Dear Collingwood - Do what you must to ensure Trav signs on

[Dundalis]

If this is serious then Cloke hands down. Dawes was simply insipid in the first GF, utterly horrible. Cloke on the other hand was good, would have been great if he kicked straight for goal, still on contribution he was there and there abouts as the best foward on the ground.

Dawes was a little bit better in the second GF and Cloke a little worse but it was hardly enough to bridge the gap between Cloke and Dawes in the first final.

As for the thread I have mentioned else where if Trav had any intention to go it would have been explored elsewhere before the draft, where they could have found him a more suitable home rather then play the lottery that will be the pre-season draft. As Zahki has mentioned I think David Cloke was asked and in an effort to push things along with a club made this comment / threat without fully understanding (or with full knowledge) of the drama it would create in a hope of getting a better deal from the club.

Though I ultimately agree, I would say however that Dawes has significantly more room for improvement. It was only the middle of the year that Dawes started to feel relatively confident in the side. Had he played the whole season, he probably would have kicked around the same amount of goals as Cloke. I think he can improve quite a bit next season, while Cloke is relatively limited in where he goes from here. He's already one of the better contested marks in the league, works as hard as any CHF etc, and is highly unlikely to significantly improve his goal kicking as much as year after year Collingwood fans keep saying he will. He will always have an issue with his kicking just like Richo and others have.

Dawes on the other hand has plenty of room for improvement given the physical domination he has proven in periods but not consistently he can impose upon defenders. As his confidence continues to rise he will start to use this more consistently.

I actually think Dawes will be our leading goal kicker for a number of years whether Cloke goes or stays.

 

[Alexander323bc]

Cloke's first assist was due to Dawes tapping it to him. At least be able to back up your arguments. Dawes also kicked two goals and was involved in more plays that resulted in goals then Cloke was. Watch the game again please.

My point is, if he wants more money, he should be slotting it in from 20m out directly in front. Until that point shut up and earn your pay rise, dont just expect it.

 

[Shoulz]

Trav is lucky he is at collingwood, & if he said that himself i say walk.!

 

[Strachuniee]

Cloke's first assist was due to Dawes tapping it to him. At least be able to back up your arguments. Dawes also kicked two goals and was involved in more plays that resulted in goals then Cloke was. Watch the game again please.

My point is, if he wants more money, he should be slotting it in from 20m out directly in front. Until that point shut up and earn your pay rise, dont just expect it.

Exactly, Dawes had at least 3-4 clever tap ons in the replay. Places a huge amount of defensive pressure and chases hard which is evident when watching him live. Was significantly better than cloke in the replay.

 

[shawthing09]

Cloke's first assist was due to Dawes tapping it to him. At least be able to back up your arguments. Dawes also kicked two goals and was involved in more plays that resulted in goals then Cloke was. Watch the game again please.

My point is, if he wants more money, he should be slotting it in from 20m out directly in front. Until that point shut up and earn your pay rise, dont just expect it.

Whilst there is no defence for missing goals from 20 out there is also no proof he is asking for a pay rise. There has been rumours that we have asked him to take a paycut. I am not sure what is true but I doubt you do either.

As I said there is no defence for missing goals from 20 out but we are the number one long kicking team in the comp and need guys who are able to put up big contests and take big contested marks and currently Cloke is a long way ahead of anyone else on the list at this. I'd almost go as far as to say Maccaffer is close to second best. If Cloke marks it and misses more often then not we lock it in and get another shot, if Dawes drops it and they rebound it is harder for us to set up defensively, especially considering he still has a tendancy to put in really poor efforts in the air at times.

I was probably harsh on Dawes replay game it was in all honesty pretty good but I still don't think he was the best foward across both GF's. Dawes was horrible and good, Cloke was good and average.

 

[Art Van der lay]

What is he worth $pa. If Swan is on $500k next year as an example.

 

[coopernewf]

C'mon people, we aren't talking about Judd or GAJ here. Cloke is an outstanding player in a couple of areas, but he isn't our most valuable player on the field either. Yes, he killed it in contested marks this year - but hey, he's not exactly the best kick in the league!!

Someone earlier said we should offer him a goal per goal bonus. I say that's precisely what we should do to keep him. Work for it Trav!

Truthfully, this is a (at least somewhat) ridiculous thread - The likelihood of him going anywhere is at best minimal. The only unfortunate thing if he actually were to leave, that we did not get enough time to arrange a deal during trade week for a suitable replacement.

But if by some one in a million chance he leaves, we will still be fine.

Out: Cloke
In: Anthony, Tarrant or Krakour.

