Play Nice Goal Umpire costs Adelaide a shot at finals, how do you stop it from happening again?

[Roby]

Yep. Apparently I'm in the minority here, but I'd rather err on the side of less disruption to the game even though this will allow some wrong decisions through.
Case in point: I think decisions between a behind and no score should be umpires call only i.e. not eligible for review. From time to time this will mean some wrong calls, but the stakes are typically low enough that we should avoid the cost of stopping the game. Those stoppages also have their impact: e.g. the team with possession exited their defensive area, potentially prevented from scoring opportunities etc.

Jesus

Reread my post, again.

My proposal will have less disruptions than we currently have.

 

[Roby]

I don't think the odd break in play is a big deal tbh. Howlers like the one on the weekend are rare. I'd rather these things get sorted out immediately where possible.

But the current system relies on umpires on the field to call for a review.

My new proposal would eliminate this, and, the score last week in Adelaide would've been corrected.

 

[Bluelegs]

But the current system relies on umpires on the field to call for a review.

My new proposal would eliminate this, and, the score last week in Adelaide would've been corrected.

I think you can have it both ways. Every score is reviewed but an umpire can call for an immediate review if they choose to. You'd rather avoid having a significant portion of dead play that doesn't count.

 

[Roby]

I think you can have it both ways. Every score is reviewed but an umpire can call for an immediate review if they choose to. You'd rather avoid having a significant portion of dead play that doesn't count.

Making umpires try and get the call right the first time, rather than going to the score review, will make them try and get it right rather than rely on the ARC, and then make half hearted attempts of adjudicating score decisions.

Which is a problem, because sometimes there's not enough evidence to overturn.

How often will the umpire make a wrong decision, that is clear cut and overturned by the ARC? I don't think very often.

 

[The Tilt]

Jesus

Reread my post, again.

My proposal will have less disruptions than we currently have.

Jesus. Settle down. I was responding to the general proposal to automatically review behinds in the background and then reverse the clock as needed. I was actually addressing your particular version of that proposal (with all due respect).

Anyway, if they're going to start auto-reviewing behinds, this will almost certainly be in addition to the current system of goal-umpire initiated reviews, rather than replacing that system. For one thing, auto-reviews need to be time-limited - You can't have play continuing on for 5 minutes before calling it back. With only 30 seconds available (I think the current limit on auto reviews of goals), you're less likely to overturn wrong decisions. I'm not entirely convinced that Saturday night's blunder would have been overturned within that time frame.

Beyond that, your proposal may have fewer disruptions, but more of the least desirable type. Pausing the game to review is the lesser of two evils when compared to reversing the clock.

p.s. You mean fewer disruptions, not less. Sorry, since you were needlessly a bit of a d!ck in your response i couldn't help myself.

 

[SC_Power]

Nah..its simple, show the score as what it was and it was a goal so adjust the score to be correct as no further score happened after that from open play. Dont conflate other free kicks etc where there is no technology there to review them like there was for this goal. Or if you dont want that, then replay the entire game or maybe as sydney didn't deserve to win either, award no premiership points for the game. But the outcome as it stands is all for Sydneys benefit and none for Adelaide and its also cost geelong a chance at finals this week too. Its the worst outcome of a hatful of outcomes the AFL cpuld have run with

Your last comment is the most insightful.

For all the conspiracy theorists out there (not for you specifically)

How does
a) The AFL wanted Sydney to win.
and
b) A Sydney win was the worst possible outcome for the AFL.
co-exist?

Maybe we can resolve that one in this thread before going further.

 

[SC_Power]

The car turning would be at fault either way, the lights going yellow doesn't mean right of way stops existing...

Not intended to be an exact analogy of course, I'm centering about the driver seeing or not seeing a traffic light change and how that impacts their decision on how they drive through an intersection.

But I'm OK if it's too confusing. Back to the football!

 

[Crow till I die]

Your last comment is the most insightful.

For all the conspiracy theorists out there (not for you specifically)

How does
a) The AFL wanted Sydney to win.
and
b) A Sydney win was the worst possible outcome for the AFL.
co-exist?

