How is it that Bolton is part of our future plans!
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AFLW 2024 - Round 8 - Chat, game threads, injury lists, team lineups and more.
Coaching Staff Brendon Bolton - Senior Coach - Locked in until end of 2020 (23/5/18)
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how long?
you're not guaranteed
you need markers along the way so people buy into it as they come up
at the moment we have over yonder.. trust us!
that's where they have gone wrong!
I'm not sure how some people are missing this!
it's very simple
Apparently we need to count to 66.
Some even struggle with that
no they didn't
they just said 66 game reset
they haven't mentioned what happens
unless I'm missing something
please find it
Wickzki
Definitely Sam MacLure.
- Oct 1, 2010
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This is our <190cm list.
Injured: Williamson, Docherty, Byrne, (Lang), Cuningham, (Pickett)
Rookies: Shaw, McDaid, LeBois
Midfielders: Kennedy, Kerridge, Dow, O'Brien, Graham, Curnow, Murphy, Petrevski-Seton, Fisher
Forwards: Lamb, Garlett, Wright, Polson,
Able to play back: Thomas, Mullett, Simpson
We literally have three guys who have the skill set to be able to play small down back who have been healthy. Wright has played out of position some of the time to his detriment. Our midfield is short on talent enough as it is already. There are no other players able to play down back that are small.
Lang and Pickett have been injured on and off during the entire season. Neither is really a small defender anyway.
We play tall down back because we have no other choice.
We've been crucified by injury and paid for mostly intelligent list design management. You draft bigs early as they take time to develop. Unfortunately it has meant that in the short term we lack numbers in the small department.
I just hope that when SOS ends up signing a flanker or two nobody is stuck in the past and screams about having too many flankers.
You can't work that out for yourself?
What did you think the 66 game reset meant?
carlton2dabone
Premiership Player
- May 17, 2012
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Your coach?
Hmmm... You do support Carlton, correct? Or is this an alt account for another club, and it's taken this long for you to slip up?
As for the content of what you're saying, you cannot pick and choose. Either we play the kids - all of them - and we get outrun and beaten and yes, we play too tall, or we play the senior players and get beaten regardless and you have people like theheatleystand and carlton2thebone complaining about how the kids always get dropped for no hopers.
And I find it interesting that it's the backline you're bewailing, when its the height of the forward line and the relative lack of speed through the middle that is tearing us up after turnovers, as they lack the pace to get back behind the ball in time to affect the next contest.
Seeing as how you mentioned me and suddenly I don’t have privledges to post in the other forum to continue our discussion, I’ll answer this instead.
Why are they linked, playing all the kids and playing too tall?
I mean, players like Casboult, Rowe, Jones, O’Shea, mullet, Kreuzer are all talller older bodies, the first 5 of them no hopers in my opinion.
So of course when you add these older no hopers into the team it naturally means you either have to drop the younger talls to stop from going even taller or logically go in even taller when you include them.
And that’s what I and many others have been screaming about on Thursday night most of this year, that because Bolton wanted to add these players in whilst still playing our young talls then we start off matches at a disadvantage before the ball is even bounced.
Gethelred
Moderator
- May 1, 2016
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Um, no.
In life, you have to find your own means of sustaining hope. I'm perfectly content to wait, fully cognizant of the course we committed to just under three years ago and the sheer time and effort involved. Given our youth, given our issues this season, I've had to revise my own expectations towards this season, but make no mistake this year was always going to be an interesting one.
In every single exchange I've had with you, you've run off when I've asked you to place yourself in the position of the club hierarchy, free of hindsight, and I've asked you for your alternative course, and every single time you've run off without answering. I'm just about done feeding your puerile attempts at fencing, and you need to find your own solution instead of asking me for mine.
Wickzki
Definitely Sam MacLure.
- Oct 1, 2010
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They implied quite heavily what happens. The list should theoretically be in a position to move forward and be competitive.
That's a total of four player acquisition (draft, trade, free agency) periods (2015, 2016, 2017, 2018).
Due to injuries I think they'll find that they're a year out and that it will take 5 player acquisition periods to right the ship and I'm perfectly okay with that. For example, it's not usually the first season that a player comes back from a severe injury like Docherty has had and does well. For that reason 2019 will be about getting that continuity back in his game and it will be 2020 that sees him recapture that form that made him a standout All-Australian. If he gets it back next year then that is a huge bonus.
My issue with the coaching is that I don't see continuous improvement procedures in place or if they are they're not working. Players are making the same poor skill and judgment areas repeatedly. I don't see improvement in those facets. That's not a list management issue its a coaching one.
