Demetriou is right. ? "AFL Park" Where to Build the new stadium

[Rob]

The emphasis of a boutique stadium is to have one that is clean. Skilled is not clean. PP wont be clean either, there is no way Carlton would hand over the keys to PP.

A clean stadium isn't about 'handing over the keys', it's about replacing the lack of access to signage and the like with a much bigger rental charge. Essentially the commercial risk is transferred from the stadium operator to the club.

A clean stadium isn't necessarily a solution to financial concerns. Your expenses will increase substantially, and you need to be able to sell the signage, corporate boxes and seats that would otherwise be for stadium members to be able to cover the rent. If you can't either sell them or get as much for them than you think, then you end up making a bigger loss. When you have to compete with 9 other clubs, doing so is easier said than done.

 

[pazza]

Tear down the joke of the State Baseball centre and place it near the Geelong freeway and Melbourne-Geelong railway at Laverton.

 

[DanA]

I live in Williamstown and I wouldn't like the idea of travelling to Geelong, or Casey to see a Dogs home game. Aren't there any other better and more central locations?

The funny thing is for you it would be about 40 minutes by train and car to skilled compared to 30 minute to the MCG.

 

[Pessimistic]

I understand that many clubs have been screwed by Carlton and the stadium deals before and therefore completely wipe the idea of playing at PP. But really it is the only location. Geelong is to far away and building any new stadium would be highly costly. The fact is the PP facilties really isnt that bad and with a bit of extra money spent on it would be quite good in no time.

Although public transport is the greatest to get there, with a reduced capacity and the trams It would be adequate. It should eb renovated anyways as with clubs like the Bulldogs and Melbourne ect playing interstate clubs, it is going to be highly unlikely that they can make a profit at the MCG or TD no matter the contract. Obviously though thr AFL must make sure that Carlton doesnt take advantage of the situation.

Good luck with that - the CEOs of MCG and Docklands are ex carlton

 

[Beckers]

I'll answer my own question.

MCG - minimum of 45 in Home and Away season
Etihad - minimum of 42 until 2015 (reduces to 35 and can include pre-season matches)

Assuming Carlton, Collingwood, Essendon, Melbourne, North Melbourne, Richmond and St Kilda play all 11 home games in Victoria, Hawthorn play 7 (4 in Tasmania), Geelong 3-4 (remainder in Geelong), Bulldogs 10 (usually sell at least one game per season), that leaves 10 games per season that the AFL are not committed to.

Who is going to spend big money to upgrade or build a new stadium for 1 game every 2 weeks?

Gold Coast Council, AFL, QLD Government, West Sydney councils!!!! They are all dipping in for 11 games a season on the Gold Coast and 11 games at West Sydney??

Once a new stadium is built, it will be utilised so many more sports than just 10 AFL games!!!

 

[AstroboyUK]

If the yare after boutique size then refurbish Junction Oval.
Get into bed with the VCA and play all Domestic cricket there.

Not too hard to get there.

God you could even lease it to MFC as their home base.

All good. Hop to it Andy.

not a bad idea at all!

 

[Beckers]

1. Any new AFL stadium will be built in the western suburbs.

That would be insane!!! Why would the AFL possibly alienate their heartland (Melbournes East/South East) by putting a new stadium in the WEST?? The East is, and always will be the focus for the AFL as it is where the majority of the fans are! Most people from the East have hardly ever been to the Western Suburbs (except maybe business or passing thru to Geelong)....and probably would never go there!

 

[AstroboyUK]

has anyone else noticed that apart from Rich vs Carlton, not one media match report has listed attendances in their match summaries this week.

maybe Im drawing a long bow, but i was starting to wonder if the lack of crowd figures stems somehow from the brewing dispute - either the venue provokatively changing its methodolgy to reduce the number and AFL not accepting them - or the AFL not publishing or approving them to delay having to pay something?

 

[speedpeck23]

? A 35,000 seat stadium at Gosch's paddock...Collingwood and Melbourne share training facility.. Share with Cricket,VFL.

 

[shintemaster]

Gold Coast Council, AFL, QLD Government, West Sydney councils!!!! They are all dipping in for 11 games a season on the Gold Coast and 11 games at West Sydney??

Once a new stadium is built, it will be utilised so many more sports than just 10 AFL games!!!

