Preview How to beat Geelong

[Knightmare]

I agree with most of what has ben said,but what I cant get my head around is why most are saying we need to tag everyone.
They would love it if we make Daisy play a defensive game.
He is one of our most imporant and attacking players.
Yes,we need to limit a couple of their players in the centre,but our midfield is as strong,if not stronger than theirs.
We need to stop their run out of the backline and pile the pressure on around the forward line and midfield.
If we get precise ball movement into our forward 50,instead of bombing it long and high, we have the big bodies down there to take the mark or bring the ball to ground for our smaller players to swoop on.
I have complete faith in our backline. Our defence will hold up.
We need the likes of Shaw,Davis and Obrien taking the game on,running hard out of defence and setting up the play further down field.

The tagging talk isn't so much trying to take the opposition man out of the game as it is a head to head matchup. So for eg. the Thomas v Bartell matchup would be used to generate more offense because Bartell can't go with Thomas and would be forced to play more defensive than he would like. Thomas will do the right defensive things anyway, but certainly won't be limited to just a defensive role.
Same with the Ball v Selwood role among others. Just head to head at the stoppages. Not recommending he take him around the ground or to shut him down.

The pressure in the forward line is the critical part of the pressure and a big reason why we were so successful in 2010 - hasn't been great this year but just have to do the best we can and hopefully get that pressure close to what it was last year.
It starts from the centre clearances then just lock it in and set the zone up in the right spots and have Reid, Maxy, O'Brien and others there to read the ball and send it back into our forward 50 to targets.

The ball movement is optimal it can be to targets inside 50. Also can send it to space inside our forward 50 where it is to our advantage - whether it be deep where a Geelong player can't get back in time or just an unoccupied area inside 50 which we can get onto first.
Certainly kicking to contests is the wrong way to go about it and Geelong will rebound it back over our heads 9 times out of 10.

High Tempo

Cats love a high tempo game. Slow games dont suit us and thats what the Hawks and WCE did to us. Sure it was a higher tempo in 24 but I wouldnt pay much attention to it. last years replay was a high tempo game and we generally score heaviily with our goal kicking mids featuring heavily.

I like this comment. Tempo is key. Play slow like we have recently and it will be VERY hard to score.
Really need to work to get that early season quick ball movement back. For probably the first half of the season my comments of our games were always along the lines of "our ball movement was great. very quick and looking good", recently it has gone the full 360 and slowed completely down to the extent where we aren't generating the drive at all and just kicking to a contest rather than making a more agressive offensive move.

I see a few key ingredients:

1. At least break even in the centre square. The Cats absolutely tore the Hawks to pieces in the centre square, that's where the game was won. If they go forward, they lock it in, and their dominance in the air makes it difficult to get out.

2. Be brave. This is not the time to go long down the line every time we move forward.

3. Manic, ferocious, ruthless pressure. We won a flag with it, we haven't seen it since. Rattle them, send a message from the opening bounce, "WE WILL NOT DIE WONDERING!"

4. Finally, make the most of every opportunity. No flashy stuff, no selfishness, get the ball and kick a ****ing goal. We know they're not going to waste many opportunities, we need to make them pay.

Hard, uncompromising football. If we do this... we will win the flag. Bring it.

Good post. Not going to quote it all. But think you covered the team ideas very well.

didnt feel the need to quote the whole post, but excellent write up...

just curious on your thoughts on the coaching match up? obviously MM is far more experienced, but scott has shown a bit. if you have any personal analysis on respective game plans and game day nous id be quite happy to hear it...

enjoy the week guys

Think it will be an excellent coaching matchup.

It's no fluke that Chris Scott has got this team into the grand final in season 1. You really have to respect the guy for what he has been able to achive with a group most thought would start to decline. Very smart coach.

Stuck to the Geelong game plan but then adding his interpretation to it to add that little bit of extra toughness and pressure through tackling which previously wasn't a feature of their game. Also seems to really have bought back that hunger that Geelong possibly lacked in 2010 which is impressive.

Has done well to introduce those new generation kids, always believed they were all quality and obviously their development programs like ours is quality.

Scott is fairly similar to Leigh Matthews as a coach and has a similar value system. Understands the vaue of quality ruckmen as well as the importance of his key forwards. Also very defense orientated and would rather stop a goal than score a goal - which is a very common philosophy when it comes to NBA coaches. Really uncompromising as he was as a player and is a "winner" in every sense of the word. Has experienced success and expects it. Not an unreasonable coach and understands his players and will coach in the way they will respond to. Very much a "teaching coach" if that makes sense.

Think he will be a good match for Malthouse. Will be vet v junior.
Don't think Mick will necessarily have the advantage some might think, but don't take that as meaning Scott is the better coach. Mick is every bit as good. More so a case of he has come across a worthy adversary.

