Rumour 2023 Rumours and Speculation (Rumours total 37!, 1 (busted) BIG FISH ALERT last October 9th) (9 confirmed! 17 Busted!)

[George Kramer]

Clubs never choose to rebuild

They have rebuilds thrust upon them

Then call it the plan

Exactly what happened to us when Nicks drove us to the bottom

 

[GameofSloanes]

He’s only 49 years old…

That's 3 more than me and I'm not sure I'll be alive by the time we win again

 

[Sanders]

Stop using big words.

Don’t be coy

 

[Sanders]

Clubs never choose to rebuild

They have rebuilds thrust upon them

Then call it the plan

And that’s what happened to us.

 

[Twist_of_Lemon]

Stop using big words.

A sensible rule for safe words.

 

[Sanders]

A sensible rule for safe words.

A song for kirky



Thank me afterwards

 

[beartoo]

A sensible rule for safe words.

Mark Twain was rumoured to have said that he got sixpence a word so why use long ones when short would suffice?
He also used more words than needed

On SM-A115F using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[MRB37]

And that’s what happened to us.

It does make you wonder how they could jump so early on an extension when they went into 2020 expecting a quick spike upwards and he took us to our worst season ever.

I'm sure they totally chalked that up to COVID restrictions impacting, but there were plenty of signs throughout through things like that Amazon documentary that either Nicks couldn't get a team to understand his gameplan or he'd built one for a team that couldn't carry it out.

 

[Sanders]

It does make you wonder how they could jump so early on an extension when they went into 2020 expecting a quick spike upwards and he took us to our worst season ever.

I'm sure they totally chalked that up to COVID restrictions impacting, but there were plenty of signs throughout through things like that Amazon documentary that either Nicks couldn't get a team to understand his gameplan or he'd built one for a team that couldn't carry it out.

We were, are, desperate to believe, because we don’t want to start over.

 

[Captain Furious]

Exactly what happened to us when Nicks drove us to the bottom

I hear Nicks also killed Princess Diana. We should bash him behind the bike sheds after school.

 

[Captain Furious]

It does make you wonder how they could jump so early on an extension when they went into 2020 expecting a quick spike upwards and he took us to our worst season ever.

I'm sure they totally chalked that up to COVID restrictions impacting, but there were plenty of signs throughout through things like that Amazon documentary that either Nicks couldn't get a team to understand his gameplan or he'd built one for a team that couldn't carry it out.

Lot of misunderstandings around the coach's role in a football club. They don't build the team, they don't determine rebuilds, they don't recruit, they're not the sole selector. They have a say in those things but not anywhere near the final one. The game plan works well when executed correctly but the team that had been built for him could not and still to an extent, is not able to execute it consistently. It's built around being able to hit targets at speed - as the modern game really has to be, you give the ball away, you get scored against - yet the players he's been given with high picks, Jones, McHenry, Berry, Pedlar, Schoenberg etc., are not elite users of the ball. They're hard-at-it types, run all day heart and soul players - of which every team needs a few. But we already had Crouch and Laird and brought in Keays. Half our side aren't equipped to excel in that game style. Hence those top 30 picks, who should by now be the driving force of the team, are all peripheral figures. There's been a marked correction since 2021, both with drafting and recruiting but it'll still take some time for Nicks to have the team he needs to contend for a flag.

 

[GreyCrow]

The game plan works well when executed correctly but the team that had been built for him could not and still to an extent, is not able to execute it consistently.

So why does he select the same ones who let him down consistently?

Nobody has been brave enough to answer this

I would keep selecting different people until I found those who do execute correctly but thats me - actually I wouldnt care if they could - just give me players who want to win

And this returns me to my misgivings about development - it seems we wait till al the mistakes are eliminated before selecting a player to move up - thats terrible planning

 

[Captain Furious]

So why does he select the same ones who let him down consistently?

