Analysis Did Darren Jarman play better football at Hawthorn or Adelaide?

[Cleric]

In the era of Darren Jarman, we didn't have Fox, and only got about three or four games a weekend on SA TV.
One would be the Crows and Port when they came in, and then another couple with other teams in them.
So, I never really saw alot of DJ playing for Hawthorn, hence my question.

So did he play the better games for Hawthorn or Adelaide?
I know his finals performances for Adelaide in 97 and 98 were his pinnacle in big games, but as an average of good games to bad, where did he do his best work?

 

[Dirty Bird]

I know Adelaide's season is over, and it's effectively our off-season, but can't you save these discussions to the offseason?

PS. I'm too young to remember watching the Hawthorn iteration so I abstain from the voting.

 

[Cleric]

I know Adelaide's season is over, and it's effectively our off-season, but can't you save these discussions to the offseason?

PS. I'm too young to remember watching the Hawthorn iteration so I abstain from the voting.

You don't realise how boring my job is....

 

[Bedi]

Based on 97 and 98 GF alone the answer has to be Adelaide. But he's the most skilled player I've ever seen at Hawthorn so an 'equally good' option should be available – as that's my vote. His highlights reel in both colours is mindblowing.

 

[StillAtLarge]

More impactful at Adelaide but his best footy was clearly at Hawthorn. Waverley suited him to a tee- lots of space and an immaculate surface to showcase his sublime skills

 

[abchawk]

Where he was better overall is debatable (although his 1997 and 1998 GFs performances are so much more memorable than his 1991 GF performance). However his 1995 season was his best individual season playing mostly in the Center/Midfield. This was his last at Hawthorn.

He won the Hawthorn B&F, but the fact he was 2nd in Brownlow behind Paul Kelly (he was ineligible as we was suspended that year) in a team that finished 2nd last and lost the last 7 games of the year to miss the finals for the first time in 14 years was stunning.
If Hawthorn was just a tiny bit better (or had Dunstall not missed a huge chunk of the season), and had Jarman not missed games, he likely would have won the Brownlow in a low count year where some of his 1/2 vote games become 2/3 vote games.

Ultimately at Adelaide he was mostly a forward, where as at Hawthorn he was sort of 60/40 midfield and half forward and more up the ground.

Reference his 1991-1995 Hawthorn highlights:

 

[Guardian Hawk]

He was brilliant at both clubs - in largely different roles (He was a mid at Hawthorn and mostly a forward at Adelaide.). I would lean Hawthorn as we got more his peak years, given he started at Adelaide at 29 years old. Of his 3 All Australians, 2 were at Hawthorn. 3 of his 4 highest Brownlow tallies were at Hawthorn. His one best and fairest was also at Hawthorn. Norm Smith obviously at Adelaide. His best season was 1995, when he won the B&F, was the AA centreman and finished runner up in the Brownlow. I reckon he was the best player in the comp that year. Having a player with his skills getting a lot of the ball through the middle made him devastating and the arguably the most impactful player in the game.

He was still brilliant at Adelaide, especially in his first year (or two). Then he spent more time forward in his 30's and was a fantastic goalkicker that stood up in big games. Even though I lean toward his peak midfield years, I think equally good is a reasonable opinion, given his effectiveness as a pure forward late in his career.

 

[Cleric]

He was brilliant at both clubs - in largely different roles (He was a mid at Hawthorn and mostly a forward at Adelaide.). I would lean Hawthorn as we got more his peak years, given he started at Adelaide at 29 years old. Of his 3 All Australians, 2 were at Hawthorn. 3 of his 4 highest Brownlow tallies were at Hawthorn. His one best and fairest was also at Hawthorn. Norm Smith obviously at Adelaide. His best season was 1995, when he won the B&F, was the AA centreman and finished runner up in the Brownlow. I reckon he was the best player in the comp that year. Having a player with his skills getting a lot of the ball through the middle made him devastating and the arguably the most impactful player in the game.