Maybe we can resolve that one in this thread before going further.

I mean leaving it as a Sydney win was the worst outcome because they simply did not win the game either. The AFL admitted it was a goal. A replay, not awarding premiership points etc were all options they could have considered here..even if the option still meant Adelaide being ruled out of finals..but the outcome they have is that Sydney are absolutely laughing as they have been gifted a win by the AFL that they didn't earn and in the process its killed 2 teams seasons and now compromised R24 and the top 8 when the technology was there to prevent this exact scenario from happening

Imagine if the AFL came out and said, we have considered the impacts of this horrendous failure of process and realise that whilst the crows were rightfully in front with 1 minute to go, we don't know what the remaining outcome would have been in that last minute so we can't award premiership points to either team in this situation.

Now that result still kills Adelaide's season, but it also means that Geelong (who were the totally innocent party in all this) are still a chance and Sydney would have to win their last minor round game to be sure of finals instead of what is a dead rubber. The Bulldogs would be playing a far more motivated Geelong than the one that has put its sore players out to pasture. That for example would have left the R24 and then the top 8 with far more integrity than it has now

Imagine the crows winning this week, GWS winning and Melbourne beating Sydney so that had the crows got the 4 points they may well have deserved hitting the front with a minute to go, Sydney would have missed finals.

Ugly stuff

 

[Maddo11]

Hypotheticals are all well and good, but that is just bloviating tripe.

Swans lead all night, crows had two hours to win and one "missed" judgement call at the end is unfortunate, but stripping premiership points needs to be reserved for punishing cheating.

 

[SC_Power]

I mean leaving it as a Sydney win was the worst outcome because they simply did not win the game either. The AFL admitted it was a goal. A replay, not awarding premiership points etc were all options they could have considered here..even if the option still meant Adelaide being ruled out of finals..but the outcome they have is that Sydney are absolutely laughing as they have been gifted a win by the AFL that they didn't earn and in the process its killed 2 teams seasons and now compromised R24 and the top 8 when the technology was there to prevent this exact scenario from happening

Imagine if the AFL came out and said, we have considered the impacts of this horrendous failure of process and realise that whilst the crows were rightfully in front with 1 minute to go, we don't know what the remaining outcome would have been in that last minute so we can't award premiership points to either team in this situation.

Now that result still kills Adelaide's season, but it also means that Geelong (who were the totally innocent party in all this) are still a chance and Sydney would have to win their last minor round game to be sure of finals instead of what is a dead rubber. The Bulldogs would be playing a far more motivated Geelong than the one that has put its sore players out to pasture. That for example would have left the R24 and then the top 8 with far more integrity than it has now

Imagine the crows winning this week, GWS winning and Melbourne beating Sydney so that had the crows got the 4 points they may well have deserved hitting the front with a minute to go, Sydney would have missed finals.

Ugly stuff

See, you’re missing the point completely.

Sydney WON the game. Because the umpires ruled that they won. Regardless of anything anyone says.
As the rules stand, no game has ever, and will ever, have a result overturned due to an umpiring error.
If they want to change the rules in the future, good luck. But that’s not the case now.

If the AFL did what you want them to do, there would be a legal case hit them so quickly that Gil wouldn’t have left the press conference.

(and if you don’t see the irony of asking the AFL to not follow their own rules and process…..)

 

[Crow till I die]

See, you’re missing the point completely.

Sydney WON the game. Because the umpires ruled that they won. Regardless of anything anyone says.
As the rules stand, no game has ever, and will ever, have a result overturned due to an umpiring error.
If they want to change the rules in the future, good luck. But that’s not the case now.

If the AFL did what you want them to do, there would be a legal case hit them so quickly that Gil wouldn’t have left the press conference.

(and if you don’t see the irony of asking the AFL to not follow their own rules and process…..)

NO they didn't win the game on the correct score. They are the first team in AFL history to be given an artificial win when they scored less that their opponents.