Nobody has been brave enough to answer this

I would keep selecting different people until I found those who do execute correctly but thats me - actually I wouldnt care if they could - just give me players who want to win

And this returns me to my misgivings about development - it seems we wait till al the mistakes are eliminated before selecting a player to move up - thats terrible planning

Another misconception that Nicks selects the team by himself...not the case, there's a selection committee. But even if, who do you bring in? You can only choose from the players you have, hence these guys (along with Cook, Murphy and Sholl - who doesn't have the body for AFL) being cycled through the last few spots. Who's banging down the door in the SANFL? Bring in Dowling and everyone howls that we have too many inside mids. Bond hasn't done anywhere near enough, Taylor is always injured, Edwards and Ryan aren't ready.

It's not that the team can't execute yet, it's the list.

 

[Sanders]

I hear Nicks also killed Princess Diana. We should bash him behind the bike sheds after school.

Zzzzzz

 

[Sanders]

Lot of misunderstandings around the coach's role in a football club. They don't build the team, they don't determine rebuilds, they don't recruit, they're not the sole selector. They have a say in those things but not anywhere near the final one. The game plan works well when executed correctly but the team that had been built for him could not and still to an extent, is not able to execute it consistently. It's built around being able to hit targets at speed - as the modern game really has to be, you give the ball away, you get scored against - yet the players he's been given with high picks, Jones, McHenry, Berry, Pedlar, Schoenberg etc., are not elite users of the ball. They're hard-at-it types, run all day heart and soul players - of which every team needs a few. But we already had Crouch and Laird and brought in Keays. Half our side aren't equipped to excel in that game style. Hence those top 30 picks, who should by now be the driving force of the team, are all peripheral figures. There's been a marked correction since 2021, both with drafting and recruiting but it'll still take some time for Nicks to have the team he needs to contend for a flag.

He’s not given finished players

He’s given guys to develop into finished players

It’s his job to do that and he’s bad at it

 

[Captain Furious]

He’s not given finished players

He’s given guys to develop into finished players

It’s his job to do that and he’s bad at it

That's an extremely naive view. Sam Berry isn't going to become Errol Gulden through development, he's a completely different type of player. If you listen to Hamish for more than 5 minutes, you'll hear the word 'competitive' about 10 times. He champions the McHenrys and Pedlars of the world who are competitive, hard at it and other cliches. Which is great, you need those types of players, you just don't need 15 of them and you don't spend your prize draft capital on them.

 

[adelaidecrows]

Lot of misunderstandings around the coach's role in a football club. They don't build the team, they don't determine rebuilds, they don't recruit, they're not the sole selector. They have a say in those things but not anywhere near the final one.

1. While there is a selection committee, it is a certainty Nicks will play who he likes. His career as coach lives and dies with the teams results so he would have the final selection. Others have ideas, push players forward and no doubt have a spirited debate and he could be swayed into playing another player than the one he had in mind. It is still his decision.

2. A rebuild is obviously a committee one. Its not the coach. Generally its a club decision that the current group of players regardless of coach cant progress forward. So I don't think anyones blaming Nicks for that.

As for the rest, I think most people understand its a committee decision around drafting and trading. The coach would have a leading say but not the final one but it would be very weighted.

The game plan works well when executed correctly but the team that had been built for him could not and still to an extent, is not able to execute it consistently. It's built around being able to hit targets at speed - as the modern game really has to be, you give the ball away, you get scored against - yet the players he's been given with high picks, Jones, McHenry, Berry, Pedlar, Schoenberg etc., are not elite users of the ball. They're hard-at-it types, run all day heart and soul players - of which every team needs a few. But we already had Crouch and Laird and brought in Keays. Half our side aren't equipped to excel in that game style. Hence those top 30 picks, who should by now be the driving force of the team, are all peripheral figures. There's been a marked correction since 2021, both with drafting and recruiting but it'll still take some time for Nicks to have the team he needs to contend for a flag.

Few questions:
What evidence do you have we aren't following Nicks instructions to the letter as to how he wants it played?

Because we lose, its the players, not Nicks? Sounds a tad apologist.

When is Nicks accountable at selection to find alternatives to players not providing him with the team dynamic he needs?

Playing the same players that continually lose and under perform is not smart is it?

Is it better to lose by 2 goals every week playing a group of players who have reached a ceiling or is it better to achieve the same win/loss ratio but lose between 3-4 goals by pumping games into younger players.