He was still brilliant at Adelaide, especially in his first year (or two). Then he spent more time forward in his 30's and was a fantastic goalkicker that stood up in big games. Even though I lean toward his peak midfield years, I think equally good is a reasonable opinion, given his effectiveness as a pure forward late in his career.

Imagine if he actually trained hard and got ultra fit.

 

[Guardian Hawk]

Imagine if he actually trained hard and got ultra fit.

Don't need to imagine - that was basically Ablett Jnr.

I would say that Jarman has the best skills the game has seen (at least since 1980). The guys in the argument are Leon Cameron, Jason Akermanis, probably Gary Ablett Jnr (and I rate Sam Mitchell very highly too). But Jarman was the best of them. Ablett Jnr (and Buckley to an extent) showed what could be done with the work ethic to match - but again, I reckon Jarman's forward nous and skills were a level above even those greats.

 

[Cleric]

Don't need to imagine - that was basically Ablett Jnr.

I would say that Jarman has the best skills the game has seen (at least since 1980). The guys in the argument are Leon Cameron, Jason Akermanis, probably Gary Ablett Jnr (and I rate Sam Mitchell very highly too). But Jarman was the best of them. Ablett Jnr (and Buckley to an extent) showed what could be done with the work ethic to match - but again, I reckon Jarman's forward nous and skills were a level above even those greats.

I asked Dipper about Jarman at a sportsman night, and he told us all about him.
Apparently when he first came to Hawthorn, Dipper was selected to be his training partner. A couple of weeks into pre season and Dipper had had enough of him. He went to the coaching staff and said that he wanted to taken off from being his training partner. He said he was the laziest trainer he had ever seen. He didn't try, was eating Pies every day, and looked terrible. He told the coaches that he was going to be a total bust.
He was told that he had to stay with him.
A couple of weeks later the footballs came out and DJ started kicking and passing the ball, and Dipper said his jaw hit the ground with what he could do. He then totally changed his mind about him not making it.

Another thing with DJ was he actually scared opposition players, and they were a bit timid to put too much heat on him, because he would crack you one.

 

[Macca19]

In the era of Darren Jarman, we didn't have Fox, and only got about three or four games a weekend on SA TV.
One would be the Crows and Port when they came in, and then another couple with other teams in them.
So, I never really saw alot of DJ playing for Hawthorn, hence my question.

So did he play the better games for Hawthorn or Adelaide?
I know his finals performances for Adelaide in 97 and 98 were his pinnacle in big games, but as an average of good games to bad, where did he do his best work?

He was elite as a midfielder at Hawthorn and rarely played a bad game. At Adelaide after his 2nd year there he became more of an impact player in a completely different role and whilst he had some massive games and massive moments, he was definitely more consistent at Hawthorn.

 

[Rusty Brookes]

Brilliant at both clubs. Dunstall is on the record saying he was the best kick to lead to and he played alongside some of the greatest kicks of the football ever (Pritchard and Platten come to mind). Ended up being a GF hero at the Crows so I maybe lean to Adelaide but he was outstanding to watch while he was at Hawthorn.

 

[Osho]

Playing key roles, match winning roles, in GFs trumps home and away heroics.

Piece de resistance versus a slice of bread.

 

[Freomaniac]

Imagine if he actually trained hard and got ultra fit.

He wasn't exactly bless with pace either. But made up for it with his overall skill set.

His brother Andrew Jarman wasn't too bad either. He wasn't quick on his feet but quick with his brain.

Both Jarman brothers were smart footballers

 

[Delisted]

Based on 97 and 98 GF alone the answer has to be Adelaide. But he's the most skilled player I've ever seen at Hawthorn so an 'equally good' option should be available – as that's my vote. His highlights reel in both colours is mindblowing.

I've read this a lot. I to was also too young to really see him play. Is there anyone you would compare him too?

