Player Watch 2022 AFL National Draft Discussion - read the pinned post

[Strapping Young Lad]

National AFL draft Monday November 28(first round only).
All other selections to be held on Tuesday November 29.
The pre-season and rookie drafts will then take place at 3pm (AEST) on Wednesday November 30.

 

[Chioli]

Indeed, but teams have packaged an F2 to move 1-2 spots. Does anyone think Pies would accept an offer for pick 14 from say the Eagles with their pick 20 + F2. If this sounds fair, then 24+F2+F3 for 14 is maybe even unders.
Even if we finish 2nd last 24+20+38 for is only just overs for pick 14. Fine for that risk to get a gun player 1 yr early into the system.

We can't give this trade(or one without F3) to GWS for pick 15 as then Syd could have picked Weddle and it would be a wasted trade. The Phantoms show Syd picking him.

I would only have tried to upgrade our pick 48 to Syd's pick 42 and then if pick 42 turns out even half good, it becomes a brilliant trade. Also seeing we didn't ask for Sydney's pick 68 in deal, I would say we have no intention of taking Vickery today.

First pick of round 2 tonight is 22. Last year it was 21. The year before it was 27.

If next year we have traded pick 22 or 23 for a talent we rate as around top 10 then we have probably done good business. If we finish 3rd last and this has the pick we have traded as 24 does anyone care?

 

[Ned Ryerson]

Bigfooty melters during trade period: ‘OMG SLEEPY MARK HOW DID YOU NOT GET ANOTHER FIRST ROUNDER’

Knightmare: Weddle at pick 18.
Twomey: Weddle at pick 15.
Fox Footy: Weddle at pick 17.

Bigfooty melters when MM gets a projected first round talent with a first round pick we acquired: ‘OMG SLEEPY MARK WHY ARE YOU THE WORST PERSON EVER’ spontaneously combusts

Never change, bigfooty, never change.

 

[TDS7]

I'm not having a go at the kid, from that highlights package he can clearly play and I am not unhappy we picked him up.

But if you get picked as All Australian under 18 Full Back then I think it would be very unusual (and quite frankly a bit unfair on Josh) to make him play midfielder or forward (both totally different positions that would take years too learn).

AFL is a tough gig no matter how talented you are and I think we would be better off playing him (intially at least) in the position he has shown to excel at.

That's why I made the comment about DGB. Fore me his is the spot Josh will be competing for next year.

Unless they throw Sicily into the midfield but that would be a massive call on Sam's behalf.

I agree with you on principle, Weddle is a brilliant lockdown defender at it would make perfect sense to just slot him back there and call it a day. But Mackenzie specifically earmarked him as a potential wing and utility tall. If the reason we targeted him was that we believed in his versatility, we'll be testing him out in different spots. To start off the season I'd like to see Day go into a wing role and Scrimshaw into a forward role, leaving a back flank/CHB job for Josh to fill, but if either of those guys don't gel with their new roles let the kid have a crack.

 

[borgo]

I really like the sound of a centre square setup of Ward, Worpel and Weddle.

I have no issue with the Hawks taking a chance on Weddle. If it's our Liam Stocker

14

Liam Stocker

Age

24

Ht

184cm

Wt

86kg

Pos.

Def

Career

Season

Last 5

D

13.6

3star

K

8.4

3star

HB

5.2

4star

M

2.4

3star

T

1.8

4star

MG

180.0

3star

No current season stats available

D

13.6

4star

K

8.4

4star

HB

5.2

4star

M

2.4

3star

T

1.8

4star

MG

180.0

3star

moment then the list management team will take responsibility for the error but it's better than sitting on your hands.

 

[Billyc]

Swans trade holy s**t. How is pick 18 worth what could be pick 19 next year in a stronger draft plus 37 plus 27 this year? I love josh weddle but he ain’t worth that. To put it in some perspective pick 18 is worth 985 points picks 25(our f2 based on this years ladder position) 27 and f3(44) is worth 1821 points I.e almost double. It is time for change we need some negotiation skill we have none. We needed to hold or ideally to gain draft capital and we’ve sold it down the river for a half back flank.

