Strategy Half time in the season - how do we look?

[iameviljez]

He had to do it in the Cup competitions. This was particularly a struggle to nail in Europe against similarly talented and tactically prepared opposition. Got there eventually.

Especially in a game like soccer, where you could be absolutely belted all game and still win (which, ironically, was the way that he landed his one and only European Cup).

 

[TheWoodenSlug]

I have never wanted to watch the replay... how many setshots , gettable setshots did we miss. I doubt the almghty Clarkson affected Mooney and Ottens..let alone who else missed shots. I think they rushed 10 behinds.. that leaves a lot of misses.

Check out the scores and the clock for each of these misses - we could/should have been well in front halfway through the third quarter. Then Dew came along and the rest is history.

Sheesh, that Ottens one gets worse every time you see it.

 

[Max Milburn]

Not sure about you, but GWS have, for a long time, had the best list. Only now do they look like actually producing. Imho, GWS is the team to beat, and Richmond are close but their list is decimated in quality.
WCE are approaching their best. And then there's Collingwood.
Point is, there is no outstanding team that is winning games regularly by 10 goals, so even a Lions or Freo, Port or Adelaide could do a Bradbury this year.
Intentionally, I do NOT include us in this discussion. But as said elsewhere, we are 2 games clear, and until that changes, it can only be a good thing.

Are you ignoring GWS's big losses Dubs?
Also WC?
Why is this irrelevant, yet our one narrow loss means so much?

 

[iameviljez]

Are you ignoring GWS's big losses Dubs?
Also WC?
Why is this irrelevant, yet our one narrow loss means so much?

Because I think GWS went to a level that we haven't matched this year.

 

[Max Milburn]

Because I think GWS went to a level that we haven't matched this year.

So their (big) failures don't count, only their wins?
Consistency is important, and it's a factor in why we are on top of the ladder.

 

[Max Milburn]

For those who think GWS are so great, let me put it this way...

I we had lost to the Eagles by 52, Freo by 24 and the Hawks by 33, would you be talking us up as the best team in the comp?

 

[TheWoodenSlug]

For those who think GWS are so great, let me put it this way...

I we had lost to the Eagles by 52, Freo by 24 and the Hawks by 33, would you be talking us up as the best team in the comp?

I feel like GWS is being a little over rated on the back of smashing Gold Coast and Carlton in recent weeks.

 

[Max Milburn]

I feel like GWS is being a little over rated on the back of smashing Gold Coast and Carlton in recent weeks.

Yes. Just ask Stewart Dew.
West Coast have also had big losses that can't just be explained away.
Lions by 44. Power by 42. Cats by 58.
Our supporters would be very, very unflattering in their analysis if we had lost three games by those margins.

 

[Cattery]

I feel like GWS is being a little over rated on the back of smashing Gold Coast and Carlton in recent weeks.

Had their pants pulled down by Hawthorn in round eight, then big wins against three "powerhouse" sides in Carlton, Melbourne and Gold Coast and suddenly they're the side to beat apparently.

They're a good side no doubt, but until they make a GF, let alone win one, I'll remain a sceptic.

 

[iameviljez]

So their (big) failures don't count, only their wins?
Consistency is important, and it's a factor in why we are on top of the ladder.

Of course it matters, it's just a point about our best vs their best, that's all.

 

[Max Milburn]

Of course it matters, it's just a point about our best vs their best, that's all.

Fair enough, but how about our worst v their worst?
Just as relevant IMO.

 

[geelong_crazy26]

So their (big) failures don't count, only their wins?
Consistency is important, and it's a factor in why we are on top of the ladder.

I have talked them up and think they are second best side in the AFL.

All I am basing that off is versing us and what I saw. I don’t care how they beat up on the shit sides because some teams come out to do that and others just cruise, which we fall into the cruise mode bracket.

I think we are better based off our game can them. As I have said I think dangerfield kelly selwood all had their worst game in over 12 months and the GWS players had absolute blinders.. yet we lost by 2 points.

They don’t have a gear to go above that game and we have plenty to improve on from that performance.