 

[Gough]

He wasn't exactly bless with pace either. But made up for it with his overall skill set.

His brother Andrew Jarman wasn't too bad either. He wasn't quick on his feet but quick with his brain.

Both Jarman brothers were smart footballers

Undersized, overweight and lazy. You wonder if either of them would even get drafted these days.

 

[Bedi]

I've read this a lot. I to was also too young to really see him play. Is there anyone you would compare him too?

I really can't, and reckon he's bit of a one off – which you'll get a good sense from watching the highlights above. But lot of similarities with many First Nation players in terms of oozing what appears as a seemingly uncanny natural talent. But of modern day Hawks I can seem some similarities in attributes like when James Sicily pulls off one of those slicing slingshot laser-precision kick (D Jarman is unquestionably the best kick i've seen in my time; incidentally his brother Andrew was prob the best handball), Cyril Rioli's all round freakish ability with the spins and ability to bamboozle opponents, mixed in with the relaxed approach of a Mabior Chol plodding along with all the time in the world. Dead eye kick on goal too. Also the kind of player who'd pop up at the last moment without getting a kick all day and be instrumental in the winning passage of play. For what he did at the Crows, how they don't have a statue of him outside Adelaide Oval, I'll never know

 

[Freomaniac]

Undersized, overweight and lazy. You wonder if either of them would even get drafted these days.

That is also true.

If they have natural talent but not the endurance, well it's easy to increase their stamina by making them run

 

[Fastback]

A group of us used to head out to Waverley to watch this guy and often ended up in fits of laughter re how freaky good he was. He'd be midway through a right foot bullet pass to Dunstall then at the last second flick it into his left hand for a left foot kick across the body to a diff forward, was ahead of his time like Daicos snr.

 

[Cleric]

A group of us used to head out to Waverley to watch this guy and often ended up in fits of laughter re how freaky good he was. He'd be midway through a right foot bullet pass to Dunstall then at the last second flick it into his left hand for a left foot kick across the body to a diff forward, was ahead of his time like Daicos snr.

Yeah, I was thinking about Daicos having similarities to DJ, then I got to thinking that with Ablett Snr running around at the same time, was there ever a threesome like them them for just doing freakish things? And the fact that none of them were indigenous is even more head shaking.

 

[spudmaster]

Undersized, overweight and lazy. You wonder if either of them would even get drafted these days.

Probably not at his current size.

 

[luciien]

Jarman remains the best kick of a football I have ever seen. Made it look effortless and was completely ambidextrous, plus could float it, lace out a rocket pass or kick around corners off a step or at full pace.

Only Aker, Sam Mitchell, Bucks and Daics come close. SA fans check out the extra time QF against the Roos in 94. Jarman was everywhere 39 touches, took a massive hanger. Platter also had 37.

 

[Fastback]

Yeah, I was thinking about Daicos having similarities to DJ, then I got to thinking that with Ablett Snr running around at the same time, was there ever a threesome like them them for just doing freakish things? And the fact that none of them were indigenous is even more head shaking.

Ground conditions were a lot worse mid-winter back then also but they'd still kick bags - KP was a bog.

 

[Back One Out]

Playing key roles, match winning roles, in GFs trumps home and away heroics.

Piece de resistance versus a slice of bread.

Jarman literally put the Hawks into the 1991 Grand Final with a freakish snap for goal from the boundary line in time-on of the 2nd Semi Final v Geelong. We won that game by 2 points. It was a HUGE game with massive ramifications. There was literally nothing between Hawthorn and Geelong that year. Both teams finished the H&A season on 16 wins. The Cats flogged the Hawks by 7 goals in their only other meeting back in Round 12.

Hawthorn's win sent the Cats into a Prelim Final versus their bogey team, West Coast. The Eagles had beaten Geelong 5 times in succession from 1989-1991. Of course, the Eagles won again the following week before losing the GF by 53 points. If Jarman hadn't kicked that semi-final goal and snatched victory, who knows if the Hawks would've beaten West Coast in the Prelim and then beaten Geelong in the Grand Final. Maybe... Maybe not...




