List Mgmt. Collingwood Trade Talk 2015

[DaicosianMarvels]

We need to start settling on a structure. It affects our trades.

I think this has been a successful year development wise, but my major dissapointment is that I still aam very unclear about our best 22 and best structure.

Couldn't agree with you more.

The reason why Hawthorn and Sydney and you could also maybe include Freo are up there is because they make sure they fill holes that need to be filled. I love how they have recruited.

Yes people want Aish and Treloar but we won't be that much better than we would be if we didn't get them. Our disposal in the back line will still be rubbish our ball use entering forward will still be rubbish.

Our key backs and forwards are fine and if we knew how to kick better and didn't turn it over that much, they would be so much better.

Our midfield is great. It has a great mixture of mature and young players, they will continue to grow and create that chemistry good midfields have. It takes a few preseasons for that to happen though and patience is the key here.

Our forward line with Moore and Cloke will be scary with them together in a year or two and it will be a better forward line than we had with Dawes and Cloke. Elliot is a gun and Fasolo seems to have finally screwed his head on. I can't wait for Moore to develop into a gun.

I love the way this club is heading but there is one big problem for me and that is the terrible ball use. That is our need we need to fix. We need players who can kick the ball out of our back half and inside 50. Toovey, Brown, Williams and Frost also if Sinclair plays then he joins that list as well, they can't kick. I have seen enough of Oxley to see him developing in to a good player and he is a good ball user.

For me it's all about getting Matt Suckling to the club first then going after Treloar. If we get them two, we will play finals next year.

 

[Matt_352]

Couldn't agree with you more.

The reason why Hawthorn and Sydney and you could also maybe include Freo are up there is because they make sure they fill holes that need to be filled. I love how they have recruited.

Yes people want Aish and Treloar but we won't be that much better than we would be if we didn't get them. Our disposal in the back line will still be rubbish our ball use entering forward will still be rubbish.

Our key backs and forwards are fine and if we knew how to kick better and didn't turn it over that much, they would be so much better.

Our midfield is great. It has a great mixture of mature and young players, they will continue to grow and create that chemistry good midfields have. It takes a few preseasons for that to happen though and patience is the key here.

Our forward line with Moore and Cloke will be scary with them together in a year or two and it will be a better forward line than we had with Dawes and Cloke. Elliot is a gun and Fasolo seems to have finally screwed his head on. I can't wait for Moore to develop into a gun.

I love the way this club is heading but there is one big problem for me and that is the terrible ball use. That is our need we need to fix. We need players who can kick the ball out of our back half and inside 50. Toovey, Brown, Williams and Frost also if Sinclair plays then he joins that list as well, they can't kick. I have seen enough of Oxley to see him developing in to a good player and he is a good ball user.

For me it's all about getting Matt Suckling to the club first then going after Treloar. If we get them two, we will play finals next year.

10/10 Post.

 

[The Royal Sampler]

Yes people want Aish and Treloar but we won't be that much better than we would be if we didn't get them. Our disposal in the back line will still be rubbish our ball use entering forward will still be rubbish.

Aish and Treloar are both very good users of the ball to be sending it inside 50.

Our midfield is great. It has a great mixture of mature and young players, they will continue to grow and create that chemistry good midfields have. It takes a few preseasons for that to happen though and patience is the key here.

It might have a good mix but any statement about our midfield being "great" is based on potential and not performance this season. Our midfield regularly gets beaten in clearances against better sides and our 2nd possessions after the clearances we have won have been rubbish. We don't have a Joel Selwood to will himself on the contest at the bounce and turn the game our way, and we don't have a Stephen Hill or Isaac Smith as a damaging runner on the outside.

We're reliant on De Goey and Freeman both reaching their potential to have even a league average midfield after Swan retires, and I shudder to think about Pendlebury declining.

 

[swoop42]

Langdon, Scharenberg, Ramsay and Maynard shall improve our kicking efficiency from defence once matured and all part of our best 22.

Treloar and Aish are both good kicks aren't they and would improve our ability to hit up targets going inside f50 should we land one or both.

Williams is hit and miss by foot but is at least prepared to take the game on with run and carry and break lines that way. Sinclair the same.

Suckling would be a nice bit of cream on top but I'd take Treloar always if I had to choose between the two of them.

Some do question whether Suckling would be as effective in a lesser side and could end up another Young.

On Young he doesn't turn 30 till next year and at Hawthorn 30 is the new 25 it would seem.

Have we given up on him to soon?

Should we give him one last go at it before the year is out?

 

[ThePhantom777]

Langdon, Scharenberg, Ramsay and Maynard shall improve our kicking efficiency from defence once matured and all part of our best 22.

Treloar and Aish are both good kicks aren't they and would improve our ability to hit up targets going inside f50 should we land one or both.

Williams is hit and miss by foot but is at least prepared to take the game on with run and carry and break lines that way. Sinclair the same.

Suckling would be a nice bit of cream on top but I'd take Treloar always if I had to choose between the two of them.