You need to offer something decent to move up the order. Of course if we finish dead last next year it looks lopsided, but equally if we finish say 12th, it's pick 27, pick 25 (or say 28 after inevitable bids) and a F3 for 18 (and for a bloke we probably rated higher than that), which is absolutely fine. And better than fine if Weddle is a gun. One to judge down the track.

 

[HedgeFund]

I agree with you on principle, Weddle is a brilliant lockdown defender at it would make perfect sense to just slot him back there and call it a day. But Mackenzie specifically earmarked him as a potential wing and utility tall. If the reason we targeted him was that we believed in his versatility, we'll be testing him out in different spots. To start off the season I'd like to see Day go into a wing role and Scrimshaw into a forward role, leaving a back flank/CHB job for Josh to fill, but if either of those guys don't gel with their new roles let the kid have a crack.

Way too sensible.

Send Scrimshaw forward, Sicily into the middle and Day up to a permanent wing.

Make the men do the work.

 

[BIGHAWK23]

People are acting like we traded a top 5 pick

We traded 2 seconds for a first

Its not that big a deal, especially when you can just move future picks forward

 

[hawkinoz]

Weddle's family are ecstatic, comes at the end.

 

[Ned Ryerson]

I think we have to differentiate the aspects of list management as I have said previously. I am rapt with our picks, mackenzie a great complement to our midfield mix and weddle I think could be an star. Absolute tick.
Trading once again absolute garbage. Objectively garbage.
Why would you take 36 and lions f3 with their offseason after they finished 4th? We could have easily taken 2 of 35,36,38 from the lions for our late picks and any of those would have netted us a better future pick than lions f3.
Swans trade holy s**t. How is pick 18 worth what could be pick 19 next year in a stronger draft plus 37 plus 27 this year? I love josh weddle but he ain’t worth that. To put it in some perspective pick 18 is worth 985 points picks 25(our f2 based on this years ladder position) 27 and f3(44) is worth 1821 points I.e almost double. It is time for change we need some negotiation skill we have none. We needed to hold or ideally to gain draft capital and we’ve sold it down the river for albeit a player I really like but not someone who will move the needle. It’s time for change.

Motivated buyer had to spend a bit more capital in a 2 minute negotiation - stop the presses. We wanted that pick, Sydney knew we wanted the pick they were always going to get steep. Have a look at Sammy’s smile when the deal is going down - something tells me our team was content with things.

 

[Leather Poisoning]

Looking at the highlights I'm more excited by Weddle than CMac2.

We must really rate the dude. We got the guy. I don't there are very many easy ways to trade up in this draft. Everyone has been trying to do it and it was only the JHF trade that really opened the door for some clubs to trade up and into the pointy end.

Clubs would generally have a similar view on where the quality is - and all be equally reluctant as each other to enable us to trade up into it.

 

[FB19]

People are acting like we traded a top 5 pick

We traded 2 seconds for a first

Its not that big a deal, especially when you can just move future picks forward

Sorry we traded 2 seconds that are bottom 6 team seconds and a f3 for an end of first round first. Which future picks are we moving forward we have our f1 dogs f2 and lions f3?

 

[Leather Poisoning]

When the doggies finish second last and we finish 10th you'll all see the genius of this

 

[Billyc]

Something decent yes. Double the points is ok if it’s 42 for 56 I.e 400’for 200. we gave up a Deficit of approx 1300 draft points tonight to put that in context that’s around pick 11. For a team with limited draft capital. It’s absolutely insane.

You don't know what the outlay is given they're future picks. And points are irrelevant. A bunch of late picks add up to early picks in points, but they are not worth that. If we finish dead last next year, I agree it's lopsided. If we finish say 12-14 and there are a few bids (as there always are), the deal is fine for another first rounder.

 

[Ned Ryerson]

And points are irrelevant.

This. Unless you're using them for a bid, draft points are like Whose Line Is It Anyway - the points don't matter.