Wickzki
Definitely Sam MacLure.
- Oct 1, 2010
- 25,953
- 62,409
- AFL Club
- Carlton
- Other Teams
- Ophidians Old Boys, Blazers, MCFC
You can only select the personnel that you have at your disposal. Unfortunately, the list is out of wack this year and it has been exacerbated by injuries.
You need to understand the list management philosophy that SOS and co have used. From that end it makes sense.
We're too tall because that's who we've got to roll with.
That is absolutely one of the main reasons
carlton2dabone
Premiership Player
- May 17, 2012
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No doubt our list isn’t complete yet, no doubt SOS and co went for the talls first because they take longer to develop, no problem with that strategy at all.
The issue isn’t why we have so many talls on our list right now, that’s been discussed as naeusiam.
I was responding to a post I was mentioned in that stated that we have if we want to play all our young kids then we go in to tall.
I couldn’t agree with that, it was Bolton’s insistence to keep including the likes of the 5 older no hoper talks I mentioned in my previous post that ensured we kept going in too tall when we also included our young talls.
Just clarifying....
Wickzki
Definitely Sam MacLure.
- Oct 1, 2010
- 25,953
- 62,409
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- Carlton
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- Ophidians Old Boys, Blazers, MCFC
So my question to you is this:
Which small players have been healthy that you would give games ahead of the older talls who shouldn't be played?
We just don't have the cattle. There isn't anyone worthy of games that is missing out that isn't tall (e.g. Harry McKay).
Gethelred
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- May 1, 2016
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Because, when you observe the complete list SOS has picked since he came to the club, you'll notice that the rate in which he's picked up talls against smalls has been roughly the same (across trades and drafting). This is despite the fact that in an AFL context you realistically need about 5-6 talls and 15-16 smalls to build a side.
We play a side without some of the kids, to ensure that the ones we already have in the ones are not unduly exposed, you have a whinge that we're not developing the kids (not without a basis, but still). We play all the kids, we're tall and unfit - due, in part, because from the drafting side of the ledger SOS has picked up a tall two out of every three picks - and we cannot run with our older stronger opposition, and you have a whinge about our lack of leadership and our poor development.
Look, I've become rather fed up. I'd prefer to come on here and commiserate with people concerning our fortunes this year. I enjoy a good argument, but I find that to be more or less all I'm doing recently, as I read attacks and vitriol and just nonsense, like someone left an overactive rottweiler puppy inside and it tore the place up. I understand that people - like you - are frustrated by a lack of perceived progress. Believe me, I get it. But constantly bemoaning the state of things, constantly grouping everyone that disagrees with you into some ubiquitous globule of internet people who disagree with you - 'heads in the sand, take your navy glasses off'; honestly, only on the Carlton forum of Bigfooty would you actually have a muppet trying to tell someone else that their support of Carlton was a bad thing! - being defensive and changing the goalposts on what exactly the argument is makes me beyond irritated, and into angry and tired.
I can keep this up, C2DB (hey, that's a catchy acronym!). I can and I will, because I have standards I refuse to let lapse. But one of the things I do miss isn't the sense of optimism as we headed into this season, or the season before. It isn't the humour that we still see, usually around Wednesday after the red haze has worn off from the weekend and before we've all talked ourselves into believing we can win again. It's in the good spirited arguing that simply doesn't happen anymore.
Right now, this board is split, fractured into individuals that support a team yet cannot stand to talk to each other. Once upon a time, we'd argue and we'd disagree, but now we have whole pages needing to be removed by the mods, with posters getting suspended left and right because each of us are too raw to truly not take things personally.
It saddens me, that we've come to this. But, like our side, we can only move forwards in time.
We have the talent in the squad, and every now and then you catch a glimpse of it. This is as good a draft as any to come last in, provided we can leverage our selections to ensure that we get multiple picks inside the top 20, as while there's lots of key position talent, there's also shitloads of midfielders, and while there are outside mids the majority are in/out or hard ball earners. There's x-factor all the way to the late second round.
This isn't really to do with Bolton, so if we need to continue this, quote me in List Management. Just realise that, while I do and probably will continue to disagree with you and the way you argue at times, we need to be a part of improving the discourse on here, and at the very least part of that starts with me.
Surely we dont need to be spoonfed anymore do we ?
Is it not obvious by looking at our midfield that we need atleast another off season to fill some more gaps in the side ?
Surely we can work that out .
Then hope for a better run with injury and further development over the coming 2-3 years .
