Cousins or Pratt? Who has brought the game into disrepute more?

[Carn the Coasters]

Cue the Carlton mods to overtake the thread and sing the praises of Pratt.

You do realise you could use this thread to bag out Benny?

 

[budf23]

Shouldn't happen not after what the Essenscum football club did a few years ago leaving up to 40k supporters not able to attend a game. The whole pratt vs cousins thing is BS

 

[- PC -]

Pratts issues have no connection with football

If he hadnt had corrupt business deals he would be a multi millionaire and not a billionaire

 

[Ruanaidh]

The price fixing Cartel affected all and sundry, anyone who purchased anything in packaging Australia-wide, including the AFL and its suppliers/sponsors. If it had occurred in the US Pratt would be co-habitating with Bubba as we speak. Cousin's affliction causes subjective harm only to those who choose to take offence. In the end he is an adult and his choices in life are affecting him alone. The AFL has displayed duplicitious logic and morals in the the way they have handled these two situations.

 

[blueboy1960]

On the one hand, we have a troubled young man who has a medical condition (drug addiction) that he has admitted to and is seeking help for.
On the other hand, we have a wise (cunning) elderly businessman and current Blues' president who has made around 700 million dollars from price fixing (and that is the public's money in the end), who admits to it and then is fined 36 million dollars. This is a white collar crime that is punishable in many other countries with a jail sentence.
Question. Who has brought the game into disrepute more? The young guy who has mainly hurt himself and his family or the older guy who has robbed everyone in the country through price fixing?
I know who I would choose.....

Its nice to see that all the oppositon teams are still smarting over Carlton's Mighty President. Wouldn't Richmond love to have a benefactor like Pratt to get them out of their mess or for that matter Greg Swann to replace that hack Greg Miller who could not even select a champion if one fell over him. Does everyone forget that Prat employes over 6,000 employees in Australia. That is a lot of mouths that he feeds. Or the fact that he & his companys donate millions yes millions per year to the arts, medicine & research & what about all his invetments in reclyling techniques. Whilst we are on the high horse about business how is what he done any different to the actions of other wealthy individuals. I bet I & the avearge punter pays more tax then any high paying exectutive. Oh and what about some of Australia most famous sports figures that have their residence in tax havens. Their actions are just the same depriving Australians of Tax revenue. So when you start throwing mud just watch were it sticks. Yes Visy did the wrong thing & they are paying for it now I see the AMCOR got off scott free what about their executives, They just got in first to dob the other guy in. Pratt you can stay president at Carlton for as long as you want. Prattt like Eddie McGurie turely is passionate about the club, funny is in it Carlton & Collingwood arguably Australias most powerful Clubs have the most passsioante Presidents who are there for the love of the club not for what the club can do for them. They mirror the feeeling of their cupporters So for all you other supporters be afraid very affraid the Carlton beast has awakended, GO Blues !!!

 

[lazy]

Eddie - for saying he wanted to "Pork" Jessica Rowe. The soccer Mums were disgusted with this!

 

[huggy_b]

Sadly I agree with the Carlton posters on this one.

Pratt who?

 

[Melbdave81]

Richmond supports, you are pathetic. You bag everyone else to deflect from your own massive issues.

While what Pratt did a few years ago was wrong, he is being punished, but it seems many on BF feel the need to become judge and jury as well. In the end, if you were smart enough you would be, but given that most of you are muppets, i suggest you go back a read your Woman's Day or New Idea to get your daily intake of news and leave the serious talk to people with a clue.

Build a bridge and get over it you w***ers, this has nothing to do with the Carlton Football Club as the price fixing occured before Pratt became president. CAN YOU MUPPETS UNDERSTAND THAT? He is now the president but everyone new that there were charges pending before he was put into the position.

Dont be jealous because we have a president who cares and wants to see his club succeed, worry about your own clubs and the issues you have and to the Richmond supporters, enjoy your spoon and pick 2, cause in the end we all now that's where the hate comes from

 

[iRemember87]

I can see how this thread has happened!!!

Cousins and Pratt are both role models to many young children out there, and both their actions could make many children out there repeat what they have done!!