To me you are merely excusing safe selection. It achieves nothing. This side is not going anywhere.

 

[Captain Furious]

1. While there is a selection committee, it is a certainty Nicks will play who he likes. His career as coach lives and dies with the teams results so he would have the final selection. Others have ideas, push players forward and no doubt have a spirited debate and he could be swayed into playing another player than the one he had in mind. It is still his decision.

2. A rebuild is obviously a committee one. Its not the coach. Generally its a club decision that the current group of players regardless of coach cant progress forward. So I don't think anyones blaming Nicks for that.

As for the rest, I think most people understand its a committee decision around drafting and trading. The coach would have a leading say but not the final one but it would be very weighted.



Few questions:
What evidence do you have we aren't following Nicks instructions to the letter as to how he wants it played?

Because we lose, its the players, not Nicks? Sounds a tad apologist.

When is Nicks accountable at selection to find alternatives to players not providing him with the team dynamic he needs?

Playing the same players that continually lose and under perform is not smart is it?

Is it better to lose by 2 goals every week playing a group of players who have reached a ceiling or is it better to achieve the same win/loss ratio but lose between 3-4 goals by pumping games into younger players.

To me you are merely excusing safe selection. It achieves nothing. This side is not going anywhere.

Ok...

1. While you may want to think that as it's supports your view, it's not accurate. Each selection committee would work a little differently (Alistair Clarkson probably has more say than Adam Yze) but the coach does not get automatic final say. It just doesn't work that way. Sorry.

2. You need to read the thread.

3. The coach absolutely does not have a leading or even weighted say in drafting. They may ask for a type of player (hence our pivot since 2001 when Nicks probably begged Hamish for no more grunt players who can't kick) but they don't get to dictate players. I remember Ross Lyon saying in an interview he had zero impact on drafting at Freo. Leigh Matthews said a similar thing.

What evidence do you have we aren't following Nicks instructions to the letter as to how he wants it played? - I watch games and assume his instructions aren't to give the ball to the opposition.

Who do you propose bringing into the team?

 

[George Kramer]

I hear Nicks also killed Princess Diana. We should bash him behind the bike sheds after school.

Have a look at the team we had in his first year and whether you think that should have been the bottom side and went so many games in a row without a win.

 

[GreyCrow]

Another misconception that Nicks selects the team by himself...not the case, there's a selection committee. But even if, who do you bring in? You can only choose from the players you have, hence these guys (along with Cook, Murphy and Sholl - who doesn't have the body for AFL) being cycled through the last few spots. Who's banging down the door in the SANFL?

But thats the point - why do they need to be banging down the door? What special formula dictates who does and doesnt play SANFL? I dont recall Rachele banging down the door - he walked straight through. I didnt see Max banging it out

Its a furphy designed to shoosh the proletariat

Bring in Dowling and everyone howls that we have too many inside mids.

Not if you drop Laird or Crouch. And this is the pint you are missing. You think there are untoucahbles. Go back to my point in the other thread.

Are the next 3 games easier than most for the year? Does Laird or Crouch or Tex or Smith or Butts need a rest to recover ? I think they do

Perfect opportunity to play some rookies - who cares where and give some injury cover to those injured

Bond hasn't done anywhere near enough, Taylor is always injured, Edwards and Ryan aren't ready.

Again who cares and who says they arent ready? Oh yeah door banging. The lie that keeps people in their place

Lets find out if they are ready.

It's not that the team can't execute yet, it's the list.

Its not the list because we havent seen the list

 

[Captain Furious]

But thats the point - why do they need to be banging down the door? What special formula dictates who does and doesnt play SANFL? I dont recall Rachele banging down the door - he walked straight through. I didnt see Max banging it out

Its a furphy designed to shoosh the proletariat

Not if you drop Laird or Crouch. And this is the pint you are missing. You think there are untoucahbles. Go back to my point in the other thread.

