Traded Adam Saad [traded to Carlton with #48 and #78 for #8 and #87]

[Tasmanian saint]

Why would a first year list manager risk their reputation by refusing to trade a pick that they'll use on him anyway? Clubs are professional, not one-eyed bigfooty posting fans.

Pick 7 for Saad and an early second is fair. Or Carlton split pick 7 into two mid-late firsts and give one to Essendon. That's fair as well.

7 on its own is overs and a second rounder is unders.

It’s more a case of why do a favour for a opposing club that is being absolutely ridiculous in there demands of if Essendon won’t budge from pick 7 then **** it just use the pick and draft him Essendon get nothing it’s no one else’s fault Essendon has an absolute moron for a list manager that has completely screwed his own club

 

[Brutalitops]

This type of attitude is exactly why you’re club is in the position it is currently re Daniher as an example to redraft sadd would be one of the stupidest things a club has ever done as you would have to match the terms of a over priced contract and be stuck with a player that passionately doesn’t want to be there it actually wouldn’t surprise me if sadd sat out a season rather then play for Essendon again to do this would be so stupid you wouldn’t rule it out for dodoro

He wont. The AFL will have quiet word with Essendon because if they redrafted him it could wind in the Courts as restraint of trade. Different if another club drafts him but Saad is a no fly zone for the bombers.

 

[Lore]

He wont. The AFL will have quiet word with Essendon because if they redrafted him it could wind in the Courts as restraint of trade. Different if another club drafts him but Saad is a no fly zone for the bombers.

Redrafting him would be madness, but its not restraint of trade.

 

[Brutalitops]

Redrafting him would be madness, but its not restraint of trade.

How so? I can understand not getting a trade done because it happens, but forcing him to return to an environment hes described as toxic?

 

[astrowizzle]

All this banging on how he isnt the fastest player in the comp. I reckon he gets to top speed a lot faster than most players. Few steps he is off. He also reaches his speeds in massive congestion cutting in and out of traffic. But he wants out so goodbye. I reckon he is early teens pick.

 

[Lore]

How so? I can understand not getting a trade done because it happens, but forcing him to return to an environment hes described as toxic?

Restraint of trade would be excluding him from the AFL competition and preventing him from trading his labour for money (earning a wage).

What you’re describing could be a worksafe claim or come under one of those extenuating circumstances clauses where the outcome of the draft causes undue hardship or something, but it wouldn’t be a restraint of trade claim in court as he is not prevented from earning a wage.

The preseason draft basically only exists to protect the AFL from restraint of trade claims, so for the draft itself to cause a restraint of trade would be absurd.

 

[faible]

All this banging on how he isnt the fastest player in the comp. I reckon he gets to top speed a lot faster than most players. Few steps he is off. He also reaches his speeds in massive congestion cutting in and out of traffic. But he wants out so goodbye. I reckon he is early teens pick.

He can also sustain that speed, bounce at that speed, move laterally and kick reasonably accurately at that speed. Compare Saad to Daw (who's been clocked at a higher top speed) and you can't quite imagine Majak managing to sustain it for more than 20m let alone executing skills. A lot of KPP's have high top speeds when they're on the lead, but don't sustain it or execute any skills at it.

 

[TheKITC]

How so? I can understand not getting a trade done because it happens, but forcing him to return to an environment hes described as toxic?

There have been far better legal minds address this over time on BF, but I believe the AFL gets around ROT by having all players (employees) directly work for the AFL (employer). The clubs are essentially part of that structure, like a branch is for a bank for example. The players also sign a contract to enter drafts and agree to the terms which state they could be chosen by any of the 18 clubs, which gives the AFL freedom to operate as they do. Players are free to enter the draft knowing this or not.

Having said that, there is almost certainly a lot of pressure applied to clubs at certain times not to do certain things that would inflame situations and create legal tensions. Essendon would not re-draft Saad, but let's just hope a reasonable arrangement can be made.

