Collingwood exposed?

[democritus]

But Caro tipped them for the flag. She wouldn't troll us, would she?

Jaeger O'Meara for the Brownlow too, I want what she's smoking.

 

[bkozican]

After such a great start it's abit scary that they fell away like that.

Bucks is the problem child.

 

[BEEG]

We have our issues but who said we would be top 4?

Structure is massive and our FF and CHB were out against a very good team most teams would struggle

Take it easy our target is the 8 but there is 12 teams who could easily make it

Any forward would have had the impact of Cloke last night under those circumstances delivery was terrible and was double and triple teamed all night as there was not another target

Most of the team should be blamed but not Cloke

 

[bradrowe#32]

We were never Top 4 candidates this year.

 

[Essendonia]

I think the problem with Collingwood is that they need more forward thrust and deep penetration. Sidebottom, Goldsack and Seedsman need to help that, they're missing Brad Dick though, shouldn't have traded him.

What a Krakouer

 

[pie chucker]

Given Collingwoods profile there are always going to be extreme opinions as to how good/bad they are. Like all clubs in a period of rebuild that will struggle to compete with the likes of Freo when they are at full strength, let alone when missing KP players like Reid and White. With Cloke literally one out against as accomplished and experienced Docker defence it was no surprise they copped a caning last night. They have a terrific midfield but are light on up forward and back, asking young, inexperienced and underdeveloped kids to hold down key roles. There will be some hard times this year but the future looks very good indeed. There isn't another team in the AFL with as much exciting young talent working their way through those crucial first 60 games and three preseasons. They also have in Pendles an excellent leader which is crucial in this stage of the lists development. The hysterical reaction of irrational people, Pie fans and not, toward the current teams prospects shows little or no foresight or indeed knowlege of how AFL football clubs operates.Unlike his predecessor, Buckley is a first class individual and football person. He wouldnt give two shits what these ignoramuses think of his ablity to coach the CFC. I"m pretty confident that Nathan Buckley will be having an extended last laugh in a couple of years time.

Probably the smartest post I've read here. We're young and were always going to struggle this year. I haven't seen many people tout us as top 4 material either.

BTW IIRC didn't Hawthorn lose their first game last year? We all know what happened after that game. I'm not saying we'll win the flag just saying that one game doesn't make the season.

Also Buckley may or may not make it. However Mick's last few games with us weren't great. We got smashed by Geelong in the last game of 2011. Struggled against West Coast in the Qual final and got lucky against Hawthorn in the Prelim. We were on the way down with some aging stars.

 

[Heaps of fun]

We have our issues but who said we would be top 4?

Structure is massive and our FF and CHB were out against a very good team most teams would struggle

Take it easy our target is the 8 but there is 12 teams who could easily make it

Any forward would have had the impact of Cloke last night under those circumstances delivery was terrible and was double and triple teamed all night as there was not another target

Most of the team should be blamed but not Cloke

Who's your FF?

 

[BEEG]

Who's your FF?

White

Cloke will play high forward

 

[blaze036]

I'm having a Jolly of a good time reading some of this stuff

Yeah it's didak.. something...

nevermind

 

[Mateyman]

This is the third season since Malthouse was kicked out by Eddie and FIGJAM took over. Buckley has cleaned out a lot of players some of which are pretty decent ones so to impose his ethos onto the side. So 2014 is all Buckley's doing and he's no longer riding on the 'coat tail' of what Malthouse developed over his long term as head coach.

So now we will start seeing just how good a coach Buckely is and just how good Collingwood's list management is under Buckley's oversight.

Do you think this is unfair or incorrect?

This is possibly fair, so we will need to wait and see. However, some posters are ridiculous in their ability to diminish any success Buckley has and attribute it to Malthouse. I have seen a poster say that the first 13 (where Collingwood did well) games of 2012 were Malthouse's, but the next 10 or so weren't

 

[blaze036]

To make an assumption based on 1 round is footy is the height of stupidity.

Take 1 round in isolation last year and you would of thought Hawthorn were a bottom 8 side. Most pies supporters don't have us top 4 but we are far better than what we showed last night and would be surprised if we didn't play finals.

 

[Forward Press]

To make an assumption based on 1 round is footy is the height of stupidity.

Take 1 round in isolation last year and you would of thought Hawthorn were a bottom 8 side. Most pies supporters don't have us top 4 but we are far better than what we showed last night and would be surprised if we didn't play finals.

Losing to their close rivals by 7 points is hardly in the same ballpark as Collingwood's effort last night.

 

[theGav56]

I know Collingwood were missing White and Reid and it hurt them. We were missing almost direct like for likes in Clarke and Gumbleton. I have about 8 players who would be genuine best 22 for us not available last night (Clarke, Gumbleton, Sylvia, Suban, Morabitto, Griffin, C Pearce, Ibbotson and you could stretch an argument to include Bradley and Crozier).

It is game 1 and clearly Collingwood made a few decisions that impacted the result, starting from letting Shaw and Daisy go, as well as Wellingham the previous year. They brought in their youth to take on Sandi in the ruck instead of opting for Hudson or Lynch. They have at least a couple of players out there who look like they may no longer belong in Clarke and Maxwell. Those are strategic decisions which did not pay of in terms of round 1.

I think it just reveals that their focus is in the medium term rather than the here and now.

 

[theGav56]

Are you serious? White was barely best 22 for Sydney, Dwyer is still very young and is an emerging player as is Thomas. Who is Karnezis?

Next time we might have a few more to chose from - Ibbotson, C. Pearce, Sylvia (de-Melbournised), Clarke, Suban and of course.... the mighty Anthony Morabito.

