I'm all in next season

[johnnysix]

How are people so confident that we won't make the finals / grand final or even snag one? We made a prelim in 2021. Our list hasn't lost much. Yes, our injuries cost us last year. All of these things can be true and we can still want Hinkley gone. I believe, and have believed for the last 7+ seasons, that the success we have had has been largely attributable to individual player effort. When they turn up and turn it on, we can beat a LOT of sides. The trouble is, when they don't, we're lost. We have no system and Hinkley doesn't seem to be able to motivate the players when it counts. They either bring it or they dont. Our injuries cost us last season because the coach took so ridiculously long to adapt to the players we had available. When he did he happened to stumble across a working forward setup. I've said it before, we have a great engine, we just loose so much power by the time it gets to the wheels through inefficiency, and I'm not just talking about our forwards. With a better coach we could be taking better advantage of the list that we do have.

 

[El_Scorcho]

How are people so confident that we won't make the finals / grand final or even snag one?

Because under Hinkley, we can't consistently beat good teams. We snatch one occasionally, but ultimately good sides have too much quality for our press to deal with and our inability to score freely costs us. Ken Hinkley can't out think the better coaches, and he can't respond to what they do to stop us.

To win a Premiership, you have to win 3 games against top 4 opponents in a row under finals pressure. It's not happening. We've demonstrated over the long term that consistently beating the better sides is beyond us.

 

[Tibbs]

How are people so confident that we won't make the finals / grand final or even snag one? We made a prelim in 2021. Our list hasn't lost much. Yes, our injuries cost us last year. All of these things can be true and we can still want Hinkley gone. I believe, and have believed for the last 7+ seasons, that the success we have had has been largely attributable to individual player effort. When they turn up and turn it on, we can beat a LOT of sides. The trouble is, when they don't, we're lost. We have no system and Hinkley doesn't seem to be able to motivate the players when it counts. They either bring it or they dont. Our injuries cost us last season because the coach took so ridiculously long to adapt to the players we had available. When he did he happened to stumble across a working forward setup. I've said it before, we have a great engine, we just loose so much power by the time it gets to the wheels through inefficiency, and I'm not just talking about our forwards. With a better coach we could be taking better advantage of the list that we do have.

We might get there ... In fact, I think we will get there ...make finals, that is. But Grand final/premiership? Nah. Because for the last 6 years, Ken Hinkley - The man that famously quoted Einstein with, "doing the same thing over end over again, and expecting a different outcome, is the definition of insanity" - keeps playing the same game plan over and over again!

And guess what?

 

[Bevoman]

We might get there ... In fact, I think we will get there ...make finals, that is. But Grand final/premiership? Nah. Because for the last 6 years, Ken Hinkley - The man that famously quoted Einstein with, "doing the same thing over end over again, and expecting a different outcome, is the definition of insanity" - keeps playing the same game plan over and over again!

And guess what?

I guess that insanity might be crediting that quote to Einstein over and over again. He never said it.
I expect to make the eight next year and I am hoping for top four.

I also want Ken gone: his pass mark should only be if we make the Grannie

 

[240volt]

I can’t see us making the GF next year for most of the reasons above but mainly because we haven’t got a GF defence.
With the line up we have at the back JC couldn’t get us over the line.
It’s not a premiership winning defence.

 

[King_Tredrea]

The days of coach’s really caring are long gone.
There’s so much money in it for them they are all about looking after themselves.
Your correct people are frustrated I canceled my membership after last years preliminary final.

I blamed the board for extending Ken’s term I blamed Ken for being a shyt coach I blamed the players for the most gutless performance I’ve seen a Port team show in over 50 years.
Successful business have successful management I have zero confidence this board will even appoint a quality successor after Ken.

I agree with majority of what you said. Not sure about the coaches not caring one though. I think majority of them do take the responsibility of representing a club and community to heart. I don’t see that with Hinkley at all.

 

[Tibbs]

I guess that insanity might be crediting that quote to Einstein over and over again. He never said it.
I expect to make the eight next year and I am hoping for top four.

