News AFL to overhaul the draft, discuss changes to Academy and FS bid matching

[giantroo]

 

[Ash1337]

Can you expand on this? For me the issue has always been draft bidding- that if a player is a first round talent they shouldn’t be denied to any club willing to use their first rounder - and I’m also now getting there with father son too.

The entry for NGA is pretty low bar. Only 1 parent of allowed heritage gives eligibility for their kid to enter and there's no minimum years for a player to eligible. It's meant to help disadvantaged kids and those from heritages that are not traditionally exposed to the AFL sport. Not sure about JUH's situation but he joined the program at 15. It sounds like the bulldogs NGA is more hands on than some other NGA programs teams I have heard set up that barely do anything than just to have them on a list.

 

[Buget]

The entry for NGA is pretty low bar. Only 1 parent of allowed heritage gives eligibility for their kid to enter and there's no minimum years for a player to eligible. It's meant to help disadvantaged kids and those from heritages that are not traditionally exposed to the AFL sport. Not sure about JUH's situation but he joined the program at 15. It sounds like the bulldogs NGA is more hands on than some other NGA programs teams I have heard set up that barely do anything than just to have them on a list.

James Borlase went NGA to Adelaide as he was born in Egypt when his Australian parents were working there as commodity traders.

His father Darryl played 246 SANFL games for Port Adelaide and his mother, Jenny, is a former Australian netball players.

It didn’t draw much controversy at the time, as he only went as a cat-b rookie (no one picked him in the national draft), but could you imagine the up roar if he went in the first round?

Why should he have qualified as NGA? He shouldnot have, he had a full junior career at Unley, all-Australia as an under 15 and under 17.

 

[Farang83150]

Can you show me this quote he kept repeating? I've read all his books, followed him immensely and never come across this quote. Very curious about it

If Roos said that it'd be one of THE dumbest statements ever made in AFL (personally don't think he said it, recon the poster made it up), it's no secret the travel side of it stuffs players longevity, you hear coaches from either side of the coin refer to it regularly.

 

[mpal6]

The AFL did go on to fix the heck up that led to JUH being eligible
The same needs to be done to the Northern academies (so first round picks can't be matched)

Happy to support the clean first round idea if its applied to Father Son as well. They should remove priority pick in the first round too. Increase the basket case club's salary cap by some % and give them more list spots to add more talent.

 

[Crankyhawk]

Happy to support the clean first round idea if its applied to Father Son as well. They should remove priority pick in the first round too. Increase the basket case club's salary cap by some % and give them more list spots to add more talent.

Or even just drop this stupid cap floor that will enable bottom clubs to pay players what they are worth and build proper warchests

 

[Ants]

Or even just drop this stupid cap floor that will enable bottom clubs to pay players what they are worth and build proper warchests

Not happening. The players would need to agree to it and why would they?

 

[threenewpadlocks]

Not happening. The players would need to agree to it and why would they?

Just pay the players an overround at the end of the season. If the AFL average is 97% of the salary cap just pay every player a 3% bonus at the end of the year collectively.

 

[Mister_Football]

Happy to support the clean first round idea if its applied to Father Son as well. They should remove priority pick in the first round too. Increase the basket case club's salary cap by some % and give them more list spots to add more talent.

Father-son is the same for everyone. Only a few teams have statewide academies. Heeney, Mills, Walter, Read, Rogers, all for pennies on the dollar.

 

[Simon_Nesbit]

Just pay the players an overround at the end of the season. If the AFL average is 97% of the salary cap just pay every player a 3% bonus at the end of the year collectively.

I actually really like this idea. Spread the $$$ out equally amongst ALL players and it benefits those on lower contracts the most.

Another suggestion was for it to be added to players "Superannuation" fund for the post football life (perhaps paid only to those on base/low contracts, draftees, etc)

 

[HavUEvaSeenTheRain]

Father-son is the same for everyone. Only a few teams have statewide academies. Heeney, Mills, Walter, Read, Rogers, all for pennies on the dollar.

Father-son isn’t available to GC and GWS.

 

[Vindicater]

Just pay the players an overround at the end of the season. If the AFL average is 97% of the salary cap just pay every player a 3% bonus at the end of the year collectively.

I think you could do something similar at individual club level as well.

If for example Essendon paid only 93% of the cap, then they need to average the last 2% out amongst all the players on the roster for that year.

Stops teams signing guys to long term stupid deals to make the floor.

 

[Buget]

Father-son is the same for everyone. Only a few teams have statewide academies. Heeney, Mills, Walter, Read, Rogers, all for pennies on the dollar.

How is father sound fair?

I bet that GC have 20 players top who qualify and 80% of them are still playing.