Some do question whether Suckling would be as effective in a lesser side and could end up another Young.

On Young he doesn't turn 30 till next year and at Hawthorn 30 is the new 25 it would seem.

Have we given up on him to soon?

Should we give him one last go at it before the year is out?

Hawthorn was willing to let him go, that's all that needs to be said about Young.

 

[Anzacday]

I really think calling Richards a ruckman is a serious stretch TD..

So that's where he got his nickname from

 

[Baltimore Jack]

Frost is on the rookie list, and as far as I'm aware, rookie listed players can't be traded? Is that correct?

Rookie listed players can be traded

 

[Kirby]

I hate Suckling and I hate people even talking about getting him. He's one of the biggest pretenders Ive seen on a football field. He has next to no defensive ability and his kicking is severely over-rated.

Yes he does some amazing kicks but he also makes some absolute howlers because he believes in his own hype.

ICK.

 

[legendstatus]

I hate Suckling and I hate people even talking about getting him. He's one of the biggest pretenders Ive seen on a football field. He has next to no defensive ability and his kicking is severely over-rated.

Yes he does some amazing kicks but he also makes some absolute howlers because he believes in his own hype.

ICK.

100% with the K man, plays up to his so called reputation as a designated kicker, that poncy sidewinding pose every time he kicks the ball makes me want to throw up! in a lesser side he'll even less effective than Young!!!!!!

 

[iGNITER]

I hate Suckling and I hate people even talking about getting him. He's one of the biggest pretenders Ive seen on a football field. He has next to no defensive ability and his kicking is severely over-rated.

Yes he does some amazing kicks but he also makes some absolute howlers because he believes in his own hype.

ICK.

DO NOT WANT.

 

[Peter Sidorkiewicz]

Aish and Treloar are both very good users of the ball to be sending it inside 50.

This won't mean shit if all they have to kick to is Travis Cloke being double teamed.

We need to give up the obsession in trying to recruit more midfielders and get another key forward pronto!

 

[surfer1]

I think we need another key forward. Cloke won't be around forever, Reid is injury prone and then that leaves only Moore

 

[DaVe86]

Couldn't agree with you more.

The reason why Hawthorn and Sydney and you could also maybe include Freo are up there is because they make sure they fill holes that need to be filled. I love how they have recruited.

Yes people want Aish and Treloar but we won't be that much better than we would be if we didn't get them. Our disposal in the back line will still be rubbish our ball use entering forward will still be rubbish.

Our key backs and forwards are fine and if we knew how to kick better and didn't turn it over that much, they would be so much better.

Our midfield is great. It has a great mixture of mature and young players, they will continue to grow and create that chemistry good midfields have. It takes a few preseasons for that to happen though and patience is the key here.

Our forward line with Moore and Cloke will be scary with them together in a year or two and it will be a better forward line than we had with Dawes and Cloke. Elliot is a gun and Fasolo seems to have finally screwed his head on. I can't wait for Moore to develop into a gun.

I love the way this club is heading but there is one big problem for me and that is the terrible ball use. That is our need we need to fix. We need players who can kick the ball out of our back half and inside 50. Toovey, Brown, Williams and Frost also if Sinclair plays then he joins that list as well, they can't kick. I have seen enough of Oxley to see him developing in to a good player and he is a good ball user.

For me it's all about getting Matt Suckling to the club first then going after Treloar. If we get them two, we will play finals next year.

Despite my earlier post, I am still very much in the 'get treloar' bandwagon. He would improve our midfield. For all the mechanics of a side, the common theme amongst all premiership sides is a great midfield. I also rate his skills.

Thereafter I think we need to really decide on our best 22 and start plugging holes.

We need to decide if Reid is predominantly a Backman or forward, and also what our best ruck structure is.

We also need to make calls on good servants like Toovey and Blair who always give 100%, but are their skills up to it?

I would actually go in with a back 7 next year of marsh, brown, Williams, scharenberg, Ramsey, Langdon and Goldsack. It changes our structure, but gives us better ball use.

Up forward I would go with Cloke, Reid, white, fasolo, Elliott and swan. I can't fit Moore in unless he can backup ruck. Otherwise we need to play witts and I don't want 2 rucks.

The hole I see is for one pure crumber and also a line breaking wingmen.

Despite this, I think we need to first complete our midfield with Treloar

 

[The Royal Sampler]

This won't mean shit if all they have to kick to is Travis Cloke being double teamed.

We need to give up the obsession in trying to recruit more midfielders and get another key forward pronto!

I was responding specifically to his point about ball use going forward.

I don't think Cloke/Reid/Moore is a bad setup at all, especially with Elliott, Fasolo and potentially Broomhead or Kennedy down there too in 2016.

 

[DaicosianMarvels]

Can't believe some are so against getting Suckling.

His kicking is not overrated at all and even if he isn't a defensive player, we have the defensive players in our backline. That's why they are in the team, they are certainly not in the team because of their kicking and decision making.

