Bluemour Discussion Thread XVIII - Please Sir, Can We Have More?

[thylacine60]

Koch is an egomaniac. If he feels someone doesn’t buy into his vision they are dead to him

 

[No1Suspect]

tencentpiece was ollie your plan B you preferred over plan A? I think it was you that mentioned something along those lines a few weeks back? Apologese if thats incorrect

 

[thylacine60]

Ollie - 2 first rounders

in trade gymnastics it's called a reverse gibbs..........

 

[smashbox gill]

As long as we can use our next 2 years 1sts to pick up Wines and Martin I will be happy.

Hence my proposal, seems very fair:
Pick 8 + Levi to GC for Martin & Brisbane 1st (GC hold)

Brisbane 1st + 2020 1st for Wines & 2020 Port 2nd

 

[RoyalBlues]

IF

Recently, the film release of “Crouching Crow, Hidden Magpie“ due out in September, was thrown into turmoil- after one third of the cast went out on a wing and “pulled out” (and unfortunately sad news of the main star pulling out is true)

THEN

It opens up the possibility of an opening night function sure to create a ruckus. The event, at the ‘G would then controversially feature rabbit terrine (from AFL House) as well as Victorian grapes in South Aussie wines. You can Bett on that.

 

[HARKER]

tencentpiece was ollie your plan B you preferred over plan A? I think it was you that mentioned something along those lines a few weeks back? Apologese if thats incorrect

Grundy, I'd say and fair enough

 

[Faz 2000]

If we could bring in Wines, Betts, Shai Bolton and Martin then we have all bases covered and good depth.

Would be a dream bounty.

 

[cfc4life]

You're missing the context of those points though - I think just about all of us are happy to have him, but the cost has to be right and we need to make sure we also address other areas of need.

Can't just burn all our high value trade assets on a secondary inside midfielder.

8 + a second, use our future first on Martin and change.
Or 8 + future first and get a second back, use two seconds for Martin, or package them to get a higher pick for Martin.
Or 8 for Martin and 17, then trade 17 + future first for Wines + a third.

Best case scenario in my book:

8 for Martin and 17.
Future first and 17 for Wines and 27. (think PA will prefer a higher pick next year to chase Luko, and GC the immediate impact of Pick 8)
Betts for a token pick/pick swap.
Cameron for a token pick/pick swap.
Take 27, 39 and 44 to the draft for a small forward (Weightman/Taylor), a mid (Dow/Garcia) and a defensive runner (dunno who).

Instant impact from Wines, Martin and Betts.
Cameron as short-term ruck depth while TDK develops further.
3 more kids to keep the development cycle ticking along, a small to succeed Eddie, a mid cause you always need mids, and a defensive runner as insurance for our injury prone ones.

This rates Martin at pick 35, which seems incredibly low.
Then you've got Wines at pick 7, again massive unders considering his contract status and leadership.

Wines is not a secondary inside midfielder.

At this point in time the noise is that Martin is asking for more than Carlton is willing to part with.

We need to take quality where we can get it.

 

[bluemahogany]

Blues open to Betts return

Carlton is open to the prospect of Eddie Betts returning to the club, but they are yet to discuss in detail what it might entail and how a deal might take place while the Crows say he is contracted.

www.theage.com.au

IT'S (maybe) HAPPENING

 

[Funk]

Any chance he was overawed, and is generally reserved by nature?

First question-= No.

Second question - No (he doesn’t suffer from Agoraphobia)

 

[Funk]

He didn't tank his interviews. Not all his family are Essendon supporters; theres a strong Pie contingent, and even a few Blues supporters in there as well.

This is opposite of what I’ve been told by people very, very close to him.

 

[Mezzoculo]

I guess my question is do you recruit old FAs if they make you better but are only ever stop gaps? Luke Hodge has worked out well at Brisbane. Jordan Lewis less so at Melbourne. Was there a point in WC recruiting Sam Mitchell? Was Daniel Cross a shining light in Melbourne's rebuild?

All four of the grizzled veterans you mentioned had an impact on their final clubs, with Lewis arguably the least. Leadership doesn't always have to be in the form of 25 possessions and a goal. Off-field mentoring and development just as important nowadays. Daniel Cross personified this at the dees - gave his all onfield and was an exemplary trainer and teacher of young men off it.

 

[Heres Waite]

IF




THEN

Are you still listening to your 2 out of three ain’t bad album? Including the hit “here comes the sun”.

 

[Blue__Balls]

This rates Martin at pick 35, which seems incredibly low.
Then you've got Wines at pick 7, again massive unders considering his contract status and leadership.

Wines is not a secondary inside midfielder.

At this point in time the noise is that Martin is asking for more than Carlton is willing to part with.

We need to take quality where we can get it.

As I said - "best case scenario in my book".

Martin is out of contract and has never completely delivered on his promise. His real value is likely a pick in the early 20s. I think GC would rather move up the draft than pad out their list with second rounders - upgrading 17 to 8 would represent a significant boost for them, as there will be some handy players on the table inside the top 10.

Wines valued at 7 is fair. He's not a gun mid, he's a solid build-around grunt player. You've also assumed our future second would be pick 11, which is certainly our aim (finals), but I think that's probably worst case scenario for Port, and they're just as likely to be getting a top 10 pick. Furthermore, if they're likely to be trading that future pick anyway (ie. Lukosius) then one or two spots doesn't matter at all.