I also want Ken gone: his pass mark should only be if we make the Grannie

Haha .. Although there is no absolute proof that he did, it also categorically cannot be said that he didnt! ... . We do know that he used the expression in the Letters to Solovine, and so perhaps it's attribution to Einstein is due to the Matthew effect.

Anyway, who the hell cares what it's origin is. Einstein at least used it, and Ken quoted him. So stop deflecting ... Either way Hinkley is a hypocrite:

• Says he does things differently ... yet keeps making the same mistakes over & over again.
• Says he backs in youth ... yet leaves Hayes out to fry, yet plays players that are then delisted at years end!

Mind-boggling!

 

[tribey]

We've demonstrated over the long term that consistently beating the better sides is beyond us.

While the media simultaneously points to his 58% win record, hyperinflated by a 30-3 record against the Suns, Saints and Roos.

‘PeOpLe ArE tOo NeGaTiVe’

I might have walked out of the 2021 Prelim at 3QT and haven’t returned, but I still remember it.

 

[Schulzenfest]

I might have walked out of the 2021 Prelim at 3QT and haven’t returned, but I still remember it.

You lasted about a quarter and a half longer than I did.

I sat through every second of the 2007 Grand Final and it wasn't half as heartbreaking as what Hinkley allowed to happen that night.

 

[EskimoPAFC]

I can confirm I heard Albert say that multiple times, usually after a few brandies.

 

[Janus]

Because under Hinkley, we can't consistently beat good teams. We snatch one occasionally, but ultimately good sides have too much quality for our press to deal with and our inability to score freely costs us. Ken Hinkley can't out think the better coaches, and he can't respond to what they do to stop us.

To win a Premiership, you have to win 3 games against top 4 opponents in a row under finals pressure. It's not happening. We've demonstrated over the long term that consistently beating the better sides is beyond us.

So that's the criteria is it?

Explain the following:

• In 2017, premiers Richmond lost to Adelaide (1st), the Western Bulldogs (10th), Fremantle (14th), GWS (4th), Sydney (6th), St Kilda (11th) and Geelong (2nd). They didn't win one game against a top four opponent that year, until it came to finals.

• In 2018, grand finalist Collingwood lost to Richmond (1st) twice, West Coast (2nd) three times (including two finals), Hawthorn (4th), GWS (7th), Geelong (8th) and Sydney (6th). The only team they beat in the top eight was Melbourne.

• In 2019, grand finalist GWS lost to West Coast (5th), Fremantle (13th), Hawthorn (9th) twice, Adelaide (12th), Essendon (8th), Brisbane (2nd), Richmond (3rd) and the Western Bulldogs (7th).

• In 2020, grand finalist Geelong lost to GWS (10th), Carlton (11th), Collingwood (8th), West Coast (5th) and Richmond (3rd) before losing to Port Adelaide (1st) and falling to the easier side of the finals draw where they beat Collingwood and Brisbane before losing to Richmond.

• In 2021, grand finalist Western Bulldogs managed to lose to Richmond (12th), Melbourne (1st), Geelong (4th), Sydney (6th), Essendon (8th), Hawthorn (14th) and Port Adelaide (2nd).

You want to know who could consistently beat good teams? 2017 Adelaide. They won against GWS (4th) twice, Geelong (2nd) twice, Richmond (3rd), Port Adelaide (5th) twice and Essendon (8th) twice on the way to the Grand Final. What the **** did it get them? A camp in the woods tied naked to a tree, that's what.

 

[bomberclifford]

You want to know who could consistently beat good teams? 2017 Adelaide. They won against GWS (4th) twice, Geelong (2nd) twice, Richmond (3rd), Port Adelaide (5th) twice and Essendon (8th) twice on the way to the Grand Final. What the * did it get them? A camp in the woods tied naked to a tree, that's what.

This is hands down the best paragraph you've ever written.

 

[El_Scorcho]

So that's the criteria is it?

Literally yes. I guess winning 3 games out of 4 will also get you there, but we can't do that either.