Are the next 3 games easier than most for the year? Does Laird or Crouch or Tex or Smith or Butts need a rest to recover ? I think they do

Perfect opportunity to play some rookies - who cares where and give some injury cover to those injured

Again who cares and who says they arent ready? Oh yeah door banging. The lie that keeps people in their place

Lets find out if they are ready.

Its not the list because we havent seen the list

But who? Name names. Other than Dowling - if you think he'd be better than Laird or Crouch, bit controversial but ok - who else are you playing?

p.s Rachele and Max both played in the opening round of their 1st seasons. Apparently Max barely lost a contest all pre season and demanded a spot. No one currently playing SANFL has done that.

 

[George Kramer]

Lot of misunderstandings around the coach's role in a football club. They don't build the team, they don't determine rebuilds, they don't recruit, they're not the sole selector. They have a say in those things but not anywhere near the final one. The game plan works well when executed correctly but the team that had been built for him could not and still to an extent, is not able to execute it consistently. It's built around being able to hit targets at speed - as the modern game really has to be, you give the ball away, you get scored against - yet the players he's been given with high picks, Jones, McHenry, Berry, Pedlar, Schoenberg etc., are not elite users of the ball. They're hard-at-it types, run all day heart and soul players - of which every team needs a few. But we already had Crouch and Laird and brought in Keays. Half our side aren't equipped to excel in that game style. Hence those top 30 picks, who should by now be the driving force of the team, are all peripheral figures. There's been a marked correction since 2021, both with drafting and recruiting but it'll still take some time for Nicks to have the team he needs to contend for a flag.

Thats the game plan? The only time that’s been the game plan was last year when we were the highest scoring team with the 9th worse defence, hardly a disaster there and we just missed finals.

Compare that to the game plan we started the year. Slow, no play on instead kick to kick. We went from the highest to the lowest scoring team with minimal improvement in our points against. Why is it that we need to fall behind and then we come with a late rate rush to constantly fall short? We aren’t conceding a lot of goals when choose to attack to make up ground on those deficits otherwise we wouldn’t be. He chose to stick with the vanilla midfield mix until he had no choice to and then introduced Soligo and Rankine. Even now he’s choosing to play Laird and Crouch in there with their 14 kicks and 42 handballs.

How about his game plan that results in intercept defenders having a field day on us? How about giving up on doing anything to try and stop Stewart because he’s too good and yet Port have stopped him twice in a row with ****ing McEntee?

You talk about the players Nicks has been given, his game plan starts and end with the contest and that’s the players he’s got, so what’s the problem? Thats his primary focus.

You can choose to dismiss Nicks criticisms but that just puts you in the same make believe world as Wayne.

 

[GreyCrow]

But who? Name names. Other than Dowling - if you think he'd be better than Laird or Crouch, bit controversial but ok - who else are you playing?

I never said he was better I said lets try him and find out

I would play Dowling , Curtin and Edwards

p.s Rachele and Max both played in the opening round of their 1st seasons. Apparently Max barely lost a contest all pre season and demanded a spot. No one currently playing SANFL has done that.

Wow 1 game. I'm convinced

 

[George Kramer]

But who? Name names. Other than Dowling - if you think he'd be better than Laird or Crouch, bit controversial but ok - who else are you playing?

p.s Rachele and Max both played in the opening round of their 1st seasons. Apparently Max barely lost a contest all pre season and demanded a spot. No one currently playing SANFL has done that.

Taylor for McHenry or Murphy. Why do one of these proven spuds have to be in the team?
Dowling for Crouch or Laird.

How about when he subbed Nank for Smith, you were ok for that?

 

[Captain Furious]

Have a look at the team we had in his first year and whether you think that should have been the bottom side and went so many games in a row without a win.

Out: Richard Douglas, Andy Otten, Cam Ellis-Yolmen (Brisbane Lions), Eddie Betts (Carlton), Sam Jacobs (GWS Giants), Hugh Greenwood (Gold Coast Suns), Alex Keath (Western Bulldogs), Josh Jenkins (Geelong Cats)

In: Billy Frampton

Milera missed the whole season other than first 2 games, Sloane missed a big chunk with injury, Doedee came back later from a knee then did his hamstring...we were absolutely decimated for talent and experience.