Recruiting AFL Trade & Free Agency X - Club has elected not to fill list spot - Davey returning from injury?

[Lore]

Quick links: Player Contract Status | Draft Watch 2022 | JHA Father/Son and NGA | Adrian Dodoro

Spoiler: LIVE DRAFT ORDER (2022 Draft Order)

Spoiler: FUTURE PICK TRACKER (2023 Draft Order)

 

[Nuggs Bunny]

The finals that Carlton missed the past two years and we made last year?

Do you think our future is brighter than Carlton's over the next three years?

 

[eth-dog]

Given I can’t remember when they got good that doesn’t help much!

2019 was their first year with big results but it's hard because it's also the year Berry, Hipwood etc all became a lot better as well

 

[Zach Package]

What would our approach have been to Blake? We can't offer him the chance at playing finals that Carlton can but moreover we can't even give him an explanation of what role he'd be playing in the team next year. We're non-starters in any FA discussion until we sort out the coaching situation.

It is certainly a hard sell but we’re not even putting a hat in the ring, it’s galling.

You cannot, with a straight face, look at a big midfielder who can mark and use the footy, run like the clappers and is a repeat sprint animal and say anything other than ‘this is the exact exemplar of what we need and what we should be looking for’.

 

[Atavistic]

Do you think our future is brighter than Carlton's over the next three years?

IDK. Did you think after last year Collingwood were going to make a prelim this year?

 

[Ants]

We also don’t need Acres. With Martin, Durham and Langford, potentially Perkins and even the Daveys. The wing is our strongest position.

I’d caveat this to say it will be our strongest position. I’d also add Cox to that group.

I’m a little surprised Melbourne isn’t interested as part of the Jackson deal. They could also use Lobb.

 

[eth-dog]

It is certainly a hard sell but we’re not even putting a hat in the ring, it’s galling.

You cannot, with a straight face, look at a big midfielder who can mark and use the footy, run like the clappers and is a repeat sprint animal and say anything other than ‘this is the exact exemplar of what we need and what we should be looking for’.

How do you know this is the case?

Just because the media isn't reporting it doesn't mean we haven't tried.

 

[Duckworth]

I suspect the coaches couldn't give 2 shits about the votes so they check the stat sheet and base voting on that.

I don't think so.

 

[Atavistic]

How do you know this is the case?

Just because the media isn't reporting it doesn't mean we haven't tried.

The media are too busy penning the next few "Essendon is a shambles" articles to bother thinking about us getting better in some way.

 

[katana]

How do you know this is the case?

Just because the media isn't reporting it doesn't mean we haven't tried.

so your logic is, even though there is no reason to suggest we made any effort to pursue that player, maybe we did and kept it totally silent (unlike every other trade/FA/etc. that we're involved in) so we can't be critical?

 

[eth-dog]

so your logic is, even though there is no reason to suggest we made any effort to pursue that player, maybe we did and kept it totally silent (unlike every other trade/FA/etc. that we're involved in) so we can't be critical?

What I'm saying is that sometimes teams go after a player, they say they aren't interested and it never actually gets to the media.

 

[katana]

What I'm saying is that sometimes teams go after a player, they say they aren't interested and it never actually gets to the media.

sure. that probably happens. doesn't mean that criticising our list management due to not getting ourselves involved with an ideal player type is invalid criticism? when there is no evidence to suggest we did, then, well, that's all we've got to go on. i feel a club in our position would want fans to feel that management is sounding out many possible targets, and would make little effort to keep that under-wraps.

 

[eth-dog]

sure. that probably happens. doesn't mean that criticising our list management due to not getting ourselves involved with an ideal player type is invalid criticism? when there is no evidence to suggest we did, then, well, that's all we've got to go on. i feel a club in our position would want fans to feel that management is sounding out many possible targets, and would make little effort to keep that under-wraps.

It definitely happens. And the whole Acres stuff came out in June. Knowing what Dodoro is like, he would have made enquiries straight away.

As far as Acres go, he pretty much plays the position we don't need at all. Like we have Durham, Langford and Martin as three hard working wings.

 

[katana]

Knowing what Dodoro is like, he would have made enquiries straight away.

i guess you and i differ here.

 

[ant555]

i guess you and i differ here.

Then I think you would be wrong.

 

[Ants]

That is easy. Personally I have never said he was a bad player or not in our best 3. So going on that you if you are in the best 3 players then you are likely to be in the coaches votes. Would be interesting to see the opposition coach break down. I have explained the rest. At the end of the day you do not want good players as your best. Yes he had a great season last year but nothing he does is totally replaceable. Shiel was just as effective mid season this year when Parish was out and Darcy was well down on what he did last year.
It is about upgrading spots. Top end as well as bottom end. He was rated the = 7th best midfielder in 2021 by the AA selectors.

I’m all for upgrading players where possible. What I don’t understand is why we’d start with Parish? He’s not the oldest in the midfield. He’s top quality. Surely you start with either someone who is weaker (Caldwell, Hobbs, Perkins) or older (Shiel, Merrett).

 

[katana]

Then I think you would be wrong.

so dodoro sounded out acres huh? is that what you're saying?