Explain the following:

• In 2017, premiers Richmond lost to Adelaide (1st), the Western Bulldogs (10th), Fremantle (14th), GWS (4th), Sydney (6th), St Kilda (11th) and Geelong (2nd). They didn't win one game against a top four opponent that year, until it came to finals.

• In 2018, grand finalist Collingwood lost to Richmond (1st) twice, West Coast (2nd) three times (including two finals), Hawthorn (4th), GWS (7th), Geelong (8th) and Sydney (6th). The only team they beat in the top eight was Melbourne.

• In 2019, grand finalist GWS lost to West Coast (5th), Fremantle (13th), Hawthorn (9th) twice, Adelaide (12th), Essendon (8th), Brisbane (2nd), Richmond (3rd) and the Western Bulldogs (7th).

• In 2020, grand finalist Geelong lost to GWS (10th), Carlton (11th), Collingwood (8th), West Coast (5th) and Richmond (3rd) before losing to Port Adelaide (1st) and falling to the easier side of the finals draw where they beat Collingwood and Brisbane before losing to Richmond.

• In 2021, grand finalist Western Bulldogs managed to lose to Richmond (12th), Melbourne (1st), Geelong (4th), Sydney (6th), Essendon (8th), Hawthorn (14th) and Port Adelaide (2nd).

You want to know who could consistently beat good teams? 2017 Adelaide. They won against GWS (4th) twice, Geelong (2nd) twice, Richmond (3rd), Port Adelaide (5th) twice and Essendon (8th) twice on the way to the Grand Final. What the * did it get them? A camp in the woods tied naked to a tree, that's what.

You've listed a bunch of teams who have demonstrated that they could get up for a Preliminary Final and win it. We haven't won a knockout final in 8 years.

These teams losing to 6th or 12th during the season is meaningless and missing the point. Hinkley coached sides (generally) do very well against poor sides because we can outwork them in defence and we have enough class in our forward line to kick a winning score. Against genuinely good sides, we can't kick a winning score and our defence will battle hard but will ultimately let our opponents through enough to cost us the game.

Adelaide got closer to a flag under Pyke than we ever have under Hinkley. That's the bar we're talking about here. The same garbage organisation who has trashed their list, who ran the camp which saw players tied naked to trees, who have ongoing issues with Indigenous former players, that hasn't won a flag in 25 years. That club made a Grand Final, along with 10 other clubs during Hinkley's tenure. Not us though.

 

[El_Scorcho]

While the media simultaneously points to his 58% win record, hyperinflated by a 30-3 record against the Suns, Saints and Roos.

‘PeOpLe ArE tOo NeGaTiVe’

I might have walked out of the 2021 Prelim at 3QT and haven’t returned, but I still remember it.

The 58% thing that people will hang their hat on is insane. He wins slightly less than 6 games out of 10. Notably none of those games are in knockout finals. He has a better winning % than a slew of legendary coaches.

Pats on the back all round because you haven't had to bottom out because Primus did it for you.

 

[Enviable Tradition]

So that's the criteria is it?

Explain the following:

• In 2017, premiers Richmond lost to Adelaide (1st), the Western Bulldogs (10th), Fremantle (14th), GWS (4th), Sydney (6th), St Kilda (11th) and Geelong (2nd). They didn't win one game against a top four opponent that year, until it came to finals.

• In 2018, grand finalist Collingwood lost to Richmond (1st) twice, West Coast (2nd) three times (including two finals), Hawthorn (4th), GWS (7th), Geelong (8th) and Sydney (6th). The only team they beat in the top eight was Melbourne.

• In 2019, grand finalist GWS lost to West Coast (5th), Fremantle (13th), Hawthorn (9th) twice, Adelaide (12th), Essendon (8th), Brisbane (2nd), Richmond (3rd) and the Western Bulldogs (7th).

• In 2020, grand finalist Geelong lost to GWS (10th), Carlton (11th), Collingwood (8th), West Coast (5th) and Richmond (3rd) before losing to Port Adelaide (1st) and falling to the easier side of the finals draw where they beat Collingwood and Brisbane before losing to Richmond.