Shame on you Mr Pratt for showing a bad example to young school kids....they might now get together at lunch and price fix the lunch orders!!!

Shame, Shame, Shame!!!

Typical Richmond twat having another dig at Carlton....one day Richmond fans will wake from the dead and see Carlton are still here...still beating their sorry pathetic ass....history won't change and neither will the future...enjoy the bottom 4 next year....

Funny how you'll finish that low and your coach comes out before preseason and says "there are no excuses for missing the finals in 2008'' blah blah blah

Famous last words from the last Hawks coach to be sacked!!! Wallace out before 2008 is finished!!!

 

[Carlton Kid]

Hmmm let me think about that...

 

[chrisjie]

Cousins got a huge sentence initially and served it. Came back and played well, passed all the medicals etc. Then gets targeted by the cops and has some perscription medicine on him and charges get dropped. So he did nothing.

Pratt on the other hand has served no sentence no punishment for taking money out of the pocket of Australians. His company made $500 million off price fixing. Yet they're fined $ 36 million. So that's a $464M profit. If you proposed that to Visy again, they'd do it in a heartbeat.

Pratt personally got no punishment, but undoubtedly made millions of salary bonuses etc.

But Pratt's thing has nothing to do with football....so probably Cousins. But I dont' think either brought it into disrepute.

 

[Maxyfan]

Dick Pratt is a disgrace and any aargument to the contrary is pathetic. He went into court and knew that he would get a (relatively) miniscule fine so freely admitted to a crime. It is funny to see all the Carlton supporters rallying around a criminal who has probably directly or indirectly ripped them off because he has been the president of the club.

Ben Cousins is an idiot that still does not know what he did wrong. His actions have brought the game into more disrepute because if you are a kid in NSW/QLD you will probably not hear very much about the game except that this guy thinks that he is a rockstar and gets drugged up whenever he feels like it.

The idea that Ben Cousins did not hurt anyine but himself is true if he wasn't (unfortunately) an ambassador for the game.

 

[Jumpin' Jimmy]

Datt Prick has brought the game, Carlton Football Club and corporate Australia into disrepute. Only for his habit of donating ill-gotten gains to worthwhile "charities" he would be behind bars for a long time.

BILLIONAIRE Richard Pratt and his most senior executives at Visy Industries engaged in a deliberate bid to conceal Australia's worst cartel since corporate collusion was outlawed, a Federal Court judge said yesterday.

"Had it not been accidentally exposed, it would probably still be flourishing," said Justice Peter Heerey. "It was run from the highest level in Visy … It was carefully and deliberately concealed. It was operated by men who were fully aware of its seriously unlawful nature."

http://www.theage.com.au/articles/2007/11/02/1193619147550.html


How ironic it is that on the same day his company was found guilty of price-fixing the Richmond Football Club announced Dick Smith Enterprises as a new major sponsor.

Richmond President Gary March said the Tigers were delighted to have secured Dick Smith Electronics as a co-major partner, alongside Australian Finance Group/AFG, who have supported the Club over the past three years.

“Dick Smith Electronics is a dynamic force in the Australian electronics industry with an excellent reputation for customer service, and it is an ideal fit for the Richmond Football Club,” March said.

“There is a real synergy between Dick Smith Electronics and the Tigers – iconic brands, with the same striking colors, innovative approach and care for our consumers.

http://richmondfc.com.au/Season2007/News/NewsArticle/tabid/6301/Default.aspx?newsId=52991

I think it sums up perfectly the difference between Carlton and Richmond. It is very much a question of morality. Carlton clearly loves Dirty Dick

 

[YellowandBlackBlood]

The fact that Pratt committed the crime in 2001-2004 does not mean he is immune from criticism today. Just look at the facts.
He is the current president of Carlton.
While presiding over Carlton, he is charged and proven guilty over price fixing.
He receives the biggest fine in Australia's corporate history while he is the Carlton president..
If he were in the US, he would now be behind bars.