Wines is absolutely a secondary inside mid to a side with Cripps. Also have Dow developing, Setters coming along nicely, Stocker a likely sort, Kennedy and Cuningham OK as rotations. Like Wines, reckon he'd be a good get, but not so important that we can blow our load on him alone.

The noise from Martin's camp sounds a whole lot like contract inflation tactics from his manager, just doing due diligence and seeing if the price can be driven up at all. I'm quietly confident he'll land with us, but if he doesn't it's even more important we don't burn too much currency on Wines as we'll need to look elsewhere.

I'm down with overpaying a bit, as a general rule, but if Martin nominates us then we're in the wheelhouse, and if Wines wants out of Port and we're his preferred destination, then we need to make sure we don't get reamed. Folks like to point to the Treloar and Neale trades, those players are a big step up from Wines. They also like to point to the Gibbs trade, which has shown exactly why you don't go all in on anything other than an absolute gun player.

 

[Pater44]

*changes username to BringHomeBetts*

*until that happens, then changes it to LetsGetKelly


On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Opine]

This is opposite of what I’ve been told by people very, very close to him.

Hmm, is that so? how close if you don't mind my asking?

 

[RoyalBlues]

Are you still listening to your 2 out of three ain’t bad album? Including the hit “here comes the sun”.

Yes but the new tracks “Cheap Wines and a Three Way Trade” - by The Human Teague and “Ruck with You” by Rogue Traders, are two new tracks to watch out for . . .

if AFL rules don’t change they’ll be on heavy rotation even in 2020.

 

[Accidental genius]

Blues open to Betts return

Carlton is open to the prospect of Eddie Betts returning to the club, but they are yet to discuss in detail what it might entail and how a deal might take place while the Crows say he is contracted.

www.theage.com.au

IT'S (maybe) HAPPENING

He’s on $600k and contracted next season which I’m sure we’d baulk at. Wonder if it would work if we get him but only pay part of his salary for next season and crows pay the balance? Would crows do something like that?

 

[TerryWallet]

Why do i get the feeling that SOS would be less than impressed with that Penburthy(husband of Adelaide Board member) article.

 

[Blue__Balls]

He’s on $600k and contracted next season which I’m sure we’d baulk at. Wonder if it would work if we get him but only pay part of his salary for next season and crows pay the balance? Would crows do something like that?

Tipping he'd be open to renegotiating a bit - but in all honesty, we missed out on Coniglio with the godfather offer, I'm sure we can afford a slightly overpaid Eddie for one season.

 

[HBF]

Wines looking like a real good chance.

He and Cripps in the same midfield. Wow!

 

[BringBackSimmo]

We are interested in Shai Bolton? Can he return to his Colts' numbers?

 

[cfc4life]

Martin is out of contract and has never completely delivered on his promise. His real value is likely a pick in the early 20s. I think GC would rather move up the draft than pad out their list with second rounders - upgrading 17 to 8 would represent a significant boost for them, as there will be some handy players on the table inside the top 10.

Wines valued at 7 is fair. He's not a gun mid, he's a solid build-around grunt player. You've also assumed our future second would be pick 11, which is certainly our aim (finals), but I think that's probably worst case scenario for Port, and they're just as likely to be getting a top 10 pick. Furthermore, if they're likely to be trading that future pick anyway (ie. Lukosius) then one or two spots doesn't matter at all.

Wines is absolutely a secondary inside mid to a side with Cripps. Also have Dow developing, Setters coming along nicely, Stocker a likely sort, Kennedy and Cuningham OK as rotations. Like Wines, reckon he'd be a good get, but not so important that we can blow our load on him alone.

The noise from Martin's camp sounds a whole lot like contract inflation tactics from his manager, just doing due diligence and seeing if the price can be driven up at all. I'm quietly confident he'll land with us, but if he doesn't it's even more important we don't burn too much currency on Wines as we'll need to look elsewhere.

I'm down with overpaying a bit, as a general rule, but if Martin nominates us then we're in the wheelhouse, and if Wines wants out of Port and we're his preferred destination, then we need to make sure we don't get reamed. Folks like to point to the Treloar and Neale trades, those players are a big step up from Wines. They also like to point to the Gibbs trade, which has shown exactly why you don't go all in on anything other than an absolute gun player.

Dow is a teenager and is still built like one. Setterfield is very young and coming off his first season post-ACL. Stocker has played 1 AFL game. Kennedy is the definition of OK. Cuningham shouldn't be used as an inside mid.

We won the clearance count from 13 of our 22, pretty good but this is the breakdown.

Cripps- 168
Curnow- 104
Kreuzer- 83
Walsh- 75
Murphy- 64

That drop off is huge. And if it stays that way, Crippa is broken before he turns 28.

We need mature midfielders. We need good players coming to the club. It's a seller's market.

We either pony up the picks required, or we go another year with no support for our captain.

 

[Tommy Alvin]

Spirit Dampener Alert

Sorry to be a realist but I have had a connection with Ollie through business and I see it as highly unlikely that he would leave Port. He is a captain, he has very strong friendships in both the playing group and club management, finally and most importantly, he is extremely loyal. Koch and Hinkley would have to have done some seriously weird caca to have Ollie want to leave. I hope I am wrong but I’m not going to get myself too excited.

TA

 

[thylacine60]

My cynical head said no to Eddie coming back, but the heart wants what the heart wants !!

Have a look at that pile of * stooges clutching at air! Hilarious. Ok, make the call......