Certified Legendary Thread 34 Essendon* Players suspended for doping violations - No opposition fans. Check OP for thread rules

[LanceRomance]

You guys telling me that I'm a result of *'s spin team need to pull your heads in. I'm capable of independent thought, don't get your knickers in a twist because someone disagrees with you and you don't like it.

Keep baying for blood all you like, you're wasting your breath.

are you sure you didnt have just a teensy little bit of KoolAid?

 

[HARKER]

The only thing that irks me is that the reward for being the best kid in the land is to be associated with a cheating club.
Don't worry whether Essendon did this or that on purpose either. His reward will be to be marked by association.

In principle though, Koch is right..........when you think about it.

 

[HBF]

Timmy still having pot shots at David Koch this morning. Asked if someone can hold him under the pool of ice when he goes down the slide for freezing MND on Monday.

 

[KnobHead]

You guys telling me that I'm a result of *'s spin team need to pull your heads in. I'm capable of independent thought, don't get your knickers in a twist because someone disagrees with you and you don't like it.

Keep baying for blood all you like, you're wasting your breath.

Wouldn't worry too much about it MEB, the old "because you don't agree with me you've been brainwashed" is an old line when people can't discuss issues.

For what it's worth, I don't get the argument about additional penalties for EFC because they're somehow profited from cheating. It's a bit like someone being released from prison and someone can't get a job, should they also be denied unemployment benefits? The other thing with the Bombers situation is that the same logic can be applied to Carlton's penalties - once we did the time we still got high draft picks. Spin it anyway you like, but we now want something different for Essendon.

Also, where does it end with the Bombers? If they fall low next year do additional sanctions still apply? what about the year after? Or if they somehow manage to climb back up is that when we start allowing them to have draft picks again? That doesn't make sense - you only get draft picks if you succeed but not if you fail.

Anyway, have a nice day

 

[serenityNow]

Time to move on imo.....they copped as much of a whack as they're gonna get. Only thing that irks me still is Watson holding that Brownlow......

 

[coryne]

I actually laughed out loud this morning when Tim suggested it was only 50/50 that the players took banned substances.
Even after all of this time he has his head in the sand and not being able to face up to the truth.

Im shocked that he even said it was a 50:50 chance that anything prohibited was used, i thought that * was 100% sure that nothing prohibited was administered to the players. Dont tell me Watson is going rogue .....

 

[coryne]

If they had been found guilty of doping at the beginning, instead of "bringing the game into disrepute", I reckon the punishment they've already received as club and players would be enough. I can understand why some would argue for losing another first round pick but for me, it's time to move on.

If they were found guilty of doping at the beginning then the punishment would have been a lot harsher .......


* should be moved to 9th place in the draft order and be thankful that that is all that occurs. They ran a systematic doping program on their entire list using multiple prohibited substance (at best tb4 and aod 9604) and either destroyed the records of the program or didn't keep any records at all. Their conduct has been disgusting, they have not taken responsibility for any part of the saga instead constantly playing the victim, and now they are in line to recive the #1 selection in the draft and 10-12 players returning from suspension for next year.


Can anyone honestly say that that is a fair outcome given the circumstances ......

 

[Jabba73]

Wouldn't worry too much about it MEB, the old "because you don't agree with me you've been brainwashed" is an old line when people can't discuss issues.

For what it's worth, I don't get the argument about additional penalties for EFC because they're somehow profited from cheating. It's a bit like someone being released from prison and someone can't get a job, should they also be denied unemployment benefits? The other thing with the Bombers situation is that the same logic can be applied to Carlton's penalties - once we did the time we still got high draft picks. Spin it anyway you like, but we now want something different for Essendon.

Also, where does it end with the Bombers? If they fall low next year do additional sanctions still apply? what about the year after? Or if they somehow manage to climb back up is that when we start allowing them to have draft picks again? That doesn't make sense - you only get draft picks if you succeed but not if you fail.

Anyway, have a nice day

The punishment ends when the temporary bans do. They should not be rewarded for being poor due to temporary sanctions. When they have their full list back, they get the pick they legitimately earn. They have not earned the right to the best player in the draft. First pick after all non-finalists would be about right.

 

[BluesRule]

Adelaide got a bigger whack for the Tippet scandal, and also imposed their own sanctions. The Bombers got off very lightly.

The Bombers have only been penalised for governance breaches. As we know they destroyed all the paperwork and should rightfully be penalised for taking players offsite and attempting to subvert the rules.

The Bombers are now guilty of doping and the AFL have explicitly said they will not penalise them as the AFL (keystone cops) did not find * guilty of doping (as there was no evidence because * destroyed it in the governance breach).

Now WADA has found * guilty, the AFL have said they will not penalise them for doping at all.

This is ludicrous and they should cop a further penalty as they
(1) cheated
(2) destroyed evidence of cheating
With only (2) being penalised so far.

 

[Cripps 'n' Blue Bloods]

If they were found guilty of doping at the beginning then the punishment would have been a lot harsher .......


* should be moved to 9th place in the draft order and be thankful that that is all that occurs. They ran a systematic doping program on their entire list using multiple prohibited substance (at best tb4 and aod 9604) and either destroyed the records of the program or didn't keep any records at all. Their conduct has been disgusting, they have not taken responsibility for any part of the saga instead constantly playing the victim, and now they are in line to recive the #1 selection in the draft and 10-12 players returning from suspension for next year.


Can anyone honestly say that that is a fair outcome given the circumstances ......

