For the believers, 2016 season still alive

[sey666]

How long is does it take to recover from traditional surgery for ACL? It is not 12 months, is it? I read somewhere that Murphy could be back for Bulldogs preseason and I remember Lecras recovering before the end of season in 2012 - both about 7-8 months.

 

[Eagleboy68]

How long is does it take to recover from traditional surgery for ACL? It is not 12 months, is it? I read somewhere that Murphy could be back for Bulldogs preseason and I remember Lecras recovering before the end of season in 2012 - both about 7-8 months.

I remember jakovich was done in about round 16 of 1996. He came back in 1997 about the same round or earlier iirc but wasn't back to his "best" until 1998.
Don't think he was ever the same imo.

Big blokes take longer to recover. Tony liberatore used the Lars method and was back in about 10 weeks I think.

 

[Cainozz]

I really don't think the Top 4 is as crucial to premiership success this year as it has been for past years. Remember that everyone gets a week off before finals, that could freshen up a lot of players and we all know how even the top 6-7 teams are on any given day. Having two byes in 3 weeks could stagnate some teams who finish in the top 4.

 

[sey666]

I remember jakovich was done in about round 16 of 1996. He came back in 1997 about the same round or earlier iirc but wasn't back to his "best" until 1998.
Don't think he was ever the same imo.

Big blokes take longer to recover. Tony liberatore used the Lars method and was back in about 10 weeks I think.

Thanks. Yes, Lars seems a quicker but a risky method - probably not worth it for somebody as important as Naitanui.

 

[WCErevival]

MacKenzie done his knee in late February and was back running in around July. He joined the team as normal for the preseason.

 

[sey666]

MacKenzie done his knee in late February and was back running in around July. He joined the team as normal for the preseason.

Exactly. So it is not 12 months recovery. Hopefully Naitanui can return around the halfway mark in 2017 and Lycett may improve (Max Gawn has gone from spud to gun in one season and Lycett is no spud) so it is still too early to write the 2017 season off particularly if we fix our midfield through sound recruiting.

 

[Borough Blood]

Let's put things into perspective, who is Lycett better than?

Sydney:
*Callum Sinclair, great for us but terrible for Sydney, Scotty's better then him.
*Toby Nankervis, unproven and still raw, Scotty would beat him 90% of the time,

Sam Naismith is ahead of both easily and Tippett is back now.

 

[Bender_]

I believe

 

[wraglesweb]

This is how i look at it we lost a great tap Ruckman and a strong stoppage midfielder all in one.

No Ruckman can do what Nic Nat does period.....

Massive Loss and at the moment I'm a non believer

 

[langdon19]

Can anyone name a west coast player that has done their knee and come back as good as before.
Woosh
Jacko
Brown
Mainy

 

[langdon19]

Can anyone name a west coast player that has done their knee and come back as good as before.
Woosh
Jacko
Brown
Mainy

Lacras
Mackenzie

 

[PerthBoy86]

Yeah I agree 5th is in some way not worse and possibly even better than 4th, so I'm not so concerned about that. Heck, even if we're thrashed by Adelaide, we could well hold onto 6th. Doubt we'd drop to 7th.

Nic Nat's tragic loss certainly will be a dent - but one wonders how much of that is psychological, too. Maybe, as great as he is, he's become a bit too much of a crutch, we're too reliant on him. I think we still CAN play great even without him, despite what the stats say. Lycett would have to step up.

Realistically, I'd be very surprised if we get into the GF, but it's certainly not out of the realm of possibility, we have shown we can certainly turn it on. Shuey and Priddis have been phenomenal, how much of that is Nic Nat though? LeCras also taking marks in 50 and kicking straight. More pressure and run against Hawthorn than we've seen. I get the feeling the Eagles are a bit too reliant on home crowd atmosphere, sometimes, though. We really have to dig deep. I hope they don't just throw in the towel because of what's happened, and we at least challenge. Just show some pride, dig deep, give it as good as you've got.

