Collingwood 2016 Pre-Season Discussion

[Kirby]

View attachment 209085

Is that Sier? Doesn't look all that chubby or short in that photo...

Nope that's not Sier. It's Lachlan Howe who is on our VFL list (and is about 200cm tall).

 

[Big Bryza]

The people who don't understand the importance of a preseason..

"Who cares he is injured, it's not round 1 yet!"

Treloar is not injured!

It's not as if he's not training. He's running and completing all the conditioning work, just on his own. The blokes a jet and won't need much time to regain his touch, which no doubt he's doing a lot of anyway.

 

[Big Bryza]

I'm "moaning" about Treloar having Osteitis Pubis which is potentially dehabilitating injury, his long term prospect is the main concern.. you normally fail to see the key point.

Swan also has about 8 years worth of preseasons under his belt compared to Treloar, and was recovering from a different set of injuries... comparing the two is silly at best. How would you know Swan was a similar program? You're both just making complete guesses

You realise OP is just a made up word?

 

[sr36]

IMO, the club will have him right to go by round 1 he'll just be underdone.

After Round 2 I intend to start a thread calling him a middle of the road hack and abuse our recruiters for paying too much for him.

 

[jackcass]

Round 1 NAB or season proper? Round 1 which year?

AFL or VFL...

 

[PicaBoo]

AFL or VFL...

If anyone bothers to read the article you will find at the end of the 1st paragraph

to make their MagPies' debut in Round 1 against Sydney Swans

Hope that clears it...

 

[PicaBoo]

After Round 2 I intend to start a thread calling him a middle of the road hack and abuse our recruiters for paying too much for him.

TG will have beaten you to it unless you mean rnd 2 NAB, then you might have a chance.

 

[jackcass]

Surgery was in early October for Treloar so we're now approaching four months without commencing full training.

With that being the case I can understand Kappa's (or anyone else's) concerns because our rehab team is notoriously poor with recent examples such as Freeman, Reid, Ramsay, Oxley, Sinclair, Broomhead and Gault of guys suffering injuries that have had recovery timelines stretched out for exceedingly long periods.

IMO, the club will have him right to go by round 1 he'll just be underdone. That doesn't preclude people from raising doubts because the communication and other aspects of injury management at Collingwood has been terrible since 2014.

Based on.... comparatively to....

Without access to each individual players medical records it's purely speculation. We don't have intimate knowledge of their injuries, complications suffered or rehab setbacks, how dutiful the players themselves were in there rehab... It's all guess work. Beams the classic case insomuch as he openly admitted that he pushed beyond prescribed limits too early and rather than get back on the park early delayed his return. Broomhead another who has had multiple different injuries (GF, wrist, shoulder) and there's not too much the club can do to prevent those.

That players suffer a recurrence of an injury (Reid, Freeman, and Sinclair) is concerning but it's an inexact science.

 

[jackcass]

Most of us are still in shock that Gault is still on an AFL list.

I still cling to the slightest sliver of hope that he can make it. His injuries over the last 2 seasons are annoying though. Hopefully he gets an injury free run in 2016 and comes good. His future beyond October this year will likely depend on it.

 

[Hardas]

The "key point" I was making is that this time last year Swan was only running laps and easing into drills. I know this because I went to several training sessions this time last year and people were raising the same concerns as they are about Treloar now. I never compared their respective injuries, only that the club appears to taking a similar cautious approach. You should remember this as you were having the same digs this time last year.

For pity's sake, can you stop making so much sense, Jasper!

 

[No SPIN]

It's a take that many will likely share, but I'm apprehensive for a slightly different reason.

My apprehension comes from the doubts I have over the board having the courage to move Buckley on if things go to shit. At least it's now only a 50/50 outcome no room for grey.

meaning what specifically - finishing 9th? or........

 

[Scodog10]

Based on.... comparatively to....

