List Mgmt. COLLINGWOOD Trade & FA 2024

[sr36]

As I stated in my initial post what is it people are hoping for if we get him?

I was in Sydney earlier this week and we were talking about Logan McDonald. Sydney want to keep him but not at any price. Out of all of Sydney’s galaxy of stars they need to fit into their salary cap it is McDonald they see as the most expendable. Supporters feel that the longer he holds out the more likely he is leaving. They are accepting of losing him to WA but not to Collingwood

I liked him in his draft year. Posters on here have indicated he is exactly what we need. But what is it we need? And does he fit the role?

Are our current expectations based on his draft year profile? and that he was a dyed in the wool Pies supporter? Is it because he kicked 4 goals against us in Round 0? Is it because he is 195/196cm?

Sydney drafted him to be their KPF but he not turned out to be that player yet.…

Sydney have tried him as a KPF full forward. He wasn’t a big contested mark, didn’t tackle and went missing too often. Joel Amartey has since surpassed him as the Swans preferred full forward

He has played 58 games. Of which in 18 games he failed to kick a goal. In 17 games he kicked 1 goal & in the remaining 23 he has kicked multiple goals

They have tried him at CHF and have played him high forward. He has struggled to get near the ball. He has also been used as a decoy forward

This year he currently sits 6th on their goal-kicking with 21 goals in a team full of goal kickers

What is he worth? Heaven forbid should we get him & "overpay for him" and he hasn’t kicked 40+ goals by round 14

I am hoping he will he be better suited on the vast space of the MCG? (where he has kicked 19.15 in 11 games – 1.72 goals per game ) rather than the small space of the SCG (where he has kicked 32.18 in 27 games – 1.18 goals per game) where playing CHF regularly gets overlooked

I used Ash Johnson’s stats as a comparison last night & included Max King’s & JUH’s stats today as a comparison today. King is considered at this point as having not lived up to his potential (and reportedly also gettable) and JUH is considered to be a champion. McDonald sits only marginally below them on stats.

Logan McDonald (Age 22) Pick 4 in 2020 draft.
58 games
Career Av: 6.3 K, 3.5 HB, 3.9 CP, 4.2 M, 1.5 MI50, 0.7 CM, 1.3 G, 0.9 BH, 1.4T, 0.5 T150, 1.4 I50
2024 (14 games): 7.5 K, 3.1 HB, 5.2 CP, 4.9 M, 2.0 MI50, 1.0 CM, 1.5 G, 1.1 BH, 1.3T, 2.0 I50

Jamarra Ugle-Hagan (Born same day as McDonald) Pick 1 in 2020 draft.
57 games
Career Av: 7.3 K, 2.5 HB, 4.5 CP, 4.5 M, 2.4MI50, 1.3 CM, 1.5 G, 1.3 BH, 1.1T, .05 T150, 2.1 I50
2024 (12 games): 8.4 K, 2.2 HB, 5.3 CP, 5.0 M, 3.0 MI50, 2.0 CM, 1.9 G, 1.6 BH, 1.2T, 1.9 I50

Max King (Age 23) Pick 4 in 2018 draft.
82 games
Career Av: 7.8 K, 2.8 HB, 6.1 CP, 5.2 M, 3.2 MI50, 2.2 CM, 2.4 G, 1.9 BH, 0.7T, 0.5 T150, 1.4 I50
2024 (11 games): 7.3 K, 3.2 HB, 4.0 CP, 4.3 M, 2.0 MI50, 1.6 CM, 1.7 G, 0.9 BH, 0.7T, 2.6 I50

My view is that you wouldn't pay much for what he currently is, as he probably isn't best 22 for us. But you'd be getting him based on what you think he'll become. **** knows is my view. Personally I see a predominately mark and kick player who isn't great in a contested mark situation or with the pace to easily get separation on the lead, so don't see the hype, but like a draft pick - let the experts or those who've watched him more closely make the projection on his future.

