List Mgmt. Contracts, trades, draft - 2022 superstar edition

[Keys]

Link to contract status of all players -

The Contracts Thread

2024 List Changes : Out: Retired- Gaff Delisted - Jones, Trew(R), Baker(R), Witherden, Burgiel, Culley(R), Rotham, L Edwards Traded - Darling (NM) Barrass (Hawthorn) In: Trade/FA acquisitions - Graham (Richmond) Baker (Richmond) Owies (Carlton) Draft - Allan (Pick 16) Shanahan (Pick 30) Gross...

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[Wild Kelly]

Nah. I explained this when I first jumped on.

I like following a teams rebuild.

Was following Freo for the past few years. Jumped off them last year, when I expected them to make finals this year.

Just interested. So you have been spending a fair bit of time on the Cockburners' and Roos' forums over the past decade?
I quite like most of what you have to contribute but don't criticise us or we will turn on you like snakes!

 

[BeornJ]

Gepp clearly responsible for the Brander debacle too. View attachment 1419058

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Classic Eagles here... Brander looks uncomfortable and wants to avoid contact.

Darling looking like he is fumbling his applause

 

[bzparkes]

Tim Gepp is the Claremont serial killer.

 

[06Premiers]

Nah. I explained this when I first jumped on.

I like following a teams rebuild.

Was following Freo for the past few years. Jumped off them last year, when I expected them to make finals this year.

Will you stay & follow Deven's development into a Norm Smith & Brownlow winning champion here?

 

[Jumpoff Joey]

He's contracted until 2023.

How do you improve our draft position in the PSD?

I dont know what is possible surrounding the rules and draft tampering so bear with me.

I was thinking trade out PSD pick to Adelaide/Port their first in the National Draft, less capital than dealing with North Melbourne allowing him to walk to Port for free. Or alternatively see if we can sell ourselves to get him on our list instead, unlikely but why not?

He’s allegedly not dealing with the sh!t show that is North at the moment. What makes you believe he’d leave one for another?

Sorry, I try to be polite when visiting opposition boards, but sometimes someone says something that just triggers me.

Thought there was some personal clashes and heavy oversight due to him visiting family etc?

As for Eagles latest performance. Yeah, we're shit on field for the moment.

But there would be so many intangibles that only the upper echelon of clubs can provide, West Coast being one these clubs. And, i'll back the club in to make a comeback.

 

[bzparkes]

I dont know what is possible surrounding the rules and draft tampering so bear with me.

I was thinking trade out PSD pick to Adelaide/Port their first in the National Draft, less capital than dealing with North Melbourne allowing him to walk to Port for free. Or alternatively see if we can sell ourselves to get him on our list instead, unlikely but why not?


Thought there was some personal clashes and heavy oversight due to him visiting family etc?

As for Eagles latest performance. Yeah, we're shit on field for the moment.

But there would be so many intangibles that only the upper echelon of clubs can provide, West Coast being one these clubs. And, i'll back the club in to make a comeback.

You can't trade PSD/rookie/MSD picks, only ND.

 

[Yeo_Check_Out_ma_Flow]

Classic Eagles here... Brander looks uncomfortable and wants to avoid contact.

Darling looking like he is fumbling his applause

Darling's got rubber hands

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[ROYAL EAGLE]

Would Elijah hewett be In top 3 contention if he was playing colts and averaging 30+ touches rather than seniors?

Yes

 

[briztoon]

Just interested. So you have been spending a fair bit of time on the Cockburners' and Roos' forums over the past decade?
I quite like most of what you have to contribute but don't criticise us or we will turn on you like snakes!

Nah, mostly on GC and Freo the past few years. Check in on Adelaide on the rare occasion. I am interested to see what Richmond do, if they grab Aaron Cadman with their first pick this year, I reckon they’ll be halfway through their rebuild without even bottoming out.

I try not to criticise, but I also try to keep my comments realistic as I see things, which can sometimes rub people up the wrong way, even on our board.

 

[briztoon]

Will you stay & follow Deven's development into a Norm Smith & Brownlow winning champion here?

You’ve paid attention to my avatar right?

 

[briztoon]

Thought there was some personal clashes and heavy oversight due to him visiting family etc?

As for Eagles latest performance. Yeah, we're shit on field for the moment.

But there would be so many intangibles that only the upper echelon of clubs can provide, West Coast being one these clubs. And, i'll back the club in to make a comeback.

This is where I have to be careful with my reply.

First, I don’t know the “real” reason/s for your performances. Yes I know covid hit your playing group late, and you have had a very bad injury run, but my personal belief is the problem runs much deeper.

Secondly, much of what I base my belief on, comes from the media narrative from the past two seasons, and I know the media don’t report everything.

