Sometimes things are better left unsaid.

 

[Brant]

Just on Big Boy at CHB, I believe the success or failure of this move will largely come down to the amount of pressure applied up field. He reads the ball in flight brilliantly and will cut off a heap of leading options and intercept where he can. If however, the opposition is able to walk it down the wing then he will be caught out for pace and agility big time. Our smaller more agile backline has likely been introduced to help BB if the oppo go small and quick...

IMO, success of BB @ CHB (2021) isn't actually about his individual performance. It's about the next wave of dudes becoming a cohesive defensive unit.

Hardwick
Greaves
DGB
CJ
Kosi
Skrillex
Day
Howe
Morrison
These guys are young AF.

Impey + Sicily are pretty much hitting their prime, but should have 4+ years ahead.

There's plenty of skill/talent there to support a Premiership, but it lacks at least 1 mature KPD (possibly Kosi &/or DGB, but likely need a 27+ year old mature body).

If BB can hold the backline together such that these guys can learn the trade without getting smashed every week then that (to me) is him being successful in 2021*.

It's then an acquisition issue requiring us to secure a Plug/Play KPD - the way we did Lake, then Frawley.

Then it's Flags.

This is also why I'd rather see him CHB this year than Ruck/Fwd.


*of course if our Ruck & midfield goes to crap again like it did in 2020, then I feel it's counter productive to keep him there & he should return to the Ruck.

 

[Lickmesocks]

It's not perfect but far from "a load of sh*t".

Their ratings have value due to the fact that they look at the data that points to how games are actually won and then to the data that points to the players that most influence that.

You don't have to agree with it but at least it's based on something largely objective. As opposed to almost every other mainstream player ratings list which is really just pure subjective opinion.

What data were they looking at for Mason Cox?

 

[MrPremiership]

What data were they looking at for Mason Cox?

Mason Cox is the only thing that stopped a Richmond 4-peat

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

This is why your avatar is perfect. In Yoda voice 'the future he sees'

College boy Yoda though,

“atomic wedgie, do you want?”

 

[matey]

The crazy thing is I don't even think Day has even played there yet

The way he likes to take the game on the wide ground will benefit his DNA!

 

[cryptor]

What data were they looking at for Mason Cox?

Like I said, it's not perfect. My major criticism of them would be that they're not transparent enough. I'd like to see their workings, not just their answers. But their business is their data so they're not going to give it away.

What Cox being in there does indicate is that they at least have the integrity to stand by their model as they'd have to have known that was going to be a talking point - particularly when Grundy didn't make it. But in context all it really means is that something about how Cox plays for Collingwood helps them perform better as a team.

For our list, what I take away from it is mostly around McEvoy and Wingard. That even though McEvoy wasn't playing primarily as a ruckman he was still having great influence on team performance - which is great in context with the constant debate over whether Ceglar and McEvoy should play in the same side and who should be the main ruck. With Ceglar killing it this pre-season and McEvoy still having an elite influence around the ground that is a good indication they can both fit. And then with Wingard, he made the CD AA team and finished 3rd in the PCM despite widely being panned throughout the year by the armchair experts on the internet. He's also a highlight of our pre-season and I'm expecting to see him carry it forward into the regular season.

 

[threesixpio]

College boy Yoda though,

“atomic wedgie, do you want?”

It’s farkn creepy as SYL

 

[perrdan09]

IMO, success of BB @ CHB (2021) isn't actually about his individual performance. It's about the next wave of dudes becoming a cohesive defensive unit.

Hardwick
Greaves
DGB
CJ
Kosi
Skrillex
Day
Howe
Morrison
These guys are young AF.

Impey + Sicily are pretty much hitting their prime, but should have 4+ years ahead.

There's plenty of skill/talent there to support a Premiership, but it lacks at least 1 mature KPD (possibly Kosi &/or DGB, but likely need a 27+ year old mature body).

If BB can hold the backline together such that these guys can learn the trade without getting smashed every week then that (to me) is him being successful in 2021*.

It's then an acquisition issue requiring us to secure a Plug/Play KPD - the way we did Lake, then Frawley.

Then it's Flags.

This is also why I'd rather see him CHB this year than Ruck/Fwd.


*of course if our Ruck & midfield goes to crap again like it did in 2020, then I feel it's counter productive to keep him there & he should return to the Ruck.

I think i'd rather Hartley come into the team if they want to play another tall, key defender. I thought he did a pretty reasonable job in the few games he got and that left leg can really kick the ball, which could prove to be a bit of a weapon exiting the back 50. Just my opinion.

 

[CliffMcTainshaw]

I remember Matthew Richardson went close to winning a brownlow on the wing towards the end of his career.

He had similar traits to buddy, massive units who could also run like the wind.

And then there's Blicav from KPB. To be honest I can't think of any other KPB who has been a success as a wingman.

 

[Roger Rogerson]

Many thanks to all our dedicated training attendees. Really appreciate these reports as a distraction from the serious issues of the day.

A general question to all training watchers. What is the general standard of our handballing during the simulations? This is an area where we have been substandard for a number of years. Too many panicky handballs to players under pressure, whereas teams like Richmond are skilled at long handballs out of congestion.

The training session I saw there are a number of drills focussed on close in handball in the chaos of a stoppage. Ball still hit the deck quite a few times. But also a few youngsters like Moore have good quick hands.

 

[burner1]

Thanks for all the reports. Seems positive but keen to see how it translates when the real stuff starts as quite a lot of inexperience on paper in our likely best 22 (eg up forward and wings) and no Sicily and Gunston (for start of season) is a big hole.

Reckon BB will play as a utility - a big body up forward, 2nd ruck and sometime intercept defender.

 

[Roger Rogerson]

I think i'd rather Hartley come into the team if they want to play another tall, key defender. I thought he did a pretty reasonable job in the few games he got and that left leg can really kick the ball, which could prove to be a bit of a weapon exiting the back 50. Just my opinion.

We don't want Hartley getting games.

 

[Simon Crawshay]

And then there's Blicav from KPB. To be honest I can't think of any other KPB who has been a success as a wingman.

The trait all three of them share is that for guys who stand 2 meters tall they are all (we're in richos case) eite runners

I guess it is very rare to find guys that tall which that kind of athletic ability.

 

[Turly]

Last season the vibe I got in Feb from people in the know was that we'd push top 4 lol, so don't read much into positives vibes in pre season. Every Pre season always seems to be the best one at this stage of the year.

Well then that's on you. What do you expect? How many teams train terribly?

If you're judging our ladder position based on training reports then you really aren't doing this right.

Maybe just show some respect to the lads that get out there and take it for what it is, training.....

 

[perrdan09]

We don't want Hartley getting games.

I'd rather him playing 3rd tall next to frost/hartigan than BB.

 

[Roger Rogerson]

We seem so much healthier as a squad this preseason.

Gunners and Sicily LTIs.

S Mitchell only started running a couple of weeks back.

T Mitchell and Saunders heaps of running but not much contact work if any.

Nash non contact hat for a fair bit.

Howe has been hit and miss but now seems back in full training.

Pepper seems to have picked up something.

Brocky a whack on the knee.

Other than whoever else I have missed that is a pretty decent chunk of the list who has completed most of the preseason.

Got to be happy with that.

Injuries will start now but starting healthy is key.