 

[Jen2310]

You can say he wouldn’t be best 22, but if we pay a high price, I’d suggest we will make him best 22 and have every intention of it being so unless his form
says otherwise. He wouldn’t be going from best 22 to a team where you are playing vfl.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[stormskye]

My view is that you wouldn't pay much for what he currently is, as he probably isn't best 22 for us. But you'd be getting him based on what you think he'll become. **** knows is my view. Personally I see a predominately mark and kick player who isn't great in a contested mark situation or with the pace to easily get separation on the lead, so don't see the hype, but like a draft pick - let the experts or those who've watched him more closely make the projection on his future.

That’s exactly why Ben brown faded out. The lead up kick mark forward struggles in todays game. Can’t be a decent KPf without the contested aerial game.

He is still only 22 so there’s def room to grow. I’m sure many of his peers in their 4th season were putting up similar stats, but his contested concerns me for how we play.

 

[Mollythedolly]

Could being the operative word here. Target the right FA / trades and it could also stay ajar longer than that.

There were posters calling our window slammed shut after the first couple of rounds this year. “Play the kids” calls were everywhere. Not sure why people can’t just enjoy the ride and hold the faith.

 

[JuniorB]

Scratch LDU off the list - I heard a sound grab of him saying he will definitely stay at North.
I'd be in for LM if we can get him at a reasonable price.

 

[Mollythedolly]

As I stated in my initial post what is it people are hoping for if we get him?

I was in Sydney earlier this week and we were talking about Logan McDonald. Sydney want to keep him but not at any price. Out of all of Sydney’s galaxy of stars they need to fit into their salary cap it is McDonald they see as the most expendable. Supporters feel that the longer he holds out the more likely he is leaving. They are accepting of losing him to WA but not to Collingwood

I liked him in his draft year. Posters on here have indicated he is exactly what we need. But what is it we need? And does he fit the role?

Are our current expectations based on his draft year profile? and that he was a dyed in the wool Pies supporter? Is it because he kicked 4 goals against us in Round 0? Is it because he is 195/196cm?

Sydney drafted him to be their KPF but he not turned out to be that player yet.…

Sydney have tried him as a KPF full forward. He wasn’t a big contested mark, didn’t tackle and went missing too often. Joel Amartey has since surpassed him as the Swans preferred full forward

He has played 58 games. Of which in 18 games he failed to kick a goal. In 17 games he kicked 1 goal & in the remaining 23 he has kicked multiple goals

They have tried him at CHF and have played him high forward. He has struggled to get near the ball. He has also been used as a decoy forward

This year he currently sits 6th on their goal-kicking with 21 goals in a team full of goal kickers

What is he worth? Heaven forbid should we get him & "overpay for him" and he hasn’t kicked 40+ goals by round 14

I am hoping he will he be better suited on the vast space of the MCG? (where he has kicked 19.15 in 11 games – 1.72 goals per game ) rather than the small space of the SCG (where he has kicked 32.18 in 27 games – 1.18 goals per game) where playing CHF regularly gets overlooked

I used Ash Johnson’s stats as a comparison last night & included Max King’s & JUH’s stats today as a comparison today. King is considered at this point as having not lived up to his potential (and reportedly also gettable) and JUH is considered to be a champion. McDonald sits only marginally below them on stats.

Logan McDonald (Age 22) Pick 4 in 2020 draft.
58 games
Career Av: 6.3 K, 3.5 HB, 3.9 CP, 4.2 M, 1.5 MI50, 0.7 CM, 1.3 G, 0.9 BH, 1.4T, 0.5 T150, 1.4 I50
2024 (14 games): 7.5 K, 3.1 HB, 5.2 CP, 4.9 M, 2.0 MI50, 1.0 CM, 1.5 G, 1.1 BH, 1.3T, 2.0 I50

Jamarra Ugle-Hagan (Born same day as McDonald) Pick 1 in 2020 draft.
57 games
Career Av: 7.3 K, 2.5 HB, 4.5 CP, 4.5 M, 2.4MI50, 1.3 CM, 1.5 G, 1.3 BH, 1.1T, .05 T150, 2.1 I50
2024 (12 games): 8.4 K, 2.2 HB, 5.3 CP, 5.0 M, 3.0 MI50, 2.0 CM, 1.9 G, 1.6 BH, 1.2T, 1.9 I50