Just remember, you got Darcy for pennies, GC will have to wait a generation before they get the opportunity for FS.

 

[mpal6]

Father-son is the same for everyone. Only a few teams have statewide academies. Heeney, Mills, Walter, Read, Rogers, all for pennies on the dollar.

"Father-son is the same for everyone." this is just not true. GWS and Gold Coast will not see a father son for years, you can't make up a rule that suits a bunch of older clubs and tie it to a romance angle of son playing for the same club as father. I'm arguing against this rule in spite of my club benefiting recently via Ashcroft, Fletcher as I know this is an unfair rule. St.Kilda haven't seen a good father son in decades while Western Bulldogs keep raking it in. Nick Daicos should be playing for a bottom club like North Melbourne, helping them rebuild. Father Son works totally against this just like you're complaining in a one-eyed way against all the academy players that you've posted.

If you are planning to remove academy and make the round 1 pure, you need to remove Father Son too. Don't give me the excuse of what a travesty would be for some son to not play at his 300-game father's club. If he's desperate to come back, he can ask for a trade. Not a father-son example but Horne-Francis left after 1 year and went exactly where he wanted to go. It happens every single year and I cannot believe people are whining against making first round pure.

 

[Buget]

"Father-son is the same for everyone." this is just not true. GWS and Gold Coast will not see a father son for years, you can't make up a rule that suits a bunch of older clubs and tie it to a romance angle of son playing for the same club as father. I'm arguing against this rule in spite of my club benefiting recently via Ashcroft, Fletcher as I know this is an unfair rule. St.Kilda haven't seen a good father son in years while Western Bulldogs keep raking it in. Nick Daicos should be playing for a bottom club like North Melbourne, helping them rebuild. Father Son works totally against this just like you're complaining in a one-eyed way against all the academy players that you've posted.

If you are planning to remove academy and make the round 1 pure, you need to remove Father Son too. Don't give me the excuse of what a travesty would be for some son to not play at his 300-game father's club. If he's desperate to come back, he can ask for a trade. Not a father-son example but Horne-Francis left after 1 year and went exactly where he wanted to go. It happens every single year and I cannot believe people are whining against making first round pure.

I 100% agree with you. On the “father” level, what is more important to them? The fact their son gets drafted? Or the fact they are playing for their club?

I like the romance of father-son, but it is rule from a semi-professional league. The afl has evolved and it cant be consistently applied. Hence academies, which are even either.

(Side note, JHF added Francis part of his name just prior to his draft. His step father Fabian Francis, played over 100 games for Port Adelaide from 95 to 01, but it was a mixture of SANFL games pre-Port entering and AFL games so didn’t qualified for FS under the SANFL or AFL provisions.

JHF would have been an interesting test case for the AFL if Flash qualified for FS)

 

[mpal6]

I 100% agree with you. On the “father” level, what is more important to them? The fact their son gets drafted? Or the fact they are playing for their club?

I like the romance of father-son, but it is rule from a semi-professional league. The afl has evolved and it can be consistently applied. Hence academies, which are even either.

(Side note, JHF added Francis part of his name just prior to his draft. His step father Fabian Francis, played over 100 games for Port Adelaide from 95 to 01, but it was a mixture of SANFL games pre-Port entering and AFL games so didn’t qualified for FS under the SANFL or AFL provisions.

JHF would have been an interesting test case for the AFL if Flash qualified for FS)

Exactly, I've argued this on multiple tangents previously. Hawks having first dibs on all 4 Hodge kids is crazy to be honest. That's a classic case of draft compromise because of a rule which was created for convenience in the first place to get Barrassi to Melbourne.

What if the player turns out to be a philanderer and has nearly 20-25 kids. Just because of this rule is one club going to get first dibs on all those 25 kids? What if all 25 are first rounders, nah nah it's father son rule, holier than thou, we can't touch it, it is what it is. How ridiculous does that sound.

I just wish that philanderer player was from GWS or GC, I can see all the rose blinkered glasses coming off quickly from father son supporters and everyone wanting to discuss about this "ridiculous father son rule".

 

[Buget]

Exactly, I've argued this on multiple tangents previously. Hawks having first dibs on all 4 Hodge kids is crazy to be honest. That's a classic case of draft compromise because of a rule which was created for convenience in the first place to get Barrassi to Melbourne.

What if the player turns out to be a philanderer and has nearly 20-25 kids. Just because of this rule is one club going to get first dibs on all those 25 kids? What if all 25 are first rounders, nah nah it's father son rule, holier than thou, we can't touch it, it is what it is. How ridiculous does that sound.

