Fixture How can Swans host a local final at a smaller stadium, but Geelong can’t?

[JohnZ]

Geelong should be banding together with North, St Kilda and the Bulldogs to lobby for this right, not going it alone.

I bring this up all the time. 13/17 clubs currently get "home finals" at their chosen home ground (I don't include GC because that is an unknown). The other four (cats, north, saints and bulldogs) get shafted. Why are our four clubs the unlucky ones?

 

[PhatBoy]

You’ve got to love how you make out that this is only a Geelong issue, when last time I looked the 3 Marvel tenants who only play home games there also play their home finals at the MCG.

Even though they generally only play 2 home and away games at the MCG each H&A season, while Geelong play there about 6 times.

So not only are Geelong not the only team in this boat, but it’s much less of an issue for them, given they play there so much more than the Marvel teams.

What it does highlight though is just how much the Geelong folks complain about it, compared to the Marvel ones.

So much so that many, like you, think they’re the only team in this boat.

Especially astounding given that the very team you are playing this week, is playing their home final at your home ground, rather than at theirs.

The mind boggles.

Have you stopped to think that it comes up a lot more because Geelong earn a lot more home finals than the Marvel tenants?

 

[falcons2]

I bring this up all the time. 13/17 clubs currently get "home finals" at their chosen home ground (I don't include GC because that is an unknown). The other four (cats, north, saints and bulldogs) get shafted. Why are our four clubs the unlucky ones?

It's pretty simple. If only one final is to be played in Victoria, it will be at the MCG. Same rule probably applies for a second final. That decision has been made so you can whinge about it, discuss it, whatever, it's not changing. Had the top 8 been, Geelong at 1, Bulldogs 2, Carlton 5 and Hawthorn 6, and the other 4 finalist were Sydney, Port, GWS and Brisbane, Geelong may well have got a game in Geelong, the Bulldogs at Marvel and the Blues and Hawks at the MCG. But that didn't happen.

I wonder if the players from these clubs feel unlucky playing at the MCG!

 

[Mr Meow]

It's pretty simple. If only one final is to be played in Victoria, it will be at the MCG. Same rule probably applies for a second final. That decision has been made so you can whinge about it, discuss it, whatever, it's not changing. Had the top 8 been, Geelong at 1, Bulldogs 2, Carlton 5 and Hawthorn 6, and the other 4 finalist were Sydney, Port, GWS and Brisbane, Geelong may well have got a game in Geelong, the Bulldogs at Marvel and the Blues and Hawks at the MCG. But that didn't happen.

I wonder if the players from these clubs feel unlucky playing at the MCG!

At the end of the day not having GMHBA finals probably did stop some good but not great recent Geelong sides making more grand finals. 2016, 2017 and 2019 are the main ones in contention.

When we have great sides they tend to get the job done at the G this century, beating an MCG tenant in a final each time. 2008 the only exception.

No side has won more finals at the G this century except maybe Hawthorn? And no other side has won as many grand finals at the G this century besides Hawthorn.

Because none of these premierships involved genuine home ground advantage, it is then very clear who the team of the 21st century is so far.

So I think the MCG finals thing adds to Geelong's status and it's great to get to play big Melbourne based clubs on their home turf in finals so often.

 

[Sentinel]

It's pretty simple. If only one final is to be played in Victoria, it will be at the MCG. Same rule probably applies for a second final. That decision has been made so you can whinge about it, discuss it, whatever, it's not changing. Had the top 8 been, Geelong at 1, Bulldogs 2, Carlton 5 and Hawthorn 6, and the other 4 finalist were Sydney, Port, GWS and Brisbane, Geelong may well have got a game in Geelong, the Bulldogs at Marvel and the Blues and Hawks at the MCG. But that didn't happen.

I wonder if the players from these clubs feel unlucky playing at the MCG!

What a worthless post. People talk about the system in place being inequitable for several teams, for valid reasons (amongst many other inequities across the AFL).

Your response "here is my explanation of the system in place, haha!"

 

[falcons2]

What a worthless post. People talk about the system in place being inequitable for several teams, for valid reasons (amongst many other inequities across the AFL).

Your response "here is my explanation of the system in place, haha!"

You engaged, so worth acknowledged, thank you.
People may talk about system being inequitable but is it really?

Inequities are variables the elite will overcome.

 

[Sentinel]

You engaged, so worth acknowledged, thank you.
People may talk about system being inequitable but is it really?

Inequities are variables the elite will overcome.

More waffle. Cheers.

 

[falcons2]

You engaged, so worth acknowledged, thank you.
People may talk about system being inequitable but is it really?

Inequities are variables the elite will overcome.

So, anyone who disagrees with you or has an alternate viewpoint is waffle - ok.

One last question, do you think anyone in the Western Bulldogs football department, players, coaches the whole lot, would prefer to play Hawthorn at Marvel rather than the MCG?

 

[FootyLad0]

The ground is not symentrical ,that's a fact.