Max King (Age 23) Pick 4 in 2018 draft.
82 games
Career Av: 7.8 K, 2.8 HB, 6.1 CP, 5.2 M, 3.2 MI50, 2.2 CM, 2.4 G, 1.9 BH, 0.7T, 0.5 T150, 1.4 I50
2024 (11 games): 7.3 K, 3.2 HB, 4.0 CP, 4.3 M, 2.0 MI50, 1.6 CM, 1.7 G, 0.9 BH, 0.7T, 2.6 I50

Presents as a poor man’s Josh Kennedy to me. Stats support that. The question is does he improve in our system? I’m happy to back the recruiting teams assessment of that. I think he’ll stay in Sydney for what it’s worth.

Logan McDonald and Joshua Kennedy AFL Stats Comparison

Logan McDonald and Joshua Kennedy AFL Stats Comparison.

www.footywire.com

 

[Apex36]

That’s exactly why Ben brown faded out. The lead up kick mark forward struggles in todays game. Can’t be a decent KPf without the contested aerial game.

He is still only 22 so there’s def room to grow. I’m sure many of his peers in their 4th season were putting up similar stats, but his contested concerns me for how we play.

Larkey does all right as a kick mark lead up forward. He has 28 goals this year, 29 marks inside 50. He has 8 contested marks total including around the ground this year in 14 rounds.

Yep, Ben Brown faded out. I’d argue though it’s because he was absolutely cooked. Norf knew it which is why they got rid of him. Melbourne nursed him though his first year there to nab a flag but he’s been fringe ever since because he just can’t move like he used to.

10 years ago people were prattling on about how the traditional contested key forward was dead and it was the new breed of athletic key talls that you wanted. Now people are saying that those contested guys are needed and leading mark/kick forwards are dead.

I’d argue that certain systems will accomodate certain types of players that others don’t. In our system we already have 2 contested key forwards running and (when fit) a second ruckman who plays mark/kick when forward. Honestly I think our system could definitely accommodate a McDonald type alongside the likes of Checkers and McStay, or Kreuger if he can stay fit and McStay when Checkers hangs up the boots. And he’s still very young so had time to develop a more contested game too. To me he’s a no brainer if the price is right.

 

[rdangelo]

If we trade in Logan McDonald what is it you are hoping to get? He is tall but doesn't play as a KPF. Averages 6 kicks, 4 marks 0.7 contested marks a game and 1.33 goals per game. Ash Johnson is tall but doesnt play as a KPF. He averages 5.3 kicks with 3.3 marks, 1.15 contested marks and 1.33 goals per game

On SM-N975F using BigFooty.com mobile app

But Ash Johnson is a spud. He's never really recovered after his very very very poor Prelim final in 2022.

 

[SchuPie]

Fox reporting Swans v confident of retaining McDonald
Good talks w manager

 

[Apex36]

Fox reporting Swans v confident of retaining McDonald
Good talks w manager

I mean, let’s face it we’re probably just being used as leverage in contract talks as usual.

 

[Chrispiesssss]

Logan McDonald is a 2nd round pick now!

 

[HoraceStrasbork]

10000%

Watching him this second half, absolutely zero second efforts.
Looks slow and not interested.

My take is it’s about 80/20 he ain’t in the system in 3 years if nothing changes (either Goodwin or trade).

Oh god…don’t keep this going.
I wish I’d have had that advice earlier.

Thought part of the science of trading is to offload players which are surplus to

Logan McDonald is a 2nd round pick now!

If that Mentally week with that non effort

 

[ThePhantom777]

Fox reporting Swans v confident of retaining McDonald
Good talks w manager

He's worth a packet of twisties after that shot on goal

 

[dardy33]

Logan McDonald is a 2nd round pick now!

Did show much today and what a shank definitely not worth 2 firsts

 

[Fat Jesus]

Did show much today and what a shank definitely not worth 2 firsts

Who said two firsts he's worth one second. Perhaps a 3rd thrown in.
Logan is only potential now. Hasn't done much.

