Contenders and Pretenders 2019 ( edited - Page 32 current discussion ) Are Richmond now the team to beat?

[Isaac Cumming No 1]

So after round 7 there is only one consistent performer:

They've taken away Essendon's speed just as they took away the Eagles transition game. They're playing on their terms and not allowing the opposition to control the ball on their own terms. There's only been two games where they've looked a minor possibility of losing and one they did. You all know who I am talking about. Can they continue this form to win the cup? Are they in top gear right now? Is there more? (God help the the rest if there is!)

The others:

I'll start with Essendon, you could argue that what we saw yesty is not Essendon and they had their F1 speed game taken away from them. When they're on boy are they on - their best is dangerous and can beat any team but it seems it can be taken away from them more easily than other teams in the "conversation"

The Grand Finalists:

WC: What is going on here? They can't find 3rd, the question is why? Well Port and a 2nd half Suns showed us - ugly up the game, outnumber at the contest and you take away their transition. Geelong did it a little differently and denied them the footy but that still disallows WC's transition. (Nafan take note - there is no current team that can out WC WC). Can't get a true read on them at the minute, what is certain list v list potential you could argue it is the no. 1 in the comp.

Collingwood: Another that can't find 3rd gear, they did briefly in the 1st qtr against Port but that's a glimpse. They're not "on" and a fair way from their best, hopefully they're "on" when it matters at the pointy end. Still beating a noted opposition on an unfamiliar park, comfortably while also kicking at goal terribly says they "should" be in contention. They by and large deny opposition the Sherrin and suffocate them when they don't have it. And yes Nathan mentioned it was their best in that 1st qtr - I disagree and maybe in the minority but I think there's still more. Either way 4 qtrs of that every week will make them contenders and very difficult to defeat if not already.

Richmond: Was that a blip on the radar? I'd say yes. What does it say about the doggies though? Well going under the radar the dogs are a v good clearance team and pressure the opposition to win them........... ala 2016, does this game style ring a bell tigers? That's right the doggies didn't out Richmond Richmond, they played their own game and "returned serve" doggie style. Write off Richmond at peril though, their system stacks up and just happened to run into a similar brand that was "on" for the day. Wouldn't read too much into it - still a serious threat.

GWS: Uber talented and probably on par with talent that the champs have, they dispatched a battle hardened surprise packet saints but it wasn't overly convincing. Jezza Cameron is looking super dangerous and the team across the park has symbiosis - very well balanced and unlike previous recent seasons have discovered a minor detail called team defence. That with the offensive game makes them very difficult to defeat.

IMV these are the teams that could win the comp given their potential and right now no doubt there is a clear leader. (Essendon the smokey)

The other "smokey's"

Adelaide: A so far disappointing Adelaide even with a gritty win against a steely opposition but still off this season and that is only reason I have them as a smokey. Their potential is worthy of contending.

Fremantle: A surprise packet Fremantle and really we should've seen it coming given their off season recruiting. The likes of Hogan and Lobb among others when it gels they'll be a formidable force - given the current sample size probably not this year but will probably contend in a year or two.

Port: Barring a poor 1st qtr they won the rest of the game against a grand finalist away. That's not bad really, yes it was sizable margin and could've been much more but they showed fight in the next 3 qtrs. Boak is in probably career form and they have a lethal ruck combo in Ryder and Lycett - they are a danger.

A minor chance of losing a game they lost? Your funny.

 

[RoarLike44In24]

Geelong arent that sure of being a contender. The start of thr season is the wrong time to peak.

 

[Carringbush2010]

A minor chance of losing a game they lost? Your funny.

Point is they've only been in two games they looked a possibility of losing and a possibility of winning. They won one and lost one and have looked unbeatable in the rest, they are the current form team.

 

[Duskfire]

Geelong arent that sure of being a contender. The start of thr season is the wrong time to peak.

Eagles last year lost the first game and then won like the next ten. Generally speaking the eventual Premier starts the season off well. Not always of course - there are some exceptions - but winning games early shouldn’t be seen as a negative.

Ultimately teams that peak too early are a result of young teams starting well and then tiring out, or one or two players going crazy and then being pressured. None of which apply to Geelong. Not saying they will win the flag of course - far to early and a horrendous finals experience - but they will make finals and if they lose it won’t be because they peaked too early.

 

[Isaac Cumming No 1]

Point is they've only been in two games they looked a possibility of losing and a possibility of winning. They won one and lost one and have looked unbeatable in the rest, they are the current form team.

It's weird the way your trying to spin it.

 

[Isaac Cumming No 1]

Eagles last year lost the first game and then won like the next ten. Generally speaking the eventual Premier starts the season off well. Not always of course - there are some exceptions - but winning games early shouldn’t be seen as a negative.

Ultimately teams that peak too early are a result of young teams starting well and then tiring out, or one or two players going crazy and then being pressured. None of which apply to Geelong. Not saying they will win the flag of course - far to early and a horrendous finals experience - but they will make finals and if they lose it won’t be because they peaked too early.