 

[mwalker]

Re: Dear Collingwood

Most marks inside 50 of any player in GF2

Most goal assists of any player in GF2

Yeah a real no show

And he played in GF2 so he is a must keeper right eddie!!!

 

[Go_Brad_Dick]

OUT: Cloke (PSD Bye-bye)
IN: Tarrant (to backline)

Harry to half forward.

With Dick and Krakeour coming in, Maccaffer, Beams getting better, Sidebottom I think will explode next year, Didak starring again, Dawes becoming more consistent, Harry going forward, Jack Anthony with new drive to succeed, Leigh Brown continued brilliance, Jolly spending time up forward, and regular goals coming from Swan, Pendles, Wellingham, Johnson, Davis (he's not finished) we won't have room for Cloke's unko kicking at goal. Good-bye David Cloke. Nice try.

 

[ThePheonix]

Come on guys!! I know his skill level isn't that great, but a player of his size, strength and pace don't grow on trees and are very very rare. Thats the reason why Franklin is so highly valued and Travis fits in his catergory. Also comeon guys!! Dawes has not got his pace and size.

Thats the reason why I never understood why Richmond did not pick up Lance Franklin and now the same reason why I don't understand so many here don't value Travis.

 

[Swooop]

Re: Dear Collingwood

I'd clearly prefer trav stays, but at the end of the day, we'll be good with or without him.

I wouldn't break the bank to keep him.

And if his attitude sucks, then he can go also ( which i doubt it does, i think that's just his Dad)

 

[Daicosssssssssss]

I want Travis to stay. He does heaps around the ground. A very strong player for his age.

If he does go I feel that John Anthony will step into his position, without his dad as manager.

 

[Alexander323bc]

Re: Dear Collingwood

My point is when u r negotiating make sure u can back up ur argument. I got u to change ur tune on Dawes by simply presenting information that backs up my point of view. In Travis' case he should sign d contract and run because there is tons of evidence that he is not consistent enough to b making threats!

 

[Ickirus]

Cloke is worth 375-400K. A 35-40 goal a year KPF with accuracy of 30% (including OOB and complete misses) isn't worth more that. We were over paying him the last few years and he only deserves more when is able to improve his accuracy and gets above 45 goals a year.

The main thing we can learn from this though is his dad just needs to STFU

 

[ThePheonix]

Also I don't understand why everyone is having a go at Travis and his father. The way I see it is that Travis seems to be a nice bloke, with a very close family. He has a best friend in his brother and a father as a manager. To me thats a great thing, don't know everyone is having a go at them. I personally would love to have a family as close as they are.

 

[Cousin of Daicos]

We'll find out how Travis really feels about all this when he gets back from overseas.

If he sacks his dad, we'll know he's committed to the club. If he keeps his dad as manager despite knowing what has transpired, I don't see him being at Collingwood long term. Delaying the inevitable.

 

[WakeUpPies]

Also I don't understand why everyone is having a go at Travis and his father. The way I see it is that Travis seems to be a nice bloke, with a very close family. He has a best friend in his brother and a father as a manager. To me thats a great thing, don't know everyone is having a go at them. I personally would love to have a family as close as they are.

Family + Business = fail, Travis is in an awkward position where he can't fire his manager for making mistakes and causing scenes, especially since he still lives at home....

 

[rose jam]

I think this is a beat up getting lots of air time because there's no footy around - and basically it's October, the worst sport month of the year.

They're negotiating a contract, a bit of postering, it'll be resolved. Collingwood is not an organisation that lets good people and players go, on the principle of a few dollars. Our salary cap should be in a good state so I really don't see this as something that won't get resolved.

But dealing with David Cloke would be frustrating. Like what Ricky Nixon said this morning, because he doesn't deal with multiple players he doesn't really know what market value is.

 

[lozza63]

Come on guys!! I know his skill level isn't that great, but a player of his size, strength and pace don't grow on trees and are very very rare. Thats the reason why Franklin is so highly valued and Travis fits in his catergory. Also comeon guys!! Dawes has not got his pace and size.

Thats the reason why I never understood why Richmond did not pick up Lance Franklin and now the same reason why I don't understand so many here don't value Travis.

TP - oh why arent more people of the same opinion? Who cares if he has a 50% goal kicking conversion rate, this shouldnt be the only KPI one is judging him on.

Look the synergy of our forward line depends greatly upon this man's height and size. Both he and Dawes have immense physical presence can play deep or act as lead up targets, such is their flexibilty (Taz & JA would be nowhere near as imposing). Both apply great tackling and contested possession pressure - as a forward tandem I rate them about 4th in the AFL behind Buddy/Roughie, Petrie(when fit)/Hansen, Tippett/Walker - even then they apply more pressure than the second and third pairings.