So there you have it. A current president proven to be a white collar criminal of immense proportions. The fact he is allowed to continue in a position of power may indicate how shady the whole AFL infrastructure is. That is how he brings the game into disrepute!

If Demetriou had any decency, he would ask Carlton to sack him as president. The competition just cannot ignore this.

Imagine if it were Demetriou that was involved with price fixing related to his involvement with companies outside football. He would immediately be asked to step down. I have no doubt about that.

Why is Pratt any different?

 

[lazy]

It wouldnt be Carlton if they didnt have a crook in charge.

Even Collo - sells out Optus Oval to get them into the Dome just to improve his own financial situation. The back rooms at Carlton must be pretty extensive for all those deals being done

 

[rockape]

what is it wif ppl trying to find anything to rubbish carlton. we been down for years and now we r rising they still want to put the boots in. carlton will shut all of you up in the near future. he who laughs last , laughs loudest. our day is coming you sooky lala's

 

[mediumsizered]

Cousins got a huge sentence initially and served it. Came back and played well, passed all the medicals etc. Then gets targeted by the cops and has some perscription medicine on him and charges get dropped. So he did nothing.

Pratt on the other hand has served no sentence no punishment for taking money out of the pocket of Australians. His company made $500 million off price fixing. Yet they're fined $ 36 million. So that's a $564M profit. If you proposed that to Visy again, they'd do it in a heartbeat.

Pratt personally got no punishment, but undoubtedly made millions of salary bonuses etc.

Pratt got punished according to the applicable laws for price fixing. It is as simple as that. Take your beef up with those who make the laws. BTW, how do you know his company made $500 million from price fixing? No-one knows how much Visy or Amcor made from price-fixing. All you & the media is basing that figure on is a statement by Maurice Blackburn Cashman that a class action will most likely be fought against the two companies & MBC have plucked a figure of $700 million as the starting point.

As for your comment about Cousins. Tell us more about his punishment. He still received his $800k contracted pay while only playing a handful of games. I hardly see that as being a punishment. Why this sudden 'poor Benny' attitude? He has brought all of this on himself. While most of the current AFL listed players seem to be able to stay out of trouble (except for the few larrikins & we all know who they are), Cousins has lurched from one disaster to another. I suppose you would have us believe that his 'bolting' from his car & going for a run & a swim to avoid police, was just part of pre-season training. The guy deserves very little sympathy. Save the sympathy for his poor father who is having to front the media to try & protect the image of his wayward son.

 

[mediumsizered]

It wouldnt be Carlton if they didnt have a crook in charge.

Even Collo - sells out Optus Oval to get them into the Dome just to improve his own financial situation. The back rooms at Carlton must be pretty extensive for all those deals being done

Optus Oval is a relic from the past. It would have been madness for Carlton to stay there much longer. The days of the old suburban footy ground were long gone. It certainly did Essendon & Collingwood no harm to give playing games at Windy Hill & Victoria Park. Perhaps your club should still be playing games at the Lake Oval.

 

[1jasonoz]

Cousins activities occurred whilst he was in the AFL.

Pratts occurred prior to him becoming the president of the Blues;

So cousins.

 

[tigerlee]

Pratt got punished according to the applicable laws for price fixing. It is as simple as that. Take your beef up with those who make the laws. BTW, how do you know his company made $500 million from price fixing? No-one knows how much Visy or Amcor made from price-fixing. All you & the media is basing that figure on is a statement by Maurice Blackburn Cashman that a class action will most likely be fought against the two companies & MBC have plucked a figure of $700 million as the starting point.

As for your comment about Cousins. Tell us more about his punishment. He still received his $800k contracted pay while only playing a handful of games. I hardly see that as being a punishment. Why this sudden 'poor Benny' attitude? He has brought all of this on himself. While most of the current AFL listed players seem to be able to stay out of trouble (except for the few larrikins & we all know who they are), Cousins has lurched from one disaster to another. I suppose you would have us believe that his 'bolting' from his car & going for a run & a swim to avoid police, was just part of pre-season training. The guy deserves very little sympathy. Save the sympathy for his poor father who is having to front the media to try & protect the image of his wayward son.