 

[rose jam]

Reidy's at the brownlow, good sign injury wise. Groins can sieze up sitting down for a long time, so feels like a good sign to me

 

[Sasuke]

I think our defensive structure can hold them if its an even share of forward 50 entries. The main thing for me is our entries into the forward zones. I think we need to be more focused on hitting up players such as beams, sidebottom, blair etc on the HFF as opposed to long to close or dawes each time. Dawes is better with short hit up leads anyway. We have bombed away too much in recent weeks resulting in many uncontested marks. The annoying thing is, we are brilliant at stoppages in our forward 50. i would nearly be happy to have players aiming wide with under pressure kicks to try keep the ball in the forward 50.

 

[Fasta_123]

I think the way we win is with pressure. Simple as that. We gotta get the press going an draw them up the ground so when they try to bomb it we've got 3 on 1's with the backline playing for each other. Ie: 2 go for the spoil one roves, one sheperds while the other darts off ready for the pass. We need Maxwell playing how he did in the last Qtr, zoning off and helping out. We need cloke to carry on with his form a way forthat to happen is to bring in goldsack to negate Scarlett and take him right out of the game. We need daisy sidebottom and kraks tO have rippa games. They're proven big game players. As much as everyone thinks this game will be won in the midfield I think it will be won from our defense and ability to cause turnovers. Really would love the caff in the side to take Scarlett. Such a pity he had an injury riddled year. He was just so strong and mobile he could hold his own with any defender.

 

[HulkHawkins]

Great write up and some interesting reading BUT all this talk on tagging Geelong players.

I didn't think Collingwood bothered with tagging players.

Should be a great match, this GF's been brewing for a few years now and can't wait, enjoy the week guys

 

[Partridge]

I think the way we win is with pressure. Simple as that. We gotta get the press going an draw them up the ground so when they try to bomb it we've got 3 on 1's with the backline playing for each other. Ie: 2 go for the spoil one roves, one sheperds while the other darts off ready for the pass.

Yep, that's one part of the game that doesn't change. For all the talk about how wonderfully complex the tactics are now, some fundamentals still need to be carried out.

1. Go in hard and win the ball.
2. Use it well. Most of all in front of goal.
3. When you don't have it chase and tackle like maniacs to get it back.

Do those three things well and you won't lose many games.

 

[i_hate_scams]

play like we did a month ago and we'll with a real good chance. With recent form we're 50-50

 

[Syphoncom]

Just not the 96 point month-ago form!

 

[Gladbaqs]

IMHO

Stop Scarlett having an impact and we win.

Maybe play Taz on him for old times sake.

 

[Number 10]

The play-on-at-all-costs game we played in the last quarter against Hawthorn was immense. We have the skill to do it. We need to run Geelong off their legs. We go to Arizona for a reason, we are also younger and players like Thomas, Jolly, Davis, Harry, Maxwell have the willpower to go all day.

We need to apply our frontal pressure with every inside 50. We need Blair, Beams, Sidebottom, Krakouer, Cloke and Dawes to lay at least 3 tackles each on average inside the 50- this is what unsettles them. Do not let them get a clean kick away like Hawthorn did last week and like they did to us the whole game in rnd 24.

Last but not least - Pendlebury. Protect him.

In the 1st quarter of round 24 we were playing some of our best footy, Pendles was absolutely on fire (18 possies I think). He is our man, he has to run riot, everytime he touches the ball, shit happens. Ball to Selwood, Wellingham to Kelly, Swan to Ling and let Pendles run off Corey/Bartel/whoever else I am forgetting.

As much as I think we won't win unless Thomas wins the Norm Smith (he needs to bring something match winning), Pendlebury is just so, so damaging.

 

[Ant85]

What's so great about this contest is that both sides know what they have to do to win.

Everything mentioned in this thread is already known in both camps.

Applying pressure, forcing turnovers, winning the 50/50 contests, getting in first, pretty much the stock standard method to winning a game of footy.

Our intensity and pressure has dropped off over the finals series, whereas Geelong are flying.

We're being too careful and playing too tight, whereas Geelong are moving the ball quickly.

We know what we have to do, we just have to do it.

Run hard, move the ball quickly, zone effectively, apply pressure, get numbers to a contest, and win the contested footy.

I'm sure Geelong will be training to do the same.

 

[Knightmare]

Great write up and some interesting reading BUT all this talk on tagging Geelong players.

I didn't think Collingwood bothered with tagging players.

Should be a great match, this GF's been brewing for a few years now and can't wait, enjoy the week guys

Wouldn't describe it as tagging as much as it is head to head matchups. In grand finals you have to expect allot of man on man.

Ball v Selwood head to head at stoppages + centre bounces.
Thomas v Bartell - when practical. But so much a defense driven matchup and more a balance between generating offense and drive as well as defense.