 

[mattyc75]

This is where I have to be careful with my reply.

First, I don’t know the “real” reason/s for your performances. Yes I know covid hit your playing group late, and you have had a very bad injury run, but my personal belief is the problem runs much deeper.

Secondly, much of what I base my belief on, comes from the media narrative from the past two seasons, and I know the media don’t report everything.

You're right our horrid run didnt start with covid or injuries, there must be more to it.
Theres been games this year where weve had a more experienced team than the opposition and still been spanked.
Obviously age plays a part ,also i think some of them never got the desire back after winning the flag
I daresay the players would know a crap/out dated gameplan wont win them games so it would be hard to stay motivated

Sent from my SM-G973F using Tapatalk

 

[Keys]

This is where I have to be careful with my reply.

First, I don’t know the “real” reason/s for your performances. Yes I know covid hit your playing group late, and you have had a very bad injury run, but my personal belief is the problem runs much deeper.

Secondly, much of what I base my belief on, comes from the media narrative from the past two seasons, and I know the media don’t report everything.

As a general rule, criticism from opposition posters is acceptable provided it is constructive and/or measured and doesn’t stray into trolling territory

Personally, as someone who has limited knowledge on potential draftees, I’ve enjoyed reading your posts on this years draft cohort.

Keep it respectful like you have to date and there won’t be any issues

Given your interest in our board is in our rebuild I’m sure you’ll understand when I say I hope your time here is short lived

 

[briztoon]

You're right our horrid run didnt start with covid or injuries, there must be more to it.
Theres been games this year where weve had a more experienced team than the opposition and still been spanked.
Obviously age plays a part ,also i think some of them never got the desire back after winning the flag
I daresay the players would know a crap/out dated gameplan wont win them games so it would be hard to stay motivated

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That would speak to a bigger cultural issue, and could fit in with my belief.

I look at how different WC and Freo handled the 2020 season, and believe WC still hasn’t recovered from 2020.

 

[WCE_Phill]

briztoon nailed it!

Forget game plans, coaching, S&C which have played a part

All starts with the pathetic attitude since 2018

 

[bzparkes]

briztoon nailed it!

Forget game plans, coaching, S&C which have played a part

All starts with the pathetic attitude since 2018

Nah mate, until briztoon acknowledges that Tim Gepp is the root of all our problems as a club, he'll forever be wrong in any assessment he provides.

 

[briztoon]

Nah mate, until briztoon acknowledges that Tim Gepp is the root of all our problems as a club, he'll forever be wrong in any assessment he provides.

Who the fook is Tim Gepp?

briztoon nailed it!

Forget game plans, coaching, S&C which have played a part

All starts with the pathetic attitude since 2018

Umm, I didn’t say that.

 

[WCE_phil]

This is where I have to be careful with my reply.

First, I don’t know the “real” reason/s for your performances. Yes I know covid hit your playing group late, and you have had a very bad injury run, but my personal belief is the problem runs much deeper.

Secondly, much of what I base my belief on, comes from the media narrative from the past two seasons, and I know the media don’t report everything.

There are multiple issues surrounding the club.

1. The soft cap particularly how low it dropped due to covid. As the richest club in the land we are used to operating in a manner where being tight on money isn't normal.
2. Trevor Nisbett. Great financial manager of the club but has been too involved for too long and there needs to be a change at the top. But he basically owns WA footy and has every possible business connection you can think of. Yes the club has been successful under his tenure but there have also been major issues and he is past it. To put it into perspective he has more control in WA footy and business than Eddie or Kennett ever did in Victoria. WA football is also fractured in general due to the WAFC being a corrupt mess and the WAFL clubs (apart from what has been a hugely mutually beneficial deal between freo and peel (like east perth and WCE 20 odd years ago) having a hard on against the WCE. Nisbett is money, but footy in WA needs a lot of love and those two have become a more and more toxic relationship.
3. 10+ years of not having access to high level draft picks
4. Our S&C and Medical staff are not class. We used to be able to get around this by having more than other clubs. However with soft caps in place and Nisbett's jobs for the boys attitude we are falling heavily behind.
5. Our rock hard home ground and training grounds. Combine that with number 1 and number 4 and you have seen a meteoric rise in overuse and leg injuries.
6. Our coach is trapped between a rock and a hard place. He built a gameplan around the players we had and got a premiership out of it. The problem with this is that the AFL have changed the rules in a manner that has hurt those players strengths whilst making them even more succeptible the other way. A change of game plan started to be trialled and implemented in a few quarters and halves last year and was worked on over the off season but with the Injury list combined with Covid hitting when it has basically been shelved for the year.
7. Our Star players are falling away with age. Mundy is an outlier but even pav and hurn looked to have been played on well past their expiry. WA based players tend to fall in a hole once they hit 30+ and we have way too many of them.
8. Directly relating to 1 but we have lost key staff members who we havent been able to replace with adequate people and it is very hard to attract people in those roles to WA. Even for leaders in the field of S&C there is only so much love for a football team. It is hard to get the best even in your own state when they would have to accept half the pay or less than what they are currently paid.
9. There seems to be a direct fracture within the playing group between the older players and the younger players. Particularly since whatever happened with Darren Glass and the club went down but it goes back further to Schofield, Lecras, Jetta etc.
10. Our clubs recruiting department is also factional and has been for years with our senior recruiter over riding the consensus of our other recruiters at times. He has already announced this will be his last year. Due again to the soft cap he is also currently our List Manager.
11. Tim Gepp has basically been the mouse in the corner reporting everything back to Nisbett for way too long and it has upset multiple coaches and in particular some assistants.
12. Our list structure is broken in regards to the areas and level of talent and their age profile.