I'll be pretty satisfied and chuffed if we just make a real go of it in finals, that's the most we can ask for.

I am fairly worried about the 12 month thing for Nic Nat, let's hope he can at least play some of next season. At least we don't have too many major players who are about to retire (Priddis could still potentially have a few more years left, whether he stays in the regular lineup remains to be seen). I think Butler will retire soon.

 

[hudson2006]

It's actually quite likely we will drop to 7th on 15 wins anyway, given that:

- Sydney and Adelaide will finish ahead of us on percentage (unless one of them is brutally smashed, which won't happen).

- Hawthorn should account for Collingwood.

- GWS is in with a good chance against North at Etihad, maybe a 50/50 game there.

- Geelong will smash Brisbane tommorrow then beat Melbourne at home.

- The Bulldogs (god these campaigners had a joke of a draw) will smash Essendon then Freo

So if we lose to Adelaide in Adelaide (which is likely), we sure aren't moving up the ladder. The Bulldogs will likely overtake us and make us travel to Etihad for a rematch.

If we pull another miracle win out of our rears, we secure 6th place (have to introduce those red blue and white jokers to something called a "plane") but are depending on at least 2 epic fails from the Hawks, GWS and Geelong in order to scrape into top four.

However the most likely outcome is that we will miss out and the top four each finish on 17 wins apiece, which was enough for the minor premier last year.

Going to be a very interesting finals series regardless.

 

[ep2018]

If we pull another miracle win out of our rears, we secure 6th place

Two 80 point wins would see them beat our % also, so hell we could win next week and still finish 7th.........

 

[RookiePick]

Let's put things into perspective, who is Lycett better than?

...

Geelong:
*Zac Smith, good ruckman, but Scotty would beat him with his hardness at the contest.
*Mark Blicavs, barely rucks.
*Rhys Stanley, great athleticism, comparable to Lobb when it comes to rucking, Scotty should best him.

...

Footscray:
*Tom Campbell, haven't really seen much of him, so I'm guessing he's just average, easily beaten.

....

Fit Stanley is dangerous forward as well as rucking and can cover some serious territory. A bit disrespectful to the bullies Campbell/Roughhead combo. They can get on top in the ruck, are dangerous forward. Both these sides (Geelong and WBD) really only need to break even in the ruck as they have very good midfields to extract and distribute the pill. Currently we need to dominate the shit out of the ruck to cover our midfield inadequacies...enter the Naita!

For us to go anywhere this year and next it is going to require team effort all over the ground. We can no longer live off Naitanui hits to advantage and ground level drive. Scott will be a massive part of any success and I am hopeful be can build something solid around him. Priddis, Shuey, Sheed and a fit Redden with Gaff and Jetta firing outside could be formidable. Duggan, Nelson and Yeo will hopefully be high quality rotations that can win their own footy next year. Simpson's ground work to build a more flexible and effective midfield will hopefully pay dividends.

 

[MWPP]

I'm much more devastated about 2017 than the rest of 2016 , and 2017 hasn't even begun yet
Refuse to give up completely until all hope is lost but I still haven't been able to feel at all happy about our great win , nor am I even looking forward to Friday night (which would've otherwise seemed like a cracker )

 

[PerthBoy86]

It's actually quite likely we will drop to 7th on 15 wins anyway, given that:

- Sydney and Adelaide will finish ahead of us on percentage (unless one of them is brutally smashed, which won't happen).

- Hawthorn should account for Collingwood.

- GWS is in with a good chance against North at Etihad, maybe a 50/50 game there.

- Geelong will smash Brisbane tommorrow then beat Melbourne at home.

- The Bulldogs (god these campaigners had a joke of a draw) will smash Essendon then Freo

So if we lose to Adelaide in Adelaide (which is likely), we sure aren't moving up the ladder. The Bulldogs will likely overtake us and make us travel to Etihad for a rematch.

