Europe Backdrop to the war in Ukraine

[Gethelred]

This is the thread for the geopolitics, history and framework around the Russia-Ukraine conflict. If you want to discuss the events of the war, head over to this thread:

Europe - War in Ukraine - Thread 4 - thread rules updated

This is the thread for discussing the War in Ukraine. Should you want to discuss the geopolitics, the history, or an interesting tangent, head over here: https://www.bigfooty.com/forum/threads/backdrop-to-the-war-in-ukraine.1302028/ If a post isn't directly concerning the events of the war or...

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[jatz14]

Absolutely not. Why would I do that when it was US/NATO imperialism that provoked this war in the first place??
...and nothing I say mirrors Putin's "nonsense". Putin would have me arrested immediately should I go to the Russia. The only thing that Putin says which is true, is that there are neo-Nazis holding key positions in the Zelensky regime and in the Ukrainian military.

However, Putin's claim that he is aiming to "de-Nazify" Ukraine is a total lie. There are plenty of Nazis in Russia, and he does not arrest them. Putin invaded Ukraine for one purpose only: to defend the interests of significant sections of the Russian capitalist class, which are fearful that the US/NATO will depose them and substitute instead other sections of the Russian capitalist class willing to be US/NATO puppets


I'm getting tired of your claims that Putin is a "fascist" carrying out "genocide"" (genocide implies the deliberate attempt to annihilate a population based on ethnicity or cultural beliefs. Putin is simply not doing that in Ukraine) , and your other claim that the UKrainian government is leading a crusade for "national freedom and democracy".

You speak for yourself and your fellow pro-Zelensky posters.

I speak for those who don't agree with you, and I will feel free to continue to post on this thread to counteract the propaganda that you post, and offer an alternative analysis of how this war developed.

It's amazing how you have turned Ukraine seeking protection from Russian imperialism into proof of Western imperialism.

Yet again illustrating an adoption of the Vatniks imperialism definition. Anything they do is imperialism, anything we do, is not.

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[IlovethePies]

It's amazing how you have turned Ukraine seeking protection from Russian imperialism into proof of Western imperialism.

Yet again illustrating an adoption of the Vatniks imperialism definition. Anything they do is imperialism, anything we do, is not.

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Huh?? You still don't understand the meaning of imperialism. Someone here (was it you?) quoted some dictionary definition, and thought that proved the point

 

[IlovethePies]

Russian military losses in WW2 were double Germanies, who were fighting a 2 front war, and in Africa, Greece, and Italy.

It was absolutely meatwave tactics, built on an utter disregard for human life.

Nothing's changed it seems.

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How can you post such rubbish, and think it is OK??

The population of the Soviet Union were fighting for their survival.

The program of Hitler was to annihilate the "Slavic untermenschen" (as well as the Jewish population)

The Soviet working class understood this. They also understood that everything they had fought for in the Russian Revolution was at stake.

So, in spite of Stalin (not because of Stalin), they sacrificed their lives, - in their millions - to halt the Nazi juggernaut.

Your version is disgusting...it is a grotesque distortion of what actually happened in the war of the Soviet Union against Nazi Germany.

 

[Chief]

How can you post such rubbish, and think it is OK??

The population of the Soviet Union were fighting for their survival.

The program of Hitler was to annihilate the "Slavic untermenschen" (as well as the Jewish population)

The Soviet working class understood this. They also understood that everything they had fought for in the Russian Revolution was at stake.

So, in spite of Stalin (not because of Stalin), they sacrificed their lives, - in their millions - to halt the Nazi juggernaut.

Your version is disgusting...it is a grotesque distortion of what actually happened in the war of the Soviet Union against Nazi Germany.

Like the Ukrainians are doing now?

 

[IlovethePies]

Like the Ukrainians are doing now?

Completely wrong.

Putin does not have a program of annihilating the "slavic untermenschen"
His program is to put pressure on US/NATO imperialism to cut a deal which ensures that Ukraine remains neutral, and not a member of NATO.
He bears no resemblance to Hitler in his political role.

The Zelensky government is based on capitalist property relations, and on defending the massive wealth of a thin layer of Ukrainian oligarchs who have cemented their future in alliance with US imperialism.
Since the restoration of capitalism in Ukraine, Ukrainian workers have experienced nothing except relentless destruction of their living standards, and a contraction of economic activity. Ukrainian workers have no interest whatsoever in defending the continued domination of the economy by Ukrainian oligarchs.

Everything in this situation is the opposite of what occurred in the Soviet Union during the Nazi invasion.

 

[Chief]

Putin does not have a program of annihilating the "slavic untermenschen"
His program is to put pressure on US/NATO imperialism to cut a deal which ensures that Ukraine remains neutral, and not a member of NATO.
He bears no resemblance to Hitler in his political role.

Putin's whole "Ukraine doesn't even exist" bit still hasn't registered with you?

 

[jatz14]

How can you post such rubbish, and think it is OK??

The population of the Soviet Union were fighting for their survival.

The program of Hitler was to annihilate the "Slavic untermenschen" (as well as the Jewish population)

The Soviet working class understood this. They also understood that everything they had fought for in the Russian Revolution was at stake.

So, in spite of Stalin (not because of Stalin), they sacrificed their lives, - in their millions - to halt the Nazi juggernaut.

Your version is disgusting...it is a grotesque distortion of what actually happened in the war of the Soviet Union against Nazi Germany.

My version is what actually happened.

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