 

[KeeperLeaguer]

Trading once again absolute garbage. Objectively garbage.
Why would you take 36 and lions f3 with their offseason after they finished 4th? We could have easily taken 2 of 35,36,38 from the lions for our late picks and any of those would have netted us a better future pick than lions f3.
Swans trade holy s**t. How is pick 18 worth what could be pick 19 next year in a stronger draft plus 37 plus 27 this year? I love josh weddle but he ain’t worth that. It is time for change we need some negotiation skill we have none. We needed to hold or ideally to gain draft capital and we’ve sold it down the river for albeit a player I really like but not someone who will move the needle. It’s time for change.

There's a player you identify that you really want but wont get to your next pick, how do you get him? Obviously you're going to pay overs to get in that position so you calculate your risks and if you think it's worth it you do the trade.
We paid what we did specifically to make sure we were in a position to select exactly the player we wanted. I'm amazed people don't look at the bigger picture.
You make it painfully obvious you've never been anywhere near an AFL trade room.

 

[hawkinoz]

Something decent yes. Double the points is ok if it’s 42 for 56 I.e 400’for 200. we gave up a Deficit of approx 1300 draft points tonight to put that in context that’s around pick 11. For a team with limited draft capital. It’s absolutely insane.

I said the below for exactly this, we did good. You are comparing post bid match position of pick 18 and comparing with worst case of pick 19, use the actual position to calculate value.
Also when you draft gun talent, your chances of rising up increases. So I would say more chances for us to have pick 26-28 next yr

Pick 14 for 24+26+44 is amazing deal for us.

Indeed, but teams have packaged an F2 to move 1-2 spots. Does anyone think Pies would accept an offer for pick 14 from say the Eagles with their pick 20 + F2. If this sounds fair, then 24+F2+F3 for 14 is maybe even unders.
Even if we finish 2nd last 24+20+38 for is only just overs for pick 14. Fine for that risk to get a gun player 1 yr early into the system.

We can't give this trade(or one without F3) to GWS for pick 15 as then Syd could have picked Weddle and it would be a wasted trade. The Phantoms show Syd picking him.

I would only have tried to upgrade our pick 48 to Syd's pick 42 and then if pick 42 turns out even half good, it becomes a brilliant trade. Also seeing we didn't ask for Sydney's pick 68 in deal, I would say we have no intention of taking Vickery today.

 

[daniel23]

What's everyone hoping for today? 1st pick has to be a small forward, there should be some good options around that pick . Also hoping Vickery doesn't get a bid before our 3rd rounder.

 

[BIGHAWK23]

Sorry we traded 2 seconds that are bottom 6 team seconds and a f3 for an end of first round first. Which future picks are we moving forward we have our f1 dogs f2 and lions f3?

From 2024 into next years draft

Pretty simple i would have thought

And the comparison to the Stocker deal is laughable

 

[matey]

MM has nailed it this year. To bring in Ramma, Blanc, Amon, Meek, Stephens, McKenzie and Webble on top of the young squad we already have. We aren’t rebuilding our list over the next few years …… most of it has already happened. Now it’s time to sit back and enjoy watching them all come through together to deliver the brown and gold more silverware

 

[TDS7]

You don't know what the outlay is given they're future picks. And points are irrelevant. A bunch of late picks add up to early picks in points, but they are not worth that. If we finish dead last next year, I agree it's lopsided. If we finish say 12-14 and there are a few bids (as there always are), the deal is fine for another first rounder.

Let's be honest here guys, if we finish dead last we're not going to give a flying f*ck about what second we traded last year while we crown Harley the new King of the Ding.

 

[Chioli]

I think we have to differentiate the aspects of list management as I have said previously. I am rapt with our picks, mackenzie a great complement to our midfield mix and weddle I think could be an star. Absolute tick.
Trading once again absolute garbage. Objectively garbage.
Why would you take 36 and lions f3 with their offseason after they finished 4th? We could have easily taken 2 of 35,36,38 from the lions for our late picks and any of those would have netted us a better future pick than lions f3.
Swans trade holy s**t. How is pick 18 worth what could be pick 19 next year in a stronger draft plus 37 plus 27 this year? I love josh weddle but he ain’t worth that. To put it in some perspective pick 18 is worth 985 points picks 25(our f2 based on this years ladder position) 27 and f3(44) is worth 1821 points I.e almost double. It is time for change we need some negotiation skill we have none. We needed to hold or ideally to gain draft capital and we’ve sold it down the river for albeit a player I really like but not someone who will move the needle. It’s time for change.