As for legal cases..nup, the AFL could have ordered a replay they have discretion..they chose not to

 

[PeterSalt]

There's a school of thought that the umpires were instructed to maybe rely on their own instincts a bit more after the previous week's score review shenanigans, and to be honest that makes more sense to me than a goal umpire winging it on his own initiative. Maybe I should head off to the Conspiracies board

Nah .. apparently the umpires are reviewed after every game and given a rating .. the higher your rating the more chance you have of being picked for the big games (finals).

No idea if there are financial bonuses attached?

Score reviews can down grade their rating

Clearly there is considerable implied pressure for the umpires to keep the game flowing

 

[bomberclifford]

I know it's not likely to ever happen again but imagine if this were reversed because of a score review up the other end



Just 12 seconds for ARC to decide lol.

It's a tough one

The casual little jump over the player on the ground... what a ****ing freak he was.

 

[sthmelb_dimmies]

78 pages?

Must not be a lot of exciting and interesting activities going on in Adelaide.

 

[JimmyBC]

78 pages?

Must not be a lot of exciting and interesting activities going on in Adelaide.

You popped in Sydney must me raging.

 

[Port 2004]

78 pages?

Must not be a lot of exciting and interesting activities going on in Adelaide.

Well don’t blame Port supporters. It’s the Crommies who,are whining.

 

[sthmelb_dimmies]

Well don’t blame Port supporters. It’s the Crommies who,are whining.

Fair play. Apologies Alberton.

 

[bonehilda]

78 pages?

Must not be a lot of exciting and interesting activities going on in Adelaide.

Keep pretending you don’t understand why we’re peeved

Start worrying about why your side gave up a 44 point lead in one and half quarters

 

[RedBloodBlackSwan]

I don't want damages I want a lengthy painful court hearing where all the details come out and are public.

I do not trust the AFL to review itself and make the required changes any more than I trust a goal umpire to make a mistake then call for a review.

I want to know what every umpire on the ground saw and was thinking and why they didn't stop play.

I want to know because the AFL has already hidden all of the details from us and will not tell us anything and are now making changes with no oversight and no way for us to know anything.

I think it is the lack of closure that is most frustrating.

I would love for the AFL to have a weekly review with umpires on the most controversial calls. I think it would be great for fans, the game and even umpires to have this exposure.

You could make it a Tuesday night weekly event, and have it hosted by ex-umpires who really know their craft, with examples to show why it can be so hard to make the right calls and all the considerations is fans take for granted.

The show could also highlight some of the really good remarkable calls that umpires make, with insights on how umpires train to improve their craft.

They could use the TV ratings to fund umpires properly, and it would help the AFL achieve its long lived dream in media exposure if every day of the calendar year.

 

[Port 2004]

Keep pretending you don’t understand why we’re peeved

Start worrying about why your side gave up a 44 point lead in one and half quarters

Not really. I have barely got involved with the discussion.

 

[RedBloodBlackSwan]

Nah .. apparently the umpires are reviewed after every game and given a rating .. the higher your rating the more chance you have of being picked for the big games (finals).

No idea if there are financial bonuses attached?

Score reviews can down grade their rating

Clearly there is considerable implied pressure for the umpires to keep the game flowing

What a dumb metric if this is true. The metric should be needless score reviews, not total score reviews.

 

[RedBloodBlackSwan]

Start worrying about why your side gave up a 44 point lead in one and half quarters

I for one am very concerned about this. Regardless of the quality of the umpiring, that last quarter and a bit was truly terrible. Mental weakness and fitness are huge challenges for our side.

 

[bonehilda]

Not really. I have barely got involved with the discussion.

Maybe not you but don’t think our fans were expecting anything less than a bunch of Swans and Port supporters trolling this thread and having an absolute ball lol

 

[SBD Gonzalez]

NO they didn't win the game on the correct score. They are the first team in AFL history to be given an artificial win when they scored less that their opponents.

That's ridiculous. Obviously you haven't been watching AFL for very long.

Just checking, has any official footage emerged yet that categorically shows the umpire got it wrong?

 

[Crow till I die]

That's ridiculous. Obviously you haven't been watching AFL for very long.

Just checking, has any official footage emerged yet that categorically shows the umpire got it wrong?

LOL