• In 2021, grand finalist Western Bulldogs managed to lose to Richmond (12th), Melbourne (1st), Geelong (4th), Sydney (6th), Essendon (8th), Hawthorn (14th) and Port Adelaide (2nd).

You want to know who could consistently beat good teams? 2017 Adelaide. They won against GWS (4th) twice, Geelong (2nd) twice, Richmond (3rd), Port Adelaide (5th) twice and Essendon (8th) twice on the way to the Grand Final. What the * did it get them? A camp in the woods tied naked to a tree, that's what.

They made grand final which is more than we can say for Len.

And Pyke still got sacked.

Meanwhile...

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[Janus]

Literally yes. I guess winning 3 games out of 4 will also get you there, but we can't do that either.



You've listed a bunch of teams who have demonstrated that they could get up for a Preliminary Final and win it. We haven't won a knockout final in 8 years.

These teams losing to 6th or 12th during the season is meaningless and missing the point. Hinkley coached sides (generally) do very well against poor sides because we can outwork them in defence and we have enough class in our forward line to kick a winning score. Against genuinely good sides, we can't kick a winning score and our defence will battle hard but will ultimately let our opponents through enough to cost us the game.

Adelaide got closer to a flag under Pyke than we ever have under Hinkley. That's the bar we're talking about here. The same garbage organisation who has trashed their list, who ran the camp which saw players tied naked to trees, who have ongoing issues with Indigenous former players, that hasn't won a flag in 25 years. That club made a Grand Final, along with 10 other clubs during Hinkley's tenure. Not us though.

My point is that if your criteria is beating top sides, then it's not a very good criteria for judging performance.

You said that we don't score freely, yet in 2020 we were 2nd for points scored differential (Richmond and Geelong bookended us and made the GF) and in 2021 we were 4th for points scored differential (Melbourne, the Bulldogs and Brisbane were 1st, 2nd and 3rd).

We are absolutely capable of winning the flag when we have our full list available and it's performing at a high standard. Making definitive statements that we can't because we don't beat top four teams in the regular season is poor logic, especially when we have added Horne-Francis and Rioli to the mix and are getting back Dixon, Lycett and Fantasia for a full season.

Speaking of Lycett, here's a question for you - if the following statements are true about the chances of winning a game improving based on winning these statistics:

• If a team has more kicks than the opposition, it wins the game 77.9% of the time
• If a team generates more opposition turnovers, it wins the game 73.2% of the time
• If a team wins or ties the mark count, it wins the game 69.2% of the time
• If a team wins or ties the clearance count, it wins the game 61% of the time
• If a team wins or ties the handball receive count, it wins the game 60.9% of the time
• If a team wins hitouts to advantage, it wins the game 54.2% of the time

Then who of the following players would you consider more advantageous to team success - the guy who scores 0.5 goals per game, takes 2.8 marks per game, generates 4.3 clearances per game, 5 kicks per game, 9 handballs per game and 8.8 hitouts to advantage per game...or the guy who scores 0 goals per game, takes 1.6 marks per game, generates 2.3 clearances per game, 3.6 kicks per game, 4.1 handballs per game and 9.3 hitouts to advantage per game?

 

[Adz2332]

Our premiership window isnt next year. 3 more years and i think it opens right up.

Our under 24 / 25s are way above our 26 - 33s players.

We need Key backs no doubt

 

[El_Scorcho]

My point is that if your criteria is beating top sides, then it's not a very good criteria for judging performance.

You have to beat the top sides to win a flag. 3 of them in a month. When was the last time we beat 3 good sides in a month? 2007?

I guess "judging performance" is a relative thing. I want to win a flag, that's the metric i'm basing my statements on.

You said that we don't score freely, yet in 2020 we were 2nd for points scored differential (Richmond and Geelong bookended us and made the GF) and in 2021 we were 4th for points scored differential (Melbourne, the Bulldogs and Brisbane were 1st, 2nd and 3rd).