Without access to each individual players medical records it's purely speculation. We don't have intimate knowledge of their injuries, complications suffered or rehab setbacks, how dutiful the players themselves were in there rehab... It's all guess work. Beams the classic case insomuch as he openly admitted that he pushed beyond prescribed limits too early and rather than get back on the park early delayed his return. Broomhead another who has had multiple different injuries (GF, wrist, shoulder) and there's not too much the club can do to prevent those.

That players suffer a recurrence of an injury (Reid, Freeman, and Sinclair) is concerning but it's an inexact science.

Based on practices I know of that take place and comparatively to other clubs.

Yes there is 100% something the club could have done with Broomhead specifically being not allow him back on the ground...

Recurrences are also not the inexact science you would think they are at Collingwood!

 

[Gone Critical]

Surgery was in early October for Treloar so we're now approaching four months without commencing full training.

With that being the case I can understand Kappa's (or anyone else's) concerns because our rehab team is notoriously poor with recent examples such as Freeman, Reid, Ramsay, Oxley, Sinclair, Broomhead and Gault of guys suffering injuries that have had recovery timelines stretched out for exceedingly long periods.

IMO, the club will have him right to go by round 1 he'll just be underdone. That doesn't preclude people from raising doubts because the communication and other aspects of injury management at Collingwood has been terrible since 2014.

I think the 2nd bolded part of your quote is as far as you can go here Sco. "That doesn't preclude people from raising doubts" It's fair enough to ask the question but until you do and then appropriately qualified people examine the evidence no conclusion can be made. You have no real idea if our rehab team is notoriously poor.

For all we know the rehab team may be doing a stellar job with worlds best practice and tireless effort in the face of an unusually bad and unlucky run of injuries. We just dont know

When it comes to footy I assume everyone on this board has either watched, studied, played, coached or all of the above. We have an education in footy and we watch the game unfold before us so are in a position to at least make comment and have an opinion. On the rehab or injury front most of us will have little to no education in the area and "the game" if you like is played behind closed doors so we have nothing but the most basic information about what is going on. So truth is unless you are involved closely with the club and also are educated in the rehab area you have no idea whether our rehab team is good bad or indifferent.

Using anecdotes to reach conclusions like you have above has served medicine and its associated fields very poorly over the years because it makes you reach many incorrect conclusions and use bad treatments.

 

[Scodog10]

I think the 2nd bolded part of your quote is as far as you can go here Sco. "That doesn't preclude people from raising doubts" It's fair enough to ask the question but until you do and then appropriately qualified people examine the evidence no conclusion can be made. You have no real idea if our rehab team is notoriously poor.

For all we know the rehab team may be doing a stellar job with worlds best practice and tireless effort in the face of an unusually bad and unlucky run of injuries. We just dont know

When it comes to footy I assume everyone on this board has either watched, studied, played, coached or all of the above. We have an education in footy and we watch the game unfold before us so are in a position to at least make comment and have an opinion. On the rehab or injury front most of us will have little to no education in the area and "the game" if you like is played behind closed doors so we have nothing but the most basic information about what is going on. So truth is unless you are involved closely with the club and also are educated in the rehab area you have no idea whether our rehab team is good bad or indifferent.

Using anecdotes to reach conclusions like you have above has served medicine and its associated fields very poorly over the years because it makes you reach many incorrect conclusions and use bad treatments.

Hah GC you have no idea what I've been told. I'm not putting this out there off of a whim. Amazing as it might seem I don't post every piece of information I receive.

 

[Bard]

Based on practices I know of that take place and comparatively to other clubs.

Yes there is 100% something the club could have done with Broomhead specifically being not allow him back on the ground...

Recurrences are also not the inexact science you would think they are at Collingwood!

So why isn't it fixed? Are the medicos all Eddie's' cousins?

 

[Bard]

I think the 2nd bolded part of your quote is as far as you can go here Sco. "That doesn't preclude people from raising doubts" It's fair enough to ask the question but until you do and then appropriately qualified people examine the evidence no conclusion can be made. You have no real idea if our rehab team is notoriously poor.