...... you conveniently overlooked the fact that Cousins has NO convictions for any of the things that you have highlighted. The same cannot be said for Pratt though. He has been found guilty and convicted of a nasty crime. In context, Pratt is far and away the winner as he has been caught and quartered. I know which one I believe is worse - the one with the record against them as it has been proven!

 

[Simche]

...... you conveniently overlooked the fact that Cousins has NO convictions for any of the things that you have highlighted. The same cannot be said for Pratt though. He has been found guilty and convicted of a nasty crime. In context, Pratt is far and away the winner as he has been caught and quartered. I know which one I believe is worse - the one with the record against them as it has been proven!

Actually your only really half right there. Pratt has been found guilty of a crime however the Liberal Party has failed to implement their policy from three years ago that would have handed down criminal convictions for white collar crime like price fixing (Labour may be in the pocket of Unions but the Libs are just as strongly involved with big Business). As such neither Ben Cousins nor Richard Pratt have criminal convictions.

I still believe that Pratt's association with the game is a blight which should be removed. People like him have no place at any club and for all the Carlton supporters trying to downplay his actions this is a man who ripped millions of dollars off of normal working Australians for his own personal gain. Every time you bought a chocolate bar or a slab of beer in those years he was personally taking money off you. Just because he's in charge of a big company they can call it price fixing but what it really is, is theft and he should serve a term accordingly. Compared with the fact that as yet Cousins is yet to fail a drug test, yet to be caught with a class A drug and yet to be charged/won't be charged based on incompetent and lazy police work I really think I could tolerate him reentering the league provided he rehabilitates.

Whilst he is an admitted drug user provided there are no links to supply I still feel that Cousins' crime is not nearly as bad and less worthy of bringing the game into disrepute defined as "involved in conduct which is unbecoming or likely to prejudice the interests or reputation of the AFL or to bring the game of football into disrepute". I fail to see how Pratt's infraction even should they have been committed prior to his presidency fail to meet that definition now that he has been found guilty. The AFL and Carlton should do the decent thing and ask Pratt to resign his position.

 

[Ruanaidh]

Richmond supporters, enjoy your spoon and pick 2, cause in the end we all now that's where the hate comes from

Not true. In this instance Richmond supporters are just dispassionate observers discussing a very topical thread. The belligerent, inane defence you offer however reflects your fear of losing your President. Which you will. Just make sure you've changed the safe combination before he leaves. What a laughing stock of a club!

 

[Schwabie]

I guess that includes the people who set the petrol prices in this country.

Pratt hasn't been banned from sitting on any boards like Elliott because he ran companies into the ground. Pratt's offences have nothing at all to do with football and shouldn't force him out from Carlton. The irony of an organisation deciding if Pratt is fit to be President due to a social cancer like pokies has been lost on the "intellects" who want him gone. Pokies and gambling has done more damage to the community than price fixing ever will.

Every club other would gladly take Pratt's money and sacrifice their morals if he wanted to join their board.

You're delusional if you think otherwise.

This is about the fourth post on this thread which has noted that "Pratt's offences don't have anything to do with football".

On that note, would it be right for a former convicted murderer (who has served his sentence) to be a president of a football club? Surely his offence too would have had "nothing to do with football".

 

[Melbdave81]

Not true. In this instance Richmond supporters are just dispassionate observers discussing a very topical thread. The belligerent, inane defence you offer however reflects your fear of losing your President. Which you will. Just make sure you've changed the safe combination before he leaves. What a laughing stock of a club!

HAHA, you are a very insecure individual aren't you. Even if we do lose, him which we wont. Im interested to hear why you think we will. There are plenty of other to take over his role of president so we'll be just fine.

I'd be worrying about your own clubs issues, 27 years isn't it.

 

[Ruanaidh]

Im interested to hear why you think we will.

His position is untenable. Either the AFL will be forced by P/O to pressure him to resign or he will fall on his own sword claiming 'familiy' or 'health' reasons. I dont think you, or other Carlton supporters, understand the scope of his deception and its ramifications. As for 27yrs....pfft...its next year that counts.