No the MCG Home Ground thing…

It’s nonsensical

 

[Aristotle Pickett]

No the MCG Home Ground thing…

It’s nonsensical

You play 6 or 7 games there every year

 

[FootyLad0]

You play 6 or 7 games there every year

1. How many are “Home games”
I count 6 games this year with two “Home games” against MCG tenants in Carlton and Bombers

2. They’ve been contracted to play “Home games” by the AFL.
Is Collingwood’s Home ground Marvel stadium? How about Richmond? I see they’ve hosted Home games away from Home….by your logic that is also their Home ground.

Marvel isn’t their Home ground just like the MCG isn’t Geelong’s, it’s absolute rubbish to suggest otherwise.

 

[Aristotle Pickett]

1. How many are “Home games”
I count 6 games this year with two “Home games” against MCG tenants in Carlton and Bombers

2. They’ve been contracted to play “Home games” by the AFL.
Is Collingwood’s Home ground Marvel stadium? How about Richmond? I see they’ve hosted Home games away from Home….by your logic that is also their Home ground.

Marvel isn’t their Home ground just like the MCG isn’t Geelong’s, it’s absolute rubbish to suggest otherwise.

The point is there is no disadvantage for Geelong playing at the MCG. You know the ground back to front.
No team is allowed to train on it , so no advantage there.
If you want to win a GF you should welcome playing there and let 50,000 more supporters access.

 

[Mr Meow]

The point is there is no disadvantage for Geelong playing at the MCG. You know the ground back to front.
No team is allowed to train on it , so no advantage there.
If you want to win a GF you should welcome playing there and let 50,000 more supporters access.

We did, at Richmond's home ground - 4 times out of 14 seasons where the MCG hosted the grand final.

 

[Sentinel]

So, anyone who disagrees with you or has an alternate viewpoint is waffle - ok.

One last question, do you think anyone in the Western Bulldogs football department, players, coaches the whole lot, would prefer to play Hawthorn at Marvel rather than the MCG?

You didn't express a viewpoint, you just explained what we already know. Then proceeded to question if it's even inequitable (laughable for a Hawks fan getting to watch their team play an 'away' game at their home ground this weekend) and that good teams will just overcome these supposedly non-existent inequities anyway. Complete waffle.

Whether the Bulldogs or any of these clubs would prefer to play finals at Marvel or the MCG is not relevant since it's never put to the clubs to make that call. Geelong have expressed their desire to play finals in Geelong yet are denied so maybe there's your answer.

 

[Blue1980]

1. Geelong AFL members are Club members by default, so they won't miss out on the member pre-sale. The neutral hawk/bomber/pies AFL members will, and I don't care about them (unless they are the away team - they get access through their associated club membership). MCC is a cricket club, if you want access to finals not at the G, become an AFL club member, or buy a general public ticket like everyone else.

2. It was never an issue when the MCG and Waverley were actual neutral grounds. When Geelong hosted Carlton in the 1962 Prelim, Geelong and Carlton had only played one game each at the G during the H+A season (18 game H+A season), and Melbourne was the only team to host H+A games at the G. The only time the finals were "unfair" was when Melbourne was the away team.

We have gone from a finals series where 1 of 12 teams can get an unearned home final advantage (Melbourne), to a system where 14/18 get proper home finals (Geelong @KP, Bulldogs/Saints/North Marvel the only who don't), and Six clubs that get an unearned home final advantage (Pies/Demons/Tigers/Hawks/Blues/Dons @MCG against those four clubs listed above). 2013 was proof of concept. The world doesn't end by giving the remaining four teams in the comp proper/true home finals. Just like the world wouldn't have ended if Brisbane were allowed to host Geelong in Brisbane for the '04 Prelim.

The GF will never change, but it should. ~1/2 teams are in VIC, and ~1/2 teams are outside of VIC. So every second GF should rotate between the MCG and an interstate venue. This is where we will eventually get to. It is too impractical to give the GF to the top seed due to all of the moving parts that need to be locked in months in advance, but we can at least guarantee Brisbane/Sydney/Adelaide/Perth a GF once every 8 years and those clubs can target those GFs if they feel the need to. No different to the home country of an olympics wanting to outperform in that year.

3. We want to play 11 home games at KP, plus home finals (weeks 1-3). For the H+A season, the club clears $1m+ per home game, because we take in all the season tickets, plus food, drink and merch sales (and hospitality suites). That's the equivilant to an 85k+ crowd at the G, and you can't make $1m from a Marvel game (as an AFL tenant). There's a reason why Geelong v Freo was chosen to be at KP, and not Hawthorn/Swans or Collingwood/Port at Marvel. The AFL earns all the money in finals, and they made bank from KP.

The reason we don't get 11 games at KP is because the AFL has contracts (they have a lot of contracts), which requires 45 games a year at the MCG. Other clubs sell home games to tassie, to ballarat, to cairns, and we lose money (or at best break even) on games moved to the G. We have members in Melbourne, we have members in Geelong, we have members in the Western Distrcits. I come down from Melbourne to most home games, it's easy. Much easier than driving from Colac or Horsham to Melbourne.

We don't need the big 4 to play in Geelong every year, but all 9 Melbourne clubs should play down in Geelong once every 2 years, just as every club should play every team at their home ground every 2 years on average. Away fans are not entitled to access.

So when north and hawthorns tassie games go and I assume there are extra games at the MCG, would Geelong then be allowed 11 home games in Geelong?