 

[Tasmanian saint]

All this banging on how he isnt the fastest player in the comp. I reckon he gets to top speed a lot faster than most players. Few steps he is off. He also reaches his speeds in massive congestion cutting in and out of traffic. But he wants out so goodbye. I reckon he is early teens pick.

Yeah I think a pick in the early teens is fair for both clubs if Essendon really want pick seven then Carlton would want a second rounder coming back I don’t know why Essendon didn’t start of negotiations with reasonable realistic deals like this instead of just being arseholes like normal

 

[zeggie]

There have been far better legal minds address this over time on BF, but I believe the AFL gets around ROT by having all players (employees) directly work for the AFL (employer). The clubs are essentially part of that structure, like a branch is for a bank for example. The players also sign a contract to enter drafts and agree to the terms which state they could be chosen by any of the 18 clubs, which gives the AFL freedom to operate as they do. Players are free to enter the draft knowing this or not.

Having said that, there is almost certainly a lot of pressure applied to clubs at certain times not to do certain things that would inflame situations and create legal tensions. Essendon would not re-draft Saad, but let's just hope a reasonable arrangement can be made.

Nope. AFL is just waiting and hoping the day never happens that a restraint of trade claim made. Due to the increase in states participating and increased $$ involved in contracts compared to decades ago, it's not a matter of if, it's a matter of when.

They even incorporated the following into the AFL Rules in contemplation that a claim will eventually made one day.

Rule 1.4(a) each provision in these Rules shall be read and constructed independently of the other provisions in these Rules so that if one or more provisions is held to be invalid as an unreasonable restraint or for any other reason whatsoever then the remaining provisions shall be valid to the extent that they are not held to be so invalid

Restraint of trade would be excluding him from the AFL competition and preventing him from trading his labour for money (earning a wage).

Incorrect and there has been multiple examples in multiple leagues around the globe.

 

[Drunkcat]

Not a team player only in it for the cash

 

[zeggie]

Not a team player only in it for the cash

I think he was sold a dream that didn't exist. Essendon are practically nearly rebuild bound now. Don't blame him for not wanting to stick around. He wants success.

 

[TheKITC]

Nope. AFL is just waiting and hoping the day never happens that a restraint of trade claim made. Due to the increase in states participating and increased $$ involved in contracts compared to decades ago, it's not a matter of if, it's a matter of when.

They even incorporated the following into the AFL Rules in contemplation that a claim will eventually made one day.

Rule 1.4(a) each provision in these Rules shall be read and constructed independently of the other provisions in these Rules so that if one or more provisions is held to be invalid as an unreasonable restraint or for any other reason whatsoever then the remaining provisions shall be valid to the extent that they are not held to be so invalid

That is standard legal practice to have clauses or rules like that to protect one's interests. That is akin to a force majeure clause or something of that nature, a pretty generic, standard agreement for several industries.

I think the prevailing legal perspective is that a player could probably challenge the league's rules around this and the salary, but to what end? It would be a long legal battle where they would probably have to sit and wait a significant period, sitting on their arse. The AFL could also argue on several grounds, that these 'restraints' or rules are in the best interests of many parties on multiple fronts and argue it pretty well IMO. This aside, I think the AFL wield a lot of power in the background of deals that are looking shaky and tense, in order to avoid a situation that could be drawn out, costly and be terrible for the optics of the competition.

You might find this to be interesting reading...

The AFL system has never seriously been threatened by court action, but prevailing theory seems to be that the league would meet the tests applied under the Nordenfeldt precedent.

 

[Kreuuuzeurns]

No club would trade 7 for a late first (16-18) and an early second (21-25), so I’m not sure why Saad + a future 2nd is being seen as reasonable.

 

[TheKITC]

If Dodoro spins his tyres too much re. Saad/Daniher, they will either have to trade someone else out in order to get Caldwell or risk their reputation of "not getting deals done and nobody will want to nominate them moving forward". I've heard that's really relevant...