I just wish that philanderer player was from GWS or GC, I can see all the rose blinkered glasses coming off quickly from father son supporters and everyone wanting to discuss about this "ridiculous father son rule".

Would the AFL have stopped if Daicos ended up at GC? No, Essendon is still a football club after Daniher departed on Free Agency, Hawthorn even traded Kennedy to Sydney.

Daicos going in an open draft would actually make for some interesting media coverage every time he came out of contract.

Father-Son only matters to the fans. And the club that lucks in and benefits for the inconsistent rule.

 

[My_Username]

The AFL did go on to fix the heck up that led to JUH being eligible
The same needs to be done to the Northern academies (so first round picks can't be matched)

I don't have a problem with 1st round picks being matched.

It's just that they (and all such bids) should require a pick less than 1 round of the bid to match it.

So if the bid is pick 10, the first pick used to match should need to be <28 (adjusted if there are extra picks in there for whatever reason).

With live trades, this should be more than doable.

 

[go_the_dockers]

Father-son is the same for everyone. Only a few teams have statewide academies. Heeney, Mills, Walter, Read, Rogers, all for pennies on the dollar.

Seriously, how can you be so stupid to say it is equal.

It clearly advantages the sides that have been in the comp for longer.

 

[liz]

Would the AFL have stopped if Daicos ended up at GC? No, Essendon is still a football club after Daniher departed on Free Agency, Hawthorn even traded Kennedy to Sydney.

Gary Ablett jr, two Shaw brother, a couple of Clokes, Lachie Hunter, Ayce Cordy, Tom Mitchell, Sean Dempster...there are probably more.

The reasons for them leaving their original club were varied. Some were nudged out, some left for playing opportunity, some for money, some for a change of environment or a new challenge. But all prioritised their careers over the romance of their fathers' clubs. And that's perfectly fine.

And then there are the likes of Marc Murphy, Josh Dunkley, Nick Blakey who had the opportunity to stay in their home state and preferred that over the romance of playing for their fathers' clubs.

 

[liz]

Seriously, how can you be so stupid to say it is equal.

It clearly advantages the sides that have been in the comp for longer.

It does advantage sides that have been around for longer (and probably those that have been more successful for longer) but the biggest issue that that even amongst clubs that have been around for a long time, the tangible outcome has been different even if theoretically the access is equal.

Clearly the benefits to Collingwood and the Western Bulldogs have been far greater in recent seasons than those that have fallen in the lap of any other club.

However, if the AFL can fix the bid matching system to bring the price paid closer to the value of the player acquired, it's not such an issue.

 

[go_the_dockers]

It does advantage sides that have been around for longer (and probably those that have been more successful for longer) but the biggest issue that that even amongst clubs that have been around for a long time, the tangible outcome has been different even if theoretically the access is equal.

Clearly the benefits to Collingwood and the Western Bulldogs have been far greater in recent seasons than those that have fallen in the lap of any other club.

However, if the AFL can fix the bid matching system to bring the price paid closer to the value of the player acquired, it's not such an issue.

1. It compromises the draft. Especially first round.

2. Sa and wa clubs don't get the advantages

 

[eggtardo]

Seriously, how can you be so stupid to say it is equal.

It clearly advantages the sides that have been in the comp for longer.

It isnt equal, you are correct but so what? This is the reality of entering a comp where there are existing teams.
New clubs (mainly the most recent) get handed a mass of draft pics in the early years - was that fair? no but the unfair nature of it was necessary. Lots of things are not equal in AFL and life.

 

[go_the_dockers]

It isnt equal, you are correct but so what? This is the reality of entering a comp where there are existing teams.
New clubs (mainly the most recent) get handed a mass of draft pics in the early years - was that fair? no but the unfair nature of it was necessary. Lots of things are not equal in AFL and life.

Agree, this is why Vic clubs have won 15 flags in 17 years.

 

[Heeney2Franklin]

It isnt equal, you are correct but so what? This is the reality of entering a comp where there are existing teams.
New clubs (mainly the most recent) get handed a mass of draft pics in the early years - was that fair? no but the unfair nature of it was necessary. Lots of things are not equal in AFL and life.

Think a little and you will realise why all the teams agreed to those draft concessions in the first place.

(Aka a large majority of them would be leaving within 5 years)

 

[mpal6]

It isnt equal, you are correct but so what? This is the reality of entering a comp where there are existing teams.
New clubs (mainly the most recent) get handed a mass of draft pics in the early years - was that fair? no but the unfair nature of it was necessary. Lots of things are not equal in AFL and life.

Exactly, then why all the whining against Academies. It's one of those inequalities which doesn't work for Vic clubs, as you said there is lot of things not equal in AFL and life. Move on then.