Overall points differential, again, is meaningless. I'm saying we beat up on bad teams who can't beat our press, but can't do the same to good teams. Good teams stop us from shithousing goals through individual brilliance and they break through our press often enough to outscore us. That lends itself to a good points differential, and yet we've scored a combined 85 points in our last 2 preliminary finals. In fact, the only team we've been able to open up our scoring against in a final in 8 years is Geelong, who were until this year famous for not being able to deal with a manic pressure press come finals time.

Apart from the odd bedshitting performance like the 2021 Prelim, we don't get spanked that often when we've got our best side out. What we do do is regularly come up short against quality opposition in big games.

We are absolutely capable of winning the flag when we have our full list available and it's performing at a high standard. Making definitive statements that we can't because we don't beat top four teams in the regular season is poor logic, especially when we have added Horne-Francis and Rioli to the mix and are getting back Dixon, Lycett and Fantasia for a full season.

We can, but we won't. Because to win a flag, we need to be mentally switched on and at our best for 3-4 games in a row against top quality opposition. Under Hinkley, that would be something we haven't seen in almost a decade.

The playing list is absolutely good enough to win a flag. What isn't is our consistency of mental application under Hinkley.

Speaking of Lycett, here's a question for you - if the following statements are true about the chances of winning a game improving based on winning these statistics:

• If a team has more kicks than the opposition, it wins the game 77.9% of the time
• If a team generates more opposition turnovers, it wins the game 73.2% of the time
• If a team wins or ties the mark count, it wins the game 69.2% of the time
• If a team wins or ties the clearance count, it wins the game 61% of the time
• If a team wins or ties the handball receive count, it wins the game 60.9% of the time
• If a team wins hitouts to advantage, it wins the game 54.2% of the time

Then who of the following players would you consider more advantageous to team success - the guy who scores 0.5 goals per game, takes 2.8 marks per game, generates 4.3 clearances per game, 5 kicks per game, 9 handballs per game and 8.8 hitouts to advantage per game...or the guy who scores 0 goals per game, takes 1.6 marks per game, generates 2.3 clearances per game, 3.6 kicks per game, 4.1 handballs per game and 9.3 hitouts to advantage per game?

You can quote as many Lycett stats as you like. He's a liability and has cost us games by going to sleep for a quarter or 2, where an opposition ruckman will take over and kill us. He's a mid level ruckman with a penchant for having a quarter off. Could we win a flag with him as our #1 ruckman? Sure. Maybe his lack of mental consistency is a part of the wider problem at the club and under a better coach he'd be a more consistent player?

That doesn't mean his replacement isn't a high priority. Probably only behind key defenders as our biggest list management headache moving forward.

 

[Coobk001]

There's no way anyone with eyesight can justify that the Lycett we saw last year, getting absolutely slaughtered, is going to make us significantly better. That game against Melbourne last year he played was just plain embarrassing.

 

[wayb2912]

There's no way anyone with eyesight can justify that the Lycett we saw last year, getting absolutely slaughtered, is going to make us significantly better. That game against Melbourne last year he played was just plain embarrassing.

Lycett did do his shoulder in the first 10 mins of that game. I also agree his tap work is not great

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[Adz2332]

You have to beat the top sides to win a flag. 3 of them in a month. When was the last time we beat 3 good sides in a month? 2007?

I guess "judging performance" is a relative thing. I want to win a flag, that's the metric i'm basing my statements on.



Overall points differential, again, is meaningless. I'm saying we beat up on bad teams who can't beat our press, but can't do the same to good teams. Good teams stop us from shithousing goals through individual brilliance and they break through our press often enough to outscore us. That lends itself to a good points differential, and yet we've scored a combined 85 points in our last 2 preliminary finals. In fact, the only team we've been able to open up our scoring against in a final in 8 years is Geelong, who were until this year famous for not being able to deal with a manic pressure press come finals time.

Apart from the odd bedshitting performance like the 2021 Prelim, we don't get spanked that often when we've got our best side out. What we do do is regularly come up short against quality opposition in big games.