Given the other logic applied in this thread, whatever is received for Saad will have to go to GWS. Caldwell is reported to have been offered 5 x $500k. Because there is an absolute and clear link between salary and trade price, they will on-trade it to GWS straight away, maybe with a 4th rounder coming back because Saad is on a bit more.

 

[chelseacarlton]

Looks like pick 27 it is, everyone’s happy!

 

[zeggie]

That is standard legal practice to have clauses or rules like that to protect one's interests. That is akin to a force majeure clause or something of that nature, a pretty generic, standard agreement for several industries.

I think the prevailing legal perspective is that a player could probably challenge the league's rules around this and the salary, but to what end? It would be a long legal battle where they would probably have to sit and wait a significant period, sitting on their arse. The AFL could also argue on several grounds, that these 'restraints' or rules are in the best interests of many parties on multiple fronts and argue it pretty well IMO. This aside, I think the AFL wield a lot of power in the background of deals that are looking shaky and tense, in order to avoid a situation that could be drawn out, costly and be terrible for the optics of the competition.

You might find this to be interesting reading...

Not the thread to argue this issue, but please note the article you linked is nearly a decade old, mainly refers to the common law doctrine only, mainly refers to drafts, and you tidbit quote isn't an accurate summary of the article.

Matching a restricted free agent offer, the player electing to go to the draft, and being redrafted by the original team - the specific action we're only actually talking about in the thread - would surely raise significant restraint of trade issues. All it takes is one case to change the entire system.

 

[EssendonPride]

Looks like pick 27 it is, everyone’s happy!

Your understanding of the word “everyone” seems pretty limited in this case.

I’d be ok with our end result being Saad for Caldwell, but no way to GWS accept pick 27 (which will get blown out a decent way by FA, etc) for him.

 

[chelseacarlton]

Your understanding of the word “everyone” seems pretty limited in this case.

I’d be ok with our end result being Saad for Caldwell, but no way to GWS accept pick 27 (which will get blown out a decent way by FA, etc) for him.

Well, you’ll have to cough up something else then, because that’s all we’re offering, Dodo has all his work cut out for him, everyone gets to sit back a watch, giggling!

 

[EssendonPride]

Well, you’ll have to cough up something else then, because that’s all we’re offering, Dodo has all his work cut out for him, everyone gets to sit back a watch, giggling!

Sorry, didn’t realise I was talking to Nick Austin.
You realise that no one on Bigfooty actually has any say in trade negotiations right?

 

[chelseacarlton]

Sorry, didn’t realise I was talking to Nick Austin.
You realise that no one on Bigfooty actually has any say in trade negotiations right?

I was voted 2nd most popular poster on the Bay last year, chief has made it very clear that I have exponential powers from here on in, here take pick 27!

 

[zeggie]

You realise that no one on Bigfooty actually has any say in trade negotiations right?

I am absolutely shocked to hear this. Did you let everyone else know on the main forum?

 

[SherbertLemon]

He wont. The AFL will have quiet word with Essendon because if they redrafted him it could wind in the Courts as restraint of trade. Different if another club drafts him but Saad is a no fly zone for the bombers.

What in the world...LOL.
Mate, he’s in a professional league.
He has to abide by the rules.

If you guys want to push him to the PSD, if none of the clubs are smart enough to pick him up (because he has talent oozing from his ballsack) we can pick him up.
We will pay him exactly what he’s asking for, in return for his footy abilities.

If he thinks the environment is toxic he’s welcome to retire.

That’s as stupid as saying a player shouldn’t have to move where they’re drafted.

 

[zeggie]

What in the world...LOL.
Mate, he’s in a professional league.
He has to abide by the rules.

Essendon....... Abide by rules.

 

[SherbertLemon]

Essendon....... Abide by rules.

Sick post man.
How many players have you walked to the PSD in the past 5 minutes.
Could be a bargain coming!!!!