There's also the fact that the number of games required at TD drops in about 5 years. It will take some time to build any proposed stadium. In the end it will be a real pity in some ways if we have to waste a whole bucket of money building a stadium just to get a decent return on playing games. I know that clubs are now saying they're not overly happy at the MCG either but at least there is a possibility of making good coin there. At TD you can put 40k into a 50k stadium and still not be making decent money. Not great great if you're 80% full and not able to earn good coin.

 

[Sloth]

How about a rejuvenated Vic Park? It already has it's own train station.

 

[no1bankteller]

Totally agree. Its just rubish talk. People are used to the MCG and Docklands standard of stadium. Even going to Princess Park, they would be lucky to pull 10,000. There goes your very reason for leaving the dome.

If they really want to reduce the number of games to put pressure on the MCG/Docklands, why not make 2010 "regional" year. Play a heap of low drawing games in regional areas like Bendigo, Ballarat, Shepparton, Wagga, Albury, etc. One game per year in these locations will get the locals along, and they can have the ground prepared well in advance. You'd take a hit on crowds, but it would be great for PR.
Most of these places are the equal of Launceston which already hosts footy games.

Great idea

Best suggestion so far IMHO.

 

[MarkT]

This is why we should never of sold Waverly.....

keep hearing this. Firstly, the sale of Waverley was required for Docklands to be built and the AFL ultimately take ownership. Secondly, the problems with the MCG and Docklands deals are not a reult of the loss of Waverley but the negotiations of the AFL in pursuig varioius agenda's from ground rationalisation to finals scheduling to broadcast deals to whatever was the agenda of the moment.

Mostly thought, the AFL dug it's own pit by eliminating all suburban grounds and most likely on the assumption that there wouldn't be 10 teams left in Victoria fighting over the 2 venues. If the AFL allowed and facilitated development of, say, North Melbourne's ground, you would have a good facility on the edge of the city serving the north. Even just taking North home games and Essendon's and Carlton's games v interstate teams creates more pressure for competition for games from the other two venues.

 

[rdhopkins2]

Nice idea for regional games. You could expect good local turnouts and maybe a thousand or so making the trip from Melbourne. Bendigo, Ballarat, Mildura, Sale, Warnnambool & Wodonga?

Tough one- great surface required and atleast capacity for 10k you would think would be required, room for portaloos, food/drink caravans etc.

 

[pazza]

That would be insane!!! Why would the AFL possibly alienate their heartland (Melbournes East/South East) by putting a new stadium in the WEST?? The East is, and always will be the focus for the AFL as it is where the majority of the fans are! Most people from the East have hardly ever been to the Western Suburbs (except maybe business or passing thru to Geelong)....and probably would never go there!

You do realise the growth that's going on this side of the Bay? e.g Hoppers Crossing's 250000 and growing rapidly...50000 at Point Cook (with it likely to hit 150000 in time), and Caroline Springs/Hillside at nearly 200000 already in 10 years.

The AFL has had its chance with the ground at Casey Fields..and with Footscray and Geelong (throw in North Melbourne too) able to access a facility in the West, the potential for these 3 clubs to grow exponetially is obvious.

Keep in mind too that with the Geelong freeway fully upgraded, the Melbourne-Geelong rail line operating very regularly and the placing of Avalon Airport on the route, access to a Western Suburbs facility for all local and interstate visitors would be a major selling point.

 

[The Stifmeister]

The North-West is kicking on like mad i.e sydenham, sunbury, melton, gisborne, baccus marsh and cragieburn. Would be crazy to neglect IMO.

 

[pazza]

Nice idea for regional games. You could expect good local turnouts and maybe a thousand or so making the trip from Melbourne. Bendigo, Ballarat, Mildura, Sale, Warnnambool & Wodonga?

Tough one- great surface required and atleast capacity for 10k you would think would be required, room for portaloos, food/drink caravans etc.

Queen Elizabeth Oval (Bendigo); Northern Oval (Ballarat) and Deakin Reserve (Shepparton) are basically at full readiness (lighting would have to improve at all 3, but, they have VFL standard lighting already).

Substitute Sale for Traralgon (Showgrounds) and it could work.

 

[Pessimistic]

keep hearing this. Firstly, the sale of Waverley was required for Docklands to be built and the AFL ultimately take ownership. Secondly, the problems with the MCG and Docklands deals are not a reult of the loss of Waverley but the negotiations of the AFL in pursuig varioius agenda's from ground rationalisation to finals scheduling to broadcast deals to whatever was the agenda of the moment.