We can, but we won't. Because to win a flag, we need to be mentally switched on and at our best for 3-4 games in a row against top quality opposition. Under Hinkley, that would be something we haven't seen in almost a decade.

The playing list is absolutely good enough to win a flag. What isn't is our consistency of mental application under Hinkley.



You can quote as many Lycett stats as you like. He's a liability and has cost us games by going to sleep for a quarter or 2, where an opposition ruckman will take over and kill us. He's a mid level ruckman with a penchant for having a quarter off. Could we win a flag with him as our #1 ruckman? Sure. Maybe his lack of mental consistency is a part of the wider problem at the club and under a better coach he'd be a more consistent player?

That doesn't mean his replacement isn't a high priority. Probably only behind key defenders as our biggest list management headache moving forward.

I dunno, moving forward the ruck is a huge issue. Hayes, Teakle, Visentini and Finlayson should have us covered. In fact id rather play a combination of those and leave out both Dixon and Lycett.

Forwards Marshall, MG, Finlayson. Ruck Hayes, Visentini or teakle.

 

[Janus]

You have to beat the top sides to win a flag. 3 of them in a month. When was the last time we beat 3 good sides in a month? 2007?

I guess "judging performance" is a relative thing. I want to win a flag, that's the metric i'm basing my statements on.

It's incredibly rare that you're ever going to play 3 top four sides in 4 weeks outside of finals. The closest I could find was in 2014, when we won against Geelong (3rd), Fremantle (4th) and Hawthorn (2nd) in 5 weeks (due to the bye).

Overall points differential, again, is meaningless. I'm saying we beat up on bad teams who can't beat our press, but can't do the same to good teams. Good teams stop us from shithousing goals through individual brilliance and they break through our press often enough to outscore us. That lends itself to a good points differential, and yet we've scored a combined 85 points in our last 2 preliminary finals. In fact, the only team we've been able to open up our scoring against in a final in 8 years is Geelong, who were until this year famous for not being able to deal with a manic pressure press come finals time.

Apart from the odd bedshitting performance like the 2021 Prelim, we don't get spanked that often when we've got our best side out. What we do do is regularly come up short against quality opposition in big games.

How can it possibly be meaningless if every other team is playing exactly the same teams as we are? It's not a subjective measure, it's measured relative to every single other side in the competition who also get to beat up on bad teams. We were a good team in 2020 who ran into awful luck in the fact that a Brisbane who only made 2nd because they played every single game in their home state and never had to travel once managed to send Richmond to the other side of the finals fixture to play us instead of being forced to play us themselves.

If we had played Brisbane in that 2020 prelim, in the first game that lot would have had to play away from home for the year and with a hostile environment, we would have been playing Richmond in the GF and would have at least had a shot at winning it.

We can, but we won't. Because to win a flag, we need to be mentally switched on and at our best for 3-4 games in a row against top quality opposition. Under Hinkley, that would be something we haven't seen in almost a decade.

The playing list is absolutely good enough to win a flag. What isn't is our consistency of mental application under Hinkley.

The only game that you could possibly be basing this opinion on is the 2021 prelim final and perhaps the first half of 2017 elimination final. In 2013, we were switched on against Collingwood and then Geelong. In 2014, we were switched on against Richmond, Fremantle and Hawthorn. In 2020, we were switched on against Geelong and Richmond. In 2021, we were switched on against Geelong.

You can quote as many Lycett stats as you like. He's a liability and has cost us games by going to sleep for a quarter or 2, where an opposition ruckman will take over and kill us. He's a mid level ruckman with a penchant for having a quarter off. Could we win a flag with him as our #1 ruckman? Sure. Maybe his lack of mental consistency is a part of the wider problem at the club and under a better coach he'd be a more consistent player?

That doesn't mean his replacement isn't a high priority. Probably only behind key defenders as our biggest list management headache moving forward.