I dont get the logic that playing well can be a negative. I'm sure the Eagles didn't want to l9setheir first game At Optus to the Swans, but the flag probably dulled the pain in the long run.

 

[Carringbush2010]

It's weird the way your trying to spin it.

The way I'm "spinning" is irrelevant, the cats ARE the benchmark at the minute.

 

[Carringbush2010]

Geelong arent that sure of being a contender. The start of thr season is the wrong time to peak.

Are they peaking though? You could mount a reasonable argument that there's more in it just as much you could question if they're peaking right now.

 

[Isaac Cumming No 1]

The way I'm "spinning" is irrelevant, the cats ARE the benchmark at the minute.

Actually your spin is relevant, and hanging onto their coat tails again is sad.

 

[Carringbush2010]

Actually your spin is relevant, and hanging onto their coat tails again is sad.

You know what's weird, is you claiming that I'm hanging on to their coat tails. I don't know how you conflate that with stating they're the form team at the minute. Weird.

 

[Isaac Cumming No 1]

You know what's weird, is you claiming that I'm hanging on to their coat tails. I don't know how you conflate that with stating they're the form team at the minute. Weird.

Lets introduce some reality to the discussion. It's early May, at this time if the year teams are accumulating points.

The Cats are doing that very well. Behind them there's A few teams are also doing well, including the Lions, Giants and Magpies. It's still a third if the way through the season though and there are other contenders.

We dont match up until round 19, there's a fair bit of water to flow under the bridge, but at this stage I would look forward that matchup with confidence. You will get more attention from the Vic media but that does us no harm.

September is a whole different ball game, and whoever lifts in finals will succeed then.

 

[nobbyiscool]

Agreed.

If the Eagles that showed up against the Pies a month ago rock into town Saturday Night against your mob, they'll give you a royal flogging. They'd give anyone a royal flogging, and would win the flag with that sort of form. If it's the Eagles of late, and your boys come to play from the opening bounce, a royal flogging will come the Eagles way.

You have much more confident in the Eagles than I do!

I think we've got improvement to come - Barrass is critical to our structure, and I don't think anyone is really thinking about how much 6-6-6 is going to be amazing for the Eagles if NicNat comes back with his usual leap.

That said, I reckon teams have figured us out. I think Port show how you beat us - you play a hard press, you play ugly footy, you deny us space, and all this exposes our lack of a plan B.

 

[4THAWN]

After Round 7:
Contenders:
Geelong
Collingwood
Richmond
GWS

WC
Bris
Port
Freo

Pretenders

Essendon
Adelaide
St Kilda
Hawthorn

Bulldogs
Melbourne
Carlton
Gold Coast
North Melbourne
Sydney

 

[Antzzz]

The Cats and Pies look the goods at the moment....playing good footy.....

 

[saints_333]

Lets introduce some reality to the discussion. It's early May, at this time if the year teams are accumulating points.

The Cats are doing that very well. Behind them there's A few teams are also doing well, including the Lions, Giants and Magpies. It's still a third if the way through the season though and there are other contenders.

We dont match up until round 19, there's a fair bit of water to flow under the bridge, but at this stage I would look forward that matchup with confidence. You will get more attention from the Vic media but that does us no harm.

September is a whole different ball game, and whoever lifts in finals will succeed then.

The huge problem with GWS is, can they ever win a final or Grand Final at the MCG? I know it comes down to the day but there is nothing so far to indicate that they could. It's like the last couple of seasons in the AFL compared to the days when the top team almost ruled the pack, it all comes down to those final games.

I know West Coast and Sydney have done it recently but they have probably the best records in Melbourne out of the interstate teams.

 

[Carringbush2010]

Lets introduce some reality to the discussion. It's early May, at this time if the year teams are accumulating points.

The Cats are doing that very well. Behind them there's A few teams are also doing well, including the Lions, Giants and Magpies. It's still a third if the way through the season though and there are other contenders.

We dont match up until round 19, there's a fair bit of water to flow under the bridge, but at this stage I would look forward that matchup with confidence. You will get more attention from the Vic media but that does us no harm.

September is a whole different ball game, and whoever lifts in finals will succeed then.

Seems we're in agreement, the cats are the form team at the minute.

Am I still hanging onto coat tails? Am I doing it right?

 

[Isaac Cumming No 1]

The huge problem with GWS is, can they ever win a final or Grand Final at the MCG? I know it comes down to the day but there is nothing so far to indicate that they could. It's like the last couple of seasons in the AFL compared to the days when the top team almost ruled the pack, it all comes down to those final games.

I know West Coast and Sydney have done it recently but they have probably the best records in Melbourne out of the interstate teams.

It's not even a small problem, let alone a huge one.

 

[PAFC_1870]

Contenders:
Geelong
Collingwood
Richmond
GWS

Uh no. Richmond aren't in that group.

There are only 3 contenders.

 

[PAFC_1870]

you play ugly footy

Port's win in the wet was anything but ugly footy.

You want ugly footy? See last night?