If we pull another miracle win out of our rears, we secure 6th place (have to introduce those red blue and white jokers to something called a "plane") but are depending on at least 2 epic fails from the Hawks, GWS and Geelong in order to scrape into top four.

However the most likely outcome is that we will miss out and the top four each finish on 17 wins apiece, which was enough for the minor premier last year.

Going to be a very interesting finals series regardless.

I give the Pies a decent change against a tired Hawthorn sans Ceglar. I won't be at all surprised if they pinch it from the Hawks.

You're right though, I think top 4 is very unlikely, and what you've said is still the most likely result.

 

[PerthBoy86]

I'm much more devastated about 2017 than the rest of 2016 , and 2017 hasn't even begun yet
Refuse to give up completely until all hope is lost but I still haven't been able to feel at all happy about our great win , nor am I even looking forward to Friday night (which would've otherwise seemed like a cracker )

Yeah, it's shattering news for both Nic Nat and the club. Also given his run of injuries this year, following the loss of his mother, must've been a tough year for him.

We would still go into next week real underdogs, but I do feel Nic Nat gave us at least more of a hope. The upside to losing to Adelaide is they will secure first or second, and Hawthorn will most likely finish 3rd, 4th, or, fingers crossed, even lower. Adelaide is the team I want to win the GF since we're most likey out of it, but I haven't given up complete hope. Partly vengeance for last year, but I really really want to see us beat Hawthorn in a Grand Final because of both 1991 and 2015 haha.

 

[MWPP]

Yeah, it's shattering news for both Nic Nat and the club. Also given his run of injuries this year, following the loss of his mother, must've been a tough year for him.

We would still go into next week real underdogs, but I do feel Nic Nat gave us at least more of a hope. The upside to losing to Adelaide is they will secure first or second, and Hawthorn will most likely finish 3rd, 4th, or, fingers crossed, even lower. Adelaide is the team I want to win the GF since we're most likey out of it, but I haven't given up complete hope. Partly vengeance for last year, but I really really want to see us beat Hawthorn in a Grand Final because of both 1991 and 2015 haha.

Yes - absolutely devastated for NicNat . He's such an amazing young man but has had such a tough 12 months (life /footy isn't fair sometimes ). I hope we can win a premiership for him ....

Adelaide are my second favourite team - always have been (for many reasons , but the events of last year have sort of solidified it )
I want them to go all the way too (now that we aren't a realistic chance anymore )

But haha - my love for them doesn't *quite* extend to being able to admit to this upside (as I still want us to win /secure a home final , if only for the valuable finals experience for next year )- but I will certainly be cheering them on during the finals series .

Last night was weird - I was hoping Port (who I otherwise don't like much ) would beat them for our sake , even though I usually want Adelaide to win their games ....

Agree with /see your points though , and share your disdain for hawthorn . I'm hoping they finish 4th or lower to be honest (many teams have won the premiership from 3rd, including the Hawks themselves last year , but no team has won it from 4th or lower under the current system )

 

[Cuzdup]

NN misses another pre-season and we will be lucky to see him next him next year. </thread>

 

[EagleShore]

Look Nic is my all time favourite Eagle and watching him is a joy and I may never forgive this club for whats happened but the 2016 season is more alive today that its been at any point this season. This is a thread for anyone who isn't ready to roll over and die with one week to go before finals.

I like the optimism in your post, but how is it the club's fault that he ruptured his ACL? Not sure if you can blame the club. Nic has always been managed very well in my opinion. He rarely plays more than 80% of a game.

 

[Broken_Chairs]

Exactly. So it is not 12 months recovery. Hopefully Naitanui can return around the halfway mark in 2017 and Lycett may improve (Max Gawn has gone from spud to gun in one season and Lycett is no spud) so it is still too early to write the 2017 season off particularly if we fix our midfield through sound recruiting.