We have some good young talent particularly from last years draft (you'll see in a few years but we ****ing nailed it even without seeing Chesser) but outside of Brady Hough and Oscar Allen none of it seems to be absolute top tier. So in reality we need to nail two more drafts, have 3 years of development into those players before we start to look up. Our 2022 was supposed to come in 2024.

The club may have a dead cat bounce next year before we do hit a hard bottom in 2024. This year I think we have been really unlucky to have the year we have had when we had it. We will likely finish 17th meaning we don't have access to the top two mids in this years draft and has recently been pointed out and then confirmed in phone conversation with me Today the other potential top tier mid in the draft is more stuck in melbourne than Bailey Williams was. If we don't finish 18th at this stage I want us to downgrade that real world pick to to about pick 6 depending on what happens from here on out.

This isn't the clubs lowest ebb. 2008, 2001, 1989 all are below it but some very serious changes need to be made and we are really hamstrung in regards to the soft cap. (we are in a much worse place now than in 2010 when we finished with the wooden spoon)

 

[Keys]

That would speak to a bigger cultural issue, and could fit in with my belief.

I look at how different WC and Freo handled the 2020 season, and believe WC still hasn’t recovered from 2020.

I’ll say this at the outset lest there be any confusion created by the rest of this post that follows - the club didn’t handle the first hub and the period leading up to it at all well and it’s my personal belief that divisions were created during that hub which haven’t been resolved since. We haven’t been the same team and whilst there’s been outside factors compounding our problems our descent began on the Gold Coast in 2020

Now with that said, I believe the players concerns with the hub at the time were somewhat justified - it was a particularly uncertain period for the country as a whole and it fell on the WA clubs to agree to relocate to Queensland for an unspecified time for the AFL to be in a position to resume. It was a burden and whilst you’re correct in saying Fremantle handled it better, I’ve no doubt that was due in part to them having a younger list and less players with families

Now there’s been plenty of time since then to resolve whatever issues did stem from that first hub and we haven’t done so. If anything, they’ve worsened to the extent we’re a shell of the united team that won in 2018 with a myriad of problems

 

[dinnaz]

At this stage I'd be happy to move down for an early second rounder (keeping in mind Ashcroft likely commands a top 3 bid):

North Melbourne #2 & F2(19)
Essendon #3 & #21
Possibly
GWS #4 & #22
Adelaide #5 & #23

 

[briztoon]

I’ll say this at the outset lest there be any confusion created by the rest of this post that follows - the club didn’t handle the first hub and the period leading up to it at all well and it’s my personal belief that divisions were created during that hub which haven’t been resolved since. We haven’t been the same team and whilst there’s been outside factors compounding our problems our descent began on the Gold Coast in 2020

Now with that said, I believe the players concerns with the hub at the time were somewhat justified - it was a particularly uncertain period for the country as a whole and it fell on the WA clubs to agree to relocate to Queensland for an unspecified time for the AFL to be in a position to resume. It was a burden and whilst you’re correct in saying Fremantle handled it better, I’ve no doubt that was due in part to them having a younger list and less players with families

Now there’s been plenty of time since then to resolve whatever issues did stem from that first hub and we haven’t done so. If anything, they’ve worsened to the extent we’re a shell of the united team that won in 2018 with a myriad of problems

I agree with all that, and it’s bang on with my belief, as an outsider.

And yes the Hub was bad for older teams with more families. Some clubs cough*Richmond*cough got pandered to far more than others.

 

[Rowan18]

that isn’t an insult to a QLD’er.

The idea of sporting club membership was/is a foreign concept in QLD. We’re in a non footy State, where the idea of membership in all sports was/is a bit foreign in the State in general.

As a state, we’re the biggest bandwagon, sports hopping, fickle supporters you will find in Australia. We love a winner and will pack out a stadium of any local winning team. But loser’s, **** there’s to many other teams to go watch.