I disagree. I think the penalties would have been the same... except, instead of being labeled as governance penalties, they would have been labeled as doping penalties.
$2mil fine, booted from finals, draft penalties for 2 years, suspended head coach and football operation manager, $30k fine for Bomber Thompson and 12 of their best players banned effectively for 12 months. I'd say that's fair, and if the appeal to the Swiss court remains unchanged, I would expect Jobe to hand back Chas.
As a result of the suspensions and the AFL's contractual obligations to field 18 teams, they have been made to field a sub-par side this year, and if that results in them getting pick #1, so be it.
EDIT: And convicted and fined for health and safety breaches.

 

[HARKER]

Time to move on imo.....they copped as much of a whack as they're gonna get. Only thing that irks me still is Watson holding that Brownlow......

Watson holding the Brownlow? Doesn't worry me in the slightest as it has no bearing on the competition, from an ongoing basis, POV.

The principle of taking something away yet there being a silver lining is attached, isn't quite right for me..........but it may be to some.
Listening to Watson (and his SEN buddies) crying out that Essendon have been punished enough is coming from a biased viewpoint.

Nothing is going to change but no doubt there will be more to say about it as the year wears on.....No doubt.

 

[Thrawn]

Only problem is that they didnt actually commit a crime.

Yes, they did. Worksafe busted them. They're the first club in VFL/AFL history to get a criminal conviction because of that.

 

[P_Crippy]

Yes, they did. Worksafe busted them. They're the first crime in VFL/AFL history to get a criminal conviction because of that.

My bad, forgot about that.
My over-riding feeling is that I have absolutely no faith in the AFL's integrity therefore i feel it's pointless worrying about what Essendon will or wont get.
I'm just focussing on my team's positivity from now on.
Also, **** *

 

[Cripps 'n' Blue Bloods]

Watson holding the Brownlow? Doesn't worry me in the slightest as it has no bearing on the competition, from an ongoing basis, POV.

The principle of taking something away yet there being a silver lining is attached, isn't quite right for me..........but it may be to some.
Listening to Watson (and his SEN buddies) crying out that Essendon have been punished enough is coming from a biased viewpoint.

Nothing is going to change but no doubt there will be more to say about it as the year wears on.....No doubt.

Actually I would say:
Essendon biased viewpoint: They've penalised too harshly. They haven't been found guilty of anything. Jobe should keep his Brownlow.
Anti-Essendon biased viewpoint: They haven't been penalised hard enough. Shouldn't get the #1 pick. I can't believe Jobe still has his Brownlow.
Level-headed non-biased viewpoint: They've copped their whack (as long as the Swiss appeal fails). They are still copping their whack on the field every week and in the courts. Jobe will hand back the Brownlow when the appeal fails, but probably should have handed it back after CAS on the proviso that he gets it back if the Swiss court overturns CAS.

Watson is clearly biased in some of his views, but I think his view, that they have been punished enough, is fairly level-headed.

You're right that Watson's Brownlow doesn't affect anything moving forward, but it shouldn't be ignored from a historical perspective.

 

[HARKER]

Actually I would say:
Essendon biased viewpoint: They've penalised too harshly. They haven't been found guilty of anything. Jobe should keep his Brownlow.
Anti-Essendon biased viewpoint: They haven't been penalised hard enough. Shouldn't get the #1 pick. I can't believe Jobe still has his Brownlow.
Level-headed non-biased viewpoint: They've copped their whack (as long as the Swiss appeal fails). They are still copping their whack on the field every week and in the courts. Jobe will hand back the Brownlow when the appeal fails, but probably should have handed it back after CAS on the proviso that he gets it back if the Swiss court overturns CAS.

Watson is clearly biased in some of his views, but I think his view, that they have been punished enough, is fairly level-headed.

You're right that Watson's Brownlow doesn't affect anything moving forward, but it shouldn't be ignored from a historical perspective.

I don't care much for history but others will.
Personal awards in a team game mean little to me.

Disagree about being punished enough, bit.
By virtue of taking players away, they have been afforded what could amount to a big ticket item, so in effect the punishment has an upside.
Of course this is hard to administer but it's patently clear that right now Dodoro would be rubbing his hands.

 

[Dominator_7]

Let them drool over the No. 1 pick.
No stand out 'once in a generation' junior this year unlike Weiters last year.

 

[Aphrodite]

**** Essendon*!

 

[HBF]

Let them drool over the No. 1 pick.
No stand out 'once in a generation' junior this year unlike Weiters last year.

And as I have said, one player isn't going to make any difference to their list makeup anyway.
Even when their players return, it will take them a while to pick up the pace of the game.
Players always speak about the issues they have coming back after a lengthy layoff.

 

[Thrawn]

Even when their players return, it will take them a while to pick up the pace of the game.
Players always speak about the issues they have coming back after a lengthy layoff.

This is why I always laugh when I see their delusional supporters say that they'll suddenly be in finals contention after having them back in.

They weren't even that good with them all in to begin with, and a year of not being able to train at the best facilities will put them behind the 8-ball compared to everyone else.

 

[Metalcrusher]

Im still reeeling from AGRO's use of the word obfuscating

FU agro i had to google it ROFL!

 

[happydude]

Does anybody rate * full list?

 

[Lace_Out]

Swisse might...

Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk

 

[ajb72]

I am sure they will come out all guns blazing in 2017. Trying to show the world how wonderful and brave they are.

And then fall in a heap around mid-season.

It will be 2012/2013 all over again.

 

[jezzajay]

Does anybody rate * full list?

i know i don't...

 

[HBF]

This is why I always laugh when I see their delusional supporters say that they'll suddenly be in finals contention after having them back in.

They weren't even that good with them all in to begin with, and a year of not being able to train at the best facilities will put them behind the 8-ball compared to everyone else.

From what I can see, they'll finish bottom 4 next year. Yeah they'll get Heppell and Hooker back, but Jobe and Hurley aren't certainties to get back. They'll struggle for a while Certainly won't be a destination for a long time.