Then Shaw v Chapman + Harry O v Stevey J would be again head to head matchups where drive from the back half would be expected from both Shaw + Harry.

 

[gareth36]

I think that mick malthouse will want a good defensive match and to quote craig bellamy before the storm prelim game he said " we dont want to get into a shoot out with the warriors" i think mick will have the same sort of mindset.

The better defensive team will win the game and if collingwood play the way they did against the hawks then it will be a long day for the pies
against the hawk the collingwood press/zone was picked apart by hawthorn with good kicking and quick ball movement.

If geelong is given time to spot up targets the way they did agains west coast and if collingwood doesnt play their press/zone roles perfectly the cats are quick enough and skilled enough by foot( most accurate team kicking the ball if i am not mistaken) to move the ball through the zone/press with minimal effort and most likely for maximum re****.

I Like every other collingwood supporter both on big footy and in the world could talk for hours days even on who should be played,who shouldnt,who should be played in what position,who should play on who etc......
but i will leave that to the ones who know best mick and the selection panel.

Also if jolly doesnt play or is limited by his dodgey groin it will make the pies job even tougher and the win even sweeter because otens is a dominant tap ruck man both in the middle and around the ground and if being a ruckman down and only having leigh brown as a ruckman (presuming cameron wood doesnt play) will give ottens and the cats a big advantage at the clearances which is one of collingwoods many strengths.

Meaning every other player on the ground will have to carry a bit more of the burden trying to keep their direct opponents quiet and to make the job a little bit more difficult it is meant to be cold,windy and raining on saturday ala 2009 grand final lets hope and pray that the weather changes to clearer and better conditions.

But if not the job will be that little bit more tougher anyway the better defensive team,the team that has more spoil and the team that has more 1%'ers will win the game lets hope that the team that does all three or at the very least two out of the three is collingwood.

And last but not least lets hope that there is not another draw.

 

[Ant85]

I think that mick malthouse will want a good defensive match and to quote craig bellamy before the storm prelim game he said " we dont want to get into a shoot out with the warriors" i think mick will have the same sort of mindset.

It will be a defensive contest.

But as MM said post-Hawks game, our defence has held up really well against WCE and Hawthorn.

Our backline isn't the issue, in fact it's probably the only solid component of our team at the moment that's given us a chance to win.

It's when we go forward that we struggle.

We're outzoned, we're too slow, and the forward pressure is lacking.

Also, our small forwards have disappeared. What's the average goal kicked by Sidebottom, Krakouer, Blair, Didak, Wellingham and Beams kicked in recent weeks? Can probably take Blair and Wellers out of that mix, but I still don't think they're playing to their best either.

Our tall forwards are doing their job, but our small forwards need a massive kick up the arse. They're required to implement the press, tackle ferociously, and pressure the opposition ball carrier coming out of defence.

At the moment, they're not.

 

[SuperSub17]

I've got it!

Score more goals than them

 

[larrikan]

Great write up and some interesting reading BUT all this talk on tagging Geelong players.

I didn't think Collingwood bothered with tagging players.

Should be a great match, this GF's been brewing for a few years now and can't wait, enjoy the week guys

We don't...it's a response to worrying about a formidable opponent. We may have one or tow play a negating role defensively but we generally don't tag. We rotate the midfield offensively and defensively to protect space.

Our strength is our midfield cannot be let run free. If they are tagged then Wellingham, Didak, Beams and co. usually step up to be our best players. However, this is happening recently. We have "run with" and "zoning off" players but rarely hard taggers like Ling.

 

[SuperSub17]

I've got it!

Score more goals than them

And before someone picks me up on it I know that we did score more goals than them in rd 8 and still lost

 

[upnsmoke]

An article on AFL.com, Click here

Points out what I pointed out and a few others back in Round 24... and to an extent Round 08.

And as to WHY Cats have been dominating Inside 50s.

Long kicks..... it beats the press, and relies on their TALLS and extra men in their forward 50 to win the ball and score.



I think this is a LEGIT concern for Mick Malthouse...
Cats have big bodies in many spots on the field.... it can be effective for them...

 

[dubber]

An article on AFL.com, Click here

Points out what I pointed out and a few others back in Round 24... and to an extent Round 08.

And as to WHY Cats have been dominating Inside 50s.

Long kicks..... it beats the press, and relies on their TALLS and extra men in their forward 50 to win the ball and score.



I think this is a LEGIT concern for Mick Malthouse...
Cats have big bodies in many spots on the field.... it can be effective for them...

All well and good my friend but now take this into account

- Pies were missing Maxwell / Shaw / Leon from defense that day.
- Leigh Brown was playing in defense - not our normal structure.
- Menzel polled three brownlow votes that day
- Goldsack was taking the kick ins.
- We were playing Jolly / Brown / Wood in the same side

Geelong will kick long into their forward 50 as they have been doing this for the past month with great success. Only this time around they will have to do this with Maxwell coming up for the spoil, Shaw & Davis providing rebound & without Menzel.