I’ll delete my account if our future second is inside 20. Tonight’s first pick is 22, last year it was 21 and the year before 27.

Suns have a top 5-10 academy and another 10-20 academy.
Does McCabe go 10-20?
Next Darcy at the Dogs ?
What else ?
What free agents may leave and get round 1 compensation ? Parish ?

If next years is 23-25 this deal feels a lot better


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com

 

[KermitJagger]

I think we have to differentiate the aspects of list management as I have said previously. I am rapt with our picks, mackenzie a great complement to our midfield mix and weddle I think could be an star. Absolute tick.
Trading once again absolute garbage. Objectively garbage.
Why would you take 36 and lions f3 with their offseason after they finished 4th? We could have easily taken 2 of 35,36,38 from the lions for our late picks and any of those would have netted us a better future pick than lions f3.
Swans trade holy s**t. How is pick 18 worth what could be pick 19 next year in a stronger draft plus 37 plus 27 this year? I love josh weddle but he ain’t worth that. To put it in some perspective pick 18 is worth 985 points picks 25(our f2 based on this years ladder position) 27 and f3(44) is worth 1821 points I.e almost double. It is time for change we need some negotiation skill we have none. We needed to hold or ideally to gain draft capital and we’ve sold it down the river for albeit a player I really like but not someone who will move the needle. It’s time for change.

Shut up about points and picks.

Every club goes into the draft with an order in which they rate the talent available, they trade picks based on that order. The trade including 27 and our futures wasn't for Pick 18, it was for Josh Weddle, a player we may well have rated 10th best in the draft. Points and picks given up are irrelevant.

You have no idea what we laid out for him or the type of player Weddle will be - even though you say up front "Weddle I think could be an(sic) star" before ending with "a player I really like but not someone who will move the needle".

 

[TDS7]

What's everyone hoping for today? 1st pick has to be a small forward, there should be some good options around that pick . Also hoping Vickery doesn't get a bid before our 3rd rounder.

Burgiel, Long, Binns, O'Sullivan, Leary in that order for a small mid/forward.

Lemmey, McCallum, Keeler, Van Es, Teal in that order for a spec tall.

Vickery to slip into the rookie draft. Pick up O'Sullivan, Leary, Van Es, or Teal in the rookie draft if they fall that far.

 

[Billyc]

The points are a guide of course but that’s massive overs. i can’t believe people are justifying what we paid. in our stage of rebuild we should have been looking to increase draft capital. In 2023 we now have the 10th best draft hand.
In 2022 we have our first pick and small improvements on our 2nd 3rd and 4th round picks. My point is we are either going to take a long time to climb or we are hoping to luck as we are taking in spectre draft hands or Now worse draft hands than expected for little gain. These are all Objective statements. I want us to succeed of course but we are shouting ourselves in the foot

It's not a matter of justifying what we paid. The point is we don't entirely know what we paid, which I agree comes with some risk. You are basing your assessment on an assumption of us finishing dead last or close to it. If that happens, I agree with you, the price is steep. If it doesn't happen and we finish 12-14, I don't. If for example, the deal ends up being something like:

Pick 27, 28 (after bids) and 46 for pick 18 (and a player we rated higher), that is absolutely fine.

 

[Ned Ryerson]

These are all Objective statements.

They're really not - they are your opinions and the absolute opposite of being objective. You have no idea what next trade period is going to look like - and if it is a super draft we can easily trade future picks to get more capital in next year. You can get off on doomsaying all you like - some of us are pretty happy we got two first round talents in.

we are shouting ourselves in the foot

Wrong again - this would be shouting ourselves in the foot: