Recruiting AFL Trade & Free Agency X - Club has elected not to fill list spot - Davey returning from injury?

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foj1 said:
Many posters here think of the 1 or 2 good games rather than the 12 ordinary ones
the difference with wright is he is bigger, was playing in a losing side , is a great kick and could second ruck as well
weideman can do none of those things consistently and was in an elite side
many essendon supporters and the list manager settles for off cuts rather than try and develop their own bulls
ps pat voss is another player of similar dimensions to weideman
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Fair point.

To really put things in perspective, Weidemans highest tally of goals in a season for a key forward is.. 19.

Weidemans last game for the Dees was against Freo this year and in 77% game time his full time stats read as 1 mark, 1 kick and 1 goal.

Weideman should only play if there's injury to Wright and Harrison Jones who are of high talent.
 
In all reality, how many 3rd rounders become serviceable league players?

We lose nothing getting Setterfield and Weideman. At best the change of scenery, role, gameplan (when we get one) will see them in the 22, at worst they provide reasonable depth.
 

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Foxx said:
Wright and Jones the mobile talls.
Weidmann i think is big enough to slot into the mix as the deep big power forward.
We don't have another experienced body on the list who can play that role. Maybe Baldwin.
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Sorry but there’s nothing powerful about him and he loses confidence when he drops a mark. He’s played his best footy as a leading CHF
 
Tulip said:
He’s a capable forward but he’s never shown the required desire for more than a game at a time. He’s been building his frame for 7 years but a stiff breeze knocks him over. There’s a Leigh Brown style spot for him, he was a promising ruck at Casey after Daw retired, I hope he makes it work.
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I don't get why you would trade him though. Surely you need him as backup for Ben Brown or McDonald. Or do you have someone else?
 
TheGrizz said:
I would rather give Baldwin 18 games next year as the 3rd key forward.

My greater issue is that Scott said when he came in that he wasn't looking to bring in experienced players to fill holes, yet targeting Setterfield and Weideman.

He had a tendency to underplay kids at Norf, I hope this isn't repeating.
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I don’t think that’s what he said, I thought it was “short term” stop gaps that were not his preference? Not that I can find an article about it now, will have to see if I wrote it in the cliffs of an interview somewhere.

He also said that list management plans have been in progress and clubs talking to each other long before trade period actually starts, which he was appointed the night before the free agency period opened and three days before trade period including the weekend so obviously a bit late to change much.

He also specifically said it depended on the trade period but that we’d probably be the youngest list in the comp — so he wasn’t ruling out older players who might raise our average list age. With the retirements and delistings announced so far we’re at 24.2 years and second youngest, not accounting for further delistings or trades:
6B21CCB4-33D9-488C-BE38-281FAA7D021E.jpeg

I read it as 24 yo Wright/ 20yo Caldwell style trade is good, 29yo Ben Brown not so much.

James Harmes is 27 too… probably right on the top edge of what we’d be okay with if they tick every other box.
 
TheGrizz said:
I would rather give Baldwin 18 games next year as the 3rd key forward.

My greater issue is that Scott said when he came in that he wasn't looking to bring in experienced players to fill holes, yet targeting Setterfield and Weideman.

He had a tendency to underplay kids at Norf, I hope this isn't repeating.
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The exact type of moves that have us finish 13th instead of bottom 2 but don't set us to improve significantly long term.
 
Atavistic said:
I don't get why you would trade him though. Surely you need him as backup for Ben Brown or McDonald. Or do you have someone else?
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They have a two ruck set up and are bringing Grundy in to replace Jackson. They’re also in a position where upgrading their depth is something they can do given their first 18 is already pretty solid…
 
Weideman and Wright aren't that similar imo.

Wright kicked 27 goals and 31 goals in his second and third seasons respectively. That's (somewhat) impressive for a young key forward in a terrible team like the Suns. He definitely stagnated after that, though clearly wasn't a Stewy Dew favourite, luckily for us.

Meanwhile, Weideman is 25 and has never kicked 20 goals in a season. Bruno's point about the Dees method of going forward being difficult for key forwards is a fair one. But that he still can't keep his spot despite getting some chances, when Tom McDonald was out with injury for so long and they're having to play the corpse of Ben Brown is reflective of what he is.

Setterfield and Weideman make some sense for us (though not a lot), but it really does feel like this is just some slight Dodoro nonsense.

This really should be his swan song.
 
foj1 said:
How do you know if Eyre, brand, mcbride, bryan or Voss are ready unless you TRY THEM
Melbourne tried weideman on many occasions and on most occasions he was not up to it with a lot of footy going inside 50
i hope I am wrong and I sound like a cranky negative bugger which I can be but when will we work out that other Teams off cuts are usually off cuts for a reason? Our coach said we would be the youngest list in the league yet we look to bring in two hack 25 year olds
i would rather throw a round 2 and 3 at Richmond for Jack graham
he would add infinitely more to our side and would honestly be in our top 3 leaders
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Does Jack Graham actually want to play for us? If he did im sure we'd get the trade done.

Eyre, Brand, McBride, Baldwin, Reid, Cox and Voss will all be given oppurtunity if form in the VFL permits. Or if they have a have a pre season that demands a round 1 spot. Weideman would be in this boat too as will Harry Jones to an extent.
Everyone gets a clean slate with a new coach.

Setterfield and Weideman would not be guaranteed best 22. They will be traded in for late picks and if they happen to find their feet and play good footy they are young enough to have long careers still.

At worst Setterfield plays centre in the VFL and having a proper midfield at that level helps our young talls develop.

Weideman can play ruck effectively so maybe that allows us to give Bryan some good minutes forward at VFL as we know he can ruck already.

Its hard to see it as a negative in my opinion.
 
TheFrenchCut said:
Weideman and Wright aren't that similar imo.

Wright kicked 27 goals and 31 goals in his second and third seasons respectively. That's (somewhat) impressive for a young key forward in a terrible team like the Suns. He definitely stagnated after that, though clearly wasn't a Stewy Dew favourite, luckily for us.

Meanwhile, Weideman is 25 and has never kicked 20 goals in a season. Bruno's point about the Dees method of going forward being difficult for key forwards is a fair one. But that he still can't keep his spot despite getting some chances, when Tom McDonald was out with injury for so long and they're having to play the corpse of Ben Brown is reflective of what he is.

Setterfield and Weideman make some sense for us (though not a lot), but it really does feel like this is just some slight Dodoro nonsense.

This really should be his swan song.
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The main similarity is that they’re both former top picks that become a moneyball option for us

I think he’s more similar to Jones really. Tall and weedy and more of a lead up player.
 

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Atavistic said:
I don't get why you would trade him though. Surely you need him as backup for Ben Brown or McDonald. Or do you have someone else?
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Van Rooyen will probably be given first crack next year. Brown probably plays Casey.
 
TheGrizz said:
I would rather give Baldwin 18 games next year as the 3rd key forward.

My greater issue is that Scott said when he came in that he wasn't looking to bring in experienced players to fill holes, yet targeting Setterfield and Weideman.

He had a tendency to underplay kids at Norf, I hope this isn't repeating.
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Setterfield and Weideman are 24 and 25 respectively with 57 and 59 games under their belt, hardly experienced. Baldwin is simply not ready for AFL nor are the likes of Eyre, Brand or Reid (the latter two should be developed as defenders anyway). They are no brainer trades to be honest and you want healthy competition for spots in the team (rather than gifting games like we did this year to Baldwin as an example). I'd back th club to play whoever is most deserving for a spot come end of pre season.
 
inb4 Weideman Coleman
 
Yoda_ said:
Isn't Weidemann just Peter Wright from Wishh?
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We originally bargained on Wright being the tall that can chop out the ruck, now that he’s proven to be far too crucial and valuable for that we still need that live body we can chuck in as the back up should we elect to go with 1 ruck.

Now that Wright has gone from cannon fodder to the centrepiece of our attack, it necessitated going out and getting more cannon fodder. I personally would have gone after Esava but here we are.


Would expect it to be a modest 1 or 2 year deal. Wouldn’t be at all surprised if we experiment with ruck and defence a bit here as well.
 
If we are able to bring in Setterfield and Weideman for cheap then it’s good business. At the very least they create some selection pressure and much needed depth.

Pick 22 still worries me with regard to Davey, I wonder if GWS would be open to trading 12 or 15 for 22 plus a future second if there’s someone on the board were keen on and worried about a bid. Probably keep it up our sleeve for draft night
 
Pweter said:
In all reality, how many 3rd rounders become serviceable league players?

We lose nothing getting Setterfield and Weideman. At best the change of scenery, role, gameplan (when we get one) will see them in the 22, at worst they provide reasonable depth.
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I really don't like this line of thinking - there absolutely is a cost with many late round picks becoming serviceable players. Its not to say that taking a punt on Setterfield or Weidman isn't worth it but there is a real cost.

2016: 8/12 (67%) played 10+ games
2017: 12/18 (67%) played 10+ games
2018: 7/12 (58%) played 10+ games
2019: 4/10 (40%) played 10+ games
2020: 5/9 (56%) played 10+ games
2021: 1/13 (8%) played 10+ games

Just looking at players who have played 10+ games in the last five drafts
2021: Marcus Windhager (17)
Other noteable picks after R4: Jai Serong, Jase Burgoyne, Greg Clark
2020: Beau McCreery (35), Brandon Walker (20), Maurice Rioli (17), Thomas Highmore (13), Tyler Brockman (11)
Other noteable picks after R4: Luke Edwards, Isiah Winder
2019: Ryan Byrnes (28), Jake Riccardi, (24), Trent Bianco (22), Hugo Ralphsmith (19)
Other noteable picks after R4: Michael Frederick, Trey Ruscoe, Josh Morris, Jy Farrar,
2018: Nick Hind (58), Justin McInenry (50), Noah Answerth (48), Bailey Scott (46), Jacob Koschitzke (36), Curtis Taylor (30), Matt Parker (30)
Other noteable picks after R4: Lachie Schultz, Connor Idun, Brayden Ham, Lachy Scholl, Caleb Graham, Toby Bedford, Darcy Fort, Marty Hore, Boyd Woodcock, Will Hayes, Atu Bosenavulagi, Brett Bewley
2017: James Worpel (79), Charlie Ballard (72), Ben Paton (55), Jack Petruccelle (54), Nathan Murphy (33), Kane Farrell (33), Tyler Brown (27), Jack Payne (23), Oscar Baker (15), Hugh Dixon (11), Brayden Crossley (10)
Other noteable picks after R4: Gryan Miers, Sam Switkowski, Dylan Moore, Matt Guelfi, Zac Langdon, Tristan Xerri, Meek, BZT
2016: Jack Graham (97), Mitch Hannan (61), Esava Ratugolea (59), Darcy Cameron (53), Junior Rioli (51), Lewis Young (43), Elliott Himmelberg (36), Myles Poholke (16)
Other noteable picks after R4: Luke Ryan, Nick Larkey, Mitch Lewis, Jake Waterman, Josh Daicos, Matt de Boer, Quinton Narkle, Tom Williamson, Cameron Polson, Dylan Clarke


Although it probably doesn't help that Dodoro and the team haven't hit on the third round+ much

  • In the last four years Brayden Ham is the highlight
  • In the last seven years Matt Guelfi is the highlight


2021: Alastair Lord, Garrett McDonagh
2020: No pick, R4 Cody Brand
2019: No pick, R4 Ned Cahill, R5 Lachlan Johnson
2018: No pick, R4 Noah Gown, R5 Brayden Ham
2017: Jordan Houlahan, R4 BZT, R5 Guelfi
2016: Kobe Mutch, R4 Dylan Clarke
2015: Mitch Brown, R5 Yestin Eades, R6, Michael Hartley
2014: No pick, R4 Connor McKenna
2013: Orazio Fantasia, R4 Lauchlan Dalgleish
2012: Marty Gleeson, Dylan Van Unen, R4 Nick Kommer, R5 Sean Gregory
 
JDavey said:
I really don't like this line of thinking - there absolutely is a cost with many late round picks becoming serviceable players. Its not to say that taking a punt on Setterfield or Weidman isn't worth it but there is a real cost.

2016: 8/12 (67%) played 10+ games
2017: 12/18 (67%) played 10+ games
2018: 7/12 (58%) played 10+ games
2019: 4/10 (40%) played 10+ games
2020: 5/9 (56%) played 10+ games
2021: 1/13 (8%) played 10+ games

Just looking at players who have played 10+ games in the last five drafts
2021: Marcus Windhager (17)
Other noteable picks after R4: Jai Serong, Jase Burgoyne, Greg Clark
2020: Beau McCreery (35), Brandon Walker (20), Maurice Rioli (17), Thomas Highmore (13), Tyler Brockman (11)
Other noteable picks after R4: Luke Edwards, Isiah Winder
2019: Ryan Byrnes (28), Jake Riccardi, (24), Trent Bianco (22), Hugo Ralphsmith (19)
Other noteable picks after R4: Michael Frederick, Trey Ruscoe, Josh Morris, Jy Farrar,
2018: Nick Hind (58), Justin McInenry (50), Noah Answerth (48), Bailey Scott (46), Jacob Koschitzke (36), Curtis Taylor (30), Matt Parker (30)
Other noteable picks after R4: Lachie Schultz, Connor Idun, Brayden Ham, Lachy Scholl, Caleb Graham, Toby Bedford, Darcy Fort, Marty Hore, Boyd Woodcock, Will Hayes, Atu Bosenavulagi, Brett Bewley
2017: James Worpel (79), Charlie Ballard (72), Ben Paton (55), Jack Petruccelle (54), Nathan Murphy (33), Kane Farrell (33), Tyler Brown (27), Jack Payne (23), Oscar Baker (15), Hugh Dixon (11), Brayden Crossley (10)
Other noteable picks after R4: Gryan Miers, Sam Switkowski, Dylan Moore, Matt Guelfi, Zac Langdon, Tristan Xerri, Meek, BZT
2016: Jack Graham (97), Mitch Hannan (61), Esava Ratugolea (59), Darcy Cameron (53), Junior Rioli (51), Lewis Young (43), Elliott Himmelberg (36), Myles Poholke (16)
Other noteable picks after R4: Luke Ryan, Nick Larkey, Mitch Lewis, Jake Waterman, Josh Daicos, Matt de Boer, Quinton Narkle, Tom Williamson, Cameron Polson, Dylan Clarke


Although it probably doesn't help that Dodoro and the team haven't hit on the third round+ much

  • In the last four years Brayden Ham is the highlight
  • In the last seven years Matt Guelfi is the highlight


2021: Alastair Lord, Garrett McDonagh
2020: No pick, R4 Cody Brand
2019: No pick, R4 Ned Cahill, R5 Lachlan Johnson
2018: No pick, R4 Noah Gown, R5 Brayden Ham
2017: Jordan Houlahan, R4 BZT, R5 Guelfi
2016: Kobe Mutch, R4 Dylan Clarke
2015: Mitch Brown, R5 Yestin Eades, R6, Michael Hartley
2014: No pick, R4 Connor McKenna
2013: Orazio Fantasia, R4 Lauchlan Dalgleish
2012: Marty Gleeson, Dylan Van Unen, R4 Nick Kommer, R5 Sean Gregory
Click to expand...

Those names tell me it’s absolutely worth it tbh
 
I'm not thrilled by the Weid pick-up but I can understand it to an extent. Our KPF grouping next year would be: Wright, Jones, Baldwin, Weideman, Stewart, Voss. Depending on forward structure, the in-form 2 or 3 of that group play AFL. Good selection pressure in a space where we've recently had very little (with makeshift forward lines in the VFL). Weid has the "bonus" in that he's shown aptitude as a relief ruck at VFL level, so could play that role in the firsts if form warrants his selection.

My preference would have been to either hold the pick or bundle it with our F3 to try and turn it into a second rounder (maybe with someone like GCS who are trying to build up a bid-match war chest in 2023). But all told this isn't the worst way to burn the pick.

It all but confirms that Ham and Waterman are gone (in terms of maintaining open list spots). May put a cloud over one of Brand and Eyre (who I had presumed would both be re-signed) as well.
 
nipst@r said:
I just don't understand the bowes and GC approach. They could split 7 and still rid themselves of bowes contract.

But we move on. In terms of our cap space I'd rather spend money on Haynes + a pick then setterfield or look at Georgiadis, tom green and offer overs and a long term contract.
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1 name Craig Cameron. How he has a job is unbelievable. People would take on that contract for pick 20, giving up pick 7 is so dumb.
 
JDavey said:
2021: Alastair Lord, Garrett McDonagh
2020: No pick, R4 Cody Brand
2019: No pick, R4 Ned Cahill, R5 Lachlan Johnson
2018: No pick, R4 Noah Gown, R5 Brayden Ham
2017: Jordan Houlahan, R4 BZT, R5 Guelfi
2016: Kobe Mutch, R4 Dylan Clarke
2015: Mitch Brown, R5 Yestin Eades, R6, Michael Hartley
2014: No pick, R4 Connor McKenna
2013: Orazio Fantasia, R4 Lauchlan Dalgleish
2012: Marty Gleeson, Dylan Van Unen, R4 Nick Kommer, R5 Sean Gregory
Click to expand...
Wow.

So many names I had such high hopes for.
 
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