Mostly thought, the AFL dug it's own pit by eliminating all suburban grounds and most likely on the assumption that there wouldn't be 10 teams left in Victoria fighting over the 2 venues. If the AFL allowed and facilitated development of, say, North Melbourne's ground, you would have a good facility on the edge of the city serving the north. Even just taking North home games and Essendon's and Carlton's games v interstate teams creates more pressure for competition for games from the other two venues.

Ian Dicker strongly indicated he had backing to take over waverley thus allowing the afl to use it plus get the cash.

This didn't happen because:

The AFL was pig headed and , in hindsight, stupid about it.

The docklands wanted to remove competition hence getting the state government ot agree to all sorts of anti competitive agreements (now we know why) the state govt of the time gave in because it wanted bread and circuses and a soccer stadium for the olympic games or something.

Hawthorn couldnt find another club interested - st kilda wanted something shiny and new. Melbourne had a banner celebrating the demise of waverley (and now they want one in casey ?) It might have been the answer for north if they had bitten the bullet and moved to the growth corridor.

Still no train line but ironically there is eastlink which will deliver huge economic improvements to the area (including corporates a plenty)

At the time I remember thinking the plan should have been a rectangular stadium where there is one now, a 35k stadium at waverly, a 35k one maybe in docklands and either redo princes park or have one abit furhter north.

Bulldogs essendon and North in the western one, Hawks saints richmond in the eastern one and coll carl, perhaps melbourne in the northern one

Big games at the MCG

 

[speedpeck23]

keep hearing this. Firstly, the sale of Waverley was required for Docklands to be built and the AFL ultimately take ownership. Secondly, the problems with the MCG and Docklands deals are not a reult of the loss of Waverley but the negotiations of the AFL in pursuig varioius agenda's from ground rationalisation to finals scheduling to broadcast deals to whatever was the agenda of the moment.

Mostly thought, the AFL dug it's own pit by eliminating all suburban grounds and most likely on the assumption that there wouldn't be 10 teams left in Victoria fighting over the 2 venues. If the AFL allowed and facilitated development of, say, North Melbourne's ground, you would have a good facility on the edge of the city serving the north. Even just taking North home games and Essendon's and Carlton's games v interstate teams creates more pressure for competition for games from the other two venues.

Agree, but that doesn't preclude the AFL from getting back into ground ownership again. They have the resources....had $100 mill for North to relocate and they considered buying Homebush.

 

[daddy_4_eyes]

Haven't read through the whole thread, but has anyone suggested fixing up Whitten oval? Bring the capacity up to 35-45,000 and it would be a great solution i would have thought.

 

[pazza]

Haven't read through the whole thread, but has anyone suggested fixing up Whitten oval? Bring the capacity up to 35-45,000 and it would be a great solution i would have thought.

Not enough room to really make it work.

And a council hell bent on screwing the club as much as possible given what has happened with the current redevelopment.

 

[Inferno]

Imo renovate the Whitten Oval or build one in those paddocks just before Laverton. If a 3rd stadium was built it would be mostly used by the Bulldogs and North so why the **** would anyone put it in the outer eastern suburbs? Neither fanbase would be doing cartwheels over the idea of having to travel 60km out to Dandenong or where ever, they may as well play in Geelong. Plus the west is a huge growth corridor.

 

[arkie]

Imo renovate the Whitten Oval or build one in those paddocks just before Laverton. If a 3rd stadium was built it would be mostly used by the Bulldogs and North so why the **** would anyone put it in the outer eastern suburbs? Neither fanbase would be doing cartwheels over the idea of having to travel 60km out to Dandenong or where ever, they may as well play in Geelong. Plus the west is a huge growth corridor.

Laverton is a hole.

 

[greenred]

Gold Coast Council, AFL, QLD Government, West Sydney councils!!!! They are all dipping in for 11 games a season on the Gold Coast and 11 games at West Sydney??

Once a new stadium is built, it will be utilised so many more sports than just 10 AFL games!!!

So the Victorian clubs are going to play their games on the Gold Coast and in Western Sydney?

 

[Chris who]

I think he is using the other states as a precedence for pumping cash into a bi monthly venue