 

[SchuPie]

Who said two firsts he's worth one second. Perhaps a 3rd thrown in.
Logan is only potential now. Hasn't done much.

Perfect time to get him
Pay and he ends up better than value rather than pay heavy and he doesn’t live up to potential

 

[WakeUpPies]

10 years ago people were prattling on about how the traditional contested key forward was dead and it was the new breed of athletic key talls that you wanted. Now people are saying that those contested guys are needed and leading mark/kick forwards are dead.

End of the day a 10/10 is a 10/10. A babe is a babe I mean a dominant forward is a dominant forward in any era!

 

[Jen2310]

This is what it says in the article about Stengle re-signing

Geelong is in the box seat to land Western Bulldogs’ midfielder Bailey Smith

6

Bailey Smith

Age

23

Ht

185cm

Wt

86kg

Pos.

M/F

Career

Season

Last 5

D

18.3

5star

K

8.5

3star

HB

9.8

5star

M

2.3

2star

T

3.8

5star

CL

2.7

4star

D

19.8

5star

K

9.6

4star

HB

10.2

5star

M

1.8

2star

T

3.2

4star

CL

3.2

4star

D

14.8

4star

K

7.6

3star

HB

7.2

5star

M

2.0

3star

T

3.4

5star

CL

1.6

4star

in this year’s trade period as the club looks to bolster its midfield stocks.

https://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/tyson-stengle-to-resign-with-geelong-after-interest-from-st-kilda/news-story/1ce6ff5a522c84e4ebe667fc734d1e45

 

[manicpie]

This is what it says in the article about Stengle re-signing

Geelong is in the box seat to land Western Bulldogs’ midfielder Bailey Smith in this year’s trade period as the club looks to bolster its midfield stocks.

https://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/tyson-stengle-to-resign-with-geelong-after-interest-from-st-kilda/news-story/1ce6ff5a522c84e4ebe667fc734d1e45

He was always going to Geelong, only linked to us because of his relationship to Nick. Stengle will end up at essendon

 

[SchuPie]

This is what it says in the article about Stengle re-signing

Geelong is in the box seat to land Western Bulldogs’ midfielder Bailey Smith in this year’s trade period as the club looks to bolster its midfield stocks.

https://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/tyson-stengle-to-resign-with-geelong-after-interest-from-st-kilda/news-story/1ce6ff5a522c84e4ebe667fc734d1e45

They’re doing quite well to re shape their midfield and have a couple of potentials developing in F50 which bodes well for their future

Really interested to see how we bring in some young / high end talent as our renewal process

 

[Roverjg]

He was always going to Geelong, only linked to us because of his relationship to Nick. Stengle will end up at essendon

In-demand Cat turns back on rival’s wild $4.5m free agency bid, signs long-term deal

In-demand Cat shuns rival’s staggering $4.5m free agency bid

www.foxsports.com.au

 

[Bussie]

Before we go all in moneyball style, how much more development does Steene, Johnson and Begg need to possibly fill a need? Although, I'm convinced Begg and Johnson are gone...so I'm answering my own question there.
Steene and Smit could work in tandem for a long time, not sold on paying overs for another long term project when we could already have them. A quick stop gap may be needed.
Tex?

 

[manicpie]

In-demand Cat turns back on rival’s wild $4.5m free agency bid, signs long-term deal

In-demand Cat shuns rival’s staggering $4.5m free agency bid

www.foxsports.com.au

That's even better. Don't want to improve essendon in any way

 

[Jen2310]

Before we go all in moneyball style, how much more development does Steene, Johnson and Begg need to possibly fill a need? Although, I'm convinced Begg and Johnson are gone...so I'm answering my own question there.
Steene and Smit could work in tandem for a long time, not sold on paying overs for another long term project when we could already have them. A quick stop gap may be needed.
Tex?

I do think Steene/ Smit is the way forward, unless they think they can re-make Begg into a key position.

 

[Bussie]

I do think Steene/ Smit is the way forward, unless they think they can re-make Begg into a key position.

I missed Eyre as well, but I know he's untried.