Anyway, it's a bit ridiculous to focus only on 2 games out of Jarman's 230 game career and ignore the other 228. The OP asked where he played his best football. We all know Jars kicked match-winning bags in the 1997 and 1998 GFs... That's pretty much all anyone ever talks about when his name comes up.

Do we want to further the discussion or be reductive? The OP wanted to know more about him. That's the whole point of the thread: Where did he play his best footy? (I think Guardian Hawk summed it up quite nicely.)

At Hawthorn, Jarman was the fittest and trimmest he ever got. He played in the centre and regularly racked up 30 touches, kicked a couple goals and had countless goal assists. He literally controlled games from the middle. He was impossible to tackle. Nobody could lay a hand on him. He always had the ball on a string and made his opponents look silly. He was the best kick I have ever seen. Any type of kick, you name it. Literally made the ball talk.

He was also an underrated tackling machine. Second only to Tony Liberatore. Hawthorn's clear leader in tackles from 1992-1995... Miles in front of our next best tackler. He was STRONG. He would bury opponents. This dropped right away when he switched to Adelaide and played up forward. He was a two way player at Hawthorn.

The stories about his "laziness" are overplayed. Maybe so when he first arrived in 1991. It probably took him a season to get up to speed. But he got himself super fit and was a complete player in 1992. (I think 1992 was his best season, better than 1995 when he finished runner up in the Brownlow.)

 

[Bedi]

Jarman literally put the Hawks into the 1991 Grand Final with a freakish snap for goal from the boundary line in time-on of the 2nd Semi Final v Geelong. We won that game by 2 points. It was a HUGE game with massive ramifications. There was literally nothing between Hawthorn and Geelong that year. Both teams finished the H&A season on 16 wins. The Cats flogged the Hawks by 7 goals in their only other meeting back in Round 12.

Hawthorn's win sent the Cats into a Prelim Final versus their bogey team, West Coast. The Eagles had beaten Geelong 5 times in succession from 1989-1991. Of course, the Eagles won again the following week before losing the GF by 53 points. If Jarman hadn't kicked that semi-final goal and snatched victory, who knows if the Hawks would've beaten West Coast in the Prelim and then beaten Geelong in the Grand Final. Maybe... Maybe not...




Anyway, it's a bit ridiculous to focus only on 2 games out of Jarman's 230 game career and ignore the other 228. The OP asked where he played his best football. We all know Jars kicked match-winning bags in the 1997 and 1998 GFs... That's pretty much all anyone ever talks about when his name comes up.

Do we want to further the discussion or be reductive? The OP wanted to know more about him. That's the whole point of the thread: Where did he play his best footy? (I think Guardian Hawk summed it up quite nicely.)

At Hawthorn, Jarman was the fittest and trimmest he ever got. He played in the centre and regularly racked up 30 touches, kicked a couple goals and had countless goal assists. He literally controlled games from the middle. He was impossible to tackle. Nobody could lay a hand on him. He always had the ball on a string and made his opponents look silly. He was the best kick I have ever seen. Any type of kick, you name it. Literally made the ball talk.

He was also an underrated tackling machine. Second only to Tony Liberatore. Hawthorn's clear leader in tackles from 1992-1995... Miles in front of our next best tackler. He was STRONG. He would bury opponents. This dropped right away when he switched to Adelaide and played up forward. He was a two way player at Hawthorn.

The stories about his "laziness" are overplayed. Maybe so when he first arrived in 1991. It probably took him a season to get up to speed. But he got himself super fit and was a complete player in 1992. (I think 1992 was his best season, better than 1995 when he finished runner up in the Brownlow.)

That is my fav goal of all time. Used to play it out in the backyard all the time, curling it through the middle from that tight angle