List Mgmt. 2024 Trade Thread - No.2

[ScrappyDo]

Sheil is part of the deal involving Gresh last year. this will bite us on the bum
Bonner Dow Sheil & Tomlinson is comical on top of losing Battle


How many players have we gone through till we found Battle ? will spend the next 5 - 8 years trying to replace him

I was under the impression that the Gresh arrangement was to trigger band 1. Surely the failure of that put an end to the reciprocal exchange. I don't want him either FWIW.

I can handle losing Battle for a band 1 compo assuming we can effectively plug the hole and someone like Ari comes in over time. If it's band 2 then yeah, not so good.
If there's a better way to sustainability improve the midfield then that would be preferable, but l haven't heard it yet.

 

[gubby88]

Don't mind losing Gresham. Should have traded Clark when he had value. Should have traded billings when he had value. All three are not part of the engine room or spine.

Battle different story. We are over engineering an outcome here because we cbf doing the hard work to get better. Transactional. Like getting a top 5 pick suddenly gets us an elite mid and pushes us to a flag. It's the old messiah complex with a coach or star player just in a different form.

Hawthorn meanwhile have rebuilt their midfield from nothing and in a fraction of the time.

Our culture is terrible.

actually, our culture rates top 4 in the AFL according to an article I read

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[StCicatriz]

actually, our culture rates top 4 in the AFL according to an article I read

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Employee satisfaction and general workplace behaviours.

At a club where we grant the players more time off than any other club. I'd be shocked if they weren't happy.

We aren't running an office here.

 

[Mowman]

I was under the impression that the Gresh arrangement was to trigger band 1. Surely the failure of that put an end to the reciprocal exchange. I don't want him either FWIW.

I can handle losing Battle for a band 1 compo assuming we can effectively plug the hole and someone like Ari comes in over time. If it's band 2 then yeah, not so good.
If there's a better way to sustainability improve the midfield then that would be preferable, but l haven't heard it yet.

Band 1 for Battle I can live with as well, anything else is rubbish
Midfield will improve if Sheil isn't taking minutes from Pou - Windy - Wilson - Garcia etc
I can't think of 1 good reason to get Sheil over. He is done, its lazy list management

 

[ScrappyDo]

I'm not going to lie I don't watch Norf very much (basically only when we play them), but is LDU really worth that much?

1. We can front load a significant portion of his salary from existing excess cap space.

2. You'd also probably have to use 3 high FRDPs to find 1 player with his capability.

3. He'd shorten our timeline to contention by 3 years.

He'd be worth anything we could afford. The only question I'd have is if we have enough of the other pieces in place yet as Norff would ask for the earth in return and I'd not want to lose our top pick this year.

 

[ScrappyDo]

Band 1 for Battle I can live with as well, anything else is rubbish
Midfield will improve if Sheil isn't taking minutes from Pou - Windy - Wilson - Garcia etc
I can't think of 1 good reason to get Sheil over. He is done, its lazy list management

Not lazy. Again, l don't want him. But we'll lose Ross and Crouch, RTB says Steele needs help, and you think we're still obliged under the Gresham deal somehow.

If it happens, I'll wait to see what the details of the contract contain because on face value it's obviously not justifiable.
I just can't see SOS getting bent over on this. Whatever his other failings may be with talant identification, he doesn't EAD when doing deals. I think that's well established.

 

[Saintos The ITK]

1. We can front load a significant portion of his salary from existing excess cap space.

2. You'd also probably have to use 3 high FRDPs to find 1 player with his capability.

3. He'd shorten our timeline to contention by 3 years.

He'd be worth anything we could afford. The only question I'd have is if we have enough of the other pieces in place yet as Norff would ask for the earth in return and I'd not want to lose our top pick this year.

At least having used our top pick on an established player you’d know we can’t **** it up.
I know we have different personnel in place now but the Tom Lee Paddy Billings Coffield fiascos have given us ptsd.

 

[ScrappyDo]

At least having used our top pick on an established player you’d know we can’t **** it up.
I know we have different personnel in place now but the Tom Lee Paddy Billings Coffield fiascos have given us ptsd.

100%

 

[Tommy Wigs]

TBH, he’s a very good fit for our midfield (so is Reid). Has that explosive, break-away pace from stoppage that we desperately need and would complement Steele, Windy, Stocker, Clark, Dow etc. Is most effective when he is first receive out of a stoppage.
Is a good kick (not great), kicked 11 goals. Averages 28 disposals (14k, 14hb).