 

[saints_333]

It's not even a small problem, let alone a huge one.

They have won 4 games in Melbourne since 2016 and they were all at Etihad. Three of those were in 2016. How is this not a huge problem? Even Carlton and St.Kilda beat or drew with them.

 

[Spursfan]

Uh no. Richmond aren't in that group.

There are only 3 contenders.

Yes I'd agree, on Coll/Geel/GWS. If Richmond get everyone back (bar Rance) and get rolling in the second half of the year they may get back in with a shot. WC are starting to worry me 3 poor games in a row, they need an upswing soon.

 

[Isaac Cumming No 1]

They have won 4 games in Melbourne since 2016 and they were all at Etihad. Three of those were in 2016. How is this not a huge problem? Even Carlton and St.Kilda beat or drew with them.

That aint true. Do some research.

 

[saints_333]

They have won 4 games in Melbourne since 2016 and they were all at Etihad. Three of those were in 2016. How is this not a huge problem?

That aint true. Do some research.

GWS Melbourne games since 2016-

2016-
Melbourne 12.8 (80) def.Greater Western Sydney 10.18 (78) MCG
St Kilda 12.7 (79) def. by Greater Western Sydney 19.12 (126) Etihad Stadium
Essendon 12.18 (90) def. by Greater Western Sydney 17.15 (117) Etihad Stadium
North Melbourne 9.9 (63) def. by Greater Western Sydney 14.16 (100) Etihad Stadium

2017-
St Kilda 16.12 (108) def.Greater Western Sydney 12.13 (85) Etihad Stadium
Carlton 10.11 (71) def.Greater Western Sydney 9.16 (70) Etihad Stadium
Richmond 9.10 (64) def.Greater Western Sydney 6.9 (45) MCG
Western Bulldogs 7.15 (57) def. byGreater Western Sydney 16.9 (105) Etihad Stadium
Richmond def GWS- Prelim Final

2018-

Collingwood 12.7 (79) def. byGreater Western Sydney 15.5 (95) MCG
St Kilda 10.13 (73) drew withGreater Western Sydney 9.19 (73) Etihad Stadium
Carlton 7.4 (46) def. by Greater Western Sydney 23.13 (151)Etihad Stadium
Melbourne 15.12 (102) def. Greater Western Sydney 8.9 (57) MCG

I must admit I was wrong on the count and they have won 6 1/2 but that is out of 13 games so they are running at 50% which isn't bad but all but 1 was at Etihad. I know they have only played 4 games at the G and actually they did manage to win 1 but there is the problem. Aside from beating Collingwood at the start of last season when they didn't have the best start to the season they haven't won there. It's just not enough practice nor indication that they could do it there imo. They do have a good record away at other grounds but it only counts in Melbourne in the finals.

 

[saints_333]

contenders and pretenders change week by week. the competition in 2019 is too even and unpredictable compared to a few years ago where you confidently declare hawthorn, sydney, geelong as contenders. no disrespect, but the top teams atm don't strike any fear. wouldn't surprise me if essendon or a port type get on a run now and charge towards the grand final.

Port?? lol

 

[Isaac Cumming No 1]

GWS Melbourne games since 2016-

2016-
Melbourne 12.8 (80) def.Greater Western Sydney 10.18 (78) MCG
St Kilda 12.7 (79) def. by Greater Western Sydney 19.12 (126) Etihad Stadium
Essendon 12.18 (90) def. by Greater Western Sydney 17.15 (117) Etihad Stadium
North Melbourne 9.9 (63) def. by Greater Western Sydney 14.16 (100) Etihad Stadium

2017-
St Kilda 16.12 (108) def.Greater Western Sydney 12.13 (85) Etihad Stadium
Carlton 10.11 (71) def.Greater Western Sydney 9.16 (70) Etihad Stadium
Richmond 9.10 (64) def.Greater Western Sydney 6.9 (45) MCG
Western Bulldogs 7.15 (57) def. byGreater Western Sydney 16.9 (105) Etihad Stadium
Richmond def GWS- Prelim Final

2018-

Collingwood 12.7 (79) def. byGreater Western Sydney 15.5 (95) MCG
St Kilda 10.13 (73) drew withGreater Western Sydney 9.19 (73) Etihad Stadium
Carlton 7.4 (46) def. by Greater Western Sydney 23.13 (151)Etihad Stadium
Melbourne 15.12 (102) def. Greater Western Sydney 8.9 (57) MCG

I must admit I was wrong on the count and they have won 6 1/2 but that is out of 13 games so they are running at 50% which isn't bad but all but 1 was at Etihad. I know they have only played 4 games at the G and actually they did manage to win 1 but there is the problem. Aside from beating Collingwood at the start of last season when they didn't have the best start to the season they haven't won there. It's just not enough practice nor indication that they could do it there imo. They do have a good record away at other grounds but it only counts in Melbourne in the finals.

Mmmm
Your not doing well. Your wrong again, last year against the Pies is not the only time we've won at the G.
I'm over correcting you though. Bye