 

[eth-dog]

i guess you and i differ here.

Whatever you think about Dodoro as a List Manager, there is absolutely one thing you can say about him, and that's the fact that he's constantly checking on players and seeing whether or not they can come here. He's a salesman and I have little doubt that he would have enquired and Acres would have said no quickly.

 

[Ants]

Need to break down the realities and the likelihoods before speculating too far ahead....

We currently have 5 snr list spots following smith, hurley, tippa retirements and cutler, mcdonagh delistings (hird was cat b rookie, not counted in list numbers).

Forgive me if I'm wrong but currently durham, baldwin, Martin, voss, wanganeen, d'ambrosio, waterman and menzie are all currently on the rookie list. (mcbride too as a cat B, not counted in numbers).

In all likelihood rookie list needs to be trimmed by 4 to create 2 spots, this gives a pick to use in the rookie draft and a spot to fill in the supplementary period over summer. So upgrade durham, Martin and d'ambrosio to the snr list. Waterman or menzie to be delisted depending on who we attract in the trade period.

Think we trade or delist francis and ham. Picks in the 50's to 60's are the best we'll do there. Think we delist one of brand or eyre. Takes us back to 5 snr list spots.

In all likelihood we match a bid for davey in the mid teen's. Means we need to maximise pick 22 in a pick trade as I am unable to see anyone out there who would be willing to join us whose value equates to that pick.

As such I think we swap 22 for a couple of later picks in and 40's and 50's and a 2nd rounder next year. Melbourne or geelong (or ideally gold coast who are likely to be in the bottom half of the ladder) come to mind. We'd use our pick 40 and the 2 x pick aquires this year to match for davey.

I'd do a late pick for setterfield. Probably leaving stocker alone. Would consider Howe from Hawthorn as a delisted free agent, he could fill a defensive role in the midfield.

As far a speculation goes unless we're getting a pick in the top 6-7 picks I'm keeping parish even if he wants to leave. Bryan I am keeping as well, unless saints are willing to cough up their 1st round pick with something going back. Ain't gonna happen.

On draft night I am taking Sheezal or cadman if they're available. Otherwise best available. Matching davey in the mid teens. Matching his twin and munkara later on. If we can live trade our future 2nd picks (ours and pick acquired from trading out 22) for something in the mid the late teens I'd do it, otherwise keep them in hand for next year.

This is incorrect. Mass and Menzie (who I’d definitely be keeping) take two of those 5 spots. So we’ve got two less list spots free than you think.

Since I don’t think we can risk J Davey being bid on in the ND, those three spots are pick #5 and Davey x2.

If either Munkara or Foley aren’t picked in the ND we can add one as a Cat B.

Therefore, any traded/DFA players in or late picks/SSP picks need to be matched by further delistings or trades. Francis, Hams and Waterman are long odds to stay. Heppell is a wild card.

I think we definitely need one late pick (preferably small defender depth). so, in summary I think we’ll have only space for 1, maybe 2, traded/recycled players and only one or none rookie or SSP picks.

 

[ant555]

so dodoro sounded out acres huh? is that what you're saying?

I am saying that clubs ask questions of player managers without it getting into the media. I know for a fact that probably 80% of inquiries go nowhere but it happens. You can not simply state we where not interested.

 

[Nifft]

I am saying that clubs ask questions of player managers without it getting into the media. I know for a fact that probably 80% of inquiries go nowhere but it happens. You can not simply state we where not interested.

I imagine the stuff that gets leaked is when it's a manager or a club trying to get some sort of advantage, by pushing a contract price up or down.

 

[BrunoV]

It is certainly a hard sell but we’re not even putting a hat in the ring, it’s galling.

You cannot, with a straight face, look at a big midfielder who can mark and use the footy, run like the clappers and is a repeat sprint animal and say anything other than ‘this is the exact exemplar of what we need and what we should be looking for’.

Except if you're our list manager.

 

[Zach Package]

Just because the media isn't reporting it doesn't mean we haven't tried.

We leak like a sieve, that’s why, if we want someone it gets out, almost immediately, at speed, like a strong fart.

 

[eth-dog]

We leak like a sieve, that’s why, if we want someone it gets out, almost immediately, at speed, like a strong fart.

If that were actually true we'd hear about us sounding out 50 players every year.

 

[andleanback]

I am saying that clubs ask questions of player managers without it getting into the media. I know for a fact that probably 80% of inquiries go nowhere but it happens. You can not simply state we where not interested.

People are naive to think list managers don’t ask the question of ANY player coming out of contract that is of any value. Can be as quick as a 5 minute phone when they find out it’s already a done deal somewhere else or that phone call may turn into something. Reporters only really go with info when the list managers are putting contract numbers in front of player agents, that’s when the leaks start to come as word gets around the competition club x is offering player y etc etc.

 

[ant555]

I imagine the stuff that gets leaked is when it's a manager or a club trying to get some sort of advantage, by pushing a contract price up or down.

Or putting pressure on the club he is at.
When you here the media say he is gettable that usually comes from opposition clubs.