Cloke can be even more dominating as power forwards really start to peak from age 24-27 - his type is irreplaceable and potentially critical loss. Give the man his 3 yr/500K per annum deal - he'll only be nudging 27 by then!

If anything we could let a Neon/Johnno go(both aged 30ish) to free up more coin in order to secure Trav - either will be lucky to stay in that team next year once Krak and Dick are both firing.

If we do not find space for Trav we shall regret it bitterly!

 

[Dee Snider]

This will all blow over sooner than later. The problem in all of this is David Cloke. He is compromised and should simply not be managing his own son. Did anyone hear Ricky Nixon on SEN this morning? In short he said D Cloke had played his cards at the wrong time, exposing himself as the part-time 'manger' that he is.

Clubs need time to manouvere their lists to be able to fit someone like this into their cap. And, in Ricky Nixon's words there are no clubs who are in a position to do this now that the trade week has been completed.

Thankfully for us all, the fact that D Cloke is the incompetent **** that he is is actually our blessing in the end.If he had tried this on in June..we might have been in some trouble.

 

[rose jam]

Clubs need time to manouvere their lists to be able to fit someone like this into their cap. And, in Ricky Nixon's words there are no clubs who are in a position to do this now that the trade week has been completed.

quote]

Heard that but he did also allude in a reference to free agency about clubs using 3rd party deals to get around the salary cap even more, which is exactly what Carlton is doing already. So perhaps they can offer him something sizeable and just cheat even more.

 

[Smoky]

This crap should have been sorted behind closed doors months ago.

According to what I've heard Cloke was the one who decided to leave negotiations until after the season as he couldn't get the deal he wanted. Then has the Gaul to insist through the press that Collingwood need to re-open negotiations (even though they did already) or he'll walk into the PSD and we get nothing for him.

This has all been done so unprofessionally from the Cloke party and put quite simply disrespectfully towards the Collingwood Football Club. David (better known as Damir) Cloke has tried to hang the whole club out to dry and has done his son no favors for future negotiations with any club.

Travis obviously wants to stay at Collingwood otherwise this would have come to a head prior to trade week... if he is so desperate to get the extra coin he wants, surely there would be other things to consider than money if he were to leave... like who can afford what he wants in their salary cap, what club he would play for and where in Australia he would want to live. All things he could sort through the trade week process and also show a little respec to Collingwood by allowing us to be compensated for his loss (if he leaves).

Unless Cloke has an under the table deal with the Gold Coast that he will be drafted with one of their first 3 draft picks and have already agreed on money he is sticking himself in a lottery of where he will live his life???

Anything less than a one year deal with Collingwood and trade at the end of the year (like all other players and player managers that have respect for clubs that have put their all into these players) will mean Cloke is never EVER welcome back at the club... and nor should he.

Collingwood FC would be absolutely furious about this bribery.

And to David Cloke... just because Travis is the last possible opportunity you have to being a player manager don't make every last mistake in the book in an attempt to get a contract fit for Jonathon Brown for your son who is yet to show he is able to actually kick goals instead of points... we all cringe and put our heads in our hands when your client has a set shot, directly in front from less than 30 meters out... and we always have.

Trav take one year... and then trade out. You are not bigger than the rest of the team.

 

[daics cousin]

Clubs need time to manouvere their lists to be able to fit someone like this into their cap. And, in Ricky Nixon's words there are no clubs who are in a position to do this now that the trade week has been completed.

quote]

Heard that but he did also allude in a reference to free agency about clubs using 3rd party deals to get around the salary cap even more, which is exactly what Carlton is doing already. So perhaps they can offer him something sizeable and just cheat even more.

If for some reason he walked,he wouldn't get to Carlton,plus Carlton is not ther best place to be at the moment with players wanting out.
Also,with Pratt passing away Carlton are not really all that cashed up,so Swan the leach cannot manouver the $$$ required to get Cloke.

If he did they will have a few more disgruntled players on their list.Andrew Walker for instance is forced to stay at carlton cause a deal could not be
done

Carlton are miles away from winning a flag.Cloke would not be the difference,they still lack a sold backline,and solid backlines win you flags these days.

 

[September Action]

Family + Business = fail, Travis is in an awkward position where he can't fire his manager for making mistakes and causing scenes, especially since he still lives at home....

Do The Clokes have a granny flat?? Could help.

 

[Sloth]

Learn to kick straight, then we'll talk.