We will also be playing with more intensity

It will be very interesting viewing that's for sure.

 

[peter9789]

We will beat Geelong because ......

We have supreme fitness - it showed as we got off the floor against Hawthorn.

We have quality players all over the field that has the capability to execute to a level rarely seen at AFL level - record percentage this year.

We are a proven finals performer and I have no doubt the team has been waiting for this day.

We have a shrewd coach and support staff - they will know who they need to tag and what tactics will be employed.

Side by Side

Back to Back

 

[blaze036]

The key thing thats been lacking is pressure. We need to get back to 2010 pressure to win, too many times lately opponents have been breaking tackles and walcing around

 

[hellfire]

All well and good my friend but now take this into account

- Pies were missing Maxwell / Shaw / Leon from defense that day.
- Leigh Brown was playing in defense - not our normal structure.
- Menzel polled three brownlow votes that day
- Goldsack was taking the kick ins.
- We were playing Jolly / Brown / Wood in the same side

Geelong will kick long into their forward 50 as they have been doing this for the past month with great success. Only this time around they will have to do this with Maxwell coming up for the spoil, Shaw & Davis providing rebound & without Menzel.

We will also be playing with more intensity

It will be very interesting viewing that's for sure.

We were also missing Thomas.

Except for the start of each quarter, we never put our A grade midfield into the centre square.

We didn't get numbers back into defence.

We didn't press, and our intensity was non-existent.

Such vast deviations from a game plan have an enormous impact on the result. Does it mean we'll win? Not necessarily. But it will be far, far, far more competitive, and it's 50/50 as to who will take it.

 

[upnsmoke]

All well and good my friend but now take this into account

- Pies were missing Maxwell / Shaw / Leon from defense that day.
- Leigh Brown was playing in defense - not our normal structure.
- Menzel polled three brownlow votes that day
- Goldsack was taking the kick ins.
- We were playing Jolly / Brown / Wood in the same side

Geelong will kick long into their forward 50 as they have been doing this for the past month with great success. Only this time around they will have to do this with Maxwell coming up for the spoil, Shaw & Davis providing rebound & without Menzel.

We will also be playing with more intensity

It will be very interesting viewing that's for sure.

Click here


Another article and pin points Cats VERY EFFECTIVE Long kicking tactic during finals.

Eagles have a decent defensive lineup, yet they got carved up by the Cats tactic. 30+ scoring shots for Cats... they did against the Pies (round 24) and against Eagles (Prelim).


Pies have some talent down back, but talent only works if the ball is to be won in a close vicinity, where courage, skills and overall talent thrives... but as Cats have demonstrated and as I have pointed out after Round 24... Pies can apply as much manic press as they want, but press doesnt work when the ball is in the air travelling 40-60 meters into their inside 50.


Mick Malthouse needs to prevent the entries.... if he doesnt its going to b a 50 point win atleast for the Cats.

 

[Ant85]

Click here


Another article and pin points Cats VERY EFFECTIVE Long kicking tactic during finals.

Eagles have a decent defensive lineup, yet they got carved up by the Cats tactic. 30+ scoring shots for Cats... they did against the Pies (round 24) and against Eagles (Prelim).


Pies have some talent down back, but talent only works if the ball is to be won in a close vicinity, where courage, skills and overall talent thrives... but as Cats have demonstrated and as I have pointed out after Round 24... Pies can apply as much manic press as they want, but press doesnt work when the ball is in the air travelling 40-60 meters into their inside 50.


Mick Malthouse needs to prevent the entries.... if he doesnt its going to b a 50 point win atleast for the Cats.

The long kick strategy won't work if we have a loose defender back.

Take a look at Hawthorn in the last quarter.

They bombed all their entries in the last quarter, and over our press, only for Maxwell or O'brien to rebound out.

Geelong persist with the long kick confident that their talls can make a contest, and keep it there in time for their smalls to run down and press us back.

Also, as I said, with wet weather, this won't work effectively.

 

[SuperSub17]

The long kick strategy won't work if we have a loose defender back.

Take a look at Hawthorn in the last quarter.

They bombed all their entries in the last quarter, and over our press, only for Maxwell or O'brien to rebound out.

Geelong persist with the long kick confident that their talls can make a contest, and keep it there in time for their smalls to run down and press us back.

Also, as I said, with wet weather, this won't work effectively.

Fully agree with you. The only problem with playing a loose back is that it means they will play a loose back as well. They will probably try to manipulate it so that it is scarlett. We should still do well as long as we don't kick it STRAIGHT TO THE LOOSE MAN, like we did so many times against Hawthorn.