12months to return pretty much

but my fear with nic is what happened to emac - obviously had to drop a lot of weight to minimise the stress on his knee. it could take him another year to regain that muscle mass.

 

[Moose1414]

I like the optimism in your post, but how is it the club's fault that he ruptured his ACL? Not sure if you can blame the club. Nic has always been managed very well in my opinion. He rarely plays more than 80% of a game.

Honestly I'm just still pissed we traded Sinclair because I argued fervently before that trade keeping him was essential to managing Nic's workload and that injuries to him and Lycett were always going to happen. Thats just a personal beef and not really what this thread is about and at the risk of derailing it i'll just say I'm not sure you can't blame the club. Doing an ACL is always unlucky but he was coming back from an operation in which they severed his plantaris tendon and about 2 minutes on google is enough to find that messing with that can't be completely dismissed in regard to ACL injuries. I'm not in a position to say what the risk factor was but personally I think there was some risk so I'm ok with blaming the club because my natural instinct in life as a worker bee is to always hate on management when things go wrong, because **** them.

"Later, Helms et al. examined the MR images of fifteen patients with sports-related injuries to the lower leg.9 The plantaris muscle and tendon, as well as the surrounding structures, were retrospectively examined for abnormalities. In all fifteen patients, evidence of rupture or strain of the plantaris muscle was present. An associated torn anterior cruciate ligament (ACL) was found in 10 of 15 patients."

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1978447/

 

[Stereophonic]

Honestly I'm just still pissed we traded Sinclair because I argued fervently before that trade keeping him was essential to managing Nic's workload and that injuries to him and Lycett were always going to happen. Thats just a personal beef and not really what this thread is about and at the risk of derailing it i'll just say I'm not sure you can't blame the club. Doing an ACL is always unlucky but he was coming back from an operation in which they severed his plantaris tendon and about 2 minutes on google is enough to find that messing with that can't be completely dismissed in regard to ACL injuries. I'm not in a position to say what the risk factor was but personally I think there was some risk so I'm ok with blaming the club because my natural instinct in life as a worker bee is to always hate on management when things go wrong, because **** them.

"Later, Helms et al. examined the MR images of fifteen patients with sports-related injuries to the lower leg.9 The plantaris muscle and tendon, as well as the surrounding structures, were retrospectively examined for abnormalities. In all fifteen patients, evidence of rupture or strain of the plantaris muscle was present. An associated torn anterior cruciate ligament (ACL) was found in 10 of 15 patients."

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1978447/

You are right, realistically, Sydney would have accepted a second round pick for Jetta and must have been stoked a GF ruckman/ forward landed on their lap for someone they probably would have delisted or on traded at the end of this season.. Sinclair is on fire. FU Sydney

 

[Eagleboy68]

Honestly I'm just still pissed we traded Sinclair because I argued fervently before that trade keeping him was essential to managing Nic's workload and that injuries to him and Lycett were always going to happen. Thats just a personal beef and not really what this thread is about and at the risk of derailing it i'll just say I'm not sure you can't blame the club. Doing an ACL is always unlucky but he was coming back from an operation in which they severed his plantaris tendon and about 2 minutes on google is enough to find that messing with that can't be completely dismissed in regard to ACL injuries. I'm not in a position to say what the risk factor was but personally I think there was some risk so I'm ok with blaming the club because my natural instinct in life as a worker bee is to always hate on management when things go wrong, because **** them.

"Later, Helms et al. examined the MR images of fifteen patients with sports-related injuries to the lower leg.9 The plantaris muscle and tendon, as well as the surrounding structures, were retrospectively examined for abnormalities. In all fifteen patients, evidence of rupture or strain of the plantaris muscle was present. An associated torn anterior cruciate ligament (ACL) was found in 10 of 15 patients."

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1978447/

Makes you wonder if the club doctors and coaching staff have access to Google??