Depends on the price I guess

I’m not usually a give up all your assets type of guy, but you’re right on all of that and being perfect for us. But he comes with massive injury risk.

 

[Tommy Wigs]

Not lazy. Again, l don't want him. But we'll lose Ross and Crouch, RTB says Steele needs help, and you think we're still obliged under the Gresham deal somehow.

If it happens, I'll wait to see what the details of the contract contain because on face value it's obviously not justifiable.
I just can't see SOS getting bent over on this. Whatever his other failings may be with talantidentification, he doesn't EAD when doing deals. I think that's well established.

Wasn’t the “favour” if Gresham brought in Band 1?

 

[Tommy Wigs]

I don’t think Dildos self pride will allow him to pay someone to take Shield.
It would be a total acknowledgment of failure.

I think he’s now (just recently) walked away hasn’t he. But I agree wholeheartedly with that if he’s still around.

 

[Tommy Wigs]

How many top end draft picks running around in hawthorn's midfield?

Still can’t believe they were allowed to price everyone out of New move in the mid season draft

 

[StFly]

At least having used our top pick on an established player you’d know we can’t **** it up.
I know we have different personnel in place now but the Tom Lee Paddy Billings Coffield fiascos have given us ptsd.

Paddy unfortunate, was still competent.
Coff, I was shipping out soon as he did that ACL, that was time to sell, time proves me making an astute call.
Club shopped Hunter, no takers.
Lee was an obvious top up gap fill.

Like, I loved when we picked up Long, sure not a high X factor explosive player, but man, tough, fast, strong, had spring in step and we make him a lock down defender first. That's, that's sucking royally in development previously, then we pick up more small forwards and he gets pushed out as he goes up the ground to waste everything we did.

There's unfortunate, like no one going going "I can use Hunter as I had young skinny guys" or "guys, guys paddy's been ko'd 4 times, find me a buyer" and there's find me an explosive forward, trade in 2 small forwards and make him a lock down defender stupidity.

Thankfully these days we just have a shit list in terms of midfield, the one place where it's relatively easy to swap out people as opposed to the 2x KPF, 1x FP and intercept defender previously.

 

[gringo2011]

actually, our culture rates top 4 in the AFL according to an article I read

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They only spend about 6 hours a week training and at the club. It’s so relaxed that there is nothing to complain about. We get the least contact of any club in the AFL. Full extra day off.

 

[gringo2011]

1. We can front load a significant portion of his salary from existing excess cap space.

2. You'd also probably have to use 3 high FRDPs to find 1 player with his capability.

3. He'd shorten our timeline to contention by 3 years.

He'd be worth anything we could afford. The only question I'd have is if we have enough of the other pieces in place yet as Norff would ask for the earth in return and I'd not want to lose our top pick this year.

I’d rather swap a pick for him than go to the draft. He’s a free agent next year and unsigned. If they are backing themselves for a surge up the ladder they might be better taking the pick now. We need a player like him and there is no guarantee that one will fall to our picks.

 

[SG34]

What are your thoughts about keeping Seb Ross on the list kind of like Gold Coast and Andrew Swallow

Andrew Swallow

Age

37

Ht

182cm

Wt

80kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

20.7

5star

K

9.6

4star

HB

11.1

5star

M

2.9

3star

T

6.6

5star

CL

5.8

5star

No current season stats available

D

8.8

3star

K

5.4

2star

HB

3.4

3star

M

2.6

3star

T

4.4

5star

?

 

[akaifu]

What are your thoughts about keeping Seb Ross on the list kind of like Gold Coast and Andrew Swallow?

List clogger

 

[Remboy]

What are your thoughts about keeping Seb Ross on the list kind of like Gold Coast and Andrew Swallow?

Probably depends on who else goes. If they feel the young guys could use his experience he could stay for a year. But he'd probably be spending a bit of time with Sandy.

 

[Joffaboy]

How many interstate clubs have won flags in the last 15years? Other VIC clubs seem to be able to manage it. We built a pile of shit and then complain when we have to sit in it. Dumb gambles got us here, poor staff, an administration that went austere and wouldn’t employ quality staff etc. Well run clubs make good decisions and we have spent 15 years making bad ones.

If we’d done it the right way around we’d be so much closer. My biggest concern is that we are back to gambling instead of planning. We are repeating the exact model Pelican had and expecting a different result. If we recruit well we might do it better this time but get it wrong and the club will be starting from the bottom just as a new franchise hits again.