I din't need to work out for myself that round 2 2015 we were going to have a 66 game rebuild that was going to take us to a wooden spoon on 2018
yeah I need that spelt out
but you are smarter than that
and you know it was kept open ended and unsigned off on of any markers for a reason
so they can't be pinned down on any accountability
I'm not a mind reader mate
they still haven't come out and told us this was the plan all along
our % is 60
we don't apply any pressure
many players who have come in during the 66 game reset are gone or going
a very high percentage
others are non preferred
carlton2dabone
Premiership Player
- May 17, 2012
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Well it obviously all depends on a week to week basis with who is fit and available that week and of course the size of our opponents weekly.
But take this week for example, the only talls we played were Jones, Rowe, Harry, Charlie and Kreuzer yet we still fielded a team of 22.
Even better the team this week comprised only a handful of no hopers who by the way we’re still the biggest culprits turning the ball over at a rapid pace.
Point being, we can definitely field a team where it’s no too tall and has way less no hopers included it in if we wanted to, this week shows that.
spoon fed?
you call that spoon feeding?
transparency and markers going forward are now called being spoonfed
Wickzki
Definitely Sam MacLure.
- Oct 1, 2010
- 25,953
- 62,409
- AFL Club
- Carlton
- Other Teams
- Ophidians Old Boys, Blazers, MCFC
Yet we still lost by 10 goals to a team a few places above us on the ladder...
Phillips and Weitering both missed. Highly likely that if both were available they both would have played. Either that or Harry goes in with Phillips being dropped.
carlton2dabone
Premiership Player
- May 17, 2012
- 4,424
- 4,620
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C
Entire comment read and noted.
I may get emotional sometimes (lately a lot of times), but it’s only because I love our club and hate seeing is stick so down in the quagmire.
But you are right, there used to be a time when by Wednesday everyone including both me was upbeat, joking and looking forward to the next game.
Unfortunately with these thrashing’s bleeding from one week to the next, it’s hard to keep a positive perspective that allows one to good humour joke anymore.
But I’ll try anyway.
A typical experience for a Carlton supporters these days is as follows:
1) 10-15 passages of play through an entire 2 hour period where we get to cheer.
2) the rest of the game is spent either facepalming at some of the stupidest and comedic decisions ever made on field,
Or screaming at the top of the lungs for players to run back and mark their opponent.
(Not my finest work but I’m trying to get the ball rilling )
Entire comment read and noted.
I may get emotional sometimes (lately a lot of times), but it’s only because I love our club and hate seeing is stick so down in the quagmire.
But you are right, there used to be a time when by Wednesday everyone including both me was upbeat, joking and looking forward to the next game.
Unfortunately with these thrashing’s bleeding from one week to the next, it’s hard to keep a positive perspective that allows one to good humour joke anymore.
But I’ll try anyway.
A typical experience for a Carlton supporters these days is as follows:
1) 10-15 passages of play through an entire 2 hour period where we get to cheer.
2) the rest of the game is spent either facepalming at some of the stupidest and comedic decisions ever made on field,
Or screaming at the top of the lungs for players to run back and mark their opponent.
(Not my finest work but I’m trying to get the ball rilling )
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Theyve been open and honest what is it you want to clarify whether its a reset or rebuild ??
Surely your not another one that cant see that the injury toll has completely blown any plans to the shizen for this year...
carlton2dabone
Premiership Player
- May 17, 2012
- 4,424
- 4,620
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- Carlton
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- #4,749
Yes we lost by 10 goals playing a big bunch of kids, but at least we achieve another game under their collective belts.
For most of the year we’ve been losing (sometimes quite heavily) playing the older blokes and getting absolutely nothing out of these losses.
Anyway, hoping that Bolton uses these last games to get as many games under the belts of all our kids and the older blokes that everyone knows are not in our future can slowly pack up they’re gear while playing out the season in the VFL.
Continuity, or lack of. bolts stressed that beyond belief. It is a huge factor in why we are where we are. Inexperience and inujuries are the 2 main culprits. The club has zero choice but to stay on path with bolts. It's that simple.
Watching the game fridee night with a fellow supporter he yearned for the season to be over. As much as it's starting to really wear thin I think the latter part of the season is a golden opportunity for bolts to keep striving with the group. I have not seen one ounce of resignation in bolts and it's plain to see he really wants to see this thru. We can only go up now folks.
Watching the game fridee night with a fellow supporter he yearned for the season to be over. As much as it's starting to really wear thin I think the latter part of the season is a golden opportunity for bolts to keep striving with the group. I have not seen one ounce of resignation in bolts and it's plain to see he really wants to see this thru. We can only go up now folks.
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