 

[Poetic Justice]

Check out the scores and the clock for each of these misses - we could/should have been well in front halfway through the third quarter. Then Dew came along and the rest is history.

Sheesh, that Ottens one gets worse every time you see it.

Damn thats a painful video

 

[Max Milburn]

Damn thats a painful video

You watched it??

 

[cynical]

given our recent finals record we are probably 4th best

the Eagles, Pies and GWS are all battle hardened teams that have been late in September

we have looked much better this year but it is a long season and our age profile isn't great, highly likely some of our kids start dropping off by seasons end

we should be competitive in a prelim at minimum, another limp-wristed finals effort isn't good enough

 

[Max Milburn]

given our recent finals record we are probably 4th best

the Eagles, Pies and GWS are all battle hardened teams that have been late in September

we have looked much better this year but it is a long season and our age profile isn't great, highly likely some of our kids start dropping off by seasons end

we should be competitive in a prelim at minimum, another limp-wristed finals effort isn't good enough

It's really hard to argue with people who think the same thing happens year in year out.
Have a look at the ladder and ask why those "battle-hardened" teams are below us.

 

[Turbocat]

Check out the scores and the clock for each of these misses - we could/should have been well in front halfway through the third quarter. Then Dew came along and the rest is history.

Sheesh, that Ottens one gets worse every time you see it.

A lot of what Id call half chances that , some under pressure , some normally would have been made. When you are on they work but in a pressure of a day going wrong ... no surprising that Chappy and SJ's were misses.. Mackies was too far out.. so all those one could put down to pressure imo. There was one setshot from each of from Stokes , Ottens , Mooney and Lonergan that all should have been goals..and Mooney on better days would have kicked all three chances , but the last two were after the goal square miss. I wonder what would have happened if Mooney had just used a little more width on his approach.. would the umpire have called him? And he has said many times that his head was not in the game ..it was think ing of what he would do after the shot It was not a great spot for an after a siren kick really but an in quarter kick it was very good.. so the timing of that shot was as detrimental as anything. Lonergan was out of his depth . Nathan Ablett would have kicked at least one of those if not more... Shame Hawkins was not ready.

So yes the Haw game plan affected us but the pressure of the day ..and it not going as smoothly as we had had all year was also key. We really would have been better to have lost another game or two.. to rest a player or two ..

One might take one bit of learn froming that and apply it to today.. its great that we are converting chances but we probably need to be aware that under pressure even excellent convertors do not always make the most of their chances so.. we probably need to ensure we can get more shots at goal than we are currently developing. And really I dont see a SJ and a Chappy in our current side...they guys we have could easily have missed those shots.

 

[Partridge]

given our recent finals record we are probably 4th best

the Eagles, Pies and GWS are all battle hardened teams that have been late in September

we have looked much better this year but it is a long season and our age profile isn't great, highly likely some of our kids start dropping off by seasons end

we should be competitive in a prelim at minimum, another limp-wristed finals effort isn't good enough

Yeah as is always the case we won't know until September.

Impossible to fault how the first half of the season has gone though. Didn't see that coming by a long way.

 

[Ricketz]

Interesting to hear Stewart dew declaring GWS the best team in the competition in his presser on the weekend.

Only one week after he saw us this almost seems like a comparison he has drawn

His opinion means about as much as ours. He isn't watching us every week, and can only base it on the snapshot of the team that turns up.

I would not have thought the best team would lose like GWS have done, and would be good at all grounds.

 

[Ricketz]

Because I think GWS went to a level that we haven't matched this year.

How is losing by four points with all the run of play in the last five minutes not matching it?

 

[God Mode]

A lot of what Id call half chances that , some under pressure , some normally would have been made. When you are on they work but in a pressure of a day going wrong ... no surprising that Chappy and SJ's were misses.. Mackies was too far out.. so all those one could put down to pressure imo. There was one setshot from each of from Stokes , Ottens , Mooney and Lonergan that all should have been goals..and Mooney on better days would have kicked all three chances , but the last two were after the goal square miss. I wonder what would have happened if Mooney had just used a little more width on his approach.. would the umpire have called him? And he has said many times that his head was not in the game ..it was think ing of what he would do after the shot It was not a great spot for an after a siren kick really but an in quarter kick it was very good.. so the timing of that shot was as detrimental as anything. Lonergan was out of his depth . Nathan Ablett would have kicked at least one of those if not more... Shame Hawkins was not ready.