Not to mention that we will have our prefered second ruck back. I think the outs are pretty even for each side. It is the actual 22 that played that made the difference.

 

[STFU Donnie]

You can't blame one player for the loss. Cloke had a shocker tonight, his lack of input was far more damaging imo.

Unfortunately, that is a far too common refrain. $1m+ per season for Cloke. Are you having a laugh?*


* for fans of Extras.

 

[PatrickBateman]

It is game 1 and clearly Collingwood made a few decisions that impacted the result, starting from letting Shaw and Daisy go, as well as Wellingham the previous year. They brought in their youth to take on Sandi in the ruck instead of opting for Hudson or Lynch. They have at least a couple of players out there who look like they may no longer belong in Clarke and Maxwell. Those are strategic decisions which did not pay of in terms of round 1.

Let Daisy and Shaw go? You're kidding right?

The Pies are suffering like many successful teams do. They're inevitably likely to slide. Most of the current team tasted ultimate success so many choose to favour their own personal goals, which may or may not include another premiership. From a Freo supporter perspective I can see why you'd see this as an apples v apples comparison, it isn't.

Players who have tasted the sweetness of a flag win simply can't match the hunger of those who haven't. Plain and simple. In a generation where intensity is arguably the most important factor between two sides, a team like Freo is riding on an intensity level that many are unable to match, hence their hard working defensive ability (work rate). Especially when compared to the current top sides (all recent winners). Your list is good too, sure. Just adding a little perspective here.

If Freo wins a flag, the team will never be the same. It's human nature I'm afraid. Teams rarely go back to back for a reason.

 

[Blues_Man]

was damming watching a replay and seeing the amount of times Pendlebury, Sidebottom, Swan would gather the ball in the back half, pass it off and literally stop running as if they knew the ball was coming back again only a few moments later.

They weren't prepared to gut run and I think that's part of this 'one way running' in which the media have now labelled them with.

That's when they weren't turning it over time and time again ...shocking skills....Beams was the leading dream team player i believe ..and yet he had zero impact on the Game, it shows how useless that data ranking actually is .

 

[Forward Press]

That's when they weren't turning it over time and time again ...shocking skills....Beams was the leading dream team player i believe ..and yet he had zero impact on the Game, it shows how useless that data ranking actually is .

Dream Team is a lot different compared to Champion Data stats, which I believe rated Beams a lot lower. Still, I'd hardly say Beams had zero impact - he was one of their better ones on the night.

 

[Blues_Man]

Most of the team should be blamed but not Cloke

He resorted to playing for free kicks last night ....paying a bloke who is hardly worth a cracker when the going gets tough, a Million a Year is ludicrous.

 

[beta_condition]

To make an assumption based on 1 round is footy is the height of stupidity.

Take 1 round in isolation last year and you would of thought Hawthorn were a bottom 8 side. Most pies supporters don't have us top 4 but we are far better than what we showed last night and would be surprised if we didn't play finals.

You and you only, we lost to Geelong by 7 points. I'm not sure how you would compare that to the crap Collingwood served up last night.

 

[theGav56]

We are in a rebuild! It ain't gonna be a long rebuild cos I actually think bucks started rebuilding after the 2011 grand final. I think our recruiting has been great especially last year. We have been a finals team for the last 8 years. I can see us missing finals action for the next 3 to 4 years then we will be contesting for another premiership buy 2017-18. Our club has too many resources and money to be crap for a long period. But more performances like last night will put huge pressure on bucks to keep his job

If you've been rebuilding since 2011 and can see you missing finals for the next 4 years, then that is a terrible rebuild considering where you started from.

 

[Southern Urchins]

I remember hearing similar hype about Freo after they smoked the AFL Swans in the Prelim.
Maybe it's just Collingwood are no good?

 

[BEEG]

He resorted to playing for free kicks last night ....paying a bloke who is hardly worth a cracker when the going gets tough, a Million a Year is ludicrous.

Paying him about 800K it was your mob that offered him the Million

 

[theGav56]

Let Daisy and Shaw go? You're kidding right?

The Pies are suffering like many successful teams do. They're inevitably likely to slide. Most of the current team tasted ultimate success so many choose to favour their own personal goals, which may or may not include another premiership. From a Freo supporter perspective I can see why you'd see this as an apples v apples comparison, it isn't.

Players who have tasted the sweetness of a flag win simply can't match the hunger of those who haven't. Plain and simple. In a generation where intensity is arguably the most important factor between two sides, a team like Freo is riding on an intensity level that many are unable to match, hence their hard working defensive ability (work rate). Especially when compared to the current top sides (all recent winners). Your list is good too, sure. Just adding a little perspective here.

If Freo wins a flag, the team will never be the same. It's human nature I'm afraid. Teams rarely go back to back for a reason.

Hawthorn, Sydney and Geelong have all successfully managed to go through transitions with their lists and game-plans. Inevitably sliding is not necessary apart from the fact that if you are at the top then the only change of direction is down. They are clear illustrations that players who win premierships don't have to start to follow their personal goals as opposed to team goals. That is something that a club and coach needs to manage for sure, but so what?

 

[BEEG]

Hawthorn, Sydney and Geelong have all successfully managed to go through transitions with their lists and game-plans. Inevitably sliding is not necessary apart from the fact that if you are at the top then the only change of direction is down. They are clear illustrations that players who win premierships don't have to start to follow their personal goals as opposed to team goals. That is something that a club and coach needs to manage for sure, but so what?

StKilda Bulldogs and others have also fallen away dramatically