For all we know the rehab team may be doing a stellar job with worlds best practice and tireless effort in the face of an unusually bad and unlucky run of injuries. We just dont know

When it comes to footy I assume everyone on this board has either watched, studied, played, coached or all of the above. We have an education in footy and we watch the game unfold before us so are in a position to at least make comment and have an opinion. On the rehab or injury front most of us will have little to no education in the area and "the game" if you like is played behind closed doors so we have nothing but the most basic information about what is going on. So truth is unless you are involved closely with the club and also are educated in the rehab area you have no idea whether our rehab team is good bad or indifferent.

Using anecdotes to reach conclusions like you have above has served medicine and its associated fields very poorly over the years because it makes you reach many incorrect conclusions and use bad treatments.

'Anecdotal evidence' sure does seem to piss the med students I know off

It's like MacBeth to actors... The bane to a doctor's existence.

 

[Quicky]

I think the 2nd bolded part of your quote is as far as you can go here Sco. "That doesn't preclude people from raising doubts" It's fair enough to ask the question but until you do and then appropriately qualified people examine the evidence no conclusion can be made. You have no real idea if our rehab team is notoriously poor.

For all we know the rehab team may be doing a stellar job with worlds best practice and tireless effort in the face of an unusually bad and unlucky run of injuries. We just dont know

When it comes to footy I assume everyone on this board has either watched, studied, played, coached or all of the above. We have an education in footy and we watch the game unfold before us so are in a position to at least make comment and have an opinion. On the rehab or injury front most of us will have little to no education in the area and "the game" if you like is played behind closed doors so we have nothing but the most basic information about what is going on. So truth is unless you are involved closely with the club and also are educated in the rehab area you have no idea whether our rehab team is good bad or indifferent.

Using anecdotes to reach conclusions like you have above has served medicine and its associated fields very poorly over the years because it makes you reach many incorrect conclusions and use bad treatments.

On this I think it was addressed at the AGM that this was reviewed last off season and the outcome was Davoren kept his job. Presumably the club was satisfied. I am interested in who did the reviewing?

 

[Jasper84]

For pity's sake, can you stop making so much sense, Jasper!

Yeah, I feel dirty posting so many serious comments, so to balance things out, here is a picture of a dog that looks like the Monopoly guy...

 

[PicaBoo]

Yeah, I feel dirty posting so many serious comments, so to balance things out, here is a picture of a dog that looks like the Monopoly guy...View attachment 209246

 

[Kilmo]

Nope that's not Sier. It's Lachlan Howe who is on our VFL list (and is about 200cm tall).

Ah, that actually makes sense. He looks huge.

 

[neilk]

If anyone bothers to read the article you will find at the end of the 1st paragraph

Hope that clears it...

The question asked was specifically about the ambiguous headline. It was cleared up in the article eventually

 

[TradeDraft]

Nice ambiguous headline from Foxsports there

Fox Sports just copied the Article from the Herald Sun

 

[Gone Critical]

Hah GC you have no idea what I've been told. I'm not putting this out there off of a whim. Amazing as it might seem I don't post every piece of information I receive.

I know I have no idea what you have been told. I also greatly respect the info you give on the board and know you have excellent sources.

Still unless your source's come directly from the medicos, physios, fitness staff and unless you have a pretty significant background and education in sports rehab so you can decipher the information I doubt the reliability of the assessment. You would need a lot of very detailed information to be able to make a judgement on how the rehab team is performing. I am not wanting to have a go at you just point out it is a common mistake to read too much into information and not understand that you need the full information. Very few people would have access to that.

 

[Old Spice]

There's a mole on the inside of the med team leaking to Scodog. Shit, that's not ideal.

 

[sirlothie]

I think this 'finals or bust' talk for Buckley is a bit hasty, the administration has shown it is in with the senior coaches for the long haul, Buckley has overseen pretty much a full list transformation and has been allowed to build his own team and will be given at least another 2-3 years to see what he can do with it.

Sacking coaches prematurely is a Richmond or Melbourne thing to do, we don't roll like that and for good reason as a change of senior coach basically mean you are back to square 1.