So yes the Haw game plan affected us but the pressure of the day ..and it not going as smoothly as we had had all year was also key. We really would have been better to have lost another game or two.. to rest a player or two ..

One might take one bit of learn froming that and apply it to today.. its great that we are converting chances but we probably need to be aware that under pressure even excellent convertors do not always make the most of their chances so.. we probably need to ensure we can get more shots at goal than we are currently developing. And really I dont see a SJ and a Chappy in our current side...they guys we have could easily have missed those shots.

Also dont forget we didn't have Egan from the previous year, who most definitely would have freed up Scarlett. Taylor became a gun as early as the next year but was a bit out of his depth, along with Lonergan.

 

[Turbocat]

Also dont forget we didn't have Egan from the previous year, who most definitely would have freed up Scarlett. Taylor became a gun as early as the next year but was a bit out of his depth, along with Lonergan.

Perhaps..

Its 11 years ago now..my memory of that year was us playing the zenith of our that side capabilities yet perhaps we peaked 2/3 rds of the way thru season. Haw have said that when we beat them by 17odd points they thought we were gettable. I think we were that good for most of the year.. maybe weakness were hidden and not often exposed.

Thats the way I think of Mooneys setshot. He was wrapped up in a wax on wax off with SJ.. often he would be unselfish and give away shots that he should have taken to practice those shots. Players were getting away with sore bodies as we could just obliterate a side in a quarter or 10 minutes .. and a lack of close games meant we were not prepared for what happens If... I compare it to 2009 .. we were not glossy , not as close to our best , especially after R14 ... but it built in a robustness..so that when we got in the arm wrestle in the GF we handled it better.

Now your point maybe have a lot value to it , as Taylor by 09 taking on NR .. he was an important part of that robustness.

 

[iameviljez]

How is losing by four points with all the run of play in the last five minutes not matching it?

Because for all the rest of the second half barring those last few minutes, we were getting completely outplayed by them. The scoreboard flattered us somewhat - they kicked 1.6 to 1.1 in that last quarter, and should have had it sewn up well in advance.

 

[God Mode]

Perhaps..

Its 11 years ago now..my memory of that year was us playing the zenith of our that side capabilities yet perhaps we peaked 2/3 rds of the way thru season. Haw have said that when we beat them by 17odd points they thought we were gettable. I think we were that good for most of the year.. maybe weakness were hidden and not often exposed.

Thats the way I think of Mooneys setshot. He was wrapped up in a wax on wax off with SJ.. often he would be unselfish and give away shots that he should have taken to practice those shots. Players were getting away with sore bodies as we could just obliterate a side in a quarter or 10 minutes .. and a lack of close games meant we were not prepared for what happens If... I compare it to 2009 .. we were not glossy , not as close to our best , especially after R14 ... but it built in a robustness..so that when we got in the arm wrestle in the GF we handled it better.

Now your point maybe have a lot value to it , as Taylor by 09 taking on NR .. he was an important part of that robustness.

We still clearly should have won then 08 GF and the reasons why we didn't have been stated endlessly. I just feel it as good as the 08 team was it would have been even stronger with Egan at CHB and N Ablett at CHF. Perhaps it wouldn't have made a difference in the end due to us missing shots anyway but who knows.

 

[Ricketz]

Because for all the rest of the second half barring those last few minutes, we were getting completely outplayed by them. The scoreboard flattered us somewhat - they kicked 1.6 to 1.1 in that last quarter, and should have had it sewn up well in advance.

Fair enough. It didn't at all feel that way to me. They were coming from behind, with the wind in their sails and couldn't crack our defence. Contrast that with our first quarter where we kicked 2.3 and one out on the full. What's the difference?

We controlled the game for 90 minutes, and ran out of legs in the end.

I'm not worried about GWS. I am confident we can beat them.