What about the fact that in 4 games, he had 4 defensive one on one contests for 0 losses, whereas Hayes had 4 defensive one on one contests for 3 losses? Or the fact that he had 3 intercept marks in 4 games to Hayes' 2 intercept marks in 7 games?

Scott Lycett has a premiership medal. The facts are that he was a significant loss for the team this season. I don't know where this bullshit narrative that he's a liability to the team came from, because it's simply not true. Let me put it this way - if any of our rucks take over the number one spot from Scott in 2023, I would fully expect them to push for All Australian in the next five years.

 

[Sewer de Lance]

When you say ”All In”, are you referring to renewing your 11 game membership & maybe even attending a couple of interstate fixtures, or are you alluding to the idea that our squad is now good enough to win a flag?

I‘m not entirely sure when our first goalless quarter will be, but I’m of the belief it will come early in 2023. If the goalless quarters don’t deflate your optimism, maybe Mackenzie, Clurey & Jonas repeated falling over their own feet against the bigger KPFs will.

Look mate, I really want to sympathise with you, but you’ll probably get more joy buying into a Greyhound syndicate, or purchasing some stock in Coke Zero then seeing us genuinely compete next year.

 

[El_Scorcho]

It's incredibly rare that you're ever going to play 3 top four sides in 4 weeks outside of finals. The closest I could find was in 2014, when we won against Geelong (3rd), Fremantle (4th) and Hawthorn (2nd) in 5 weeks (due to the bye).

2014 was notably the last season where we were consistently mentally switched on, we blew the 2nd half of that season with our tall selection strategy.

How can it possibly be meaningless if every other team is playing exactly the same teams as we are? It's not a subjective measure, it's measured relative to every single other side in the competition who also get to beat up on bad teams. We were a good team in 2020 who ran into awful luck in the fact that a Brisbane who only made 2nd because they played every single game in their home state and never had to travel once managed to send Richmond to the other side of the finals fixture to play us instead of being forced to play us themselves.

Again, our defence oriented gameplan gives us big wins over bad teams by forcing turnovers. Good teams don't give us the ball and we can't score against them. We don't have another way to score apart from individual brilliance.

If we had played Brisbane in that 2020 prelim, in the first game that lot would have had to play away from home for the year and with a hostile environment, we would have been playing Richmond in the GF and would have at least had a shot at winning it.

If Scott Lycett hadn't had his arse handed to him in the 2020 prelim we'd have gotten some meaningful centre clearances and won comfortably.

The only game that you could possibly be basing this opinion on is the 2021 prelim final and perhaps the first half of 2017 elimination final. In 2013, we were switched on against Collingwood and then Geelong. In 2014, we were switched on against Richmond, Fremantle and Hawthorn. In 2020, we were switched on against Geelong and Richmond. In 2021, we were switched on against Geelong.

We weren't switched on in the 2020 prelim. We allowed a total Richmond domination of centre clearances which meant we had to launch every score from halfback against the best transition defence in the league, and we scored 40 points and lost.

That's not being switched on. It's better than the 2021 disaster but it's still a disaster.

What about the fact that in 4 games, he had 4 defensive one on one contests for 0 losses, whereas Hayes had 4 defensive one on one contests for 3 losses? Or the fact that he had 3 intercept marks in 4 games to Hayes' 2 intercept marks in 7 games?

Scott Lycett has a premiership medal. The facts are that he was a significant loss for the team this season. I don't know where this bullshit narrative that he's a liability to the team came from, because it's simply not true. Let me put it this way - if any of our rucks take over the number one spot from Scott in 2023, I would fully expect them to push for All Australian in the next five years.

Ah, a premiership medal, something no bog standard player has ever achieved.

Scott Lycett won his premiership as part of a 2 ruck setup where he took about half the stoppages. He's just a mid level ruckman who wouldn't be first ruck at many clubs. Letting Ryder go in favour of him was ultimately a mistake.

 

[dirty2]

El_Scorcho I thought Lycett was the main ruck because big Nat was out injured... I could be wrong.

Not defending Lycett... Im all for Hayes taking over.