We’re also soft when it comes to the weather. If it’s bellow 20 degrees, no one ain’t going out in that sh!t weather. We’ll stay home and watch it on TV.

Who buys a membership when you can just get tickets at the gate. I might go this weekend, but next week who knows, it might be cold(ish).

The Brisbane Bronco’s are the West Coast Eagles of the NRL, and the Lions have more members than the Broncos. Club membership just really isn’t a thing here.

We always had a core of 25k members (10k in Melbourne though) right through the bad years. We didn’t struggle to find members, we struggled to attract new members.

We have a different psyche here, so that ain’t an insult.

I have a soft spot for Brissie and hope you guys win it this year. I wasn't trying to insult the club, just point out that West Coast are nowhere close to the same situation off field that you guys had to overcome.

 

[Rowan18]

Pretty bl00dy harsh there on the drafts...

2007:
Masten (215 gms)
Ebert (268 gms/76? @ Eagles)
Notte
Scooter (169 gms/135@ Eagles)
McGinnity (93 gms)
Pretty bl00dy good draft. 2 s 200 gamers, plus Scooter liekly would have been bar injuries... The fact we got Eberted and Notte didn't switch to Fb are the only real misses.

2008:
NicNat (208 gms)
Shuey (228 gms)
Swift
Ash Smith
J Jones
2 top 5 list players - A+.

2009:
Sheppard (216 gms)
Weedon
Stevens
A 200 gamer is good.

I didn't say we did badly in 07 and 08, but considering it was a full rebuild, we didn't get as many A Graders as you'd like.

Masto was good solid depth, but we're all hoping to draft a midfield leader with a top 3 pick. He was a best 11-22 player, but nowhere near the talent you'd dream of at that selection.

Ebert got better later but never showed anything amazing for us. Dudded us on the trade too.

Selwood was a solid B grader.

Shuey and Nic Nat were good selections - good draft there. Both A Graders. Didn't end up with anything else of value from that draft.

2009 was total crap when you look at how much we stuffed every selection past the first. Shep ended up good, but not until 2015.

Considering we were rebuilding, we only ended up with one A grade midfielder (Shuey) in the three drafts. Selwood and Masto played good roles in 2011/12, but their talent dropped away after then.

2010 was the draft that secured the rebuild, adding another quality mid and an amazing spine with Darling, Gov and Lycett as a bonus.

 

[WCE_phil]

I didn't say we did badly in 07 and 08, but considering it was a full rebuild, we didn't get as many A Graders as you'd like.

Masto was good solid depth, but we're all hoping to draft a midfield leader with a top 3 pick. He was a best 11-22 player, but nowhere near the talent you'd dream of at that selection.

Ebert got better later but never showed anything amazing for us. Dudded us on the trade too.

Selwood was a solid B grader.

Shuey and Nic Nat were good selections - good draft there. Both A Graders. Didn't end up with anything else of value from that draft.

2009 was total crap when you look at how much we stuffed every selection past the first. Shep ended up good, but not until 2015.

Considering we were rebuilding, we only ended up with one A grade midfielder (Shuey) in the three drafts. Selwood and Masto played good roles in 2011/12, but their talent dropped away after then.

2010 was the draft that secured the rebuild, adding another quality mid and an amazing spine with Darling, Gov and Lycett as a bonus.

The Yeo, Cripps, Redden, Jetta and Vardy trades ended up winning us the flag in 2018.

 

[Keys]

Thinking out loud

There’s every possibility at some point we’ll jump above North on the ladder giving us pick 2 in the draft which will effectively become pick 3

Assuming Wardlaw and Ashcroft are taken as expected, there’s no standout pick 3 and the one that might jump up there (Sheezel) is a potential flight risk

So, based on current ladder positions, we

1) Trade pick 3 to GWS for pick 5 and Bruhn
2) Trade ours (21) and Ports (26) 2nd round picks to Brisbane for their first (18) and Robertson. Gives Brisbane an extra 622 points for Ashcroft and values Robertson at about pick 31

Use pick 5 on Hewett and 18 on Broadbent if he’s still there

Gives us Bruhn, Robertson, Hewett and Broadbent to add to Culley, Chesser, Hough and Bazzo

And we’d still have our 3rd pick (39) to use

For the above to work it probably needs GWS to rise from 15th as Bruhn would likely be worth more than a 2 spot upgrade which is fine as it’s sounding likely Hewett lasts past 5 anyway

Also if Brisbane finish lower than 2nd the points upgrade isn’t as significant making that trade harder

And yes it’s dependant on both Bruhn and Robertson being willing to come here and their respective clubs being willing to part with them

So totally unlikely but it looks a nice pipe dream to an uneducated draft watcher