Suckling is like Seedsman but better.

In the last few weeks, I realised that we might be a bit further away from challenging than I thought, so I am now on the Treloar over Dangerfield bandwagon. Just as Swan is nearing the end of his career, Treloar comes a long and our midfield is set for the next 5 years.

 

[Palmer Stoat]

I was responding specifically to his point about ball use going forward.

I don't think Cloke/Reid/Moore is a bad setup at all, especially with Elliott, Fasolo and potentially Broomhead or Kennedy down there too in 2016.

Cloke is 28, though. Thus far in his career he's been durable (though the calf is a little concerning, as this is an injury that seems to plague older players), but KFs, particularly power forwards, don't typically play great footy after 30 -- some are done even sooner. Cloke may be an exception, but you'd be game to plan your list management around this assumption. And you'd be equally game to assume that Reid will a regular selection given that he's missed practically two years with a litany of leg injuries.

For me, KF should be top priority. The imponderable is will any KFs that we rate be available at our first pick?

EDIT: I should add that I expect us to use our first-rounder as part of a trade for Treloar.

 

[Soaring Magpie]

100% with the K man, plays up to his so called reputation as a designated kicker, that poncy sidewinding pose every time he kicks the ball makes me want to throw up! in a lesser side he'll even less effective than Young!!!!!!

He is a downhill skier riding the coat tails of the hawthorn guns.
He would add little to our side.

 

[Babylove]

This won't mean shit if all they have to kick to is Travis Cloke being double teamed.

We need to give up the obsession in trying to recruit more midfielders and get another key forward pronto!

True, but the recruitment of Treloar and/or Aish will probably result in Swan spending more time forward. And it looks like if he can get his body right that Reid may be going forward too.

 

[4#Didak#4]

The Suckling debate is an interesting one. If he is a FA then I would certainly consider him, but I wouldn't trade for him. His kicking will make us a better side even if its just for the kick ins. However, you do need to be a little careful with over rating him. Being in a good side and being the cream is a little different to being relied upon as a full time defender. Malceski seems to be finding this out at the moment. For the right price I think he fills a need so would chase as a FA/RFA but would keep all trading dedicated to Treloar.

 

[swoop42]

To me trading Witts or losing Scharenberg for a first round pick is how we can possibly land both Treloar and Aish and still have a first round selection to draft a young kpf.

It would seem to much of a risk to draft Carlisle with the WADA hearing hanging over his head.

Really we need Reid to get bloody right as it will help us settle our structure no end.

Losing Keeffe hasn't helped in this regard either as I'm sure we would have trialled him as the 2nd ruck/forward option.

If we retain a first round pick this season we'd be mad not to select a kpp.

 

[morelli89]

Sucklings kicking isn't quite as good as people make it out to be. Yes he can send some absolute pinpoint long perfect bullets down the field, but he also grubbers quite a few, and he is a total liability defensively. He looks good in the Hawthorn team, but don't think he would have anywhere near the same impact for us.

 

[DrDavoren]

Wish we had of got Bernie Vince he is a jet on his day and 2/2 against Pendles.
We need to look for someone like him as well as a ready made forward like a Lynch so we could move White to a wing.
I think he was playing there at Sydney in his last year it let's him use his tank and may reduce some pressure being further up the ground.
Treloar if available is a no brainer with Swan coming to an end and would set up our midfield for the next 5-10 years.
A call on ruck stocks may be coming and I think Grundy should be the one we keep if there are takers for Witts.
We could use White as backup and look to an older ruck for backup.

 

[ThePhantom777]

Suckling isn't in Hawks best 22 therefore we don't want him in ours. It will be Young 2.0 and he'll take a younger players spot.

 

[ThePhantom777]

Despite my earlier post, I am still very much in the 'get treloar' bandwagon. He would improve our midfield. For all the mechanics of a side, the common theme amongst all premiership sides is a great midfield. I also rate his skills.

Thereafter I think we need to really decide on our best 22 and start plugging holes.

We need to decide if Reid is predominantly a Backman or forward, and also what our best ruck structure is.

We also need to make calls on good servants like Toovey and Blair who always give 100%, but are their skills up to it?

I would actually go in with a back 7 next year of marsh, brown, Williams, scharenberg, Ramsey, Langdon and Goldsack. It changes our structure, but gives us better ball use.

Up forward I would go with Cloke, Reid, white, fasolo, Elliott and swan. I can't fit Moore in unless he can backup ruck. Otherwise we need to play witts and I don't want 2 rucks.

The hole I see is for one pure crumber and also a line breaking wingmen.

Despite this, I think we need to first complete our midfield with Treloar

Could Reid go to CHB and Moore go forward? I thought there was talk a while back (in relation to Reid's injury woes) that playing back was easier on the body because the play was mostly in front of you.

 

[Bucksboys]

Suckling isn't in Hawks best 22 therefore we don't want him in ours. It will be Young 2.0 and he'll take a younger players spot.

It's Maynard's leg and position he'd be taking too