Luckily we sacked the best recruiter we’ve had since Bevo.

You are answering a question I didn't ask.

You reckon we get good players within the current system even though teams like Brisbane, Bulldogs, Collingwood and Carlton get free top class players that are unavailable to us. Two finalists and last years premier.

Every Northern team gets access to their NGA's that we have no access to. Three of them in the top eight.
You then complain that the president tries to get it changed so we do have access and not having a 'vision' or some ethereal stuff totally unrelated to the reality of what the club faces.
The club has been hitting the draft since 2022 with many good picks. They will for it for two more.
You can't keep complaining about a different administration and list managers making mistakes ( so you reckon) five years ago.
How is this current admin responsible for then?
So instead of lashng out because it doesn't suit you, have a look at what they are trying, and why the president is attempting to get the one hand that is tied behind our back at least loosened, while using the only tool they have which is shopping around assets with currency.
The execution is what has many anxious.

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[Joffaboy]

They only spend about 6 hours a week training and at the club. It’s so relaxed that there is nothing to complain about. We get the least contact of any club in the AFL. Full extra day off.

16 hours a week. FFS get a grip

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[gringo2011]

You are answering a question I didn't ask.

You reckon we get good players within the current system even though teams like Brisbane, Bulldogs, Collingwood and Carlton get free top class players that are unavailable to us. Two finalists and last years premier.

Every Northern team gets access to their NGA's that we have no access to. Three of them in the top eight.
You then complain that the president tries to get it changed so we do have access and not having a 'vision' or some ethereal stuff totally unrelated to the reality of what the club faces.
The club has been hitting the draft since 2022 with many good picks. They will for it for two more.
You can't keep complaining about a different administration and list managers making mistakes ( so you reckon) five years ago.
How is this current admin responsible for then?
So instead of lashng out because it doesn't suit you, have a look at what they are trying, and why the president is attempting to get the one hand that is tied behind our back at least loosened, while using the only tool they have which is shopping around assets with currency.
The execution is what has many anxious.

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Certainly want it raised and fixed but now he needs to work out how to fix ourselves.

We look like we have a suite of kids from the academy and a FS this year. Luckily he didn’t fix it last year. We are looking at Ireland again which is smart and hopefully employing quality scouts in the state leagues. There are plenty of options to improve. The trick is to have diverse talent streams.

 

[pebblesofsand]

He’s whinging about the system instead of working within it. The academy bidding needed fixing and hopefully that’s done now. Time get the list managers, coaches and footy department in one place, Set a definitive outline of a plan moving forward and sell it to us. He keeps making a dick of himself putting his head up so has retreated. Time to grow a pair and stand up.

Rubbish

 

[Joffaboy]

Certainly want it raised and fixed but now he needs to work out how to fix ourselves.

We look like we have a suite of kids from the academy and a FS this year. Luckily he didn’t fix it last year. We are looking at Ireland again which is smart and hopefully employing quality scouts in the state leagues. There are plenty of options to improve. The trick is to have diverse talent streams.

I agree and the players over the last three years have been a very good haul
Pou
Owens
Windy
NAZ
Wilson

All very good players

Hastie
Garcia
Collard
Shoenmaker
Keeler

All have shown great potential

Van Es
Hotton

Unsure

I think 10 out of the 12 are good players or potential.
That is a pretty good effort with the picks and players available.

But we don't get access to the matchwinners. Would we have got Nick Daicos or Ashcroft. Would we have got Darcy? Probably not, but our hand may have been strengthened more if the player these clubs picked up with their still live first pick was available.

We dint know how many matchwinners the Northern clubs are gifted in future with NGA's. We know Heeney, but there could be 10 NGA's from the northern academies about to male their mark.

I fully support the President taking on the AFL and their filthy client media over this travesty and think we have done ok with the resourses available.
Wilkie
Sharman
Caminiti
Wood.

All rejects, all very good players. The talent selection has been superb in my view.

These avenues are continued to be looked into, however it would be nice in a professional sport to have something like an uncorrupted draft.


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[CaptainRisky]

We will get band 1 for Battle

Peatling, Shiel & Tomlinson should be in StKilda colours next yr

Tomlinson is insurance for losing Battle & allow others to continue to develop… plus he wants out as he and Steven May absolutely despise each other

Peace out

Pealting well that's just Fab and another broken down mid , yep we are going places

Its called South

 

[gubby88]

Pealting well that's just Fab and another broken down mid , yep we are going places

Its called South

that's OK, that's where the generational talent is

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